Jay Bruce 2012 Silver Slugger

[edabbs44]

Originally Posted by Patrick Bateman

Well, he was quoting a post that said "Holliday's year was way better," which suggested the poster was not discussing completely from a Silver Slugger perspective.

He closed it by saying "I'm not sure how or why Bruce beat him out" so he was obviously talking about the award.

[edabbs44]

Originally Posted by PuffyPig

I believe it's based on offense. Speed is certainly an aspect of offense. So is getting walks. So is BA. It's not simply given to the best "slugger".

I think the traditional triple crown numbers predominantly drive the Silver Slugger voting.

[PuffyPig]

Originally Posted by edabbs44

He closed it by saying "I'm not sure how or why Bruce beat him out" so he was obviously talking about the award.

I thought he was talking about the award.

But the silver slugger award is given to the player with the best offensive contribution. Speed is a definite component of offense. Bruce can run rings around the plodding Holliday. He hit 70 points in OPS better with RISP. That more than makes up the marginal 30 or so points in general OPS.

Especially when all I was responding to was that Holliday had the "way better [offensive] year". He didn't.

[PuffyPig]

Originally Posted by edabbs44

I think the traditional triple crown numbers predominantly drive the Silver Slugger voting.

Based on what?

Since the only criteria listed is "offense", voters can decide themselves what constitutes offense.

[edabbs44]

Originally Posted by PuffyPig

Based on what?

Since the only criteria listed is "offense", voters can decide themselves what constitutes offense.

They base their selections on a combination of offensive statistics including batting average, on-base percentage, and slugging percentage, as well as the coaches’ and managers’ general impressions of a player’s overall offensive value.

Since the traditional numbers are highlighted, and based upon the past winners, I think much more weight is given to those areas. Especially power numbers.

[PuffyPig]

Originally Posted by edabbs44

Since the traditional numbers are highlighted, and based upon the past winners, I think much more weight is given to those areas. Especially power numbers.

"Especially power numbers" suggest that Bruce was picked becuase he had the 2nd most EBH and 2nd best ISO among OF's in the NL.

[Redhook]

Originally Posted by PuffyPig

I thought he was talking about the award.

But the silver slugger award is given to the player with the best offensive contribution. Speed is a definite component of offense. Bruce can run rings around the plodding Holliday. He hit 70 points in OPS better with RISP. That more than makes up the marginal 30 or so points in general OPS.

Especially when all I was responding to was that Holliday had the "way better [offensive] year". He didn't.

I was talking about the award.

Looking over all the stats again and reading all the comments, I still believe Holliday had a better year in the Silver Slugger categories. I went a bit too far by saying it was way better, but I still believe it was better. It pains me to say that because I love Bruce and the fact that he plays for the Reds. And, on top of that, I'd rather have Bruce than Holliday on my team, and believe he's the better player overall.

Bruce is faster and a better runner than Holliday, but Bruce only had 9 stolen bases. He's no speed demon himself so I'm not sure how that would've separated him that much from Holliday for this award.

Both were weaker than normal with RISP with Holliday being worse. I'm not sold that the difference in OPS with RISP makes up the difference for the entire year's OPS. But, I understand your thoughts on that.

Why I truly believe Holliday's year was better for the Silver Slugger award is because his batting average and on-base percentage were so much higher than Jay's. Way higher. Based on those stats, Holliday was the tougher out. That's pretty important to me.

Hopefully, next year, this award will again be awarded to Bruce and it will be a no-brainer!

[PuffyPig]

Originally Posted by Redhook

I was talking about the award.

Looking over all the stats again and reading all the comments, I still believe Holliday had a better year in the Silver Slugger categories. I went a bit too far by saying it was way better, but I still believe it was better. It pains me to say that because I love Bruce and the fact that he plays for the Reds. And, on top of that, I'd rather have Bruce than Holliday on my team, and believe he's the better player overall.

Bruce is faster and a better runner than Holliday, but Bruce only had 9 stolen bases. He's no speed demon himself so I'm not sure how that would've separated him that much from Holliday for this award.

Both were weaker than normal with RISP with Holliday being worse. I'm not sold that the difference in OPS with RISP makes up the difference for the entire year's OPS. But, I understand your thoughts on that.

Why I truly believe Holliday's year was better for the Silver Slugger award is because his batting average and on-base percentage were so much higher than Jay's. Way higher. Based on those stats, Holliday was the tougher out. That's pretty important to me.

Hopefully, next year, this award will again be awarded to Bruce and it will be a no-brainer!

Holliday also ranks near the top in being a dirty filthy Cardinal. That knocks him down to Cairo/Valdez range, IMO.