Zack Greinke?

[membengal]

Well, Jake, speaking for myself, I tossed out my list as a starting point. Sure KC wouldn't take that. But the list you have put together? Bailey, Thompson, Frazier and Cumberland? I would do that too. It's negotiable. Getting someone like Grienke is worth putting the depth of the Reds system to the test.

[OldXOhio]

Originally Posted by Aronchis

Yes I have watched Bailey pitch. He no longer has plus velocity.

doug, why even bother discussing it and making excuses for him when you know as much as myself, Homer doesn't have it anymore.

Washed up at age 21, what a crock.


As for Grienke, I'd think KC's simply trying to sell high. The guy's been known as a bit of head case in these parts. Royals are a long way away from contending - convert his current 2.88 ERA into something bigger, more long term and move on.

[Mario-Rijo]

Originally Posted by OldXOhio

Washed up at age 21, what a crock.


As for Grienke, I'd think KC's simply trying to sell high. The guy's been known as a bit of head case in these parts. Royals are a long way away from contending - convert his current 2.88 ERA into something bigger, more long term and move on.

Yeah you are probably right. One key factor I had forgotten about is that Dayton Moore is the GM who had a cool 22 years under his belt in the ATL. Which as we all know has a particular knack for being able to take an unbiased look at their own talent, polishing it up and dealing it off. Only to find out later you ended up with a real Bong as he's getting smoked right & left.

[PuffyPig]

Originally Posted by membengal

Well, Jake, speaking for myself, I tossed out my list as a starting point. Sure KC wouldn't take that. But the list you have put together? Bailey, Thompson, Frazier and Cumberland? I would do that too. It's negotiable. Getting someone like Grienke is worth putting the depth of the Reds system to the test.

That's an awful lot to give up for a pitcher who hasn't put together even a good half season yet.

That wouls be a package that could get you a Haren type pitcher i.e. proven ace.

[PuffyPig]

Originally Posted by membengal

Kent Bottenfield and Adam Kennedy yielded Jim Edmonds in his prime. That was pretty good shining. And then some.

Kennedy wasn't shined up. He actually performed better than expected and became a respectable major league secondbaseman.

The trade was for one year of an often injured Edmonds, who then signed a long term deal with the Cards.

As I said, Walt's specialty is signing FA's to be, and then signing them long term. Shining up minor leaguers to trade is something I don't think he's ever done.

[Mario-Rijo]

Originally Posted by PuffyPig

Kennedy wasn't shined up. He actually performed better than expected and became a respectable major league secondbaseman.

The trade was for one year of an often injured Edmonds, who then signed a long term deal with the Cards.

As I said, Walt's specialty is signing FA's to be, and then signing them long term. Shining up minor leaguers to trade is something I don't think he's ever done.

Well then by this assessment do you think that Joe Blanton would make the ideal Jocketty target?

[GoReds]

Haren and Bedard commanded top notch packages to acquire. Greinke is not in the same class with Haren and Bedard. While the package has to be attractive, what I've heard is that KC wants to restock the minors. That makes a package including Stubbs, Bailey and a couple of others appear to meet that goal.

[RedsManRick]

Greinke's lack of sustained success is precisely why he's a perfect target. Sure, if the Royals want a Haren/Bedard package, you move on. But if you can come in under that, you can get through his prime under market who has made it through the injury nexus unharmed (physically) and has enough innings to prove he's at least a league average pitcher. He's at the cusp of getting too expensive, but not there yet.

I think a Bailey, Stubbs, Fransisco offer would at least get you a real spot at the table. The question comes down to how Bailey is valued. I don't think any of us has a real good sense of the perception out there -- my sense is that his valuation is all over the map. It depends on how the Royals view him.

[PuffyPig]

Originally Posted by Mario-Rijo

Well then by this assessment do you think that Joe Blanton would make the ideal Jocketty target?

It would be if I thought he was actually good ( I don't), and he was in his walk year (he's not).

These type of deals only mak sense if you have the money to throw around and sign these guys.

[GoReds]

Thompson is pitching well for the Bats since his promotion to AAA. Would you consider a package including Thompson to the Royals for Greinke?

[RedlegJake]

First off lets deal with Greinke's "head case". He suffered a form of depression that is treatable both clinically and medically. He's not a head case in a baseball sense at all. Very amenable to coaching, very intelligent, and he IS a pitcher, not a thrower. The guy is for real. He, Gordon and David De Jesus are my favorite Royals. Living here I watch several Royals games every year and follow the team with some interest, though not on the same emotional level as the Reds. I would give up the package I named for Greinke. I think he is as good as Haren and will prove out long term but yes, the stigma associated with clinical depression will haunt Zack, probably for the rest of his career. The chance to acquire a young pitcher of his quality is just too good not to go for it.

[Brutus]

I don't typically like to fixate much on the pie-in-the-sky possibilities, as the landscape in Major League Baseball manages to keep Reds' fans grounded -- or at least does its best to try.

However, today on the CBS Facts & Rumors blog, David Andriesen is citing a New York Post report by George King that the Royals will listen on anyone, including Greinke.

That blog is found here.

It seems to me that Greinke is the kind of guy the Reds should pay dearly for and not regret it.

On the down side, he's due for a significant raise next year (up to $13.5 mil from his current $7.25 mil salary).

But on the plus side, he's signed for two seasons, could be fit into this year's budget a bit easier and with Arroyo and Harang likely coming off the books, could be fit into the next few years' payroll much easier. Combine that with the fact he's still young, has a relatively clean bill of health and is a true ace, to me... a package of Travis Wood, Yonder Alonso, et all makes a ton of sense.

Perhaps Kansas City is only listening in theory, and would still ask for half of any team's 40-man roster to make the deal work. But I do think the Reds have what it would take, if they're willing.

[savafan]

I'm hesitant about trading Wood, but if Greinke was on the table, I'd lose a lot of sleep considering it.

[dsmith421]

Originally Posted by savafan

I'm hesitant about trading Wood, but if Greinke was on the table, I'd lose a lot of sleep considering it.

If Greinke was on the table and Wood was the best player we were giving them in exchange, I would bite the Royals' hand so hard that they'd have to praw my jaws open with a crowbar long after I died.

[Brutus]

Originally Posted by dsmith421

If Greinke was on the table and Wood was the best player we were giving them in exchange, I would bite the Royals' hand so hard that they'd have to praw my jaws open with a crowbar long after I died.

Agreed, LOL.

I would imagine it would cost the Reds, at very minimum, Wood and Alonso both, and I fret to imagine what else. But if the package started with those two, it's probably a no-brainer.