Your Offseason Plan in 3 Moves or Less

[TRF]

My 3 move plan is a contingent plan.

If Choo accepts QO

1. Offer Leake and Phillips to A's for Cespedes. (they'll say no.) If they say yes, move Hamilton to 2B immediately. He starts at 2B in 2013 for the Reds.

2. Cingrani takes Leake's place in the rotation (actually he takes Arroyo's place.) Offer Arroyo, Marcum, Colon, Hughes, Haren, Garza a 2 year deal around 9 mil per year.

3. Start Chapman in ST. Seems it makes him very effective as a closer when he starts ST.

If Choo rejects QO

Same thing but offer contract to one or two of Ellsbury, Nix, D. Young

In both scenarios I DFA Ludwick.

[mth123]

1. Three way deal with Rockies and Royals. Royals get Brandon Phillips and Daniel Corcino, Rockies get Aaron Crow, Tim Collins, Emilio Bonifacio and Chris Heisey. Reds get Dexter Fowler and Josh Rutledge.

2. Mike Leake to the Angels for Howie Kendrick

3. Ryan Hanigan to the Red Sox for Brandon Workman

Fowler CF
Kendrick 2B
Votto 1B
Bruce RF
Ludwick LF
Frazier 3B
Mesoraco C
Cozart SS

Pena C
Schumaker 2B/OF
Rutledge IF
Paul OF
Hannahan IF

Latos
Cueto
Bailey
Cingrani
Chapman

Hoover
Marshall
Broxton
Lecure
Parra
Simon
Ondrusek, Workman, et al

[MoneyInTheBank]

mth, are you worried about Fowler outside of Coors? Or do you think it's more of a "comfort at home no matter where that may be"?

[Tony Cloninger]

Convince The Yankees to take BP for Brett Gardner...since Cano just signed with the Tigers ...out of the blue.

Trade Homer Bailey, Mike Leake and Ondrusek to the Angels for Trumbo and Kendrick. This is based on Chapman being convinced to join the rotation.

If he does not.....than I convince the Angels to take Heisey and Nick Christian....and tell them it is quantity over quality.

I would have signed Smith from Cleveland, but that is too late.

I go after the former Twin and White Sox reliever who's name escapes me right now but had a great year last year before being traded to a contender.

[vottofan4life]

Convince The Yankees to take BP for Brett Gardner...since Cano just signed with the Tigers ...out of the blue.

Trade Homer Bailey, Mike Leake and Ondrusek to the Angels for Trumbo and Kendrick. This is based on Chapman being convinced to join the rotation.

If he does not.....than I convince the Angels to take Heisey and Nick Christian....and tell them it is quantity over quality.

I would have signed Smith from Cleveland, but that is too late.

I go after the former Twin and White Sox reliever who's name escapes me right now but had a great year last year before being traded to a contender.

Cano never signed with tigers? and the reliever you're talking about is jesse crain i believe

[Tony Cloninger]

Cano never signed with tigers? and the reliever you're talking about is jesse crain i believe

The trade is predicated on Cano signing with another team. It was more of a nice dream I had than anything else.

I even had the Cardinals trading for Andrus because they got desperate and gave up Carlos Martinez and Shelby Miller to get him.

To be serious.... Cano signing elsewhere is not that far fetched and could lead to the Yankees trading for BP. The cardinal thing was a nice dream, even before they signed Peralta. I was just hoping they would get desperate.
Which they did by getting Peralta but gave up nothing but money they have enough of to do it. I would have preferred they traded some of their younger players.

[mth123]

mth, are you worried about Fowler outside of Coors? Or do you think it's more of a "comfort at home no matter where that may be"?

GABP is a hitters park too. If I was The Padres, Dodgers or Giants I might worry about it more. But that's another thing. A large portion of his "outside of Coors" is played in SF, SD and LA, three places that are not hitter friendly. I don't think the switch to GABP from Coors will hurt him much at home and the mix of road parks should be much more favorable outside of the NL West.

