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02-04-2006, 09:24 AM
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#1 |
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.377 in 1905
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Carmel, IN
Posts: 1,538
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'87 Reds
What was the difference between the 2005 Reds and the '87 Reds? Both teams had really good offenses and poor starting pitching. At least, working off of memory, I remember the '87 team have very bad starting pitching.
But that team still finished with a winning record...84-78. The one thing that I remember is the '87 team had a kick butt bullpen, probably the best in the game at the time. Is that what enabled them to win more than they lost
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...the 2-2 to Woodsen and here it comes...and it is swung on and missed! And Tom Browning has pitched a perfect game! Twenty-seven outs in a row, and he is being mobbed by his teammates, just to the thirdbase side of the mound. |
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02-04-2006, 10:09 AM
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Just The Big Picture
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: The Bluegrass State
Posts: 6,150
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Re: '87 Reds
That '87 team did have awful starting pitching. It was so bad that I can only think of three starting pitchers from that staff: Browning, who had an off year, Ted Power, and Bill Gullickson. Who were the other two, or was that when Pete was using only four starters?
You are right that the bullpen was very good. Franco from the left and Rob Murphy from the right. IIRC Murphy kept a PC in the dugout to analyze hitters or something. The national media took notice of it. The Reds had a chance to improve that staff by trading for Rick Reuschel from the Pirates, but they thought the asking price too high. The Giants pulled the trigger on a deal, and came into Riverfront in early August down 4 1/2 games to the Reds. They proceeded to sweep a five-game series and leave town with a 1/2-game lead. I don't remember Reuschel being all that great, but I think the combination of the Reds not getting him and the Giants getting him kinda demoralized the Reds players. I seem to recall some of them complaining in the papers. And while we're talking about 1987, how about Eric Davis in April and May?
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Help stamp out, eliminate, and do away with redundancy. |
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02-04-2006, 10:19 AM
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Member
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 4,266
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Re: '87 Reds
Murphy was a lefty. Looks like Frank Williams was tough from the pen too.
top 5 starters in number of starts for the Reds in '87: Ted Power Tom Browning Bill Gullickson Guy Hoffman Ron Robinson
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02-04-2006, 10:20 AM
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#4 |
