David Beckham

[improbus]

Originally Posted by bucksfan2

I think this is big news. It would be like Derrik Jeter going overseas next year to play in an european baseball league (if it exists). Beckham isn't what he once was but he may be the most recognizable athlete on the fact of this earth.

As for Donavan he isn't the best american has to offer. He is the most hyped player for USA but he has failed to produce when the spotlight is on in the world cup and has failed a couple of times in Europe only to return to his safety net of MLS soccer. He succeedes at a AA level of soccer compared to the major league level played in Europe.

Donovan is going to become US Soccer's leading goal scorer from the mid-field position, which says two things. One, he is great, and two, we've never produced a true goal scorer.

Also, I agree that Donovan should have gone to Europe and stayed, but nobody can make him. He would have improved more in Europe, oh well. But, I don't think he failed because he couldn't play, I think he was homesick (at least that's the story I've always heard).

BTW, Buck, if Donovan isn't the best American, who is (excluding the goalkeepers)?

[bucksfan2]

Originally Posted by improbus

Donovan is going to become US Soccer's leading goal scorer from the mid-field position, which says two things. One, he is great, and two, we've never produced a true goal scorer.

Also, I agree that Donovan should have gone to Europe and stayed, but nobody can make him. He would have improved more in Europe, oh well. But, I don't think he failed because he couldn't play, I think he was homesick (at least that's the story I've always heard).

BTW, Buck, if Donovan isn't the best American, who is (excluding the goalkeepers)?

Right now I would take Beasley and Dempsey. You could also make an arguement that over the past few years McBride was a better player than Donavan. You have to look at desire to become a better player. Desire to play with the best in the world. A guy like DeMeritt who has played against the best is going to have more soccer savy and been in pressure situations than Donavan has when it comes to big games. Donavan came about when soccer had started to generate a lot of buzz in America. A lot of kids were playing soccer and Donavan was the picture of American soccer. IMO his career is more about his name than his acutal results when it counted.

[improbus]

Originally Posted by bucksfan2

Right now I would take Beasley and Dempsey. You could also make an arguement that over the past few years McBride was a better player than Donavan. You have to look at desire to become a better player. Desire to play with the best in the world. A guy like DeMeritt who has played against the best is going to have more soccer savy and been in pressure situations than Donavan has when it comes to big games. Donavan came about when soccer had started to generate a lot of buzz in America. A lot of kids were playing soccer and Donavan was the picture of American soccer. IMO his career is more about his name than his acutal results when it counted.

Look, I'm not saying that Donovan hasn't made some mistakes, but look where Beasley and McBride are playing. Fulham are terrible, and Rangers is a nice club, but I would take most of the MLS clubs over the Scottish clubs (just look at the way they played here...) Also, I've lived in Columbus and watched McBride since day one, and he was definitely a late bloomer. He's a nice target player who scores a few goals here and there, but you only really have to worry about him on free kicks/corners.

If Donovan were to play in Europe, he would be on a Champions League squad from a major league (Italy, England, Germany, Spain).

Finally, I'm really getting tired of hearing about how bad MLS is. It stunk in 1995, when Adrian Paz was offsides every ten minutes and Pete Marino was a striker, but now they are WAY better. Look at there record in the recent friendlies (even if the other teams are training, they're season starts in a few weeks)

MLS ALL-STARS 2-0 CELTIC (should have been 4-0)
CHELSEA 1-0 LA GALAXY (without Becks, and LA nearly score three goals...)
FIRE 1-1 CELTIC (Fire dominated with Blanco until late)
REAL SALT LAKE 2-0 EVERTON (Everton played Johnson, Neville, Howard, Beattie, and Nuno Valente, and remember RSL is the WORST team in the MLS)

I think the rest of the world is starting to get worried, that's why they are bashing MLS.

[NJReds]

Originally Posted by improbus

I think the rest of the world is starting to get worried, that's why they are bashing MLS.

Worried may not be the right word. But what the 'rest of the world' glosses over is that most of their leagues are extremely top heavy with between 3-5 great world-class clubs and a big drop-off after that.

MLS may never be able to field a team that can compete for the UEFA Champions League. But it can be a solid mid-level league that develops the kind of depth for the US national team that it despirately needs.

[Hoosier Red]

Now the All-Star games were different, but to compare the MLS in mid season form playing against teams just getting started for the season, and playing them at home gives the MLS teams a huge advantage.

The results are good, but it's still not enough to make Real Madrid shake in their boots.

[improbus]

Originally Posted by NJReds

Worried may not be the right word. But what the 'rest of the world' glosses over is that most of their leagues are extremely top heavy with between 3-5 great world-class clubs and a big drop-off after that.

MLS may never be able to field a team that can compete for the UEFA Champions League. But it can be a solid mid-level league that develops the kind of depth for the US national team that it despirately needs.

Exactly right. I don't ever expect MLS to be a top level league, but I don't accept abject dismissal of the league.

Also, the sign that the league is improving is NOT Beckham, Angel, and Blanco, it is Juan Toja. Toja could be playing on a ton of teams in Europe, but more importantly, he's young. Young international players are the key. Old guys are nice and give the league a bump, but the young guys are what make soccer leagues grow.

[WMR]

Landon Donovan is our most skilled player right now.

Clint Dempsey is our most dangerous player, and has the potential to eventually become our most skilled player as well (until he's supplanted by Freddy ).

