How did Walt do?

[BRM]

Just for good measure, from the same Fox Sports article:

Loser: Blue Jays

The Blue Jays asked the world for ace Roy Halladay and never moved him. As if that wasn't bad enough, they acquired a known head case in the Reds' Edwin Encarnacion for Scott Rolen. J.P. Ricciardi played a dangerous game with Halladay, asking top dollar for him. Now he's Toronto's to keep for another season. If Halladay is traded for considerably less next season, this will look even worse.

[nate]

I don't know if Miller is privy to important information that those outside of the Reds FO aren't privy to, but here is Zach Stewart's bio pic from his minor league baseball stats page:

I hear they all float down there.

[Homer Bailey]

In the last year, our GM has signed the 4th least valuable player in baseball (based on VORP) to a 2 year contract, and traded our best pitching prospect for a 35 year old 3B with an injury history. How did Walt do? HA!

Oh, and somehow he hasn't fired Dusty Baker. Walt gets an F from me.

[edabbs44]

In the last year, our GM has signed the 4th least valuable player in baseball (based on VORP) to a 2 year contract, and traded our best pitching prospect for a 35 year old 3B with an injury history. How did Walt do? HA!

Oh, and somehow he hasn't fired Dusty Baker. Walt gets an F from me.

That's a really skewed way of looking at things. We could also say that he traded an unproven minor league pitcher who some project as a reliever for a pretty nice upgrade at 3B.

[BRM]

Is it the consensus opinion that Zach Stewart was the Reds best pitching prospect? Is Zach Stewart the reliever a better prospect than Travis Wood the starter? I can see where Stewart would be the top guy if he was clearly projected to be a starter but there seems to be some doubt. Just curious what the thoughts are.

[Homer Bailey]

That's a really skewed way of looking at things. We could also say that he traded an unproven minor league pitcher who some project as a reliever for a pretty nice upgrade at 3B.

No it's not a skewed way. It's my opinion. The team is nowhere close to being good, and he mortgaged a great asset of the future for a 3B that might play 100 games next year. Because of this move, there won't be any payroll increases, meaning no Holliday for sure.

Is it the consensus opinion that Zach Stewart was the Reds best pitching prospect? Is Zach Stewart the reliever a better prospect than Travis Wood the starter? I can see where Stewart would be the top guy if he was clearly projected to be a starter but there seems to be some doubt. Just curious what the thoughts are.

Stewart was being groomed to be a starter for the Reds. He was moved to the pen in AAA to cut down on innings. I think he is the best pitching prospect in the organization. Or at least he was.

[nate]

That's a really skewed way of looking at things.

You better sit down before reading this:
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I agree.

[BRM]

I agree.

[edabbs44]

No it's not a skewed way. It's my opinion. The team is nowhere close to being good, and he mortgaged a great asset of the future for a 3B that might play 100 games next year. Because of this move, there won't be any payroll increases, meaning no Holliday for sure.

It's also the opinion of some to say that he sold high on a guy who may have pitched over his head this year for a known commodity who has (KNOCK ON WOOD!!!!!!) stayed away from the injury bug this season and who we know will provide value to the major league product next year.

[Homer Bailey]

It's also the opinion of some to say that he sold high on a guy who may have pitched over his head this year for a known commodity who has (KNOCK ON WOOD!!!!!!) stayed away from the injury bug this season and who we know will provide value to the major league product next year.

Yet the move made the team even more expensive, thus basically eliminating any splash the Reds were going to make in the FA pool next year (which was probably going to be none anyway). The Reds needed to sign Holliday, and now they certainly will not. The trading chips could have been used to fill other holes (SS, CF).

Now the Reds will probably do their annual terrible signings of a couple cheap players that sign for not so cheap money and don't serve any purpose (see Hairston, Taveras, Gonzalez, Lincoln, etc.).

[jojo]

Zach Stewart is an interesting arm. That said, he's more likely to be a relief pitcher than a starter on someone's 25 man roster.

I think some have him penned into a major league rotation with the expectation he'll be there really soon.

[Bumstead]

Maybe, but how improved are the Reds going to be if they are saddled by Rolen's $11M salary? How are the Reds going to replace the pitching that they have lost (ie: Volquez) if they trade away potential candidates and don't have the payroll flexibility to sign a quality starter? Why give up players like Stewart for a guy that makes $11M? Encarnacion was enough by himself. Who's going to play in the OF???

You can't rebuild from the middle and they are trying it again...it won't work without having the ability (payroll wise) to sign good free agents. The Reds don't have that kind of Payroll flexibility regardless of how that parameter is set. Terrible baseball trade in my opinion.

Bum

[nate]

Yet the move made the team even more expensive, thus basically eliminating any splash the Reds were going to make in the FA pool next year (which was probably going to be none anyway).

But we really don't know how much money above and beyond Rolen adds to next year's payroll.

The Reds needed to sign Holliday, and now they certainly will not.

I don't think they need to sign Holliday as it would take an enormous chunk of payroll (I read an article today speculating he'll likely get 5 years/$75mm) and get us right back into the team's biggest problem: below average performance at too many positions. The same money that could put Holliday in LF might be able to net average performance at SS and a starting pitcher. I think that makes the overall team better than just signing Holliday.

Of course, if Uncle Bob wants to go to the ATM and get Holliday, I'm down.

The trading chips could have been used to fill other holes (SS, CF).

Yes, perhaps.

Now the Reds will probably do their annual terrible signings of a couple cheap players that sign for not so cheap money and don't serve any purpose (see Hairston, Taveras, Gonzalez, Lincoln, etc.).

Perhaps. Walt's got a lot to do between now and next opening day. Especially with the news of Volquez' injury.

[nate]

Maybe, but how improved are the Reds going to be if they are saddled by Rolen's $11M salary? How are the Reds going to replace the pitching that they have lost (ie: Volquez) if they trade away potential candidates and don't have the payroll flexibility to sign a quality starter? Why give up players like Stewart for a guy that makes $11M? Encarnacion was enough by himself. Who's going to play in the OF???

You can't rebuild from the middle and they are trying it again...it won't work without having the ability (payroll wise) to sign good free agents. The Reds don't have that kind of Payroll flexibility regardless of how that parameter is set. Terrible baseball trade in my opinion.

Bum

They're making it out to be a mystery Angela Lansbury and Madlock couldn't solve but I don't think the Reds are on the hook for the entire $11mm.

[Homer Bailey]

But we really don't know how much money above and beyond Rolen adds to next year's payroll.

I don't think they need to sign Holliday as it would take an enormous chunk of payroll (I read an article today speculating he'll likely get 5 years/$75mm) and get us right back into the team's biggest problem: below average performance at too many positions. The same money that could put Holliday in LF might be able to net average performance at SS and a starting pitcher. I think that makes the overall team better than just signing Holliday.

Of course, if Uncle Bob wants to go to the ATM and get Holliday, I'm down.

Yes, perhaps.

Perhaps. Walt's got a lot to do between now and next opening day. Especially with the news of Volquez' injury.

I agree with pretty much everything there. The thing I am/was most upset about is the fact that this move makes me fear the other moves that are to follow (or the moves that will now not occur).