It seems simplistic but I agree that the players of late in this organization just don't seem to have winning attitudes.
In 1990 I felt by acquiring guys with playoff experience in Mariano Duncan, Bill Doran, Billy Hatcher, Rick Mahler and with Griffey Sr. already on board they just knew what it took to get a team to win and get in to the playoffs. Throw in Lou Pinella who while hadn't won anything yet as a manager just seemed to add to the chemistry that produced a winning attitude.
I haven't seen a real winning attitude like this since the Greg Vaughn days.
"Boys, I'm one of those umpires that misses 'em every once in a while so if it's close, you'd better hit it." Cal Hubbard
So if it's Owens and Whitesell (which I'm starting to think), I have to think you add Whitesell to the ML team, which means Votto to LF. (which is what the Alonso drafting seemed to indicate anyway)
Otherwise having Whitesell as part of trade is useless.
Bud Selig: "I'm the worst commissioner ever"
Rob Manfred: "Hold my beer"
https://redsintelligence.com/smforum/index.php
MF, I think the question is not whether or not culture/leadership is important. Let's assume it is for the sake of discussion. The question is whether Dunn's presence somehow prevented the Reds from having said culture. I think it's difficult to make the case that Dunn is at fault for the Reds attitude. Rather, I think the attitude is a direct result of a dearth of talent. Losing begets losing. I don't disagree that the Reds culture left a lot to be desired. But I don't see many teams with the poor talent level the Reds have run out there the last 8 years with the type of culture being described. It's tough to adopt a position where losing is unacceptable when the deck is constantly stacked against you.
I suppose one could argue that no amount of talent is worth the money Dunn would require if it does not also come with the type of leadership abilities you've described. However, I imagine that on a team in the hunt, Dunn's attitude and role in the clubhouse will be cast in a very different light. It would have been very interesting to see how Dunn would have been received had he been surrounded with more talent in Red.
Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.
Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.
Eight years of losing and the Reds are paying Dunn and Griffey 25 million while watching this team play to a level of mediocrity.
Maybe the Reds don't get Texieria. Maybe they go with a youth movement. But bottom line is this team wasn't going to win with these two and no matter who the manager or general manager or who the owner is.
If you think small, you'll go nowhere in life.
Duncan, Doran, Hatcher, etc. are great for chemistry when you have Davis, Larkin, O'Neil, Sabo, Rijo, Browning, Myers, Dibble, Charlton. The problem of the Reds of recent vintage is the lack of guys from that group, not the lack of Billy Dorans and Rick Mahlers.
You can't fret about the players who put you over the top when you are sitting at the base of the mountain.
Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.
Chris Young and Brandon Webb on gettin Dunn:
"It's great," D-backs center fielder Chris Young said of the deal. "He's an amazing hitter. He can help any offense out, no doubt about it. I'm glad to have him here.
"He puts up some amazing power numbers. You know he's going to hit some home runs and he brings us some excitement to the game as well."
"It's going to be good," said pitcher Brandon Webb. "He's a guy that produces a lot of runs, he draws some walks and has a good on-base percentage. I don't know where they're going to stick him, but wherever it is, he's going to do some damage."
http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?...=.jsp&c_id=ari
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