Offseason Discussion

[Gapper]

Looks like we just signed a catcher.....

Buster Olney ‏@Buster_ESPN 2m
The Reds' signing of Brayan Pena frees up the Reds to either non-tender Ryan Hanigan or trade him. Rays, Yankees have liked him in the past.

[Gapper]

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2013/1...ayan-pena.html

Looks like he hits pretty well from the left side of the plate, which will do well when he spells Mesoraco. I wonder what we can get for Hanigan.

[RedlegJake]

Hanigan for Matt Joyce. Then you have platoons that work behind the plate and in LF. Cheap too.

[RedlegJ]

Ken_Rosenthal: Pena earned $875K last season and will get raise in this deal, source says. Mesoraco likely starter with Pena backing up, Hanigan on move.

DCameronFG: The AL East bidding war for Ryan Hanigan is going to be fun. Four nerdy teams all need a catcher and will love what Hanigan provides.

[RedlegJ]

Someone posted this in ORG so I thought i'd share. These tweets are from Darren Wolfson. He is a news anchor and sports reporter in Minneapolis. The last two tweets are responses to questions.

The #MNTwins contingency in Orlando at the GM meetings: Ryan, Antony, & Radcliff. Lots of meetings w/ agents & trade talk w/ GMs lined up.

@christopherokey Not yet. Maybe those leak in the next few days. My hunch (no sourcing yet): they talk to the Reds about Homer Bailey.


@ChrisKuznik Ryan told me he will be pro-active & seek out GMs who have arms to move. The A's do (more like Anderson). The Reds do (Bailey).

[JayBruceFan]

Hanigan for Matt Joyce. Then you have platoons that work behind the plate and in LF. Cheap too.

Platoons never work, at any position, in any sport.

[Redsfansince72]

if the Cardinlas get Tulowitzki I am going to be upset!! I dont want to hear another Walt Excuse for doing zilch to IMPROVE the Reds!! The Cards loose Pujols and look WAY better now.. Heck the Reds lost Votto, they would be competing in the wrong direction of the standings..

Cardinals, Rockies To Discuss Troy Tulowitzki Trade
By Charlie Wilmoth [November 10 at 9:51pm CST]

The Cardinals and Rockies will discuss a potential Troy Tulowitzki trade at this week's GM/owner meetings, Jeff Passan of Yahoo! Sports reports. The Cardinals have also asked the Rangers about the possibility of trading for Elvis Andrus or Jurickson Profar, Passan writes.

The Cardinals' troubles at the shortstop position are well-known, as is the depth of their young talent, so potential Tulowitzki or Profar deals have long been the subjects of fan speculation. The Rockies have said they aren't interested in dealing Tulowitzki, but Passan suggests that Rockies ownership may be coming around to the idea of freeing itself of the seven years and $134MM remaining on Tulowitzki's contract, which carries through 2020 (with a club option for 2021).

Passan writes that one potential piece the Rockies might receive in return is first baseman Matt Adams, who so far has been blocked by Allen Craig in St. Louis. Adams hit .284/.335/.503 in part-time duty for the Cardinals this year. The Rockies would also like a pitcher -- the Cardinals will not trade Michael Wacha, but Shelby Miller appears to be a possibility. Adams and Miller would highlight a package of three or four players that the Rockies might receive in return for Tulowitzki.

Tulowitzki's contract has a no-trade clause, but the presence of former Rockies teammate Matt Holliday and the Cardinals' reputation as a winning organization might entice him to accept a deal. Tulowitzki, 29, hit .312/.391/.540 and produced 5.6 wins above replacement in 2013, making him the best shortstop in baseball. His injury history may be a concern, however, given the length of his contract.

[Redsville]

if the Cardinlas get Tulowitzki I am going to be upset!! I dont want to hear another Walt Excuse for doing zilch to IMPROVE the Reds!! The Cards loose Pujols and look WAY better now.. Heck the Reds lost Votto, they would be competing in the wrong direction of the standings..

Cardinals, Rockies To Discuss Troy Tulowitzki Trade
By Charlie Wilmoth [November 10 at 9:51pm CST]

The Cardinals and Rockies will discuss a potential Troy Tulowitzki trade at this week's GM/owner meetings, Jeff Passan of Yahoo! Sports reports. The Cardinals have also asked the Rangers about the possibility of trading for Elvis Andrus or Jurickson Profar, Passan writes.

The Cardinals' troubles at the shortstop position are well-known, as is the depth of their young talent, so potential Tulowitzki or Profar deals have long been the subjects of fan speculation. The Rockies have said they aren't interested in dealing Tulowitzki, but Passan suggests that Rockies ownership may be coming around to the idea of freeing itself of the seven years and $134MM remaining on Tulowitzki's contract, which carries through 2020 (with a club option for 2021).

Passan writes that one potential piece the Rockies might receive in return is first baseman Matt Adams, who so far has been blocked by Allen Craig in St. Louis. Adams hit .284/.335/.503 in part-time duty for the Cardinals this year. The Rockies would also like a pitcher -- the Cardinals will not trade Michael Wacha, but Shelby Miller appears to be a possibility. Adams and Miller would highlight a package of three or four players that the Rockies might receive in return for Tulowitzki.