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So Long Uncle Joe
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Hamilton,Ohio
Posts: 3,849
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Re: '87 Reds
Code:
1987 CINCINNATI REDS PITCHING STATS NAME W L PCT G GS CG SV GF IP H R ER BB SO Ted Power 10 13 .435 34 34 2 0 0 204 213 115 102 71 133 Tom Browning 10 13 .435 32 31 2 0 1 183 201 107 102 61 117 Bill Gullickson 10 11 .476 27 27 3 0 0 165 172 99 89 39 89 Guy Hoffman 9 10 .474 36 22 0 0 2 158.2 160 83 77 49 87 Ron Robinson 7 5 .583 48 18 0 4 14 154 148 71 63 43 99 Frank Williams 4 0 1.000 85 0 0 2 19 105.2 101 37 27 39 60 Rob Murphy 8 5 .615 87 0 0 3 21 100.2 91 37 34 32 99 John Franco 8 5 .615 68 0 0 32 60 82 76 26 23 27 61 Bill Landrum 3 2 .600 44 2 0 2 14 65 68 35 34 34 42 Dennis Rasmussen 4 1 .800 7 7 0 0 0 45.1 39 22 20 12 39 Pat Pacillo 3 3 .500 12 7 0 0 2 39.2 41 30 27 19 23 Jerry Reuss 0 5 .000 7 7 0 0 0 34.2 52 31 30 12 10 Bill Scherrer 1 1 .500 23 0 0 0 10 33 43 17 16 16 24 Mario Soto 3 2 .600 6 6 0 0 0 31.2 34 18 18 12 11 Jeff Montgomery 2 2 .500 14 1 0 0 6 19.1 25 15 14 9 13 Pat Perry 1 0 1.000 12 0 0 1 3 15.1 6 0 0 4 6 Tom Hume 1 0 1.000 11 0 0 0 2 13.1 14 6 6 2 4 Paul O'Neill 0 0 1 0 0 0 1 2 2 3 3 4 2 TOTALS 84 78 .519 554 162 7 44 155 1452.1 1486 752 685 485 919 NAME ERA RSAA HR H/9 BR/9 SO/9 BB/9 SO/BB SHO WP IBB HBP BFP BK NW NL Ted Power 4.50 -6 28 9.40 12.66 5.87 3.13 1.87 1 3 7 3 887 2 11 12 Tom Browning 5.02 -16 27 9.89 13.13 5.75 3.00 1.92 0 2 7 5 791 4 10 13 Bill Gullickson 4.85 -11 33 9.38 11.62 4.85 2.13 2.28 1 4 6 2 698 1 9 12 Guy Hoffman 4.37 -2 20 9.08 12.08 4.93 2.78 1.78 0 3 5 4 669 1 9 10 Ron Robinson 3.68 10 14 8.65 11.22 5.79 2.51 2.30 0 2 8 1 638 0 7 5 Frank Williams 2.30 23 5 8.60 12.09 5.11 3.32 1.54 0 4 9 2 446 0 3 1 Rob Murphy 3.04 14 7 8.14 11.00 8.85 2.86 3.09 0 1 5 0 415 0 8 5 John Franco 2.52 16 6 8.34 11.30 6.70 2.96 2.26 0 1 6 0 344 0 9 4 Bill Landrum 4.71 -3 3 9.42 14.12 5.82 4.71 1.24 0 4 6 0 276 1 2 3 Dennis Rasmussen 3.97 1 5 7.74 10.32 7.74 2.38 3.25 0 1 0 1 187 2 3 2 Pat Pacillo 6.13 -8 7 9.30 13.84 5.22 4.31 1.21 0 3 0 1 176 0 2 4 Jerry Reuss 7.79 -14 2 13.50 16.88 2.60 3.12 0.83 0 1 2 1 163 1 1 4 Bill Scherrer 4.36 0 3 11.73 16.09 6.55 4.36 1.50 0 2 4 0 151 0 1 1 Mario Soto 5.12 -3 7 9.66 13.07 3.13 3.41 0.92 0 1 1 0 138 0 2 3 Jeff Montgomery 6.52 -5 2 11.64 15.83 6.05 4.19 1.44 0 1 1 0 89 1 1 3 Pat Perry 0.00 7 0 3.52 6.46 3.52 2.35 1.50 0 0 1 1 55 0 1 0 Tom Hume 4.05 0 0 9.45 11.48 2.70 1.35 2.00 0 0 0 1 54 0 1 0 Paul O'Neill 13.50 -2 1 9.00 27.00 9.00 18.00 0.50 0 0 0 0 11 0 0 0 TOTALS 4.24 1 170 9.21 12.35 5.69 3.01 1.89 2 33 68 22 6188 13 80 82 Code:
