time for some optimism-a look at 2010

[Will M]

the gloom and doom is kinda depressing. i have been looking at what we will have next year and it looks pretty good.

1B - Votto
2B - Phillips
SS - need #1. Janish seems like a utility infielder. Valiaka has question marks. Cozart is in AA.
3B - EE seems pencilled in here warts an all. Frazier should arrive sometime next year and I hope he pans out and is at 3B in 2011.
RF - Bruce. yeh he stunk this year but still has immense potential
CF - Dickerson, Stubbs and/or Heissey
LF - need #2. the Reds could use Heissey or Dickerson here. they may go get a bat here either for the long term or as a stopgap waiting for Alonso (Votto to LF?). Alonso hopefully will arrive sometime next year. depending on how Dickerson plays from here out and how Stubbs/Heissey play when they get the call we'll know better how to address LF this offseason.
C - Hanigan
Bench - Sutton, Rosales, Valaika, Dorn, Janish,etc. Lots of cheap bench players available to us. We could also sign a couple of guys to minor league deals like we did this year with Gomes, Nix, Ward, Jones,etc.
We need to find a backup catcher which shouldn't be too hard.

SP - Potentially very strong 1-2-3-4 with Cueto-Harang-Volquez-Bailey.
Owings seems a fine #5 while we wait for guys with bigger upsides like Stewart, Leake, & Wood. Arroyo is still around but the Reds would love to find a team desperate enough for pitching to take on his deal. $11M for a BOR starter can be better spend elsewhere.

RP - Cordero, Rhodes, Massett, Herrara, Fisher, Roenicke, Burton. Thats seven deep right there.

Overall 2010 looks pretty promising. Our pitching could be really strong if Volquez & Bailey pitch well. we have four guys with TOR potential. The pen looks strong and deep. We will have an infusion of talent with Stubbs & Heissey being ready opening day and Frazier/Alonso likely coming mid season.

The only glaring need for 2010 is a shortstop.

Why could 2010 be a lot better than 2009?
1. a healthy Volquez
2. a whole season of Bailey
3. a healthy EE
4. a new improved Jay Bruce
5. our losses are few: Weathers, Gomes, Nix, R Hernandez
6. get a shortstop and i really like our chances in 2010 (and beyond)

[RedLegSuperStar]

My thing about predicting what year we will be good and this and that is just about a waste of time as predicting trades. You can't count on prospects to pan out at the major league level as they do in the minors. Injuries are a huge part of this teams rise and decline and always have been. Imagine where the team is with a healthy Votto, Encarnacion, Arroyo, Volquez, Cueto, Gonzalez, and now Bruce. I know you are not claiming the Reds are going to compete in 2010 but others have. They can compete now if ownership wanted to. This farm system is loaded from top to bottom with enough talent to obtain needs and they are afraid to make a move. Last year was the same as they elected to stand pat and this offseason was nothing to scream about and it shows in season ticket sales. This organization is going to have to learn that putting a product on the field that can compete will put money in their pockets. Missing oppertunities to drive ticket sales and revenue isn't a smart business move especially in this economy. Which will take the blame in the long run.

[OnBaseMachine]

I'm optimistic about the Reds chances of contending in 2010 assuming Jocketty upgrades a couple positions, most notably shortstop and left field. I really like the Reds potential 1-4 of Cueto, Volquez, Bailey, and Harang. That's four potential above average or better starters. Find some offense to go with that rotation and the Reds could be very good next season, IMO.

[Strikes Out Looking]

I hate to rain on the parade, but isn't Taveras signed for 2010 and what makes anyone think Dusty (also signed for 2010) won't trot him out there in CF everyday next year (and then blame CDick for Willie's ineptitude on the field)?

[redsfan4445]

you forgot one thing Taveras is signed to a $4 million deal next year.. thats your lead-off hitter..sigh.. so much for that optimism

[VR]

I'm thinking Harang has to be turned to fill your SS/LF need....either via trade or free agent $.