Tulowitzki's contract has a no-trade clause, but the presence of former Rockies teammate Matt Holliday and the Cardinals' reputation as a winning organization might entice him to accept a deal. Tulowitzki, 29, hit .312/.391/.540 and produced 5.6 wins above replacement in 2013, making him the best shortstop in baseball. His injury history may be a concern, however, given the length of his contract.

I was curious if anyone saw this late last night. Didn't see a topic thread for this all to its own yet, but curious if it deserves one. I only hope that this gets Bob and Walts attention to the fullest this week at the GM meetings. If the Cardinals have the intent to make a huge splash we better act first or counter.

[MoneyInTheBank]

Platoons never work, at any position, in any sport.

The World Series champs used platoons at Catcher, LF and 1B

[RedlegJake]

Yeah...platoons never work. I left it alone because I thought it had to be sarcasm. You're just wrong.

[mth123]

Yeah...platoons never work. I left it alone because I thought it had to be sarcasm. You're just wrong.

I think platoons are very helpful where most hitters are concerned. The Reds have a lot of guys who seem to struggle similarly against RHP - Frazier, Mesoraco, Heisey, Phillips, Cozart and even Ludwick these days. These guys are probably more than the short half of a platoon, but adding a LH bat that would allow some of these guys to sit about half the time against RHP should help. Xavier Paul is really the only "other half" on the roster. Maybe Brayan Pena can fill the role at catcher. Jack Hannahan is the kind of guy who makes it appear that platoons don't work. The right guys can boost production from the position as a tandem more than what either can provide individually. The problem is sometimes the LH half is a poor hitter and doesn't help much. Jettison Hannahan and bring in Eric Chavez for about 40 starts per year and the production at 3B will rise dramatically IMO.

[Old school 1983]

I think platoons are very helpful where most hitters are concerned. The Reds have a lot of guys who seem to struggle similarly against RHP - Frazier, Mesoraco, Heisey, Phillips, Cozart and even Ludwick these days. These guys are probably more than the short half of a platoon, but adding a LH bat that would allow some of these guys to sit about half the time against RHP should help. Xavier Paul is really the only "other half" on the roster. Maybe Brayan Pena can fill the role at catcher. Jack Hannahan is the kind of guy who makes it appear that platoons don't work. The right guys can boost production from the position as a tandem more than what either can provide individually. The problem is sometimes the LH half is a poor hitter and doesn't help much. Jettison Hannahan and bring in Eric Chavez for about 40 starts per year and the production at 3B will rise dramatically IMO.

I'm agreeing with this 100%. If third base does not receive a full blown upgrade, Chavez would be an excellent platoon partner with Frazier.

[RedlegJake]

I think platoons are very helpful where most hitters are concerned. The Reds have a lot of guys who seem to struggle similarly against RHP - Frazier, Mesoraco, Heisey, Phillips, Cozart and even Ludwick these days. These guys are probably more than the short half of a platoon, but adding a LH bat that would allow some of these guys to sit about half the time against RHP should help. Xavier Paul is really the only "other half" on the roster. Maybe Brayan Pena can fill the role at catcher. Jack Hannahan is the kind of guy who makes it appear that platoons don't work. The right guys can boost production from the position as a tandem more than what either can provide individually. The problem is sometimes the LH half is a poor hitter and doesn't help much. Jettison Hannahan and bring in Eric Chavez for about 40 starts per year and the production at 3B will rise dramatically IMO.

I agree 100%. I was disagreeing with JayBuceFan who said platoons never work in any sport. Platoons are extremely useful. Frazier/Chavez as you point out, would be so much more productive than just Frazier. Catcher is a position that really lends itself to platooning effectively because few catchers can go 145-150 games a year. Having guys that split opposite is ideal. Pena OPS'd .801 last year against righties. Mes was at .874 vs. lefties. Their distaff numbers? Pena .608 vs LH, Mes .576 vs RH. Platoon heaven.

[JayBruceFan]

It was hardly sarcasm but I guess I shouldn't have worded it in such absolute terms. But they rarely, if ever, sustain any type of long term success and are something you shouldn't be building a club around, if you can help it that is.

Outside of catcher, platoons are rarely effective for any extended period of time. They may work for a season or two but it's not really productive in the long run because 1 or both players will eventually come back to earth.

Look at football for an example, almost every situation that has involved platooning QB's has failed miserably or someone has risen to the occasion to win the job. It's hardly a perfect science and should always be a last resort.

[Redsville]

Is this too far fetched....

-Say Pena deal is to free up Mesoraco not Hannigan for a trade.
-Reds understand don't stand a chance to sign Bailey long term, need to trade to team with large enough payroll that can
-Walt/Bob want to unload BP very badly based off of comments made, also need team with 2b open and large payroll

Reds/Dodgers...

BP/Bailey/Hamilton/Mesoraco
4
Kemp/Z Lee/2b prospect

BP & future money of Arroyo/Bailey/Choo allows us to afford Kemp.

I'm not sure if we would want to lock up that much payroll with Kemp/Votto..but who knows

Sounds like from radio guys like Lance that we could be in for huge offseason.