1987 CINCINNATI REDS HITTING STATS PLAYER G AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB SO SB CS AVG SLG OBA OPS Dave Parker 153 589 77 149 28 0 26 97 44 104 7 3 .253 .433 .311 .744 Buddy Bell 143 522 74 148 19 2 17 70 71 39 4 1 .284 .425 .369 .794 Eric Davis 129 474 120 139 23 4 37 100 84 134 50 6 .293 .593 .399 .991 Bo Diaz 140 496 49 134 28 1 15 82 19 73 1 0 .270 .421 .300 .722 Barry Larkin 125 439 64 107 16 2 12 43 36 52 21 6 .244 .371 .306 .678 Kurt Stillwell 131 395 54 102 20 7 4 33 32 50 4 6 .258 .375 .316 .690 Kal Daniels 108 368 73 123 24 1 26 64 60 62 26 8 .334 .617 .429 1.046 Tracy Jones 117 359 53 104 17 3 10 44 23 40 31 8 .290 .437 .333 .771 Nick Esasky 100 346 48 94 19 2 22 59 29 76 0 0 .272 .529 .327 .856 Dave Concepcion 104 279 32 89 15 0 1 33 28 24 4 3 .319 .384 .377 .761 Ron Oester 69 237 28 60 9 6 2 23 22 51 2 3 .253 .367 .317 .684 Terry Francona 102 207 16 47 5 0 3 12 10 12 2 0 .227 .295 .266 .561 Paul O'Neill 84 160 24 41 14 1 7 28 18 29 2 1 .256 .488 .331 .819 Dave Collins 57 85 19 25 5 0 0 5 11 12 9 0 .294 .353 .388 .741 Terry McGriff 34 89 6 20 3 0 2 11 8 17 0 0 .225 .326 .289 .615 Jeff Treadway 23 84 9 28 4 0 2 4 2 6 1 0 .333 .452 .356 .809 Lloyd McClendon 45 72 8 15 5 0 2 13 4 15 1 0 .208 .361 .247 .608 Ted Power 35 59 3 7 1 0 1 4 3 31 0 0 .119 .186 .175 .361 Tom Browning 34 52 2 8 2 0 0 6 3 21 1 0 .154 .192 .200 .392 Bill Gullickson 27 53 4 11 2 0 1 3 0 11 0 0 .208 .302 .208 .509 Guy Hoffman 36 45 2 5 1 0 0 5 0 15 0 0 .111 .133 .111 .244 Ron Robinson 48 36 4 7 0 0 0 2 0 14 0 0 .194 .194 .189 .384 Leo Garcia 31 30 8 6 0 0 1 2 4 8 3 1 .200 .300 .286 .586 Dennis Rasmussen 7 15 1 1 0 0 0 0 1 7 0 0 .067 .067 .125 .192 Pat Pacillo 13 11 1 1 1 0 0 0 1 6 0 0 .091 .182 .167 .348 Sal Butera 5 11 1 2 0 0 1 2 1 6 0 0 .182 .455 .250 .705 Mario Soto 6 12 1 1 0 0 0 0 0 3 0 0 .083 .083 .083 .167 Jerry Reuss 7 8 0 1 1 0 0 0 0 5 0 0 .125 .250 .125 .375 Max Venable 7 7 2 1 0 0 0 2 0 0 0 0 .143 .143 .143 .286 Bill Landrum 44 5 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .200 .200 .200 .400 Rob Murphy 87 5 0 1 0 0 0 0 0 2 0 0 .200 .200 .200 .400 Frank Williams 85 5 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 .000 .000 .000 .000 John Franco 68 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 .000 .000 .000 .000 Jeff Montgomery 14 2 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 .000 .000 .000 .000 Bill Scherrer 23 1 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 .000 .000 .000 .000 TOTALS 2241 5560 783 1478 262 29 192 747 514 928 169 46 .266 .427 .330 .757 PLAYER RC RCAA RCAP OWP RC/G TB EBH ISO SEC BPA IBB HBP GIDP SAC SF POS Dave Parker 76 -13 -27 .420 4.43 255 54 .180 .261 .459 13 8 14 0 6 RF Buddy Bell 83 7 5 .536 5.72 222 38 .142 .284 .475 3 1 14 1 2 3B Eric Davis 124 56 50 .748 9.57 281 64 .300 .570 .719 8 1 6 0 3 CF Bo Diaz 58 -17 1 .379 4.04 209 44 .151 .192 .414 1 5 16 4 6 C Barry Larkin 52 -16 3 .372 3.97 163 30 .128 .244 .437 3 5 8 5 3 SS Kurt Stillwell 46 -13 4 .379 4.03 148 31 .116 .192 .406 2 2 5 2 2 SS Kal Daniels 100 50 41 .775 10.38 227 51 .283 .495 .699 11 1 6 1 0 LF Tracy Jones 53 -1 -10 .488 5.15 157 30 .148 .276 .503 0 3 10 0 5 LF Nick Esasky 56 5 -2 .535 5.71 183 43 .257 .341 .537 3 0 10 2 1 1B Dave Concepcion 39 -1 2 .483 5.09 107 16 .065 .168 .406 5 0 10 1 3 2B Ron Oester 25 -12 -9 .326 3.55 87 17 .114 .203 .386 4 0 8 2 0 2B Terry Francona 16 -16 -21 .215 2.60 61 8 .068 .126 .317 1 1 5 1 0 1B Paul O'Neill 25 1 -2 .517 5.49 78 22 .231 .350 .528 1 0 3 0 0 RF Dave Collins 15 3 1 .589 6.43 30 5 .059 .294 .520 0 2 1 2 0 LF Terry McGriff 