[OnBaseMachine]

Originally Posted by Strikes Out Looking

I hate to rain on the parade, but isn't Taveras signed for 2010 and what makes anyone think Dusty (also signed for 2010) won't trot him out there in CF everyday next year (and then blame CDick for Willie's ineptitude on the field)?

If the Reds are serious about winning in 2010, they'll release Taveras this offseason.

[redsfan4445]

Harang and Manuel for Michael Taylor from the Phillies??

[TheNext44]

Originally Posted by Strikes Out Looking

I hate to rain on the parade, but isn't Taveras signed for 2010 and what makes anyone think Dusty (also signed for 2010) won't trot him out there in CF everyday next year (and then blame CDick for Willie's ineptitude on the field)?

Worst case scenerio, 2010 CF is Stubbs, which really is not that bad.

Taveras is out there because he has 30-50 SB speed, which Dusty requires for his CF. So does Stubbs, and Stubbs is better defensively, another requirement for Dusty for a CF.

Dusty doesn't fall in love with players, he falls in love with skills like speed. If Stubbs can provide that skill in CF, and play better defense, Dusty will play him over Taveras.

[BuckeyeRedleg]

Originally Posted by OnBaseMachine

If the Reds are serious about winning in 2010, they'll release Taveras this offseason.

True. We know that, but they apparently don't.

If they were serious about winning in 2009 or 2010, they would never have signed him in the first place.

[Falls City Beer]

Originally Posted by BuckeyeRedleg

True. We know that, but they apparently don't.

If they were serious about winning in 2009 or 2010, they would never have signed him in the first place.

Replace Taveras' PA all-season with an average CF. Where are the Reds in the standings right now?

[Will M]

Both Gomes and Nix are arbitration eligible for 2010. Gomes has been great so far. if he keeps it up the rest of the way we could keep him.
something like:
LF Dickerson/Gomes
CF Stubbs or Heissey
RF Bruce/Gomes

Basically get his bat in there vs LHP.

[BuckeyeRedleg]

Originally Posted by Falls City Beer

Replace Taveras' PA all-season with an average CF. Where are the Reds in the standings right now?

Probably not a whole lot better, but that's not the point. This is an organization that thought he would help.

He was not the answer. He shouldn't have even been a choice. He is ranked 830th out of 838 players in VORP. He's been awful in CF and pretty pedestrian on the basepaths. Add it all up and it's worse than bad. And the sad thing is that half this board could have predicted that, but the dudes getting paid the big bucks to make decisions on the future of our beloved franchise thought he was an answer for this franchise to compete in 2009 and 2010.

My point is they really never could have been serious about 2009 or 2010. That or they are just plain stupid. Take your pick.

[Caveat Emperor]

Originally Posted by Falls City Beer

Replace Taveras' PA all-season with an average CF. Where are the Reds in the standings right now?

The journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.

FWIW -- I expect Harang to get moved at the deadline. Walt ain't dumb -- the team can probably find Harang's production out there in FA this offseason for about what Harang is costing, and given the projected tightness of the market they can probably bring back a good haul of productive young talent in return for him.

[Falls City Beer]

Originally Posted by BuckeyeRedleg

Probably not a whole lot better, but that's not the point. This is an organization that thought he would help.

He was not the answer. He shouldn't have even been a choice. He is ranked 830th out of 838 players in VORP. He's been awful in CF and pretty pedestrian on the basepaths. Add it all up and it's worse than bad. And the sad thing is that half this board could have predicted that, but the dudes getting paid the big bucks to make decisions on the future of our beloved franchise thought he was an answer for this franchise to compete in 2009 and 2010.

My point is they really never could have been serious about 2009 or 2010. That or they are just plain stupid. Take your pick.

I'd say that's pretty reductive.

I don't think Wayne was an idiot because he signed Patterson; I think he was a poor GM because of his consistent track record of overpaying for production.

I can understand the argument that Walt isn't doing enough to help the team, not acquiring enough talent. I could agree with that. But to consider this Taveras deal as the emblem of his efforts is just missing the point.