Chris Carpenter likely out for 2013.

[LoganBuck]

Originally Posted by Brutus

Bleacher Report has been bought by Comcast/NBC so yes, NOW they're trying to make it into a fully-fledged sports site. But when that article was written two years ago, it was nothing more than sports fans blogging on a whim.

Agree outside of Matt Miller the draft guru, BR is a cesspool. Redszone should never post links to BR, we are better than that.

[PuffyPig]

Originally Posted by MikeThierry

That's a good question

Waino vs. Cueto: I see it as a push. If someone held a gun to my head, I would say Cueto right now with known information.
Garcia vs. Latos: Latos
Lynn vs. Bailey: Lynn
Kelly or Miller vs. Arroyo: Kelly or Miller
Westbrook vs. Leake: Push

It really dependson how you place the starters order. Even accepting Mike's analysis:

Cueto=Wainwright
Latos>Lynn
Bailey>Keely or Miller
Arroyo>Garcia
Leake=Westbrrok

[Salukifan2]

Originally Posted by Brutus

I'm not sure what you're getting at with the Phillips hate, but actually it's mostly Cardinals' fans that hate him. Heck, the guy has almost a million followers on Twitter.

In fact, that is the most of any MLB player with Twitter near as I can tell:

MLB Twitter accounts

Not everyone uses Twitter, and among those who do, not everyone uses it very often, but Phillips is so far ahead of everyone else in followers, it's hard to suggest he's "hated" outside of St. Louis.

Phillips is one of the more popular players in baseball. I'm sure there are plenty that hate him, but you could find people that hate any player.

Yes, people who say ridiculous things always have people that want to listen. Thats why Howard Stern, Don Imus, Bill MAher, Bill O'reilly, etc.... are all millionaires. T-Plush had alot of followers too.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/mul...content.4.html

That list is of "most Eccentric" which is a nice way of saying annoying.

He's the one who insulted a team and a fan base on a radio show, then showed up the other teams catcher at the beginning of a game starting a brawl. Yes, both teams were too blame but if Phillips would have first, not said anything inflamatory or second not came up to molina like they were old chums jus to get a rise out of him then the fight wouldn't have happened.

He is also the one who accused Neil walker of being a racist when Neil Walker's family practically prays to Roberto Clemente every night. Neil Walker is about the furthest thing from a racist.

Also, major networks aren't going to publish lists of the most annoying players. They will leave that to bloggers which is why it works fine for this. For analysis yeah its not that great, but for an article about annoying players? its just fine

[Salukifan2]

Originally Posted by PuffyPig

It really dependson how you place the starters order. Even accepting Mike's analysis:

Cueto=Wainwright
Latos>Lynn
Bailey>Keely or Miller
Arroyo>Garcia
Leake=Westbrrok

Westbrook is better than leake. Arroyo is not better than a healthy garcia.

[RedsfaninMT]

Originally Posted by MikeThierry

It's not out of the question that the Cards resign Lohse now that this news hit. Plus I expect Wainwright to be better, two years removed from injury and I expect both Kelly and Lynn to be better in their second year in the majors.

mlbtraderumors.com (yes, they have been wrong before) says the Cards have negligible interest in Lohse, tthat hey prefer to get the #1 draft pick compensation.

As for as the Cardinals' fans...I don't care what sport you're talking about, claims of "we have the best fans in all of the sport" always rub me the wrong way, and that has been a frequent claim by Cards fans over the years. It similarly used to tick me off to hear the Cowboys fans claim the Cowboys "are America's team."

Good rivalries comes from competing for the playoffs, and certainly the rivalry between the Reds and Cards had heated up only over the past few years. Let the teams settle it on the field.

Leave the postulations about having "the best fans in the sport" out of it.

[Salukifan2]

It annoys me too. But honestly, i hear sportacasters say it more than fans now. Every team should say that about their fans and most do. When you have Joe Buck and Tim Mccarver constantly spewing Cardinals BS on TV it doesn't help shake that connotation.

[Brutus]

Originally Posted by Salukifan2

Yes, people who say ridiculous things always have people that want to listen. Thats why Howard Stern, Don Imus, Bill MAher, Bill O'reilly, etc.... are all millionaires. T-Plush had alot of followers too.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/mul...content.4.html

That list is of "most Eccentric" which is a nice way of saying annoying.

He's the one who insulted a team and a fan base on a radio show, then showed up the other teams catcher at the beginning of a game starting a brawl. Yes, both teams were too blame but if Phillips would have first, not said anything inflamatory or second not came up to molina like they were old chums jus to get a rise out of him then the fight wouldn't have happened.