8 -6 -3 .262 3.00 29 5 .101 .191 .351 0 0 3 0 0 C Jeff Treadway 14 2 3 .580 6.30 38 6 .119 .155 .471 0 1 1 3 0 2B Lloyd McClendon 6 -5 -3 .232 2.75 26 7 .153 .222 .390 0 0 1 0 1 C Ted Power 2 -10 0 .036 0.87 11 2 .068 .119 .222 0 1 1 9 0 P Tom Browning 2 -8 0 .050 1.06 10 2 .038 .115 .236 0 0 1 6 0 P Bill Gullickson 3 -6 1 .110 1.69 16 3 .094 .094 .264 0 0 2 4 0 P Guy Hoffman 1 -7 -1 .020 0.63 6 1 .022 .022 .133 0 0 0 3 0 P Ron Robinson 1 -6 0 .027 0.75 7 0 .000 .000 .162 0 0 1 5 1 P Leo Garcia 3 -2 -2 .276 3.12 9 1 .100 .300 .429 0 0 0 0 1 CF Dennis Rasmussen 0 -3 -1 .000 0.00 1 0 .000 .067 .125 0 0 0 0 0 P Pat Pacillo 0 -2 0 .000 0.00 2 1 .091 .182 .167 0 0 1 1 0 P Sal Butera 1 -1 0 .262 3.00 5 1 .273 .364 .500 0 0 0 0 0 C Mario Soto 0 -2 0 .000 0.00 1 0 .000 .000 .083 0 0 0 0 0 P Jerry Reuss 0 -2 0 .000 0.00 2 1 .125 .125 .250 0 0 0 2 0 P Max Venable 0 -1 -1 .000 0.00 1 0 .000 .000 .143 0 0 0 0 0 CF Bill Landrum 0 -1 0 .000 0.00 1 0 .000 .000 .000 0 0 1 1 0 P Rob Murphy 0 -1 0 .000 0.00 1 0 .000 .000 .200 0 0 0 1 0 P Frank Williams 0 -1 0 .000 0.00 0 0 .000 .000 -.200 0 0 1 1 0 P John Franco 0 0 0 .000 0.00 0 0 .000 .000 .000 0 0 0 0 0 P Jeff Montgomery 0 0 0 .000 0.00 0 0 .000 .000 .000 0 0 0 0 0 P Bill Scherrer 0 0 0 .000 0.00 0 0 .000 .000 .000 0 0 0 0 0 P TOTALS 809 20 30 .477 5.02 2374 483 .161 .276 .475 55 31 129 57 34
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0 Value Over Replacement Poster "Sit over here next to Johnathan (Bench)...sit right here, he's smart."--Sparky Anderson |
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02-04-2006, 10:24 AM
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#5 |
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So Long Uncle Joe
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Hamilton,Ohio
Posts: 3,849
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Re: '87 Reds
Code:
1987 NL TEAM PITCHING STATS TEAM W L PCT G GS CG SV GF IP H R ER BB SO ERA Giants 90 72 .556 510 162 19 38 143 1471 1407 669 604 547 1038 3.70 Dodgers 73 89 .451 443 162 29 32 133 1455 1415 675 601 565 1097 3.72 Mets 92 70 .568 470 162 16 51 146 1454 1407 698 621 510 1032 3.84 Astros 76 86 .469 478 162 13 33 149 1441.1 1363 678 616 525 1137 3.85 Expos 91 71 .562 497 162 16 50 146 1450.1 1428 720 632 446 1012 3.92 Cardinals 95 67 .586 524 162 10 48 152 1466 1484 693 641 533 873 3.94 Phillies 80 82 .494 551 162 13 48 149 1448.1 1453 749 673 587 877 4.18 Pirates 80 82 .494 475 162 25 39 137 1445 1377 744 674 562 914 4.20 Reds 84 78 .519 554 162 7 44 155 1452.1 1486 752 685 485 919 4.24 Padres 65 97 .401 497 162 14 33 148 1433.1 1402 763 681 602 897 4.28 Cubs 76 85 .472 488 161 11 48 150 1434.2 1524 801 727 628 1024 4.56 Braves 69 92 .429 485 161 16 32 145 1427.2 1529 829 735 587 837 4.63 TOTALS 971 971 .500 5972 1942 189 496 1753 17379 17275 8771 7890 6577 11657 4.09 TEAM HR H/9 BR/9 SO/9 BB/9 SO/BB SHO WP IBB HBP BFP BK PARK Giants 146 8.61 12.12 6.35 3.35 1.90 8 59 86 27 6202 25 89 Dodgers 130 8.75 12.42 6.79 3.49 1.94 7 54 62 28 6238 18 81 Mets 135 8.71 12.08 6.39 3.16 2.02 5 42 51 34 6191 13 95 Astros 141 8.51 11.95 7.10 3.28 2.17 4 