Should Dusty Baker Receive an Extension?

[klw]

I think having Dusty back would be fine as long as the bench is improved. My issue with Dusty is lineup and game management but if his tools are improved then that can be reduced as an issue. Dusty lost me for a long time on June 24 which is best known as the game in which Chapman gave up the bomb to Willingham in the 9th and the Reds lost 4-3. http://espn.go.com/mlb/playbyplay?gameId=320624117 Where Dusty lost me was after bomb, Frazier walked to bottom of the 9th. Mez was due up next. He already had gone 2 for 3 with a double. Mez had been playing better of late and was the hot bat of the day. Instead, Dusty sent up Willie Harris to bunt. Harris bunted, then a couple of batters later Valdez made the last out. I was done. He does seemed beloved by the players and over a season that means alot. If we get him the full complement of players to avoid the bench that the Reds had this year then I say bring him back.

[WMR]

Originally Posted by AtomicDumpling

Dusty does a great job as a clubhouse manager or an off-the-field manager in terms of handling personalities, motivating players and the like. Dusty is smart enough to allow Bryan Price to handle the pitching staff. But when it comes down to lineup construction and in-game management he is one of the worst in the business.

Great post. The fact that he didn't have LeCure up in the bullpen when Leake went out for his final inning was just unbelievably poor in-game management and a perfect microcosm of where Dusty fails again and again (and will continue to fail until eternity). LeCure should have been warmed up and ready to be inserted upon the first Giant hit of that inning. Just turrible.

[Degenerate39]

Anyone think the playoffs would've been different had Cueto not gotten hurt? With Latos pitching game 3 and having the possibility of having Cueto back again for 5 if necessary.

[The Snow Chief]

Originally Posted by Brutus

Don't think you're stupid enough to fall for the argument that this Reds team did better with Dusty than without and that its' not worth risking the alternatives to find out whether it's true? I never said the Reds made the playoffs solely on account of Dusty Baker. But I sure as heck think if someone is going to make the argument he was given talent, then they should also not be talking out of both sides of their mouths and act like it's his fault they didn't do anything in the playoffs. You can't have it both ways. Either he was not responsible for their success in the regular season or he was equally not responsible for the lack of playoff success.

That grass isn't always greener on the other side. Personally, I think the Reds are better with Dusty than without. And to whatever extent that is debatable, I don't think we should want to find out if it's true. Bobby Valentine says hello.

My point is that what happened earlier this century has no relevance to the question of whether Dusty is the person to lead this team to a World Series title. You keep bringing up the past, but this organization was run like the Pirates until this ownership group took over. Things are different now, so I don't think your reference to past Reds performance is particularly compelling.

Dusty did a fine job with the team this season. The 97 wins are impressive in any season, although it needs to be understood that we played in a division with two 100 game losers. Given the makeup of the division and starting pitching performances by the Reds this season, I don't particularly think it was working miracles to win 97.

This team has the talent to compete for a World Series over the next 2-3 years if they can re-sign Ludwick and make a couple smaller upgrades. After that, I think most of the starting pitching will likely sign elsewhere. We have too much money tied up in other players to give them big FA deals. We have a two, maybe three, year window to win it all with this group. The question is, do you want Dusty to be the person making the clutch decisions in crucial playoff games during this limited window?

I don't have the confidence in Dusty to make the correct situational decisions that come up in playoff baseball that do not come up in the regular season. Do you think Dusty would have pulled Zito in game 4 after 2 2/3 of rocky baseball before he gave up the big inning? The Giants manager did so and I think that won the series for them. I have no confidence in Dusty to do that. I think Dusty left his pitchers who were leaking oil in for one or two batters too long in game 4. I really think he was out managed in that game.

If the Reds retain Dusty and win it all with him, no one will be happier than me. I think he is a good guy and I wanted it to work out for him. I just don't think he is the person I want calling the shots in the playoffs and, if I were Walt, I would go in another direction.

[edabbs44]

Originally Posted by WMR

Great post. The fact that he didn't have LeCure up in the bullpen when Leake went out for his final inning was just unbelievably poor in-game management and a perfect microcosm of where Dusty fails again and again (and will continue to fail until eternity). LeCure should have been warmed up and ready to be inserted upon the first Giant hit of that inning. Just turrible.

Doesn't that contradict the post you were agreeing with, stating that Price handles the staff?

Does anyone actually know who makes what decisions in game? Or is it bad result decisions Dusty, good result decisions anyone else?

[edabbs44]

Originally Posted by Degenerate39

Anyone think the playoffs would've been different had Cueto not gotten hurt? With Latos pitching game 3 and having the possibility of having Cueto back again for 5 if necessary.

Cueto and Votto not being Votto were both problems. No excuse, they should have won being up 2-0 but it would've been nice with a healthy squad.

[Benihana]

Originally Posted by Degenerate39

Anyone think the playoffs would've been different had Cueto not gotten hurt? With Latos pitching game 3 and having the possibility of having Cueto back again for 5 if necessary.

No. The Reds bats never showed up. They disappeared around Labor Day and never came back. Leake's performance yesterday and Latos' meltdown today cost us dearly (and Dusty is partly to blame,) but the lack of hitting cost us the series. Too many wasted opportunities.

[Benihana]

I'm fine either way with or without Dusty going forward. I think the Manager is one of the most overrated positions in sports.

[OldXOhio]

Originally Posted by wheels

I like Dusty Baker as a human being, and a regular season manager. He's great at keeping people together over the long grind.

It's just that his tactical mistakes are far too frequent for a club that seems to now be a regular playoff contender.

Nothing against Dusty, but the Reds need a next level type of a guy.

This would be my hope as well. I think Dusty has done a great job, but after this you have to question whether he is the right guy. Walt will soon let us know what he thinks.

[Matt700wlw]

Originally Posted by edabbs44

Cueto and Votto not being Votto were both problems. No excuse, they should have won being up 2-0 but it would've been nice with a healthy squad.

I'm not sure any teams has a "healthy" squad after the guantlet of 162 games...

[AtomicDumpling]

Originally Posted by Benihana

I'm fine either way with or without Dusty going forward. I think the Manager is one of the most overrated positions in sports.

Agreed.

[AtomicDumpling]

Dusty is also one of the highest paid managers in the game. I don't have a problem with that necessarily, but if the extra money he makes compared to a good replacement manager is the difference between being able to sign a quality free agent to upgrade the team then it could be a factor to consider.

[edabbs44]

Originally Posted by Matt700wlw

I'm not sure any teams has a "healthy" squad after the guantlet of 162 games...

Remove Cain and turn Posey into a slap hitter and the result may have been different.

[westofyou]

Even if Dusty goes (and I sense the Reds might lean on his health issues to push him that way) next season there will a new manager that will be deemed just as clueless and useless in numerous threads

[The Snow Chief]

Here is what Craig Calcaterra has to say about Dusty's in-game performance.

Respectfully, I think some Reds fans are so scarred by the crappy way that the Reds organization was run for so many years that they are afraid that getting rid of Dusty will be a return to that era. Guys, Dusty can't manage a team without talent either. He won 66 games his last year in Chicago and that is what he would have done if he managed our bad rosters earlier this century. This team has talent and, while Dusty deserves some credit, I think talent is the primary reason they won the division. Their starting pitching and bullpen was much better than anyone else in the division.

Dusty's in game management is just not strong enough to be the guy who I want to lead us over these next two or three crucial seasons.

http://hardballtalk.nbcsports.com/20...murder-weapon/