Clint Dempsey's flair is a quality innate to his game. Flair cannot be taught, you've either got it or you don't. He could become the first American to possess truly world-class flair. Playing in the EPL will only increase his growth-rate and eventual plateau, as Landon remains comfortable in MLS.

[bucksfan2]

The problem with the MLS is that it needs star power. It needs america's best but if you want the best american team you need most of your players to play over in europe. The contracts and appeal over in Europe will trump any sport played in america. There is no way the MLS can compete for the best players in the world therefore their talent level is going to be second tier. I can sit back and watch some of the best play soccer and am mesmerized at their talent. I try and watch the MLS and the level of play is just lacking. I think Freddie Adu summed it up by saying he wanted to go to Europe and play as soon as he was able to. In order to become the best soccer player you need to refine your talent overseas.

[improbus]

Originally Posted by bucksfan2

The problem with the MLS is that it needs star power. It needs america's best but if you want the best american team you need most of your players to play over in europe. The contracts and appeal over in Europe will trump any sport played in america. There is no way the MLS can compete for the best players in the world therefore their talent level is going to be second tier. I can sit back and watch some of the best play soccer and am mesmerized at their talent. I try and watch the MLS and the level of play is just lacking. I think Freddie Adu summed it up by saying he wanted to go to Europe and play as soon as he was able to. In order to become the best soccer player you need to refine your talent overseas.

I'm not sure if its the "competition" that they need through playing in Europe. But, they definitely need to understand the pressure of playing in Europe. In MLS, they can be almost anonymous. Nobody knows them and very little pressure from the fans and from the media is applied. But, players need to be a part of a UEFA birth push, or a good old fashioned relegation battle.

[M2]

IMO, Beckham's arrival is significant in that the mainstream media is catching on to something that's already happened. Soccer's a popular sport in this country. MLS is selling a lot of tickets. When teams like Real Madrid, FC Barcelona, Chelsea, Manchester United, Cruz Azul and Club America play exhibition games over here, the tickets sell like hotcakes. The U.S. Women's team is massively popular. There's mulitple channels piping games in from all around the globe.

The problem has largely been that the media has been slow on the uptake. A lot of that is generational. The editors at most newspapers and magazines and the sports anchors at your local television station are Baby Boomers. They never played soccer, they never watched it. It's totally alien to them. Yet once you get into Gen X and younger, you've got a whole pile of folks familiar with the sport. People who've played the sport, and there's tens of millions who have, don't have as much trouble with low scoring contests as the sports insiders who constantly gripe about such things. We know how hard it is to score a goal. We get it.

So Beckham's basically a spotlight where suddenly the media realizes, "Hey, there's a lot of fans here." That doesn't mean there's going to be any sort of radical change in the amount of coverage the sport gets (though I'd note Sportscenter has been showing more highlights) and I'm guessing that a few outlets and sponsors will notice the game is more popular with males age 25-34 than they had previously thought.

One thing's for sure, the sport is only going to get more popular. My guess is it's going to be the most played team sport in the country, if it already isn't. Add in immigration patterns (Mexicans love the sport) and the increased exposure of the game and you've got a rising star.

Hockey's geographically limited. NASCAR's a huge niche, but it's still a niche. The NBA is getting less popular all the time. I'd love to see a line graph on the number of baseball fields in the U.S. and the number of soccer fields in the U.S. over the past 30 years. I can take a guess as to which direction those lines are headed. Football seems unassailable, but we've spent our lives in the Football Era. Since the introduction of the Super Bowl, it's ruled the roost. That's not going to last forever. I've said this before, but it bears repeating, I come from a generation where guys watch football even if they didn't play it in a organized fashion. That's odd. It's certainly not the sort of thing that's going to last forever. I assume this isn't universal, but when I was a kid we constantly played pickup football. I rarely see kids playing pickup football games these days.

The world changes. Beckham's a signal that it's been changing under our noses.

[WMR]

Wow, awesome post, M2.

That should be an Op Ed for the NY Times.

[improbus]

Originally Posted by M2

So Beckham's basically a spotlight where suddenly the media realizes, "Hey, there's a lot of fans here." That doesn't mean there's going to be any sort of radical change in the amount of coverage the sport gets (though I'd note Sportscenter has been showing more highlights) and I'm guessing that a few outlets and sponsors will notice the game is more popular with males age 25-34 than they had previously thought.

Unfortunately, I think MLS gets some play now because after baseball, its either MLS or the WNBA. As soon as NFL training camps start, expect the MLS coverage to disappear. This to me doesn't make any sense from ESPN's point of view. They have a unique and powerful position with Sportscenter to promote and give a sort of "Real, Legitimate Sport" status to the MLS. Wouldn't it benefit them to grow the sport into something that they could get more ratings with? They're working they're butts off to make us like Arena League Football and the X-Games, why not soccer?

[Matt700wlw]

That's Posh's husband, right?

[GIK]

I love soccer/football. It helps my wife's family is European. I hope the DB-effect, if there is one, lasts longer than our public's typical attention span.

[MWM]

Anyone catch Drew Carey on Letterman last night. He was talking about how Soccer is his favorite sport right now, and he loves sports. He spoke fairly intelligently about why he likes the sport and what makes it intriguing, and how once you understand the sport, seeing 0-0 or low scoring matches can still be very exciting. He also said that once you see a professional soccer game live, it totally changes your perception. It was a nice plug for soccer.