Carson Palmer signs Extension

[SteelSD]

Originally Posted by Falls City Beer

The OL had NOTHING to do with Kimo's angle of attack. Nothing. Erase the O lineman from that film and Kimo spears Palmer's knee from the side unaided. Period. Malicious? Who cares? I don't know. Intentionally low hit (late is debatable, that much I agree with you about)? God yes.

When you drive full force into an object that resists you and said object releases one side of your body while still engaging your other, you're most likely going to fall off-balance to the released side, particularly if you're a 300-pound guy who's not trained in ballet...or ninjitsu. At that point, little force is required to aid you in falling further off-balance.

The offensive lineman had a TON to do with where Kimo went and how he got there. Erase the offensive lineman, and Kimo smacks Palmer sooner and higher.

[WMR]

Steel, you are wrong here. Kimo chose to deliver that blow. That's the crucial point. He chose to attack Carson in the manner that he did. He was never forced to maul Palmer's knee in a vicious "controlled" "accidental" "Roll".

That tackle should never be made in the first place. That's the crucial point. Watch the replay, no one forced to him attack Palmer like that. You Don't Make That PLAY. EVER.

Speaking as someone who was at the game, it was like every ounce of oxygen was sucked out of the stadium when Palmer was injured. The pre-game atmosphere was truly something special, but it truly was a palpatable sensation that swept through the stadium when Carson left the field.

When we stopped them that first series and Carson threw that bomb, it was so obvious that we were going to romp. The crowd was unbelievable. Really unfortunate that a dirty team like the Steelers had to bring such an abrupt and unfair ending to the festivities.

[WMR]

P.S.

Enjoy the spanking from the Colts this weekend.

My advice to Tony Dungy?

Keep both backs pulled in and tell them to watch Peyton's back.

stay classy pittsburgh.

[WMR]

Did someone say that Von Oelhoffen is studying to become an actor??

If so, his success certainly will not hinge on not having had ample practice.

[SteelSD]

Originally Posted by WilyMoROCKS

Steel, you are wrong here. Kimo chose to deliver that blow. That's the crucial point. He chose to attack Carson in the manner that he did. He was never forced to maul Palmer's knee in a vicious "controlled" "accidental" "Roll".

Considering that you later claim to have been at the game, I'm surprised you don't seem to understand the speed the game unfolds at. I would, however, like to know how a "vicious controlled accidental roll" can possibly be planned by a bull-rushing interior lineman who gets to the QB two to three times a year. Was there dance practice before hand?

That tackle should never be made in the first place. That's the crucial point. Watch the replay, no one forced to him attack Palmer like that. You Don't Make That PLAY. EVER.

That play wouldn't have been possible had the Bengals offensive lineman blocked an INTERIOR LINEMAN in a way that didn't turn him into the QB. Kimo was NOT an end speed-rush guy who took an unabated path to the QB. That's why no penalty was called, BTW. Well, that and the fact that there was zero opportunity for Kimo to do anything resembling stopping in mid-air.

Speaking as someone who was at the game, it was like every ounce of oxygen was sucked out of the stadium when Palmer was injured. The pre-game atmosphere was truly something special, but it truly was a palpatable sensation that swept through the stadium when Carson left the field.

I'm sure that had to suck. In fact, it would suck for a fan of any team that just lost it's starting QB (if that QB was any good). I took no pleasure in that freak injury and was openly concerned about Palmer.

When we stopped them that first series and Carson threw that bomb, it was so obvious that we were going to romp. The crowd was unbelievable. Really unfortunate that a dirty team like the Steelers had to bring such an abrupt and unfair ending to the festivities.

Ah, and here comes the concept that the Bengals would have "routed" the Steelers with Carson Palmer at QB. Just to remind you, the Bengals lost to Pitt with Palmer at QB this season. Jon Kitna played the half of his LIFE after Palmer went down. The Bengals didn't punt until 1:25 was remaining in the first half. And the Bengals still couldn't stop Pitt from scoring. Why? Because the Bengals' defense is an opportunistic sieve. I do believe I've mentioned that before. Pitt put up point totals of 27, 31, and 31 against the Bengals this season.

If you, as a fan, were at all "deflated" after your team went into the half with a 17-14 lead against a team that finished with the same record as you, that doesn't mean a dang thing to me.

Do you realize how quickly Pittsburgh scored on their drives? Exactly one took up as much as four minutes (and it was a field goal). A 20 yard screen pass. A 54 yard completion. A 40-yard Pass Interference call (which was Pass Interference). A 43-year flea-flicker. A 25-yard Bettis run.

