Penn State / Jerry Sandusky Pt. II

[dougdirt]

Originally Posted by WMR

If you really want to make yourself feel nauseous, check out the Penn State Rivals or Scout board.

I really don't want to do that, but I can unfortunately imagine what it looks like.

[Razor Shines]

Rome pointed out how ironic it is that the school sent out security to protect the statue but they didn't lift a finger for those kids.


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[The Operator]

Originally Posted by Razor Shines

Rome pointed out how ironic it is that the school sent out security to protect the statue but they didn't lift a finger for those kids.


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Priorities...

[Sea Ray]

Originally Posted by dougdirt

You must have missed where Matt Millen was sticking up for him. I won't go as far as saying defending him, but saying that there is more to Joe Paterno than this incident.

I saw that. I'm no Matt Millen fan but I don't think he said anything outrageous. In fact as usual he pretty much didn't say anything. Just a bunch of mumbo jumbo. Nothing unfair about saying there's more to Paterno than this big mistake but we already knew that

[BuckeyeRed27]

Originally Posted by Sea Ray

I saw that. I'm no Matt Millen fan but I don't think he said anything outrageous. In fact as usual he pretty much didn't say anything. Just a bunch of mumbo jumbo. Nothing unfair about saying there's more to Paterno than this big mistake but we already knew that

I only saw Millen for a minute or two yesterday and I just felt bad for him. ESPN basically set him up to fail. He is just way to close to that situation to provide any sort of commentary.

[fearofpopvol1]

I'd like to see the football program completely suspended for 4 years. I think the players already committed should be given the chance to transfer.

Hit 'em where it hurts. The football program brings massive dollars to the school and they should sting them there.

All individuals involved who knew about it should be charged to the fullest extent of the law.

[Sea Ray]

Originally Posted by fearofpopvol1

I'd like to see the football program completely suspended for 4 years. I think the players already committed should be given the chance to transfer.

Hit 'em where it hurts. The football program brings massive dollars to the school and they should sting them there.

All individuals involved who knew about it should be charged to the fullest extent of the law.

I understand where you're coming from but such a penalty would be awfully harsh and hit a lot of innocent parties

First of all it's likely that many of the 80 or so football players on scholarship will not be able to get scholarships from other schools. There's also the many folks who make money off the football team from the vendors to the sportsbar workers around town. These are hard working folks who need the money.

As it is the guilty parties will be punished harshly. You know Paterno's fate. The other three men in power will be subject to civil and possibly even crominal charges and the school will have to pay out handsomely to each and every victim that comes out.

[Assembly Hall]

Originally Posted by Sea Ray

I understand where you're coming from but such a penalty would be awfully harsh and hit a lot of innocent parties

First of all it's likely that many of the 80 or so football players on scholarship will not be able to get scholarships from other schools. There's also the many folks who make money off the football team from the vendors to the sportsbar workers around town. These are hard working folks who need the money.

As it is the guilty parties will be punished harshly. You know Paterno's fate. The other three men in power will be subject to civil and possibly even crominal charges and the school will have to pay out handsomely to each and every victim that comes out.

Some very valid points.

I have been around long enough to see a lot of "scandals". The thing about what I have seen in the past is that it always seemed to involve cash and perks for players, point shaving, athletic boosters spreading money, and recruiting violations. The Penn State situation is uncharted waters for the NCAA. There was no wrong doing actually concerning the football program. A coach of the football program using an on campus organization took advantage of young boys over a period of extended years. And it appears that people with in the football infra structure after being aware of it chose to cover it up. The fact of the matter is there was no rules infractions by the football program, however numerous civil laws were broken.

I dont know what the answer is to as far as what the NCAA can do about it. I also dont think that a NCAA "death penalty" is warranted here as per how the rules are set up. However what happened there absolutely disgusts me.
I am an IU fan, and as such am a fan of the Big Ten. I think the other 11 schools should really consider kicking the Lions out of the conference. We dont need the NCAA to do that.......take a vote and boot them out.

What would Penn State do if the Big Ten kicked them out?

[The Operator]

Originally Posted by Sea Ray

I understand where you're coming from but such a penalty would be awfully harsh and hit a lot of innocent parties

First of all it's likely that many of the 80 or so football players on scholarship will not be able to get scholarships from other schools. There's also the many folks who make money off the football team from the vendors to the sportsbar workers around town. These are hard working folks who need the money.

As it is the guilty parties will be punished harshly. You know Paterno's fate. The other three men in power will be subject to civil and possibly even crominal charges and the school will have to pay out handsomely to each and every victim that comes out.

All of the guilty parties in the OSU gold pants / tattoo scandal are long gone. Yet the program is paying the price this year by being ineligible to play in a bowl game and losing several scholarships if I remember correctly.

Programs paying the price for indiscretions of past players or coaches happens all the time.

And in this case, it needs to happen big time at Penn State. That program became so big and powerful that something like this could happen just to protect its image. Even with JoePa and the idiots who were running the University gone, the program still needs to be put down for a while just to get rid of that aura of being able to do whatever they want, whenever they want, to whoever they want.

