6/02/13 Redlegs v. Peglegs

[Norm Chortleton]

I wouldn't mind to see Fay or Sheldon or Marty or P Doc or even C Trent manage a game or two.

[UK Reds Fan]

-Dusty justs want to pitch Chapman in the 9th only...even when Broxton has been struggling badly.
-Lecure threw 12 pitches the other game of series yet..it is w.o question Broxton's place to throw in the 8th inning of games we lead in.

I'm sorry, but he can complain of media all he wants...the continued "automatic roles" of this team have cost games we should have won. He needs to stop the robotic managing of go with the pitchers who are actually our best pitchers (Chapman,Lecure and Hoover have been the best...and go with them).

[BCubb2003]

So who gets the first game, Fay, Daugherty, C. Trent or Mark Sheldon?

[kaldaniels]

Dusty, asked about handling of bullpen: "You can't put in Chapman all the time. ... I don't know man, maybe you should come down & manage."

Hardly thread-worthy.

Unless there is an agenda.

[Roy Tucker]

Dusty does everything by the book.

The problem is, he doesn't realize not every situation is in that book.

[Blitz Dorsey]

Blitz, I bet if you had a bunch of people questioning every single move you made at YOUR job...you might get a bit testy sometimes too, dontcha think?

And besides...since when was it a "bad decision". The moment that YOU decided it was?

What would your response have been if Dusty put Chapman in to pitch the 8th and 9th and he gave up the walkoff then? Or if he pulled Simon when YOU wanted him to only to see Chapman be wild and walk in the winning run?

The "I told you so" act from many around here gets old rather quickly IMO.

It's bigger than one game. I understand what you are saying taking this situation in a nutshell. But answer me this: Why do you think every expert who does this for a living at Baseball Prospectus, Baseball America, etc (the true experts in my eyes) all find Dusty to be a below-average manager? And I'm not exaggerating. They are unanimous that he does things that cost his teams wins every year. Do you think all the experts are wrong?

Listen, I WANT to like Dusty. I really feel like I see a lot of the good that he does. He manages the clubhouse well. He's a leader of men. He (usually) handles the media well (this thread an exception of course). All those things are important. But all the experts are in agreement that he's just not a good manager and games like today prove why in my book. The atrocious defense will overshadow it, but Dusty made some bad decisions IMO.

But again, this particular post (not this thread, but this exact post) is more looking at the macro picture. Dusty just doesn't get it done as well as he should -- and everyone who studies managers for a living agrees.

[RiverRat13]

Hardly thread-worthy.

Unless there is an agenda.

Maybe not, but regardless the "you should come do it" response is weak in any circumstance by a player or manager.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Let's not be confrontational.

Let's be realistic.

Allowing a struggling Broxton to face a power-hitting lefty in that situation was simply a bad move. We all know that the odds of Chapman retiring Jones were exponentially better than Broxton's. Everyone could see it and in a strange, metaphysical sense, feel it as well. He stayed entrenched in his dogmatic adherence to everyone having a certain role and it ended up with Jones putting one in the Allegheny. It was a bad move. No way to sugar-coat it.

Appologies. I wasn't trying to be confrontational. But I am being realistic. Broxton's on the staff...struggling or not, he's got to get some work too. He'll never turn it around if he doesn't pitch. Does anybody think he won't be needed this season?

[TheBigLebowski]

Appologies. I wasn't trying to be confrontational. But I am being realistic. Broxton's on the staff...struggling or not, he's got to get some work too. He'll never turn it around if he doesn't pitch. Does anybody think he won't be needed this season?

Not saying he shouldn't have pitched. Just saying he shouldn't have been trusted to pitch to Jones in that situation.

[Blitz Dorsey]

Maybe not, but regardless the "you should come do it" response is weak in any circumstance by a player or manager.

Yep. Basically, Dusty didn't have a reasonable response and resorted to this childish nonsense. It's unbecoming of a manager.

[New York Red]

I'm no Dusty fan, but I did see the interview after the game. I wouldn't exactly call that "going off on the media". I didn't take it that way at all.

[kaldaniels]

Yep. Basically, Dusty didn't have a reasonable response and resorted to this childish nonsense. It's unbecoming of a manager.

And that's fine to have that opinion. But if you are going to rake him over the coals in the game thread and also run over here to start a thread based on that quote, I'm gonna point it out.

Nothing more. I've said my piece.

[BCubb2003]

Whether it's a good idea or not, doesn't "the book" say the home team uses the closer in a tie because there's no save situation, and the visitors wait for the save? It's not so strange.

Meanwhile, we'll have to hope that Broxton makes a turnaround like Parra has.

[_Sir_Charles_]

It's bigger than one game. I understand what you are saying taking this situation in a nutshell. But answer me this: Why do you think every expert who does this for a living at Baseball Prospectus, Baseball America, etc (the true experts in my eyes) all find Dusty to be a below-average manager? And I'm not exaggerating. They are unanimous that he does things that cost his teams wins every year. Do you think all the experts are wrong?

Listen, I WANT to like Dusty. I really feel like I see a lot of the good that he does. He manages the clubhouse well. He's a leader of men. He (usually) handles the media well (this thread an exception of course). All those things are important. But all the experts are in agreement that he's just not a good manager and games like today prove why in my book. The atrocious defense will overshadow it, but Dusty made some bad decisions IMO.

But again, this particular post (not this thread, but this exact post) is more looking at the macro picture. Dusty just doesn't get it done as well as he should -- and everyone who studies managers for a living agrees.

Simple answer to the bolded item. Because he has become the symbol to those groups as the icon of what's wrong in the game. Right or wrong, he's become the flag bearer for it. How often do you see other managers in the bigs use their closers outside of closing situations? Very rarely. Is it right or wrong? Doesn't matter...Dusty's the one that gets pointed towards. He makes bad moves sometimes. So does every manager. If those "so-called" experts were to look at every manager in an unbiased manner...they'd consider them all to be below average because what they consider to be an average manager simply isn't true. Their ideal manager does NOT exist.

And by the way...I find it extremely funny that you consider the "true experts" to be the guys who don't even play the game. Some of them may have NEVER played the game. Think about that before you label them experts.

[dubc47834]

Let's not be confrontational.

Let's be realistic.

Allowing a struggling Broxton to face a power-hitting lefty in that situation was simply a bad move. We all know that the odds of Chapman retiring Jones were exponentially better than Broxton's. Everyone could see it and in a strange, metaphysical sense, feel it as well. He stayed entrenched in his dogmatic adherence to everyone having a certain role and it ended up with Jones putting one in the Allegheny. It was a bad move. No way to sugar-coat it.

Let's not be confrontational? This starting of this thread was confrontational, he knew this was going to blow up and not to know that is moronic!