I couldn't care less if the Bengals players (much less fans) were allegedly "deflated" after losing Carson Palmer. If they were, then that's a lack of professionalism and it highlights the team's lack of playoff experience. The Bengals weren't looking to count on an untested second-string QB at that point. They were putting Jon Kitna in the game- a guy who's had a good deal of success before, knows the offense, and wasn't at all rusty after playing the previous week. In short, Jon Kitna is no Tommy Maddox in all the good ways that Jon Kitna is no Tommy Maddox.

Pitt played New England a few years ago in the playoffs and Tom Brady went down. Drew Bledsoe took over cold off the bench and smacked them silly. Why? Because the Patriots actually had something resembling a defense.

See, defense is important. If the Bengals get one, then you can start talking about obvious "routs". Until then, that claim is an absurdity.

[Redsfaithful]

A 40-yard Pass Interference call (which was Pass Interference).

No, it really wasn't. The officiating was terrible, and that was one of the worst examples.

Steel, you're being intellectually dishonest if you think that there's not a world of difference between Kitna and Palmer. The Bengals lost because Palmer went down, not because of their defense. If Palmer stayed in the game then the Bengals would have easily scored more than 31 points. The entire complexion of the game would have changed, the Bengals wouldn't have come out so flat in the second half (which was apparently caused by some sort of halftime incident in the locker room that probably wouldn't have happened if Palmer was still healthy), and Ben would have had to throw more than 19 times or whatever it was. And when the Steelers have to pass they lose. I'm sure they'll have to put the ball in the air 35+ times this weekend and we'll all get to see what an elite quarterback Ben Roethlisberger really is.

I guarantee the Colts are thrilled to be playing the Steelers as opposed to a Carson Palmer led Bengals team.

Come Sunday none of this is really going to matter anymore. Go Colts!

[GAC]

Originally Posted by RFS62

You guys ever play football?

It's not that easy to totally control your every movement when you're rushing the passer. You talk like he's a robot or something, completely programmable.

Things in the NFL happen at light speed. You're analyzing a slow motion replay and projecting your bias.

It's a violent game, played at incredible speed.

I agree, but you're wasting your time.

[GAC]

Originally Posted by Redsfaithful

No, it really wasn't. The officiating was terrible, and that was one of the worst examples.

Steel, you're being intellectually dishonest if you think that there's not a world of difference between Kitna and Palmer. The Bengals lost because Palmer went down, not because of their defense. If Palmer stayed in the game then the Bengals would have easily scored more than 31 points. The entire complexion of the game would have changed, the Bengals wouldn't have come out so flat in the second half (which was apparently caused by some sort of halftime incident in the locker room that probably wouldn't have happened if Palmer was still healthy), and Ben would have had to throw more than 19 times or whatever it was. And when the Steelers have to pass they lose. I'm sure they'll have to put the ball in the air 35+ times this weekend and we'll all get to see what an elite quarterback Ben Roethlisberger really is.

I guarantee the Colts are thrilled to be playing the Steelers as opposed to a Carson Palmer led Bengals team.

Come Sunday none of this is really going to matter anymore. Go Colts!

I agree with you that the Colts should have no problem with the Steelers. They'd have no problem with the "latter season" Bengals either.

To say the Bengals lost solely because Palmer went down is somehow being blind to the fact of how this Bengals team played (very poorly) on both sides of the ball over these last several weeks. They mentioned it on Fox Sports before the game, and showed the stats - over the last 7 games, the Bengals defense was one of the worst in the NFL. They averaged giving up 31 pts/game, 120 yds rushing, 240 yds passing. That's just what the Steelers scored too. You aren't going far in the post-season with a performance like that - PERIOD! And IMO, Manning and offene would have feasted on the Bengal's secondary because this secondary was not playing like it had earlier in the season.

Yes - it's possible that with palmer in there they would have made it a closer game, and maybe won. But I still gave the edge to the Steelers based on this "slide" by the Bengals and the Steeler's playoff experience.

And the Bengals will be back. So will Palmer. And Lewis knows they have some huge deficiencies/holes to fill on defense.

[GAC]

dbl post

[rdiersin]

Originally Posted by Redsfaithful

No, it really wasn't. The officiating was terrible, and that was one of the worst examples.

I thought it was PI, but I also thought that the play on TJ in the end zone of the previous series, I think, was also PI. That's why the officiating was terrible. They were pretty much the same play, yet called differently. That's always the trademark of bad officiating.

[savafan]

Originally Posted by GAC

Listen to what you are saying? If he doesn't know the ball has been released, then how can it mean license for a late hit?

Yes - I can understand it if a ref sees it and throws a flag (thats the ref's responsibility - that is their job). Where was the flag? Is that Kimo's fault?

What I was saying is that Kimo not knowing the ball had been released shouldn't be a valid excuse for the refs not to throw the flag for a late hit. If that was the case, then I'd expect all defensive linemen in the future to play with their heads down or eyes shut. It was simply poor officiating.

