Redszone Community Prospect Vote RUNOFF: #13 - RedsZone.com - Cincinnati Reds Fans' Home for Baseball Discussion

dougdirt · 12-07-2007, 01:16 PM

There is a three way race for the #13 prospect between Carlos Fisher, Juan Francisco and Sean Watson after 85 votes.

Vote for the one you think is the best option. The two that don't win will be put back on the ballot for #14.

*BaseClogger* · 12-07-2007, 01:31 PM

nice fisher is out to the early lead!

Highlifeman21 · 12-07-2007, 01:32 PM

I have a feeling #14 & #15 will fall to the guys that don't win this runoff.

lollipopcurve · 12-07-2007, 01:34 PM

I'm a Watson guy here. He should be able to parlay that nasty knuckle-curve into some kind of career at the major league level.

TOBTTReds · 12-07-2007, 01:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Highlifeman21

I have a feeling #14 & #15 will fall to the guys that don't win this runoff.

Hey alright, 13 votes later, you are starting to realize how this works!

Sorry I couldn't resist.

Highlifeman21 · 12-07-2007, 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AvesIce51

Hey alright, 13 votes later, you are starting to realize how this works!

Sorry I couldn't resist.

Which means for #14, I will vote for Chris Dickerson yet again. And when he doesn't win as #14, I'll vote for him for #15.

RedsManRick · 12-07-2007, 02:17 PM

I voted for Fisher. I'm just a tad scared of a guy who gets hit around that hard in the FSL. 8 HR in 54 IP is an accomplishment in Sarasota. I'm pretty much splitting hairs. This should really be a scouting decision, so I'm voting along with some other voters whom I trust.

Kc61 · 12-07-2007, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedsManRick

I voted for Fisher. I'm just a tad scared of a guy who gets hit around that hard in the FSL. 8 HR in 54 IP is an accomplishment in Sarasota. I'm pretty much splitting hairs. This should really be a scouting decision, so I'm voting along with some other voters whom I trust.

I think Francisco's upside and performance as a 19-20 year old exceeds the prospects of the other two, with the possible exception that I could see Watson emerging as a reliever. So I'm for Francisco, would put Watson second, Fisher third.

Mario-Rijo · 12-07-2007, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lollipopcurve

I'm a Watson guy here. He should be able to parlay that nasty knuckle-curve into some kind of career at the major league level.

Yeah between these 3 I think Watson and Fisher make it to the show and Watson has the bigger upside. I am hoping for Fisher to prove me wrong as he will likely be a starter but I don't see it. I like Francisco but feel he has too many hurdles, the plate discipline the lack of a defensive position (LF or 1B at best). But again I would love to see him prove me wrong.

dougdirt · 12-07-2007, 02:45 PM

RMR, if its a scouting discussion then its probably Watson/Francisco - gap - Fisher. Their upsides are much better than Fishers. Watson has a mid 90s fastball and a devastating plus curveball to go along with two other pitches that he throws. Francisco has good bat speed, a rocket for an arm, tons of current power with even more projection and real bad plate discipline, but thats the only thing going against him. Fisher has a big body and a good fastball and sinker, but stuff wise he is not in the same class as Watson and his size isn't an advantage of him either.

That said, I voted Francisco based on his tools.

Cyclone792 · 12-07-2007, 03:13 PM

I'll keep voting for Fisher until he finally wins one.

Francisco doesn't know what the strike zone is. He'll never get on base at any type of remotely decent clip until he figures out that a strike zone actually exists in baseball.

REDblooded · 12-07-2007, 03:23 PM

Yep.....Francisco for me. Upside galore, and massive power potential.

RedsManRick · 12-07-2007, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kc61

I think Francisco's upside and performance as a 19-20 year old exceeds the prospects of the other two, with the possible exception that I could see Watson emerging as a reliever. So I'm for Francisco, would put Watson second, Fisher third.

I love his power potential but I don't trust minor league power that is paired with horrific discipline. I'm sure he's getting 2 or 3 hittable pitches per at bat and doing a lot of damage to them when he makes contact. But he's only going to see fewer and I have more faith in a guy developing power as he matures than I do a historic free swinger learning to reign things in. Put in him the FSL and I think you see a .220/.260/.375 kind of ugly, ugly line.

I know he's got tools but tools without skills makes for a really good A ball player. He's young and has a long time to mature. But prospect rating wise, I need to see another tool translated in to a skill before I invest. The power can come through maturation. The plate discipline and contact are harder to develop.

camisadelgolf · 12-07-2007, 03:45 PM

Sean Watson for #13 '08
Carlos Fisher will be two years older than Sean Watson and will have played only one level higher. Sean Watson has been more highly regarded by scouts than Carlos Fisher.

Code:

Name		 H/9	BB/9	 K/9	WHIP
Sean Watson	8.17	2.40	9.25	1.17
Carlos Fisher	8.80	2.66	7.59	1.27

Name		 AB	BB	  K	 OBP
Juan Francisco	752	29	204	.303

Kc61 · 12-07-2007, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedsManRick

I love his power potential but I don't trust minor league power that is paired with horrific discipline. I'm sure he's getting 2 or 3 hittable pitches per at bat and doing a lot of damage to them when he makes contact. But he's only going to see fewer and I have more faith in a guy developing power as he matures than I do a historic free swinger learning to reign things in. Put in him the FSL and I think you see a .220/.260/.375 kind of ugly, ugly line.

