Jocketty talking extensions

[traderumor]

Originally Posted by Dan

If (somehow) the Reds are out of it come July, and Arroyo is pitching decently, he'd make a nice piece of trade bait.

Sounds like a really bad booby prize to me.

[westofyou]

Originally Posted by traderumor

Sounds like a really bad booby prize to me.

It's like saying I'm ok because my daughter is old enough to make a living as a stripper if I lose my job.

[cinreds21]

Originally Posted by lollipopcurve

I really want to see them make a run at extending Choo, provided he does well in 2013.

But Ludwick's 2-year deal kinda puts a kink into that. I am going to be very mad if Hamilton is not leading off Opening Day 2014. Extending Choo basically says that's not happening. They could trade Ludwick, but Walt is too loyal to his guys.

[George Anderson]

Originally Posted by cinreds21

But Ludwick's 2-year deal kinda puts a kink into that. I am going to be very mad if Hamilton is not leading off Opening Day 2014. Extending Choo basically says that's not happening. They could trade Ludwick, but Walt is too loyal to his guys.

I don't get this Hamilton worship thing. I am well aware he is a top notch prospect but he hasn't proven yet he can even play above A ball.

[cinreds21]

Originally Posted by George Anderson

I don't get this Hamilton worship thing. I am well aware he is a top notch prospect but he hasn't proven yet he can even play above A ball.

He had a .286 average in 175 at-bats in Double-A with a .406 OBP. Not jaw dropping, but not horrible and worth saying he hasn't proven anything above A-ball. I sincerely think Hamilton will improve and at worse be Juan Pierre. Juan Pierre was damn good in the 2000s. He has game-changing speed and it is what the Reds need as they haven't had, and still do not have, a leadoff hitter in a few years.
And, I don't think Choo is the answer longterm at leadoff. I don't even consider him a leadoff hitter. Only 407 of his 2553 at-bats were batting leadoff.

[PuffyPig]

Originally Posted by George Anderson

I don't get this Hamilton worship thing. I am well aware he is a top notch prospect...........

You actually answered your own question.

Posters like top notch prospects becuase they can turn into top notch players.

He also fills a huge need for the Reds.

[George Anderson]

Originally Posted by PuffyPig

You actually answered your own question.

Posters like top notch prospects becuase they can turn into top notch players.

He also fills a huge need for the Reds.

History shows the vast majority of top notch prospects don't even end up making it to MLB.

When he gets to AAA and shows he can play then I will get excited. Till then he is just another "top notch prospect".

[Scrap Irony]

Originally Posted by George Anderson

History shows the vast majority of top notch prospects don't even end up making it to MLB.

Not true.

Top notch prospects (those ranked between 1-25) are almost sure bets to make it to the major leagues.

Success, however, is certainly not a sure thing at that point.

Hamilton had an outstanding year, both in AA and high A. His obp and speed (not to mention a high slugging percentage) are all signs of a player that can "play up" to his talent level. So are his continued improvement curve and his his high make-up.

In short, there's reason to be excited. (Though expectations need to be tempered with the idea that he may not work out, as you've already mentioned.)

[George Anderson]

Originally Posted by Scrap Irony

Hamilton had an outstanding year, both in AA and high A. His obp and speed (not to mention a high slugging percentage) are all signs of a player that can "play up" to his talent level. So are his continued improvement curve and his his high make-up.

In short, there's reason to be excited. (Though expectations need to be tempered with the idea that he may not work out, as you've already mentioned.)

.286 average in 175 at-bats in Double-A with a .406 OBP is an outstanding year?

Hamilton very well may one day live up to his expectations but the poster I responded to originally was saying he would be dissapointed if Walt didn't have him penciled in at the leadoff spot in 2014. It is way to early to expect that considering what we have seen so far in the minors.

[Scrap Irony]

Originally Posted by George Anderson

.286 average in 175 at-bats in Double-A with a .406 OBP is an outstanding year?

Let's finish those numbers, shall we?

.286/ .406/ .383/ .789

51 SB/ 16 CS

33 Runs

50 games

17% BB rate
20 % K rate

22-years-old

I'd call that pretty incredible for 50 games, yeah.

If you extrapolate those numbers over a full season, you're talking a leadoff guy scoring 100 runs, with 150 SB, and an obp over .400.

Who wouldn't take that?

[PuffyPig]

Originally Posted by George Anderson

History shows the vast majority of top notch prospects don't even end up making it to MLB.

When he gets to AAA and shows he can play then I will get excited. Till then he is just another "top notch prospect".

Many top propsects never reach AAA, reaching the major leagues from AA.

If a player can handle AA with ease, he's pretty much a sure bet to reach the majors in some sort of capacity.

[George Anderson]

Originally Posted by Scrap Irony

Let's finish those numbers, shall we?

.286/ .406/ .383/ .789

51 SB/ 16 CS

33 Runs

50 games

17% BB rate
20 % K rate

22-years-old

I'd call that pretty incredible for 50 games, yeah.

If you extrapolate those numbers over a full season, you're talking a leadoff guy scoring 100 runs, with 150 SB, and an obp over .400.

Who wouldn't take that?

Well we are all entitled to what we define as a "pretty incredible" but the reality is this "pretty incredible" feat as you defined it only happened in 50 games at the AA level. Show me where Hamilton can put up these numbers consistently in more games at a higher level and I will jump on the bandwagon.

[cinreds21]

Well, just watch Louisville this season and you'll see.

[Tadasimha]

Originally Posted by cinreds21

But Ludwick's 2-year deal kinda puts a kink into that. I am going to be very mad if Hamilton is not leading off Opening Day 2014. Extending Choo basically says that's not happening. They could trade Ludwick, but Walt is too loyal to his guys.

Why would this make you mad? It would be a really good thing imho for Hamilton (provided he shows development at AAA and if he gets a September call-up) to be the 4th outfielder behind Choo and Ludwick - getting his feet wet, making starts in CF with Choo in LF so Ludwick gets a break, coming in as a pinch runner. He could easily play his way into a starters roll by the end of the season or end up getting ready to be the starter in 2015 with Choo in LF after Ludwick's contract is up.

[cinreds21]

I can't stand when teams bring up a top prospect and lets him rot on the bench. In September, I understand, but I think it would be be stupid to let his arbitration clock continue to click if they don't play on him starting in April 2014. Then again, the Reds have shown with Frazier that they don't care if you're better than who is starting.