Reds looking at Haren

[jmble]

From Lance's blog

Fox Sports
The Reds are pushing for Haren as well as Bedard, apparently believing that they could acquire such a pitcher without including outfielder Jay Bruce in the deal. A package centered around Homer Bailey and Joey Votto might not be enough, but the Reds' reluctance to part with Bruce is understandable. One rival G.M. says Bruce could be another Larry Walker . .

Wayne must be reading Redszone. All the names that have been brought up here keep showing up as potential targets.

[Jim]

Haren seems like a better fit for the Reds than Bedard. However, same question applies... what do the Reds have to give up to make such a trade? I agree with the article that Votto and Bailey probably are not enough. As long as we don't burn Bailey AND Cueto, Kriv will pull the trigger on the deal.

[AdamDunn]

God... no please... he's going to cost to many prospects.

[The Cowboy]

Originally Posted by AdamDunn

God... no please... he's going to cost to many prospects.

When do we want to win? Now? MAYBE later with the prospects? Harang and Haren would dominate not only the Central but the National League.. Im not an advocate of giving up all of our prospects, but if we have to give up Bailey/Cueto, Hamilton?Votto and others for a legit ace, why not? He is not a Denny Naegle or a Brett Tomko.. He is an ace.

[BEETTLEBUG]

Why not Harden in stead of Haren?

[AdamDunn]

Originally Posted by The Cowboy

When do we want to win? Now? MAYBE later with the prospects? Harang and Haren would dominate not only the Central but the National League.. Im not an advocate of giving up all of our prospects, but if we have to give up Bailey/Cueto, Hamilton?Votto and others for a legit ace, why not? He is not a Denny Naegle or a Brett Tomko.. He is an ace.

how about, for sure later with prospects. That is why they are called the Big Four. We are pretty much assured that at LEAST 2 out of the four will be top of the line baseball players. Just be patient. Why do we need to trade prospects to get players when we can sign players and keep the prospects. I'd rather sign a player than trade for them. This years FA market is slim. But just wait until someone like Webb, Haren, Bedard, Kazmir, or someone of that nature to go FA and jump on them like cats on tunafish. That's what the Mets have done. They kept Wright and Reyes and signed Martinez, Beltran, Wagner and a host of other legit players.

If we trade prospects, we win now for a short while. We keep the prospects, we lose now for the short run but we win later for the long run. I'd rather have the later of the two.

[kaldaniels]

Originally Posted by AdamDunn

how about, for sure later with prospects. That is why they are called the Big Four. We are pretty much assured that at LEAST 2 out of the four will be top of the line baseball players. Just be patient. Why do we need to trade prospects to get players when we can sign players and keep the prospects. I'd rather sign a player than trade for them. This years FA market is slim. But just wait until someone like Webb, Haren, Bedard, Kazmir, or someone of that nature to go FA and jump on them like cats on tunafish. That's what the Mets have done. They kept Wright and Reyes and signed Martinez, Beltran, Wagner and a host of other legit players.

If we trade prospects, we win now for a short while. We keep the prospects, we lose now for the short run but we win later for the long run. I'd rather have the later of the two.

I would contend that nothing is for sure with prospects. This of course is why the Reds scouting department needs to be top notch. Just remember, not one of these guys has done anything top of the line yet in the bigs. I certainly hope they are great for the Reds...but remember...nothing is certain.

[mroby85]

you almost have to take haren or bedard if you can get them. In my opinion if you get one of those two, you might as well start printing the playoff tickets now.

[ChatterRed]

Originally Posted by AdamDunn

how about, for sure later with prospects. That is why they are called the Big Four. We are pretty much assured that at LEAST 2 out of the four will be top of the line baseball players. Just be patient. Why do we need to trade prospects to get players when we can sign players and keep the prospects. I'd rather sign a player than trade for them. This years FA market is slim. But just wait until someone like Webb, Haren, Bedard, Kazmir, or someone of that nature to go FA and jump on them like cats on tunafish. That's what the Mets have done. They kept Wright and Reyes and signed Martinez, Beltran, Wagner and a host of other legit players.

If we trade prospects, we win now for a short while. We keep the prospects, we lose now for the short run but we win later for the long run. I'd rather have the later of the two.

This is why you consider trading your prospects: http://www.redszone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=64045

Adam Dunn and Austin Kearns were deemed non-tradeable when they were prospects.........how'd that turn out? Half this board or more than half wants to trade Adam Dunn.

I would say other than Dunn, none of those prospects met all the hype surrounding them.

[MasonBuzz3]

in today's Cleveland PD, there is an article about the Tribe trying to acquire Haren from the A's. The article says that the Indians figure that it would take one player of the 25 man (Asdrubal Cabrera?), and one near MLB prospect to acquire Haren.

from this article, I would think that Hamilton/Votto and Bailey would be better than what the Tribe could offer

[mroby85]

you would think so, i wonder if the reds are willing to give up bailey and votto/hamilton though, i know i would be hesitant.

[AdamDunn]

Originally Posted by kaldaniels

I would contend that nothing is for sure with prospects. This of course is why the Reds scouting department needs to be top notch. Just remember, not one of these guys has done anything top of the line yet in the bigs. I certainly hope they are great for the Reds...but remember...nothing is certain.

Nothing is certain with veteran players either. Look at Willis, Martinez, AJ Burnett, Matt Clement, Prior, Wood, the list goes on. But I'd rather have four uncertain high ceiling, low cost prospects who have a good chance (66.7%~ I'd say) of panning out than one veteran, soon to be expensive veteran pitcher who has a high chance of staying the same way (85%~) and two low cost prospects. Not to mention we don't even know how long we'd have Haren/Bedard. with prospects, if they pan out, we have them for seven years, four of them at low cost.

[kaldaniels]

Originally Posted by AdamDunn

Nothing is certain with veteran players either. Look at Willis, Martinez, AJ Burnett, Matt Clement, Prior, Wood, the list goes on. But I'd rather have four uncertain high ceiling, low cost prospects who have a good chance (66.7%~ I'd say) of panning out than one veteran, soon to be expensive veteran pitcher who has a high chance of staying the same way (85%~) and two low cost prospects. Not to mention we don't even know how long we'd have Haren/Bedard. with prospects, if they pan out, we have them for seven years, four of them at low cost.

Hey, there are a million different ways all these proposed trades could play out...some scenarios I would like, some I would not. Hopefully you are not implying that I said trading for one of these pitchers is a sure-thing in regards to how they will perform.....I never have/never will say that. That said...realize, my post was just stating that of the super-4 prospects...not one of them, let alone two of them are sure-things.

[OUReds]

Originally Posted by AdamDunn

Not to mention we don't even know how long we'd have Haren/Bedard.

Not sure I follow you here? Haren would be under our control for three years, Bedard for two. If you mean a long term contract, I don't think you should factor one into the equation for either.

[NeilHamburger]

That third year makes all the difference to me, it makes haren much more valuable, and gives you three legitimate years in a row to compete for a world series. That's all I can ask.