I know he's got tools but tools without skills makes for a really good A ball player. He's young and has a long time to mature. But prospect rating wise, I need to see another tool translated in to a skill before I invest. The power can come through maturation. The plate discipline and contact are harder to develop.

Well, Fisher will be 25 before next season. He hasn't yet mastered AA. He's never been touted as a high prospect. His main attribute seems to be his abilty to keep the ball down, important at GABP for sure.

Watson is a polished college pitcher who blew away low A ball, as did a number of others (Thompson, Gonzalez) but then had a tougher time at High-A.

Francisco is now 20 and had .268, 25, 90 at low-A. I've been told repeatedly on this site to ignore strikeouts and focus on production. Here's a guy with huge production. With even slight improvement in plate discipline, his numbers would be off the chart. At the number 13 pick, considering that he is a young prospect, I'm taking that chance.

This is not a doubles hitter, say a Chris Valaika, who needs to develop superior plate discipline to be effective. Francisco has huge power production, so even if he is never a high OBP guy he can produce.

While I'm hopeful all three will pan out, and I consider them all good prospects, the choice here seems apparent to me.

12-07-2007, 01:31 PM	#2
BaseClogger WOOOOO!!! Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Midland, MI Posts: 6,075	Re: Redszone Community Prospect Vote RUNOFF: #13 nice fisher is out to the early lead! __________________ "On-base percentage is great if you can score runs and do something with that on-base percentage," Baker said. "Clogging up the bases isn't that great to me."

12-07-2007, 01:32 PM	#3
Highlifeman21 Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Bristol, just around the corner from ESPN Posts: 8,694	Re: Redszone Community Prospect Vote RUNOFF: #13 I have a feeling #14 & #15 will fall to the guys that don't win this runoff.

12-07-2007, 01:34 PM	#4
lollipopcurve Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Shelburne Falls, MA Posts: 9,477	Re: Redszone Community Prospect Vote RUNOFF: #13 I'm a Watson guy here. He should be able to parlay that nasty knuckle-curve into some kind of career at the major league level. __________________ "Baseball is a very, very complex business. It's more of a people business than most businesses." - Bob Castellini

12-07-2007, 02:17 PM	#7
RedsManRick Stat Wanker Hodiernus Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 14,913	Re: Redszone Community Prospect Vote RUNOFF: #13 I voted for Fisher. I'm just a tad scared of a guy who gets hit around that hard in the FSL. 8 HR in 54 IP is an accomplishment in Sarasota. I'm pretty much splitting hairs. This should really be a scouting decision, so I'm voting along with some other voters whom I trust. __________________ Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

12-07-2007, 02:45 PM	#10
dougdirt The Boss Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 30,677	Re: Redszone Community Prospect Vote RUNOFF: #13 RMR, if its a scouting discussion then its probably Watson/Francisco - gap - Fisher. Their upsides are much better than Fishers. Watson has a mid 90s fastball and a devastating plus curveball to go along with two other pitches that he throws. Francisco has good bat speed, a rocket for an arm, tons of current power with even more projection and real bad plate discipline, but thats the only thing going against him. Fisher has a big body and a good fastball and sinker, but stuff wise he is not in the same class as Watson and his size isn't an advantage of him either. That said, I voted Francisco based on his tools. __________________ www.redsminorleagues.com

View Poll Results: Who is the #13 prospect? (runoff)
Carlos Fisher	27	35.06%
Juan Francisco	21	27.27%
Sean Watson	29	37.66%
Voters: 77. You may not vote on this poll

12-07-2007, 01:16 PM	#1
dougdirt The Boss Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 30,677	Redszone Community Prospect Vote RUNOFF: #13 There is a three way race for the #13 prospect between Carlos Fisher, Juan Francisco and Sean Watson after 85 votes. Vote for the one you think is the best option. The two that don't win will be put back on the ballot for #14. __________________ www.redsminorleagues.com

12-07-2007, 03:13 PM	#11
Cyclone792 Playoffs Join Date: May 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 6,233	Re: Redszone Community Prospect Vote RUNOFF: #13 I'll keep voting for Fisher until he finally wins one. Francisco doesn't know what the strike zone is. He'll never get on base at any type of remotely decent clip until he figures out that a strike zone actually exists in baseball. __________________ *Barry Larkin - HOF, 2012* *Put an end to the Lost Decade.*

12-07-2007, 03:23 PM	#12
REDblooded Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 2,119	Re: Redszone Community Prospect Vote RUNOFF: #13 Yep.....Francisco for me. Upside galore, and massive power potential.

12-07-2007, 03:45 PM	#14
camisadelgolf Vampire Weekend @Bernie's Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 11,311	Re: Redszone Community Prospect Vote RUNOFF: #13 Sean Watson for #13 '08 Carlos Fisher will be two years older than Sean Watson and will have played only one level higher. Sean Watson has been more highly regarded by scouts than Carlos Fisher. Code: Name H/9 BB/9 K/9 WHIP Sean Watson 8.17 2.40 9.25 1.17 Carlos Fisher 8.80 2.66 7.59 1.27 Name AB BB K OBP Juan Francisco 752 29 204 .303 __________________ Get MLBtraderumors Reds updates on Facebook. http://www.facebook.com/pages/Reds-R...33794710005587 http://i.imgur.com/1bCKpaH.jpg

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