Am l the only person who thinks moving Chapman to the rotation is a very risky move?!

[OGB]

To those throwing the "tired arm" thing out there like some kind of conspiracy theory, keep in mind that he was A) never once diagnosed with a "tired arm" and B) it didn't end his season.
You're essentially projecting an imaginary hindrance on him because you think he should stay the closer.
If Chapman didn't have the stamina or pitches to be a big league starter, the Reds' brass wouldn't have signed him to a 6 year contract, they wouldn't have had him working as a starter last spring, and they wouldn't be planning on moving him again this offseason. End of story.

[TSJ55]

Originally Posted by OGB

...If Chapman didn't have the stamina or pitches to be a big league starter, the Reds' brass wouldn't have signed him to a 6 year contract, they wouldn't have had him working as a starter last spring, and they wouldn't be planning on moving him again this offseason. End of story.

I've avoided this thread b/c it's already on record that I think attempting to move Chapman to the rotation is a mistake. For all of the reasons already stated and additionally my belief that he is more thrower than pitcher and doesn't possess the mental skillset to start.

All that re-stated, I just can't let "End of story" be the end of the story. Just b/c Red's brass thinks something doesn't make it gospel. Are you implying they've never made a bonehead move? All the decisions ever made in the front office were the right ones? Come on man...

[redsfanmia]

Originally Posted by scott91575

None of the Reds starters pitched over 200 innings on a 5 day schedule until they started pitching in the bigs, and there are numerous very successful pitchers that pitched in the bullpen and then moved to starters. Chapman's starting routine was not different than Mike Leake before he became a starter in the major leagues.

Oh, and certainly not all pitchers spend their entire career as a starter. I assume you mean starter, and even then I just gave you David Price and Adam Wainwright who didn't start as a starter. That would be a Cy Young winner and a Cy Young runner up. RA Dickey was a reliever. Roy Halladay made 25 relief appearances with the Jays in his early days. John Smoltz, of course, spent time as a closer before coming back to be an All Star starter again.

Danny Graves did this too and it ruined his career.

[Captain13]

I would be curious to see how many of the people that don't want to move him to the rotation are the same ones who complained the last two seasons that the Reds were "wasting" Chapman in the bullpen.

I, for one, thought the bullpen was a bad idea (I was wrong). Chapman was a starter in Cuba, signed as a starter, and paid as a starter...lets make him a starter. I see 60 innings as a closer or 180 innings as a starter, sounds like 3x the return on a starter.

[SweetLou1990]

I am very concerned that Chapman has a high risk of injury no matter where he is. I think that he is the most dominant reliever in baseball, so why mess with it?

But, I also wonder... " What could have Chapman done as the game 2 starter in the NLDS against the Giants, instead of barely getting, what 2 appearances, can't remember if it was meaningful....

So, instead we may have a rotation of Cueto, Latos, Chapman, Arroyo & Bailey. Bailey last Sept pitched like a solid #2 (or even 1), but with him in the 4 or 5 spot, this could be one helluva rotation.

I hate to admit it I(because I fear the injuries that he appears to be susceptable to), but the risk may be worth the reward.

[Bob Sheed]

Hard Throwing relief pitcher with fatigue and control problems.

Sure, let's make him a starter.

What could go wrong?

[scott91575]

Originally Posted by redsfanmia

Danny Graves did this too and it ruined his career.

Danny Graves ruined his career by being Danny Graves. His year after starting was not much different than the years before in the bullpwn. Graves just got old and was not good to start with.

[HometownHero]

Its very risky but when you have an arm like this you're forced to give it a shot as a SP because if it pans out you can have a #1 level SP which are worth tons. I just hope it works better than Neftali Feliz did this year when the Rangers tried to do the same thing.

[OGB]

Originally Posted by TSJ55

I've avoided this thread b/c it's already on record that I think attempting to move Chapman to the rotation is a mistake. For all of the reasons already stated and additionally my belief that he is more thrower than pitcher and doesn't possess the mental skillset to start.

