My Thoughts Today From Section 519

[Cyclone792]

Originally Posted by fearofpopvol1

Here's an interesting question...

Do you think Utley can be as good as Morgan? Obviously, he won't be quite as good defensively, but offensively, he has a chance at being as good if not better over a full career.

Doubtful.

Utley's problem, when comparing him historically to other great second basemen, will be that he didn't even reach the majors until age 24 and his first big season wasn't until age 26. For historical greatness, that's a pretty late arrival. By comparison, Joe Morgan already had three seasons with an OPS+ over 130 by the time he was 26.

For peak comparisons, Morgan had a six season stretch from 1972-77 that was simply disgusting too. Think of it like this ... take Chase Utley's 2007 season; it was outstanding. To match Morgan's peak, Utley would have to have four or five seasons better than his own 2007 season. Sure it's possible, but it's not very likely at all.

That's how great Morgan was.

[fearofpopvol1]

Originally Posted by Cyclone792

Doubtful.

Utley's problem, when comparing him historically to other great second basemen, will be that he didn't even reach the majors until age 24 and his first big season wasn't until age 26. For historical greatness, that's a pretty late arrival. By comparison, Joe Morgan already had three seasons with an OPS+ over 130 by the time he was 26.

For peak comparisons, Morgan had a six season stretch from 1972-77 that was simply disgusting too. Think of it like this ... take Chase Utley's 2007 season; it was outstanding. To match Morgan's peak, Utley would have to have four or five seasons better than his own 2007 season. Sure it's possible, but it's not very likely at all.

That's how great Morgan was.

Those are definitely some valuable points, but I do think that Utley has a real chance to play the game longer (and at a higher level during his "elder" years) than Morgan did.

[Raisor]

Originally Posted by Hap

Jeff Keppinger is a very solid infielder. He should get the bulk of the time at first base after A-Go is healthy and Votto (time to go to Japan) goes to AAA.

ummmm, riiiight.

312/.347/.516 it's only (right under) 100 career ab's and everything, but still....

[savafan]

Okay, I already admitted I was wrong...

[Cedric]

I don't know if we need to start trashing Brandon Phillips because of someones weird opinion.

And Chase Utley has the range of my great Aunt. I guess you could just put Barry Bonds in the lineup at 2b and call him the best there if you want. It's really not fair comparing Phillips to Utley when Utley isn't even a decent 2b.

[fearofpopvol1]

Originally Posted by Cedric

I don't know if we need to start trashing Brandon Phillips because of someones weird opinion.

And Chase Utley has the range of my great Aunt. I guess you could just put Barry Bonds in the lineup at 2b and call him the best there if you want. It's really not fair comparing Phillips to Utley when Utley isn't even a decent 2b.

.990 fielding % (last year) makes him top 5 in the league. I'd love to see your stats to back that statement up.

Phillips is superior to Utley defensively, but it's not by as big of a margin as you'd think and saying he "isn't even a decent 2B" is ludacrous.

[MWM]

Originally Posted by Cedric

I don't know if we need to start trashing Brandon Phillips because of someones weird opinion.

Not sure what you're referring to, but there hasn't been any Phillips bashing. It's more about praising Joe Morgan. I don't think many people have much bad to sy about Brandon.

[Ron Madden]

Originally Posted by Hap

Jeff Keppinger is a very solid infielder. He should get the bulk of the time at first base after A-Go is healthy and Votto (time to go to Japan) goes to AAA.

I don't know why everyone is in such a hurry to send Votto down.

So far, Hatteberg hasn't done any better than Votto.

[top6]

Originally Posted by MWM

Methinks some people in this thread aren't really grasping just how great a player Joe Morgan really was.

Not a lot of people do. In fact, even Joe Morgan seems too stubborn to appreciate just how great he was.

FWIW, Johnny Bench is also sort of underrated. I mean, everyone accepts that Morgan and Bench were great, but I sometimes think people don't appreciate just how amazing they were (and I am just talking numbers since I only saw both of them play at the tail end of their careers).

[icehole3]

I agree, Phillips may equal Little Joe in the field and thats a big may...at the plate Morgan was ahead of Phillips.

[LoganBuck]

Originally Posted by Ron Madden

I don't know why everyone is in such a hurry to send Votto down.

So far, Hatteberg hasn't done any better than Votto.

They are buying into "DustyBall", I predicted that Castro would stay at Votto's expense, when Gonzalez comes back. I hate every ounce of that prediction, but who doesn't see it coming?

[redsmetz]

Originally Posted by LoganBuck

They are buying into "DustyBall", I predicted that Castro would stay at Votto's expense, when Gonzalez comes back. I hate every ounce of that prediction, but who doesn't see it coming?

It's absurd to suggest that Castro will stay at Votto's expense. With regards to the 1st base situation, I don't see Hatte playing as the perceived "vet love", but rather playing two players who are off to slow starts to see which one presently kicks in. But I doubt that Votto will be sent to AAA - Dusty's a Votto backer and he'll get playing time as this season unfolds, IMO.

[TRF]

leave! Sava... alone! sniff! what did he do to any of you!

<mascara streams down face>

[dfs]

Originally Posted by Hap

Jeff Keppinger is a very solid infielder.

Yes. Yes he is.

Originally Posted by Hap

He should get the bulk of the time at first base after A-Go is healthy and Votto (time to go to Japan) goes to AAA.

....No. No I don't think so.

Originally Posted by Hap

Brandon Phillips may become better than Joe Morgan.

No. No. Once you adjust for park and era, Morgan is one of the top 10 to ever play the game. By the time Morgan was the age Brandon Phillips is now, Joe had put up 3 full seasons with an OPS+ around 130 and two more of 110. Brandon Phillips has been above average exactly once producing an OPS+ of 105 last year.

That's not an insult to Phillips. It's like comparing Josh Bard to Johnny Bench. Bard is a nice little player. Bench was a bit more.

Originally Posted by Hap

Griffey's HR was vintage Griffey -- a laser beam with a little bit of a hook at the end.

Yeah. It was nice. Better yet was when Keppinger took second because the Phillie infield fell asleep. That was awesome.

Originally Posted by Hap

Dusty Baker knows how to manage a bullpen.

You know....It's too early to throw serious flower's Baker's way about that, but the early returns sure do look good. The only thing I would have questioned yesterday was putting Coffey in for the ninth instead of letting Lincoln rack up a 3 inning save. That's a quibble, Coffey could use the work.

Originally Posted by Hap

Corey Patterson could be an all-star this year.

Yesterday I figured out that can't root for Corey Patterson, because in my head he is still a Cub. Maybe by June I'll be able to rethink that.

Originally Posted by Hap

Edinson Volquez throws gas, however he will have his struggles this year at times with command.

Edinson is today's Danny Jackson. If the umpire gives him the inside corner on lefthanded batters, he's gonna be hard to hit. If the ump doesn't give him that corner, he's in for a long day.

[RBA]

Looks like section 519 got a very good batch of beer.