Berkman signs with Rangers for 1yr/$10MM

[PuffyPig]

Originally Posted by MikeThierry

I'm not going to deny it has its uses. It would make sense if you're trying to analyze how a player will do going forward. It doesn't make sense though when talking about past performance and comparing it to others performance that particular year.

But you are condemning Greinke for having a decent WAR because you say his WAR doesn't measure up to his results (presumably because of bad luck, being on bad team etc.).

When signing Greinke, I believe the Angels were looking at what he was likely to do in the future, as they should.

[*BaseClogger*]

I enjoy reading Mike's posts and believe if you do not want to read his contributions you should simply put him on ignore rather than whining about it (especially when it's the only reason you ever post anymore). It would be selfish and unfair the rest of us to push Mike out of the conversation...

[OnBaseMachine]

No one is whining, and who are you referring to about only posting to point out Mike's posts? Sure as heck isn't me. But Mike is definitely a big reason why I rarely post as much anymore. It's no fun logging onto a Reds board and having to constantly read the Cardinals bragging.

[MikeThierry]

Originally Posted by PuffyPig

But you are condemning Greinke for having a decent WAR because you say his WAR doesn't measure up to his results (presumably because of bad luck, being on bad team etc.).

When signing Greinke, I believe the Angels were looking at what he was likely to do in the future, as they should.

That's a fair assessment and I think you pointed out what a lot of GM's do. I'm looking at his stats and he only had one really spectacular year. I think it would be remote that he has a year even close to his 2009 season and going by his career he's a pitcher that seems to be a #2,#3 type pitcher. I guess teams can hope upon hope that the "luck factor" will turn around but thus far it hasn't. I certainly do not feel he has put up the kind of numbers that warrent Ace type money. Plus, as I pointed out before, I question his mental makeup. He had trouble in KC and every time I see him pitch I just do not see that "IT" factor. When I see a guy like Karate Boy (Cueto) on the mound, I see a pitcher that is fearless and a guy that you can rely on to pitch a big game. When I see Greinke, I see a guy who slumps his shoulders at times and does let pressure get to him. The psychological aspect of the game is something numbers can't quanify but it is there.

[MikeThierry]

Originally Posted by OnBaseMachine

No one is whining, and who are you referring to about only posting to point out Mike's posts? Sure as heck isn't me. But Mike is definitely a big reason why I rarely post as much anymore. It's no fun logging onto a Reds board and having to constantly read the Cardinals bragging.

How about growing a thicker skin maybe? People here all the time slag on the Cardinals and guys like Molina who's an otherwise great person yet I just let it roll off my shoulders. I'm not telling you how you should post or feel but it would serve you well to let things like that not bother you.

[OnBaseMachine]

Originally Posted by MikeThierry

How about growing a thicker skin maybe? People here all the time slag on the Cardinals and guys like Molina who's an otherwise great person yet I just let it roll off my shoulders. I'm not telling you how you should post or feel but it would serve you well to let things like that not bother you.

Um, this is a REDS message board. Do you really think we're going to brag on the Cardinals?

[MikeThierry]

Originally Posted by OnBaseMachine

Um, this is a REDS message board. Do you really think we're going to brag on the Cardinals?

Look, I'm not going to discuss this issue any more considering that it has been addressed time and time again by moderators and others here. If you want to continue this childish exchange, you can send me a private message. If I'm making your life difficult IGNORE ME.

[PuffyPig]

Originally Posted by MikeThierry

That's a fair assessment and I think you pointed out what a lot of GM's do. I'm looking at his stats and he only had one really spectacular year. I think it would be remote that he has a year even close to his 2009 season and going by his career he's a pitcher that seems to be a #2,#3 type pitcher. I guess teams can hope upon hope that the "luck factor" will turn around but thus far it hasn't. I certainly do not feel he has put up the kind of numbers that warrent Ace type money. Plus, as I pointed out before, I question his mental makeup. He had trouble in KC and every time I see him pitch I just do not see that "IT" factor. When I see a guy like Karate Boy (Cueto) on the mound, I see a pitcher that is fearless and a guy that you can rely on to pitch a big game. When I see Greinke, I see a guy who slumps his shoulders at times and does let pressure get to him. The psychological aspect of the game is something numbers can't quanify but it is there.