[paintmered]

Originally Posted by Sea Ray

I understand where you're coming from but such a penalty would be awfully harsh and hit a lot of innocent parties

First of all it's likely that many of the 80 or so football players on scholarship will not be able to get scholarships from other schools. There's also the many folks who make money off the football team from the vendors to the sportsbar workers around town. These are hard working folks who need the money.

It would indeed be harsh. And the many folks around State College who own restaurants, hotels and bars would bear much of the negative impact of no football. Consider how many of those businesses exist because of Penn State football and the 100,000 visitors that it brings to the area eight times each year. Penn State football became too big to fail not only the university but also for the surrounding community. I have to think that that fear of essentially killing off a sizable chunk of the local economy and impact all those innocent people played a part in the decision to not pursue the Sandusky allegations way back when.

All this being said, I don't know if it's appropriate for the NCAA to impose the death penalty. I do think it would be appropriate for Penn State to voluntarily suspend the program for at least a season and allow all players to transfer without losing a year of eligibility. Too many people are considering the impact to the thousands who make their living in part to Penn State football and forget that it may have been all those people who created and fed the culture that allowed the atrocities to go unreported and unpursued. To take into consideration the local industry supported by Penn State football, and to lessen their punishment as a result is a continuation of the culture that allowed the problem to continue for as long as it has.

[The Operator]

Originally Posted by paintmered

It would indeed be harsh. And the many folks around State College who own restaurants, hotels and bars would bear much of the negative impact of no football. Consider how many of those businesses exist because of Penn State football and the 100,000 visitors that it brings to the area eight times each year. Penn State football became too big to fail not only the university but also for the surrounding community. I have to think that that fear of essentially killing off a sizable chunk of the local economy and impact all those innocent people played a part in the decision to not pursue the Sandusky allegations way back when.

All this being said, I don't know if it's appropriate for the NCAA to impose the death penalty. I do think it would be appropriate for Penn State to voluntarily suspend the program for at least a season and allow all players to transfer without losing a year of eligibility. Too many people are considering the impact to the thousands who make their living in part to Penn State football and forget that it may have been all those people who created and fed the culture that allowed the atrocities to go unreported and unpursued. To take into consideration the local industry supported by Penn State football, and to lessen their punishment as a result is a continuation of the culture that allowed the problem to continue for as long as it has.

Best. Post. Ever.

I wish I had written that.

[Sea Ray]

Originally Posted by The Operator

All of the guilty parties in the OSU gold pants / tattoo scandal are long gone. Yet the program is paying the price this year by being ineligible to play in a bowl game and losing several scholarships if I remember correctly.

Programs paying the price for indiscretions of past players or coaches happens all the time.

And in this case, it needs to happen big time at Penn State. That program became so big and powerful that something like this could happen just to protect its image. Even with JoePa and the idiots who were running the University gone, the program still needs to be put down for a while just to get rid of that aura of being able to do whatever they want, whenever they want, to whoever they want.

The vendors still have jobs at OSU. If we're discussing a Bowl ban for PSU that's another discussion altogether.

[dougdirt]

When the government stops giving the school money, the school is going down anyways. Just a matter of time.

[Sea Ray]

Originally Posted by paintmered

It would indeed be harsh. And the many folks around State College who own restaurants, hotels and bars would bear much of the negative impact of no football. Consider how many of those businesses exist because of Penn State football and the 100,000 visitors that it brings to the area eight times each year. Penn State football became too big to fail not only the university but also for the surrounding community. I have to think that that fear of essentially killing off a sizable chunk of the local economy and impact all those innocent people played a part in the decision to not pursue the Sandusky allegations way back when.

That's a huge stretch. Why should the folks in Happy Valley be put out of work when those sorts of busineeses continue in every other big college football town? The guy selling programs at PSU did nothing wrong and shouldn't lose his job over this.

Incidently I reject the common notion that PSU covered this up because the program was too big to fail. If they'd have reported the Sandusky incident(s) to authorities, the program would have had a little bit of criticism for hiring a child molester (assuming he was convicted) but it would have continued and Paterno would have kept his job. Every SAT still would have been sold out in Happy Valley. The program would have suffered very little

[paintmered]

You think it's a stretch to suggest that the Penn State administration and athletic department didn't want to disrupt the economic machine that is (or at least was) Penn State football? Reporting child rape inside the program even then would have subjected the program to NCAA and Title IX investigations and possible sanctions. It wouldn't have killed the program but it would have been disruptive. It also would have been a stake to the heart to the very proud reputation that Penn State was never among the wrongdoers.

All those outside the admin and program are absolutely innocent since they had no direct tie to the events that took place. But many made their livings at the feet of Joe Paterno and the successes of the football team, donated to the school and funded facility improvements (Beaver Stadium expanded from 46,000 to nearly 110,000 during Paterno's tenure). In turn, they saw economic benefit from it all. How could that not create a culture of protecting the program at all costs? Happy Valley isn't like Columbus. It doesn't have state government or banking corporate headquarters as other economic drivers. There's the university, football tourism, and very little else.