39 61 26 6114 14 83 Expos 145 8.86 11.79 6.28 2.77 2.27 6 47 45 26 6151 14 112 Cardinals 129 9.11 12.55 5.36 3.27 1.64 4 46 79 27 6254 22 95 Phillies 167 9.03 12.89 5.45 3.65 1.49 5 35 86 35 6265 23 109 Pirates 164 8.58 12.21 5.69 3.50 1.63 10 61 60 22 6131 18 110 Reds 170 9.21 12.35 5.69 3.01 1.89 2 33 68 22 6188 13 108 Padres 175 8.80 12.81 5.63 3.78 1.49 6 55 62 36 6206 21 94 Cubs 159 9.56 13.67 6.42 3.94 1.63 4 58 67 27 6311 29 104 Braves 163 9.64 13.59 5.28 3.70 1.43 4 42 55 39 6270 9 122 TOTALS 1824 8.95 12.53 6.04 3.41 1.77 65 571 782 349 74521 219 Code:
1987 NL TEAM HITTING STATS TEAM AB R H 2B 3B HR HR% RBI BB SO SB CS AVG SLG OBA OPS Mets 5601 823 1499 287 34 192 3.43 771 592 1012 159 49 .268 .434 .339 .773 Cardinals 5500 798 1449 252 49 94 1.71 746 644 933 248 72 .263 .378 .340 .718 Giants 5608 783 1458 274 32 205 3.66 731 511 1094 126 97 .260 .430 .324 .754 Reds 5560 783 1478 262 29 192 3.45 747 514 928 169 46 .266 .427 .330 .757 Braves 5428 747 1401 284 24 152 2.80 696 641 834 135 68 .258 .403 .339 .742 Expos 5527 741 1467 310 39 120 2.17 695 501 918 166 74 .265 .401 .328 .729 Pirates 5536 723 1464 282 45 131 2.37 684 535 914 140 58 .264 .403 .330 .732 Cubs 5583 720 1475 244 33 209 3.74 683 504 1064 109 48 .264 .432 .326 .758 Phillies 5475 702 1390 248 51 169 3.09 662 587 1109 111 49 .254 .410 .327 .737 Padres 5456 668 1419 209 48 113 2.07 621 577 992 198 91 .260 .378 .332 .710 Astros 5485 648 1386 238 28 122 2.22 603 526 936 162 46 .253 .373 .318 .691 Dodgers 5517 635 1389 236 23 125 2.27 594 445 923 128 59 .252 .371 .309 .680 TOTALS 66276 8771 17275 3126 435 1824 2.75 8233 6577 11657 1851 757 .261 .404 .328 .732 TEAM RC TB EBH ISO SEC BPA IBB HBP GIDP SAC SF OUTS PA PARK Mets 866 2430 513 .166 .292 .490 74 31 94 70 39 4354 6333 95 Cardinals 756 2081 395 .115 .264 .450 61 18 126 84 51 4384 6297 95 Giants 784 2411 511 .170 .266 .467 73 39 99 55 35 4436 6248 89 Reds 809 2374 483 .161 .276 .475 55 31 129 57 34 4348 6196 108 Braves 763 2189 460 .145 .276 .456 82 38 133 86 34 4348 6227 122 Expos 762 2215 469 .135 .243 .449 77 35 100 57 42 4333 6162 112 Pirates 751 2229 458 .138 .250 .448 67 29 121 71 51 4373 6222 110 Cubs 803 2412 486 .168 .269 .471 45 21 109 59 30 4354 6197 104 Phillies 758 2247 468 .157 .275 .455 51 25 133 63 40 4370 6190 109 Padres 729 2063 370 .118 .243 .435 75 27 122 81 36 4367 6177 94 Astros 692 2046 388 .120 .237 .427 52 24 115 58 50 4368 6143 83 Dodgers 647 2046 384 .119 .212 .409 70 31 126 82 39 4434 6114 81 TOTALS 9120 26743 5385 .143 .259 .453 782 349 1407 823 481 52469 74506
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0 Value Over Replacement Poster "Sit over here next to Johnathan (Bench)...sit right here, he's smart."--Sparky Anderson |
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02-04-2006, 11:32 AM
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#6 |
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breath
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: PDX
Posts: 39,663
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Re: '87 Reds
Here's a look at some of the stats each club had vs the league average.
