Broxton's new 3 year deal

[malcontent]

Visions of another Rich Harden....great stats over 5-6 innings, with high pitch counts (walks, strikeouts and deep counts) forcing early exits.

I'm afraid hitters are going to be far more patient facing Chapman as a starter, so his control is going to have to improve significantly for this to work at all.

[Larkin88]

Off the top of my head, does this make Marshall the only lefty in the bullpen now that Bray is gone and Chapman is seemingly rotation-bound?

Got to think that's something they will look to address in a middle reliever, either through internal rejumbling or by going outside the organization. Cingrani, maybe? (I personally hope he continues to be developed as a starter)

[nkyguys.02]

Walt's plan was for Chapman to start last year, but Madson ended up getting hurt. No surprise he is trying again this year. I don't see it as just slightly overpaying for a closer, I see it as a closer and picking up a potential ace that has the talent to be our true #1. Hopefully we model our plan with Chapman similar to the Braves method with Medlin. Keep Leake around to eat up some innings and as a safety net until the missle proves himself in the rotation. Chapman's stats in spring training were great. Here's to hoping it translate to a full season of starting.

We still need another lefty in the pen, and some help with the sticks. Getting two other needs for the high end price of one closer seems like the right direction to me.

[DocRed]

I'm OK with that if it gets Chapman in the Starting rotation. Plus Brandon League isn't Mariano Rivera either. He is older than Broxton and has worse 2012 and career stats. If that is what League got paid, then Broxton's fair market value should be similar.

Plus, don't forget we were shelling out over $12 million a year for Coco Cordero. Anything seems like a good deal after that...

[MoneyInTheBank]

It's obviously a risk, but the Reds must be pretty confident that his 2nd half of 2010 and all of 2011 was due to injury. You can certainly close out games cheaper than $7M annually but I'm not going to raise too big of a stink over it

[Hondo]

You guys that are saying $7 Million per year is way more than Broxton is worth need to wake up and smell the coffee... That is the market...

I mean, the Reds got a "discount" on Madson last year for $8.5 Million, so if Broxton was not injured in 2011 and had played on a better team than the Royals the entire year... He might have had 40-50 saves last year so $7 Million is quite a bargain considering Broxton is getting security and the Reds aren't having to pay $12-$15 Million per year for a closer.

Good Deal ALL AROUND for both parties.

[texasdave]

Fangraphs not enamored by the deal. They don't really hate it either. Puzzled may be the right word.

http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index...-reds-bullpen/

[LexRedsFan]

It feels like we overpaid. bleh.I kind of agree with the fangraphs sentiment. It's kind of an enigma.

[webbbj]

Originally Posted by Hondo

You guys that are saying $7 Million per year is way more than Broxton is worth need to wake up and smell the coffee... That is the market...

I mean, the Reds got a "discount" on Madson last year for $8.5 Million, so if Broxton was not injured in 2011 and had played on a better team than the Royals the entire year... He might have had 40-50 saves last year so $7 Million is quite a bargain considering Broxton is getting security and the Reds aren't having to pay $12-$15 Million per year for a closer.

Good Deal ALL AROUND for both parties.

Thats the market for overpaid relievers. The guy pitches 1 inning a game and isnt even used properly. (and thats for every manager). The reds bullpen would be just fine w/ who the have coming through the organization.


For $21mill/3yrs that could of been used to get a decent bat which is way more valuable than someone who plays 60 innings.

[TSJ55]

Originally Posted by webbbj

For $21mill/3yrs that could of been used to get a decent bat which is way more valuable than someone who plays 60 innings.

No way Dude. Everybody knows that the Reds starting staff was turrible. Chapman was so hit or miss that his closing role must be changed. Consistent clutch hitting and putting up crooked numbers inning after inning is how they won so many games last year.

[rgslone]

Aren't there still some concerns about the health of Broxton's arm? That was the impression that I had last season. There was also discussion about his drop off in velocity compared to his days with the Dodgers, as well as weight issues. I could have the wrong impressions about Broxton, so somebody with much more knowledge about his situation please reassure me that at least his health is not a concern.

[Larkin88]

Originally Posted by rgslone

Aren't there still some concerns about the health of Broxton's arm? That was the impression that I had last season. There was also discussion about his drop off in velocity compared to his days with the Dodgers, as well as weight issues. I could have the wrong impressions about Broxton, so somebody with much more knowledge about his situation please reassure me that at least his health is not a concern.

His health is improving over where it was going into 2011. I think the Reds are gambling that his time with Cincinnati was more reflective of what we could expect from a healthy Broxton going forward... as opposed to when he was still a little dinged up even with the Royals.

We'll see how it pans out, obviously. I think that's the play here, though.

[texasdave]

http://www.fangraphs.com/statss.aspx...759&position=P

Interesting numbers on Broxton. He was exclusively fastball and slider with the Royals. But since coming over to the Reds he added the cutter. Hmm.

[Salukifan2]

I think you had to try Chapman as a starter at some point or else there would always be that what if feeling, that being said the reds will be in a tight spot if Broxton doesn't work because as everyone knows a bullpen arm could be great one year and awful the next. Its very unlikely that Simon, Arredondo, and Marshall all have sub 3 era next season.

So you have to move Chapman to starter at some point, you just have to hope it doesn't blow up on you.

[webbbj]

Originally Posted by Brittingham.Sam

I think you had to try Chapman as a starter at some point or else there would always be that what if feeling, that being said the reds will be in a tight spot if Broxton doesn't work because as everyone knows a bullpen arm could be great one year and awful the next. Its very unlikely that Simon, Arredondo, and Marshall all have sub 3 era next season.

So you have to move Chapman to starter at some point, you just have to hope it doesn't blow up on you.

They should have started chapman last year. Who is the bullpen should have no bearing on whether chapman is a starter. If the reds want to start him just start him. They wanted to start him last year and had no excuse not to. Madsen getting injured wasnt an excuse. They didnt have to overpay for a "closer" to justify starting chapman.

The whole "closer" role frustrates me, waiting so long to start chapman frustrates me, and the idea that whether chapman starts is contingent on finding a "closer" frustrates me.

I love jockety and the reds I just think chapman has been misused from day 1.

They knew they wanted him to be a starter from the moment they signed him. They should have never flip flopped on that plan. He probably could have started a full season last year if they just stuck to the original plan.