All that re-stated, I just can't let "End of story" be the end of the story. Just b/c Red's brass thinks something doesn't make it gospel. Are you implying they've never made a bonehead move? All the decisions ever made in the front office were the right ones? Come on man...

I used "end of story" as a figure of speech, so my apologies. That said, believe what you want about the Reds' front office ability to evaluate their own players, but I'm tired of forum members just tossing things out as fact that they've completely fabricated. This takes me back to the dozen or more simpletons who said Bailey would never succeed because he was a head case. All of that was based off of one Enquirer article years ago where some minor league guy made some kind of offhand remark about Homer being stubborn, or something like that.

[TSJ55]

Originally Posted by OGB

I used "end of story" as a figure of speech, so my apologies.

No apology necessary to be sure. No offense taken.

Originally Posted by OGB

That said, believe what you want about the Reds' front office ability to evaluate their own players, but I'm tired of forum members just tossing things out as fact that they've completely fabricated. This takes me back to the dozen or more simpletons who said Bailey would never succeed because he was a head case.

I have to assume you're not grouping me in with the simpletons since I used "I think." and "my belief". As in, it's my opinion that... and not a fact. Ironically, the only factual type language I see is your "End of Story" You also didn't really address my question about Reds front office ever making a mistake.

Originally Posted by OGB

All of that was based off of one Enquirer article years ago where some minor league guy made some kind of offhand remark about Homer being stubborn, or something like that.

I don't read the Enquirer so I'm not aware of this article.

If they decide that Chappy should start, I hope it works out. I will gladly have a huge slice of humble pie in exchange for a big time dominant starter. I simply don't think he has the toolset to start. Heck, he may even be unstable enough that he can't recover from the attempted change. Only time will tell.

[texasdave]

Originally Posted by OGB

I used "end of story" as a figure of speech, so my apologies. That said, believe what you want about the Reds' front office ability to evaluate their own players, but I'm tired of forum members just tossing things out as fact that they've completely fabricated. This takes me back to the dozen or more simpletons who said Bailey would never succeed because he was a head case. All of that was based off of one Enquirer article years ago where some minor league guy made some kind of offhand remark about Homer being stubborn, or something like that.

I think Homer Bailey's stubborness is pretty well-documented. Some guy by the name of Dusty Baker said as much as recently as October of 2012.

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?...s_mlb&c_id=mlb

[OGB]

Originally Posted by texasdave

I think Homer Bailey's stubborness is pretty well-documented. Some guy by the name of Dusty Baker said as much as recently as October of 2012.



http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?...s_mlb&c_id=mlb

I feel like you just helped make my point. Where from that statement or any other past remarks would one get "headcase."

[OGB]

Originally Posted by TSJ55

No apology necessary to be sure. No offense taken.



I have to assume you're not grouping me in with the simpletons since I used "I think." and "my belief". As in, it's my opinion that... and not a fact. Ironically, the only factual type language I see is your "End of Story" You also didn't really address my question about Reds front office ever making a mistake.



I don't read the Enquirer so I'm not aware of this article.

If they decide that Chappy should start, I hope it works out. I will gladly have a huge slice of humble pie in exchange for a big time dominant starter. I simply don't think he has the toolset to start. Heck, he may even be unstable enough that he can't recover from the attempted change. Only time will tell.

I was talking about people in general, not you in particular.

Chapman was given time off last year after a stretch of ineffective relief pitching. How that leads people to believe he's incapable of throwing a starters ininngs is beyond me. This is a guy who was a starter until a few seasons ago and spent all last offseason/spring training in that role.

[texasdave]

I wonder if Hal McCoy would know more than a poster on a message board?

[redsfanmia]

Originally Posted by scott91575

Danny Graves ruined his career by being Danny Graves. His year after starting was not much different than the years before in the bullpwn. Graves just got old and was not good to start with.

Graves was a good closer, he is the Reds all time leader in saves.