It highlights how incredibly bad the pitching was in 2005. Code:
CINCINNATI REDS SEASON 1987 AVERAGE DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds -.003 .266 .269 EXTRA BASE HITS DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds 8 483 475 OBA DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds -.009 .330 .339 RUNS DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds 16 783 767 RUNS CREATED/GAME DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds 0.01 5.02 5.01 SECONDARY AVERAGE DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds .001 .284 .283 SLG DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds .008 .427 .419 STOLEN BASES DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds 3 169 166 TOTAL AVERAGE DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds .001 .715 .714 WALKS DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds -64 514 578 --------------------------------------------------------- CINCINNATI REDS SEASON 2005 AVERAGE DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds -.007 .261 .268 EXTRA BASE HITS DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds 58 572 514 OBA DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds .000 .339 .339 RUNS DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds 64 820 756 RUNS CREATED/GAME DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds 0.39 5.46 5.07 SECONDARY AVERAGE DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds .034 .308 .274 SLG DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds .019 .446 .428 STOLEN BASES DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds -18 72 90 TOTAL AVERAGE DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds .036 .754 .719 WALKS DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds 60 611 551 --------------------------------------------------------- CINCINNATI REDS SEASON 1987 BASERUNNERS/9 IP DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds 0.00 12.35 12.53 ERA DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds -.16 4.24 4.09 HITS/9 IP DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds -.26 9.21 8.95 HOMERUNS DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds -18 170 152 STRIKEOUTS/9 IP DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds -.34 5.69 6.04 STRIKEOUTS/WALKS DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds 0.12 1.89 1.77 WALKS/9 IP DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds 0.40 3.01 3.41 --------------------------------------------------------- CINCINNATI REDS SEASON 2005 BASERUNNERS/9 IP DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds 1.00 14.00 12.76 ERA DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds -.95 5.18 4.23 HITS/9 IP DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds -1.32 10.41 9.09 HOMERUNS DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds -56 219 163 STRIKEOUTS/9 IP DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds -.57 6.00 6.57 STRIKEOUTS/WALKS DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds -.05 1.94 1.99 WALKS/9 IP DIFF PLAYER LEAGUE 1 Reds 0.20 3.09 3.29 |
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02-04-2006, 12:33 PM
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#7 | |
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Member
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Savannah, TN
Posts: 2,778
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Re: '87 Reds
Quote:
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Tim McCarver: Baseball Quotes I remember one time going out to the mound to talk with Bob Gibson. He told me to get back behind the batter, that the only thing I knew about pitching was that it was hard to hit. |
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02-04-2006, 12:54 PM
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#8 | ||
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breath
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: PDX
Posts: 39,663
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Re: '87 Reds
Quote:
These three in season trades are awesome retrospect. Quote:
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02-04-2006, 01:44 PM
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He sure could hit
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Dayton
Posts: 702
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Re: '87 Reds
IIRC, the Reds could have gotten Rick Reuschel but for whatever reason they wouldnt pull the trigger. When he went to the Giants I was so ticked off. Rick Reuschel would have been the difference for us and instead he went to our rival and he WAS the difference for them. Reuschel had that slide step and was quick to the mound with runners on base. Not much of an "athlete" but was a very effective pitcher.
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02-04-2006, 02:18 PM
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#10 |
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Member
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 4,266
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Re: '87 Reds
ahh. A Chris "strained eyelid" Brown sighting.
