The catcher's stats stats (broken down)

[redsandrails]

Anyways.....

AB's

Ross- 165
LaRue- 164
Valentin- 153

AVG-

Ross- .279
LaRue- .177
Valentin- .242

OBP-

Ross- .374
LaRue- .313
Valentin- .293

SLG-

Ross- .630
LaRue- .293
Valentin- .399

HR-

Ross- 15
LaRue- 5
Valentin- 6

K-

Ross- 48
LaRue- 44
Valentin- 24

R-

Ross- 27
LaRue- 18
Valentin- 19

2B-

Ross- 11
LaRue- 4
Valentin- 4

OPS w/ RISP

Ross- .933
LaRue- .564
Valentin- .570

AVG w/RISP

Ross- .293
LaRue- .135
Valentin- .196

OPS as PH

Ross- 1.694 (9 AB)
LaRue- .625 (8 AB)
Valentin- .832 (44 AB)

Team Record When Starting-

Ross- 22-28
LaRue- 30-17
Valentin- 13-15

Now why do we do so much better with LaRue catching? The majority of his starts are with Harang pitching, our winningest pitcher. We are 17-10 when Harang pitches. Ross has been catching E.Z. a lot and the cast of characters in the #5 slot so his record is a lot worse as a result.

[dabvu2498]

Catcher's ERA:

LaRue -- 4.54
Ross -- 4.64
Javy -- 5.06

Ross has been catching E.Z. a lot

Actually Javy caught EZ the majority of the time.

[37red]

Poor LaRue, I really like him, he's a good catcher, he tries hard but he really just can't hit the ball. What were his hitting stats last year?

[BRM]

Originally Posted by 37red

Poor LaRue, I really like him, he's a good catcher, he tries hard but he really just can't hit the ball. What were his hitting stats last year?

Jason LaRue in 2005: .260/.355/.452 - .807 OPS

[Matt700wlw]

Originally Posted by BRM

Jason LaRue in 2005: .260/.355/.452 - .807 OPS

Career year I would say....or close.

[BRM]

His OPS improved every year from 2001 through 2005.

2001: .707
2002: .729
2003: .743
2004: .765
2005: .807

[dabvu2498]

Originally Posted by BRM

Jason LaRue in 2005: .260/.355/.452 - .807 OPS

38 RS, 27 2B, 14 HR, 60 RBI, 41 BB, 101 K

Career .737 OBP

[RedsManRick]

LaRue has actually been passable offensively throughout his career, and it was his arm that made him valuable. I chalk up his offensive struggles this year primarily to his lack of playing time. He's in a really bad catch-22. He can't come out of his funk until he plays more but he won't play more until he hits better.

I think that given his usage to date, he likely has at least 3-4 years left as a major league catcher and that he'll resurface somewhere as a starter and put up a few years of .750+ OPS. There's no reason he can't be a .250/.325/.425 guy. You just don't see people fall this hard, this fast, for no apparent reason -- particularly after trending upwards for 4 years.

[dabvu2498]

Originally Posted by RedsManRick

he likely has at least 3-4 years left as a major league catcher and that he'll resurface somewhere as a starter and put up a few years of .750+ OPS

Not many 35-37 year old catchers OPSing at .750.

Just for fun, I checked out his BP PECOTA.

Projected OPS (age):
2006 - .758 (32)
2007 - .751 (33)
2008 - .766??? (34)
2009 - .734 (35)
2010 - Out of baseball (36)

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/pecota/larueja01.php

[kheidg-]

Personally I'd rather see LaRue starting before Ross just because he is way better defensively and throwing runners out. He also handles the pitching staff better than either of the other two. IMO, LaRue 4 days a week, Ross 2, and Valentin 1 would be the way to go. The record with LaRue catching says enough in itself.

[RedsManRick]

Originally Posted by dabvu2498

Not many 35-37 year old catchers OPSing at .750.

Just for fun, I checked out his BP PECOTA.

Projected OPS (age):
2006 - .758 (32)
2007 - .751 (33)
2008 - .766??? (34)
2009 - .734 (35)
2010 - Out of baseball (36)

http://www.baseballprospectus.com/pecota/larueja01.php

I guess I was thinking he was a year or two younger. The point stands that even PECOTA sees a few usefull years left in him. He should not be washed up and I think the usage is the problem rather than the other way around.

[registerthis]

Originally Posted by kheidg-

Personally I'd rather see LaRue starting before Ross just because he is way better defensively and throwing runners out.

Those are important, particularly with a catcher, to be sure...but Ross is just kicking the crap out of LaRue with the bat, and his defense isn't so atrocious that it can't be lived with. With what Ross is doing at the plate, you have to keep his bat in the lineup as much as possible. Jason LaRue and his .177 BA and .293 SLG% can stay on the bench, thank you very much.

Ross should be starting 4-5 games a week, LaRue should be getting the other starts, and Valentin should be relegated solely to a pinch hitting/late inning replacement role.

[redsrule2500]

If Ross had played all seasnon he would be on pace for 70+ Homers.

Amazing

[TOBTTReds]

Originally Posted by kheidg-

Personally I'd rather see LaRue starting before Ross just because he is way better defensively and throwing runners out. He also handles the pitching staff better than either of the other two. IMO, LaRue 4 days a week, Ross 2, and Valentin 1 would be the way to go. The record with LaRue catching says enough in itself.

I'm gonna have to disagree big time.

But I've been over it many times before. This is my opinion from a post in June:

I think his (LaRue) game-calling is rather poor, and he has trouble literally receiving the pitches and loses many close strikes because of his eratic catching style and movement behind the plate.

Since I don't feel we have any catcher that is really a good catcher (so far I think Ross is the best receiver), then I feel we stick with the best offensively. And I think LaRue will be fine offensively with some more AB's.

But LaRue is costing us 3 mil a year, and we already have a very good hitter vs. LH'ers in Ross, and JV can handle RH'ers. Where does that leave LaRue? Hopefully sent out with that contract.

Here is another argument about LaRue that I agree with from DFS:

He still has problems with plays at the plate and I don't think he'll ever frame pitches properly, but he has at least conceded to setting a target for his pitchers which he simply has not done in years past. He's leading the team in past balls again, and if you watch him stab for the ball I think you'll agree that's just technique. It's been 5 years now and he hasn't ever fixed it, so I think that's what it is.

I responded with

I will throw in there, that he thinks his pitchers have better fastballs than they really do and calls for them too often in situations where they shouldn't be called.

Here is that thread: http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=50220

[TeamBoone]

It totally amazes me that LaRue and Valentin have nearly the same number of AB's as Ross when they play so much less than he does.