Arizona State's Baseball Coach Should be Fired and Flogged

[Boston Red]

He put in a kid in relief in their Super Regional game tonight who had thrown 118 pitches two days before. One day of rest after 118 pitches, and he throws the kid back out there. Baffling. The pitcher looks like he's going to get the loss, too, as Fresno leads them 12-5 in the 9th.

[LoganBuck]

Nolan Ryan, Jeff Brantley and Marty Brennamen applaud the guy.

[klw]

This is starting to happen occasionally. Throw a guy out of the pen on a day when it was slated for him to throw on the side. See Harang and the Padres game and Pettitte did it last year a few times.

[cincinnati chili]

Originally Posted by klw

This is starting to happen occasionally. Throw a guy out of the pen on a day when it was slated for him to throw on the side. See Harang and the Padres game and Pettitte did it last year a few times.

Look how well Harang has pitched since then.

[flyer85]

Originally Posted by LoganBuck

Nolan Ryan, Jeff Brantley and Marty Brennamen applaud the guy.

you left out Dusty Baker

[IslandRed]

Originally Posted by Boston Red

He put in a kid in relief in their Super Regional game tonight who had thrown 118 pitches two days before. One day of rest after 118 pitches, and he throws the kid back out there. Baffling. The pitcher looks like he's going to get the loss, too, as Fresno leads them 12-5 in the 9th.

Hate to say it, but this has been going on forever in college baseball. David Price made a relief appearance last year on two days' rest after throwing a 10-inning complete game. And this was just a few days before Price was to go #1 in the draft.

Bottom and unfortunate line, coaches are paid to win, college pitching staffs aren't very deep and the tournament settings put extra stress on them. (To use one extreme example, FSU lost its first regional game, so it had to win four elimination games in three days to advance.) Teams often play their most important games with a staff that's already used up. It's actually better than it used to be, IMHO. There's at least an awareness of the issue now, whereas in the old days they didn't think twice about riding their horses into the ground.

[Boston Red]

Maybe so, but I couldn't help but take a little bit of pleasure in the fact that they kid gave up six runs in the inning, which essentially sealed ASU's fate. I feel bad for the pitcher, but the coach definitely got what he deserved.

[Az. Reds Fan]

The way coach Pat Murphy handled Mike Leake is the least of his worries. The staged fight between ASU's best players, Ike Davis and Brett Wallace, before the game might end up costing Murphy his job.

[redsfanmia]

Pitchers are coddled too much as it is, I say if the kid says he can do it then let him.

[dougdirt]

Originally Posted by redsfanmia

Pitchers are coddled too much as it is, I say if the kid says he can do it then let him.

Pitchers are coddled so much these days because they were brought up coddled and to keep their arms healthy they need to continue to be coddled. Heck, I grew up playing baseball in the 90s and we had set rules on how often a pitcher could throw, how many innings and how much rest between games. These guys now are coming up with pitch counts, innings limits and so on. When you grow up like that, your arm is only capable of so much and you have to know its limits. This isn't 1960 anymore, guys aren't throwing 200 innings in high school, so when they get to the majors they can throw 300 like its nothing.

[Kingspoint]

Originally Posted by Boston Red

He put in a kid in relief in their Super Regional game tonight who had thrown 118 pitches two days before. One day of rest after 118 pitches, and he throws the kid back out there. Baffling. The pitcher looks like he's going to get the loss, too, as Fresno leads them 12-5 in the 9th.

Happens all the time in College in the playoffs as does 150-pitch outings during the regular season.

[Kingspoint]

Originally Posted by dougdirt

Pitchers are coddled so much these days because they were brought up coddled and to keep their arms healthy they need to continue to be coddled. Heck, I grew up playing baseball in the 90s and we had set rules on how often a pitcher could throw, how many innings and how much rest between games. These guys now are coming up with pitch counts, innings limits and so on. When you grow up like that, your arm is only capable of so much and you have to know its limits. This isn't 1960 anymore, guys aren't throwing 200 innings in high school, so when they get to the majors they can throw 300 like its nothing.

With this knowledge, Baker (and Narron before him) have/had no business extending Arroyo beyond 90 pitches, ever. He was always a 90-pitch max pitcher...about 1 inning less than your average Major League Starter. Arroyo is toast now.

Harang is also heading towards being toast now after leading the league the last three seasons in Innings pitched.

[Stephenk29]

Played a college game this year where a kid threw over 170 pitches. Was throwing harder by the end of the game too. Sometimes there is the occasional rubber arm I guess.

[redsfanmia]

Originally Posted by dougdirt

Pitchers are coddled so much these days because they were brought up coddled and to keep their arms healthy they need to continue to be coddled. Heck, I grew up playing baseball in the 90s and we had set rules on how often a pitcher could throw, how many innings and how much rest between games. These guys now are coming up with pitch counts, innings limits and so on. When you grow up like that, your arm is only capable of so much and you have to know its limits. This isn't 1960 anymore, guys aren't throwing 200 innings in high school, so when they get to the majors they can throw 300 like its nothing.

Thats my point, why are kids coddled so much when they are brought up? I played ball in the 80's and I remember throwing until my arm just flat out ached and I would ice it and the next day be fine. The problem is that kids that can throw hard are seen as lottery tickets so they are not allowed to build any kind of endurance because of fear of injury and I understand that but they need be able to develop as a pitcher.

[redsfanmia]

Originally Posted by dougdirt

Pitchers are coddled so much these days because they were brought up coddled and to keep their arms healthy they need to continue to be coddled. Heck, I grew up playing baseball in the 90s and we had set rules on how often a pitcher could throw, how many innings and how much rest between games. These guys now are coming up with pitch counts, innings limits and so on. When you grow up like that, your arm is only capable of so much and you have to know its limits. This isn't 1960 anymore, guys aren't throwing 200 innings in high school, so when they get to the majors they can throw 300 like its nothing.

Doug you seem like a knowledgable guy so I will ask you this why cant pitchers be developed to throw like they did in the 1960's? It would seem to me that since we have better training techniques and better medical technology that pitchers would be able to throw harder than the guys from years ago and throw for longer periods of time than the old timers. Maybe I just dont get it but it would seem like athletes of today are bigger, faster, stronger and better than the old days but it has not translated into the pitchers of today.