"...and he's got incredible sink."....Hat on Saarloos

[Ga_Red]

http://news.cincypost.com/apps/pbcs....702160330/1027

[redsmetz]

Sweet. I'm chomping at the bit for us to get practicing and working toward the season.

Saarloos doesn't look like a big guy, fairly slight frame from the picture in the Post. Is he old enough to be wiley?

[redsmetz]

Isn't Hatteberg the player his fellow players voted most likely to be a manager? I like to see a sharp player who looks at the game broadly. I know some folks believe we need more production from his position, but I continue to think that for this year, he brings lots of value to us both on the field and in the clubhouse. I think he will be the back up next year if Votto is ready and he brings some smarts to our younger players.

[Always Red]

incredible sink?

so did Graves. and Ryan Wagner, too, come to think of it.

Major league hitters lay off of those pitches, because most true sinkers are out of the strike zone; they're balls. They wait for you to come at them with a strike, something they have to swing at.

He's got to have another pitch, or be able to throw it for a strike. You can't fool big league hitters every time.

Having said that, I hope Saarloos steps up big this year!

[vaticanplum]

Originally Posted by redsmetz

Isn't Hatteberg the player his fellow players voted most likely to be a manager? I like to see a sharp player who looks at the game broadly. I know some folks believe we need more production from his position, but I continue to think that for this year, he brings lots of value to us both on the field and in the clubhouse. I think he will be the back up next year if Votto is ready and he brings some smarts to our younger players.

I think Hatteberg is a huge asset to this organization, I really do. Some older players can be good presences, but not all have the verbal skills and the positivity to convey all that. I get the impression that he really does. Part of me really hopes the Reds hang onto him until he retires, as you say, then keep him on as a coach or something.

[jimbo]

"After he got traded to the Reds, Saarloos picked up a bat and went into the batting cage - "but I never took a swing, I just bunted," he admitted."

Thank you, thank you, thank you. Something Reds pitchers have not been very good at for quite some time.

[Moosie52]

Hatteburg on Milton: "He's got incredible stink."

[TeamBoone]

Originally Posted by jimbo

"After he got traded to the Reds, Saarloos picked up a bat and went into the batting cage - "but I never took a swing, I just bunted," he admitted."

Thank you, thank you, thank you. Something Reds pitchers have not been very good at for quite some time.

I don't think it's because the Reds have been remiss in giving it the good old college try. I know last year that had someone working with them on bunting; he was on Real Reds talking about it. I should remember the name, but I'm sorry, I don't.

[mth123]

Originally Posted by Always Red

incredible sink?

so did Graves. and Ryan Wagner, too, come to think of it.

Major league hitters lay off of those pitches, because most true sinkers are out of the strike zone; they're balls. They wait for you to come at them with a strike, something they have to swing at.

He's got to have another pitch, or be able to throw it for a strike. You can't fool big league hitters every time.

Having said that, I hope Saarloos steps up big this year!

Bingo. A perfect explanation for minor league numbers with good K Rates and low walk rates and the reverse in the majors. Minor leaguers swing and miss, major leaguers take and walk.

[Falls City Beer]

Originally Posted by Always Red

incredible sink?

so did Graves. and Ryan Wagner, too, come to think of it.

Major league hitters lay off of those pitches, because most true sinkers are out of the strike zone; they're balls. They wait for you to come at them with a strike, something they have to swing at.

He's got to have another pitch, or be able to throw it for a strike. You can't fool big league hitters every time.

Having said that, I hope Saarloos steps up big this year!

Graves had sink. Then he didn't.

Wagner had the slider, but not the sink exactly.

[reds44]

Originally Posted by Always Red

incredible sink?

so did Graves. and Ryan Wagner, too, come to think of it.

Major league hitters lay off of those pitches, because most true sinkers are out of the strike zone; they're balls. They wait for you to come at them with a strike, something they have to swing at.

He's got to have another pitch, or be able to throw it for a strike. You can't fool big league hitters every time.

Having said that, I hope Saarloos steps up big this year!

Danny Graves did not have incredible sink. Maybe for awhile he did, but not when he started sucking. There is a reason me and my brother called it a gravity ball.

[acredsfan]

Originally Posted by TeamBoone

I don't think it's because the Reds have been remiss in giving it the good old college try. I know last year that had someone working with them on bunting; he was on Real Reds talking about it. I should remember the name, but I'm sorry, I don't.

That Moses guy?

[Always Red]

Originally Posted by reds44

Danny Graves did not have incredible sink. Maybe for awhile he did, but not when he started sucking. There is a reason me and my brother called it a gravity ball.

in his prime, Danny Graves was a better pitcher than Saarloos has been, at least to this point. I agree, when Graves was "sucking" it was nothing more than a gravity ball .

Once upon a time though, Danny Graves had a very nice sinker. There were some times out there when Graves was virtually unhittable, and he made some good hitters look really bad. That's my point- Saarloos probably has a nice sink, but given his mediocre success to this point, it's probably not "incredible."

I'm giving Hatte points for loyalty, though!

[Spitball]

A sinker is basically a two-seam fastball that drops because there are fewer seams exposed to the friction with each rotation. The key is location, especially if the pitcher doesn't miss many bats.

Like any pitcher, the key to being a sinkerballer is to avoid mistakes. Unlike the split-finger that drops out of the strike zone, the sinker that is located properly will be topped by the bat and pounded onto the ground.

Personally, I would want some pitchers with hard sinkers, but they tend to give up lots of hits and linedrives rather than lofty flyballs. Typical groundball pitchers also tend to give up their share of homeruns.

[OnBaseMachine]

I'm starting to come around on Saarloos. I think he is going to be an asset to the 2007 Reds; I predicted around 160-170 innings of 4.25 ERA ball, which would be huge behind Harang and Arroyo and possibly Bailey.