Justin Upton...again

[Boss-Hog]

Originally Posted by Benihana

First off, that's incorrect (Bedard maybe, not Blanton).

Secondly, even if there were truth to it, what does it have to do with anything?

I remember others wouldn't trade Pokey Reese for Ken Griffey Jr.

I reread a few of the Blanton threads and there actually were several posters (some current, some former) in favor of including Votto + others in a trade for Blanton (most were against including Votto, though). I don't know if others necessarily included Bailey. That being said, I agree with you that I don't see what that has to do with this thread.

[traderumor]

Originally Posted by Kc61

I still doubt the Reds will trade Hamilton. For anybody. I think they want this kid with the Reds as a base stealer and a drawing card.

I'm with you. He's going to come up in every high profile trade rumor, but it would seem like a team without a leadoff hitter since the aforementioned Bip Roberts would be slotting him there for 2013 or early 2014, and in CF.

[dunner13]

I love Billy Hamilton but at then end of the day his only above average ability is his amazing speed. He has no power, he can hit but hes not Ichiro so as much as I love him if you can get Justin Upton you trade hamilton in a second. I wouldn't trade him for just anyone but Upton is one of the best young players in the game and most likely will have a few MVP trophies on his mantle by the time he retires which as fast as hamilton is its very doubtful he ever wins an mvp.

[Scrap Irony]

That's not true, dunner. Hamilton has speed (an 80 tool if ever there was one), the hit tool (a 330 average over his past year's worth of ABs), and, if moved to CF, both the glove and arm tool grade out as plus-plus. (One scout insisted he could move to CF today and become a Gold Glover next year in the majors.)

He is also patient at the plate and showing an improvement in pitch recognition, not to mention the kind of athlete that makes plays no one else makes in places no one else makes them.

Hamilton could be a game-changer at the top of the order. And that's worth quite a bit.

[Vottomatic]

Originally Posted by Kc61

I still doubt the Reds will trade Hamilton. For anybody. I think they want this kid with the Reds as a base stealer and a drawing card.

I agree. They've mismanaged Chapman, but he is a huge drawing card. Hamilton will be too.

Seems like this Reds management is becoming all about revenue and less about winning.

[Joseph]

Originally Posted by Vottomatic

I agree. They've mismanaged Chapman, but he is a huge drawing card. Hamilton will be too.

Seems like this Reds management is becoming all about revenue and less about winning.

C'mon, sure you don't believe that. Drawing cards are great. Every teams wants marquee players, but the Reds have pumped seemingly most every dollar made from these players right back into payroll and player development. Do you think the old regime would have ponied up for Votto, Phillips, or Bruces' contracts?

No one is beyond reproach, but I think you are barking up the wrong tree with that statement. Its about winning.

[Vottomatic]

Originally Posted by Joseph

C'mon, sure you don't believe that. Drawing cards are great. Every teams wants marquee players, but the Reds have pumped seemingly most every dollar made from these players right back into payroll and player development. Do you think the old regime would have ponied up for Votto, Phillips, or Bruces' contracts?

No one is beyond reproach, but I think you are barking up the wrong tree with that statement. Its about winning.

Ok. I'll admit my frustration kicks in sometimes and comes through in my posts. But I've been frustrated all the way back to 2010. I think the Reds were a bit lucky that season and it has hurt them ever since because they had the same holes in the lineup that season.

I've never been a fan of Stubbs which makes CF a hole in the lineup. And LF has been a patchwork starting with Gomes for a few years.

They have done a good job of bolstering the starting pitching, but LF and CF, and cleanup and leadoff have had issues for years.

To invest so much money in Votto and not surround him with the proper lineup is such a waste. Votto is probably shaking his head in terms of signing long term with a small market club at this point. The guy's numbers are incredible and could be so much more if management knew how to surround him with the right players.

[bellhead]

If upton were to sign a 3 year extension then i'd do it...

[Vottomatic]

There's gonna be nothing left of our farm system if they make some of these trades.

[RedEye]

Originally Posted by Vottomatic

There's gonna be nothing left of our farm system if they make some of these trades.

At some point you've got to cash in your chips. If you can do it for a player like Upton, that's be best possible scenario.

[Vottomatic]

Originally Posted by RedEye

At some point you've got to cash in your chips. If you can do it for a player like Upton, that's be best possible scenario.

No. I agree. The Reds have every position pretty much accounted for at the major league level at this point except LF and CF, with no top level OF prospects. And it just so happens that leadoff and cleanup are the biggest holes offensively.

If they acquire Pierre and Upton, I'll be curious to see if Dusty uses them properly.

[Benihana]

Originally Posted by bellhead

If upton were to sign a 3 year extension then i'd do it...

Upton is already signed through 2015. I'm at the point where I dont really want liabilities accumulating beyond then unless of course they are way below market value.

[RedEye]

Originally Posted by Vottomatic

If they acquire Pierre and Upton, I'll be curious to see if Dusty uses them properly.

I think it would be hard for him not to. Even to an "old school" manager, their roles are pretty obvious, don't you think? Speedy guy at leadoff, RH slugger to slot between two lefties in the lineup. Lather, rinse, repeat every day for the next couple years.

[Vottomatic]

Originally Posted by RedEye

I think it would be hard for him not to. Even to an "old school" manager, their roles are pretty obvious, don't you think? Speedy guy at leadoff, RH slugger to slot between two lefties in the lineup. Lather, rinse, repeat every day for the next couple years.

You'd really have to think that upper management would have a sit down with Dusty and explain the moves and where these guys will be hitting.

I don't see where Dusty realistically has a choice anyway, unless he simply wants to be a hardhead.

[cinreds21]

If Billy is off limits then something of Cingrani, Lotzkar, Rodriguez/Gregorious and Joseph may be something close.