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02-04-2006, 02:21 PM
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#11 |
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.377 in 1905
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Carmel, IN
Posts: 1,538
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Re: '87 Reds
Maybe another factor was that the '87 team had a better defense than last years team. I don't have any numbers to back it up, but it seemed that the '87 team had a decent defense.
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...the 2-2 to Woodsen and here it comes...and it is swung on and missed! And Tom Browning has pitched a perfect game! Twenty-seven outs in a row, and he is being mobbed by his teammates, just to the thirdbase side of the mound. |
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02-04-2006, 02:48 PM
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#12 | |
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breath
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: PDX
Posts: 39,663
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Re: '87 Reds
Quote:
Code:
ERRORS E A 1 Kurt Stillwell 23 247 2 Barry Larkin 19 358 3 Dave Parker 11 17 4 Ron Oester 10 186 T5 Buddy Bell 7 241 T5 Bo Diaz 7 70 T7 Nick Esasky 6 41 T7 Kal Daniels 6 5 T9 Ron Robinson 5 18 T9 Dave Concepcion 5 169 T11 Eric Davis 4 10 T11 Paul O'Neill 4 2 T11 Jeff Treadway 4 48 T14 Tom Browning 3 23 T14 Terry McGriff 3 14 ERRORS E A 1 Felipe Lopez 17 369 T2 Edwin Encarnacion 10 116 T2 Rich Aurilia 10 295 4 Adam Dunn 9 17 5 Ryan Freel 8 159 6 Ramon Ortiz 7 28 7 Joe Randa 6 148 8 Jason LaRue 5 52 9 Wily Mo Pena 4 2 T10 Javier Valentin 3 28 T10 Ken Griffey Jr. 3 6 T12 Matt Belisle 2 10 T12 Sean Casey 2 55 T12 Austin Kearns 2 8 T12 Kent Mercker 2 11 T12 Rainer Olmedo 2 46 T12 D'Angelo Jimenez 2 63 |
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02-04-2006, 03:14 PM
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#13 |
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Posting in Dynarama
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Boston
Posts: 26,809
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Re: '87 Reds
The '87 Reds ranked 15th in defensive efficiency at .698. The '05 Reds ranked 28th at .678.
The bullpen was a decided for the '87 club and it had a bunch of good, young players. The '88 Reds would lead all of MLB in DER at .726. Eric Davis, Barry Larkin, Paul O'Neill, Chris Sabo, Kal Daniels, Tom Browning, Rob Dibble and Joe Oliver were emerging from the system. Jose Rijo, Danny Jackson, Norm Charlton, Hal Morris and Mariano Duncan would all show up in the next few years. All of these guys were in their 20s. And Pythagoras, as always, helps tell the story. The '87 Reds finshed 84-78 because they played like an 84-78 team, outscoring the opposition by 31 runs. The 2005 Reds played like 75-87 team, getting outscored by 69 runs. Relatively speaking, the '87 Reds were 100 net runs better than the '05 model. So you're talking about a team with broader position player skills (the '87 model could run too), better pitching and a better foundation on which to build. Honestly, I don't recommend comparing these Reds to any other Reds club that's been seen in many of our lifetimes. You've got to go back 50+ years before you run into something similar.
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Baseball isn't a magic trick ... it doesn't get spoiled if you figure out how it works. - gonelong I'm witchcrafting everybody. |
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02-04-2006, 11:14 PM
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#14 |
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.377 in 1905
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Carmel, IN
Posts: 1,538
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Re: '87 Reds
The top starters for each team and their ERA+
1987 SP Ted Power 94 SP *Tom Browning 85 SP Bill Gullickson 88 SP *Guy Hoffman 97 2005 SP *Eric Milton 69 SP Aaron Harang 116 SP Ramon Ortiz 83 SP *Brandon Claussen 105 SP Luke Hudson 70
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...the 2-2 to Woodsen and here it comes...and it is swung on and missed! And Tom Browning has pitched a perfect game! Twenty-seven outs in a row, and he is being mobbed by his teammates, just to the thirdbase side of the mound. |
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02-05-2006, 12:17 AM
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#15 |
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Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 356
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Re: '87 Reds
I was going to go to Browning's perfect game but passed on it because of the weather
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"Playoffs? Don't talk about playoffs. Are you kidding me? Playoffs? I'm just hoping we can win a game, another game. " Jim Mora |
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