Even if he suffers a bit from a move out of Coors, he should still be exponentially better than any of the in house options. I don't see Choo, Ellsbury or even Granderson signing with the Reds. One of the Dodgers (Kemp or Ethier) is probably too expensive. The alternatives are scrap heap guys like Gutierrez and Schumaker or staying with Heisey and Hamilton. I'll take Fowler all day, every day in comparison to those alternatives.

[757690]

GABP is a hitters park too. If I was The Padres, Dodgers or Giants I might worry about it more. But that's another thing. A large portion of his "outside of Coors" is played in SF, SD and LA, three places that are not hitter friendly. I don't think the switch to GABP from Coors will hurt him much at home and the mix of road parks should be much more favorable outside of the NL West.

Even if he suffers a bit from a move out of Coors, he should still be exponentially better than any of the in house options. I don't see Choo, Ellsbury or even Granderson signing with the Reds. One of the Dodgers (Kemp or Ethier) is probably too expensive. The alternatives are scrap heap guys like Gutierrez and Schumaker or staying with Heisey and Hamilton. I'll take Fowler all day, every day in comparison to those alternatives.

That's an excellent point about his road splits. Guys who play in Coors, have to play a big chunk of their road games in pitchers parks in SD, SF and LA. It's a big reason why Rockies players have such big home/road splits.

Fowler has hit well in GABP, and his biggest weakness, his range defensively, shouldn't be as big of an issue in GABP as opposed to Coors. He's a really good fit for the Reds.

[kpresidente]

GABP isn't a hitters park, it's a homerun hitters park. There is a difference.

[kpresidente]

But that's another thing. A large portion of his "outside of Coors" is played in SF, SD and LA, three places that are not hitter friendly.

Neither are Bush and PNC. Not quite as extreme but close. Besides, you're looking at 30 games he played at the pitchers parks vs. 100 in Coors and Chase Field. That's pretty dramatic difference.

[PuffyPig]

My 3 move plan is a contingent plan.

If Choo accepts QO

1. Offer Leake and Phillips to A's for Cespedes. (they'll say no.) If they say yes, move Hamilton to 2B immediately. He starts at 2B in 2013 for the Reds.

2. Cingrani takes Leake's place in the rotation (actually he takes Arroyo's place.) Offer Arroyo, Marcum, Colon, Hughes, Haren, Garza a 2 year deal around 9 mil per year.

3. Start Chapman in ST. Seems it makes him very effective as a closer when he starts ST.

If Choo rejects QO

Same thing but offer contract to one or two of Ellsbury, Nix, D. Young

In both scenarios I DFA Ludwick.

Choo turned down the QO long ago.

[mth123]

Neither are Bush and PNC. Not quite as extreme but close. Besides, you're looking at 30 games he played at the pitchers parks vs. 100 in Coors and Chase Field. That's pretty dramatic difference.

Fowler is not a great player or an all star, but even outside of Coors he's way better than the in house options, and in the deals I've proposed, nothing I'd be worried about losing is going the other way for the upgrade. He seems to struggle a bit against RHP, skippy could play those days. Phillips and the long term obligation needs to go, Corcino spit the bit in 2013 and Heisey's arb status is pricing himself out of being useful.

Fowler would give the Reds a chance in the short term that they won't have with Status Quo and getting out from under Phillips improves the long term.

[kpresidente]

Don't get me wrong, I like your trade, and Fowler is def an upgrade, but I think if people are expecting anything close to an .800 OPS they'll be disappointed.

[757690]

Don't get me wrong, I like your trade, and Fowler is def an upgrade, but I think if people are expecting anything close to an .800 OPS they'll be disappointed.

I'm guessing in GAPB, and it's just a wild guess, not supported by in depth research, Fowler would put up a .750ish OPS, driven by a .350ish OBP, which as a leadoff hitter, providing league average defense in CF, would make him a very valuable player for the Reds.

[mth123]

Don't get me wrong, I like your trade, and Fowler is def an upgrade, but I think if people are expecting anything close to an .800 OPS they'll be disappointed.

.725 would be about 150 OPS points more than Billy Hamilton and he'd be the Reds third or fourth best bat with that number depending on how far back Ludwick comes. More than that would be gravy.