Even if you exclude his "great" year, he's been a 5 WAR pitcher on the other a years (4.0 in 2011 equates to 5 when you extrapolate his missed starts).

Cueto had a career best last year (by far) of 4.9.

BTW, in the last 5 years Greinke ranks 5th in baseball in WAR for pitchers.

That spells more than an "average" pitcher anyway you cut it.

[kaldaniels]

Mike the Cardinal Homer is gonna get razed more often than most on this board, by myself included, and I've come to accept the fact that he can live with that due to the quality of the board. At sometime in the future I may even get annoyed with him and tell him to go back to Cardinals-land. But I won't be blaming him for my lack of posting.

I actually wait for the day we get to see Mike talk himself through a last place Cardinal season...but who am I kidding, he won't be poking around on here when that happens. Just joking, Mike...or am I?

[kaldaniels]

Originally Posted by PuffyPig

Even if you exclude his "great" year, he's been a 5 WAR pitcher on the other a years (4.0 in 2011 equates to 5 when you extrapolate his missed starts).

Cueto had a career best last year (by far) of 4.9.

BTW, in the last 5 years Greinke ranks 5th in baseball in WAR for pitchers.

That spells more than an "average" pitcher anyway you cut it.

Yep. For anyone out there who puts Greinke in the #3 category, my homework assignment is to give me a list of all the #1 and #2 pitchers you feel are in MLB right now.

[westofyou]

Originally Posted by kaldaniels

I actually wait for the day we get to see Mike talk himself through a last place Cardinal season...but who am I kidding, he won't be poking around on here when that happens. Just joking, Mike...or am I?

Ya mean like this guy?

http://www.redszone.com/forums/member.php?u=1173

[Plus Plus]

Originally Posted by OnBaseMachine

Um, this is a REDS message board. Do you really think we're going to brag on the Cardinals?

First of all, this is a baseball forum that consists largely of Reds fans and was founded by Reds fans. It is not exclusively for Reds fans' usage, nor is it prohibited to follow another baseball team and also post here. If you read the forum's "about us," you will see that there is not a single part there about fans of other teams and how they aren't welcome. This has been discussed numerous times on the ORG and is not a point of debate.

Second, I don't see any "Cardinals bragging" going on in Mikes posts. He posted a position about Loshe vs. Wainwright and the Berkman signing, and used both facts and opinion to back up his statement. Just because a topic contains a Cardinals player doesn't make it "bragging," any more than posts about how Miguel Cairo was a poor third baseman in 2012 make someone a Reds hater.

Third, as Mike brought up, the site has a terrific ignore function. If the two ORG members who are Cardinals fans are keeping you from participating on RedsZone after 34,000+ posts, then I would recommend exploring the ignore function or not opening threads about current or formal Cardinals players.

If you (or anyone else) have questions beyond this, please send any of the moderators or administrators a PM. However, this random and repeated bickering because someone wears a red hat with a StL on it instead of a red hat with a wishbone C needs to stop.

[Blitz Dorsey]

You guys are waaaaaaay too hard on Mike.

It's not like he's a Michigan fan or something.

[RedsBaron]

I've been a Reds fan since 1966, but Mike is one of my favorite posters here.

[MikeThierry]

Originally Posted by Blitz Dorsey

You guys are waaaaaaay too hard on Mike.

It's not like he's a Michigan fan or something.

hmm... I might just become one HAHAHA just kidding guys. Any state that has the Detroit Red Wings as their primary point of pride is a state I can't get on board with in any sports.