[gonelong]

Originally Posted by SteelSD

Jon Kitna played the half of his LIFE after Palmer went down.

So what? How'd he do the 2nd half?

Because the Bengals' defense is an opportunistic sieve. I do believe I've mentioned that before. Pitt put up point totals of 27, 31, and 31 against the Bengals this season.

Those 2 interceptions in the 2nd half didn't help the cause, and neither did the sack Kitna took followed up by his fumble to kill a drive. Kitna took 4 sacks because he can't get through his progressions as fast as Palmer.

The game was a coin-flip before Palmer went down, and Cincy was looking to grab the early advantage. Would the Bengals have won? Nobody knows, but the chasm between Palmer and Kitna is huge, big 1st half out of Kitna nonwithstanding. Palmer ended the season with a 101 QB rating, I can't image Kitna had a better than 70 rating for the game.

I have it DVR'd so I'll check on it tonight.

GL

[deltachi8]

Let it go people, let it go now. I speak from experience - the 1999 Stanley Cub FInals - the "No Goal" of Brett Hull against my Sabres. It pained me for months and was not worth it.

The Benagls had a hell of a season and will be better next year because of this game. They learned something Sunday that no coach or playbook can teach, playoff experience, how to handle it.

[gonelong]

Originally Posted by deltachi8

Let it go people, let it go now. I speak from experience - the 1999 Stanley Cub FInals - the "No Goal" of Brett Hull against my Sabres. It pained me for months and was not worth it.

I'm still upset about the OSU/Texas game.



GL

[SteelSD]

Originally Posted by Redsfaithful

No, it really wasn't. The officiating was terrible, and that was one of the worst examples.

No. The worst example was the Personal Foul called on the Bengals when neither the defender or offensive Steelers player didn't realize they were a step or two out of bounds. And that was Pass Interference. See, you have to wait for the ball to arrive before you can mess with a receiver.

Steel, you're being intellectually dishonest if you think that there's not a world of difference between Kitna and Palmer.

Now go find where I said there wasn't. Positioning a strawman and then calling someone else "intellectually dishonest" isn't a real valid debate tactic. It's actually the opposite of "valid debate tactic".

The Bengals lost because Palmer went down, not because of their defense. If Palmer stayed in the game then the Bengals would have easily scored more than 31 points.

So your entire hope this playoffs rested on the concept that the Bengals offense would consistently score more than 31 points?

You're a Reds fan. You should know the serious issues present with a plan that consists of needing to constantly outscore your own defense.

The entire complexion of the game would have changed, the Bengals wouldn't have come out so flat in the second half (which was apparently caused by some sort of halftime incident in the locker room that probably wouldn't have happened if Palmer was still healthy), and Ben would have had to throw more than 19 times or whatever it was.

What could have happened isn't necessarily what would have happened. I'm not sure at what point you believed that it was impossible to lose that game, but it was possible to lose it. In fact, the Steelers beat the Palmer-led Bengals in that stadium once before this season. That actually happened.

And if there was a halftime incident in the locker room that supposedly led to a lack of drive entering the second half, well that's just immaturity. Doesn't happen to true professionals. Something bad happens. You either overcome it or you don't. But I'll be darned if I'm going to start caring about excuses as to why a team that played flawless ball in the first half and entered the half with a lead abruptly stopped caring with 15:00 on the clock in the third quarter. There are reasons and then there are excuses. Palmer fits in the "reason" category. Officiating and "halftime incidents" lean the other direction.

You can tell yourself over and over again that was an obvious win with Palmer at the helm, but it just ain't so. Makes for good rivalry building fodder I suppose. But a better rivalry builder woud be if ol' Marv figured out what a defense looked like.

And when the Steelers have to pass they lose. I'm sure they'll have to put the ball in the air 35+ times this weekend and we'll all get to see what an elite quarterback Ben Roethlisberger really is.

Your first sentence is pure fallacy. Pitt can win when throwing the ball and they can lose when throwing the ball- just like any other NFL team. The key is not to make mistakes. And if you haven't figured it out yet, Roethisberger and Carson Palmer are as near performance clones as you can get.

Ben Roethlisberger and Co. just beat you with his arm. Couldn't care less that he needed only 19 throws while playing near-perfect football to do it. You just saw an "elite" QB beat you. Appears you didn't so much notice that. Oh well.

I guarantee the Colts are thrilled to be playing the Steelers as opposed to a Carson Palmer led Bengals team.

The only thing I can rightly "guarantee" is that the Colts would prefer they be able to advance to the AFC Championship without needing to take the field at all next week.

Everything else is pure conjecture.