He is also the one who accused Neil walker of being a racist when Neil Walker's family practically prays to Roberto Clemente every night. Neil Walker is about the furthest thing from a racist.

Also, major networks aren't going to publish lists of the most annoying players. They will leave that to bloggers which is why it works fine for this. For analysis yeah its not that great, but for an article about annoying players? its just fine

What "ridiculous" things have been said by Phillips? I don't know if you're aware of this, but when Phillips called the Cardinals whiny babies, the entire NL Central fanbase stood up and applauded for Phillips saying what everyone knew to be true.

[757690]

One thing reds fans need to remember is that Phillips was annoying when he first came up. He was terrible handling the press, and was a hot dog on the field. Many fans, including most Cardinal fans, have no idea that he has pulled a 180 and become one of the nicest, fan and media friendliest players in the game.

I doubt Mike and SalukiFan know that during the season, Phillips has a daily contest on his twitter account and the winner gets a phone call and signed balls, hats, etc. from Brandon, many times delivered himself.

So I'm sure there are fans who haven't been paying attention, who think Phillips is still the annoying hot dog he was a few years ago, and thus still find him annoying. But presently, Phillips has turned that around and is a very popular fan favorite to those who have been paying retention.

[coachpipe]

He's been battling the past few years with injury and he's getting old. Plus I hate him and everything about the cards. So glad he's gone.

[Mutaman]

Glad to see that the merger has led to some serious discussions: like whether BP is a good guy or not.

[757690]

Originally Posted by Salukifan2

Yes, people who say ridiculous things always have people that want to listen. Thats why Howard Stern, Don Imus, Bill MAher, Bill O'reilly, etc.... are all millionaires. T-Plush had alot of followers too.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/mul...content.4.html

That list is of "most Eccentric" which is a nice way of saying annoying.

He's the one who insulted a team and a fan base on a radio show, then showed up the other teams catcher at the beginning of a game starting a brawl. Yes, both teams were too blame but if Phillips would have first, not said anything inflamatory or second not came up to molina like they were old chums jus to get a rise out of him then the fight wouldn't have happened.

He is also the one who accused Neil walker of being a racist when Neil Walker's family practically prays to Roberto Clemente every night. Neil Walker is about the furthest thing from a racist.

Also, major networks aren't going to publish lists of the most annoying players. They will leave that to bloggers which is why it works fine for this. For analysis yeah its not that great, but for an article about annoying players? its just fine

Phillips called Jared Hughes a racist, because of a racist slur that Hughes called him during a game. He never said anything about Neil Walker.

[NCCardfan]

Originally Posted by RED VAN HOT

I wonder if coming back unexpectedly early last year took a toll.

Yes IMO it did hurt him long term. But he came back to get 2 post-season wins in 2012, maybe that made it worth something.

[MikeThierry]

Originally Posted by RedsfaninMT

mlbtraderumors.com (yes, they have been wrong before) says the Cards have negligible interest in Lohse, tthat hey prefer to get the #1 draft pick compensation.

As for as the Cardinals' fans...I don't care what sport you're talking about, claims of "we have the best fans in all of the sport" always rub me the wrong way, and that has been a frequent claim by Cards fans over the years. It similarly used to tick me off to hear the Cowboys fans claim the Cowboys "are America's team."

Good rivalries comes from competing for the playoffs, and certainly the rivalry between the Reds and Cards had heated up only over the past few years. Let the teams settle it on the field.

Leave the postulations about having "the best fans in the sport" out of it.

That annoys me as well, being a Cards fan. I said it here before (I wish I could dig up the thread) that the Cardinals fans cannot consider themselves the best fans in baseball since Jack Buck died. He set the class and tone of Cardinals nation and we have been missing that. As much as I pride myself in saying Cardinals fans gave the Red Sox a standing ovation when they swept us in the WS in 2004, I'm not sure today's fan base would do the same thing in 2013. You will never see me type out here that we have the best fans in baseball.

[757690]

Originally Posted by NCCardfan

Yes IMO it did hurt him long term. But he came back to get 2 post-season wins in 2012, maybe that made it worth something.

Yeah, I actually admire Carp and the Cards for that. In this day of babying pitchers, I like when they let them pitch when the season is on the line.

[MikeThierry]

Originally Posted by Salukifan2

Westbrook is better than leake. Arroyo is not better than a healthy garcia.

Agree with this. There is no way a healthy Garcia is worse than a healthy Arroyo. Puffy, I can see your arguments for the other pitchers but not Arroyo or Westbrook.