Hoosier Hoops

[traderumor]

Originally Posted by Razor Shines

I don't think that's it. They took 21 threes but 7 or 8 of those were in the last few minutes in desperation time. The problem was 13 Uturn overs in the first half and also letting Smith have the half of his life. The second half was ok.


They're tied for 241st in the nation in 3 pointers attempted per game at 16 per, only 1 more than Ohio St. They shoot it well but they don't rely on it. I don't know how else I can say it.

You beg the question that reliance on treys is reflected by lots of attempts. It was demonstated today and Thursday by low percentage on threes and two losses. The high percentage on threes is what turns an ordinary team into a threat.

The second half looked better because they drained a few threes. And the Bucks had already done their heavy lifting.

But what do I know. I obviously don't have a clue.

[WMR]

I actually really have a great deal of affection for lots of IU fans on this site... sorry for the role I played in making this thread ugly for the past couple pages.

I think both fan bases should be pretty happy right now with what they have.

[WVRed]

This is a poor argument. I could go shoplift a pack of gum from the grocery store and not get caught. Does that mean I'm clean?

Funny you should mention that. Bob Knight has never been in trouble with the NCAA and had high graduation rates. Does that mean he is clean? Glass houses...

Did you read my post? It seems as if you did not. My issue was that Cal likely knew of the benefits, but even if he didn't, he still tried to defend Kanter as an amateur after. That's arrogance or ignorance right there.

Call it what you want, but I'll stick to what I said in the previous response:

What the NCAA did with this ruling was ludicrous. Not so much because of what it did to UK (we made the FF without Kanter), but because the ruling is going against everything the NCAA says they want to promote, which is international talent. Kanter accepted money, but as Scrap said, the money that was accepted was put toward tuition and schooling so he could improve himself academically to play in the United States.

How do you think the Kanter ruling is going to affect international players coming to play collegiate sports in the US? European basketball is one of the shadiest businesses around where teams hold talented players for ransom for a high priced buyout. (Ricky Rubio) College would have likely been an alternative for some of these players, but I see the current "draft and stash" routine continuing.

Show me a quote where Cal said he turned Camby in please. No prognostications or purported stories, I want a real quote from Cal.

Regardless, Calipari was the coach and Camby was under his tutelage. Calipari is responsible for Camby and his actions involving the sport of basketball, period.

Cal was a great supporter of his kids grades, including Camby too, right?

http://www.nytimes.com/1994/11/20/sp...pagewanted=all

What has Cal's graduation rate been for his career? How many of his players have been ins some sort of academic trouble? Do you know Scrap Irony?

Welcome to the world of Atlantic 10 (or even C-USA) basketball. In order to survive in college coaching, you have to take risks on talented athletes, some of which aren't so talented in the classroom. I'm sure you could dig up similar articles on other coaches.

That being said, before the fall semester, UK had twice posted 3.0+ GPA's since Cal came to Lexington. This past semesters GPA was actually down to 2.7, and that is the LOWEST it has been since Cal has been here.

Why did Cal bolt for the NBA when the investigation was underway? And why did he leave for Kentucky when there was fire in Memphis with Rose & Dozier? Cal reminds me of Pete Carroll. Cal was the coach when Rose allowed his brother to travel to the games for free and that is a violation. Are you claiming he had no knowledge of that? Then you have the test score scandal too. Cal is the coach, his players play for him. Did he ever speak out against the issues with Rose? If he did, I sure don't remember it.

I can't speak for the Camby situation, but the Derrick Rose scandal did not break until Cal was hired at Kentucky.

I can't harp too much since the NCAA has allowed it, but I certainly frown upon it as I think it's a shady practice. To the best of my knowledge, IU has never resorted to it.

Thats your opinion. It's a competitve advantage and UK is not the only other team that does it. See my previous response with Marquis Teague, Xavier Henry, Chris Duhon, and Mario Chalmers.

If anything its like oversigning in college football. You might not agree with it, but its legal, and its going to happen.

As I said before, did Cal forget how many wins he had? Did he forget about the vacated seasons? It's either arrogance or ignorance. He could have stopped the celebration or said something and he didn't.

Did you think maybe there is arrogance on behalf of the NCAA? You can say whatever you want about Cal, but the NCAA is one of the most corrupt and indefensible organizations in this country. They have made millions exploiting "student-athletes" and Cal has spoken out against the NCAA with the "superconference" concept which basically does away with the NCAA and pays athletes.

I think one thing that people can't stand about Cal outside of the cheating is how his teams are fast tracks to the NBA. Coaches such as Roy Williams and Coach K (with exceptions) have done more to hinder the development of freshmen players and kill their draft stock. Cal's dribble drive system allows freshmen to showcase their talents for the next level, and Cal is absolutely honest with them in whether or not they should return to college or leave. Imagine Coach K ripping up a kids scholarship to tell him he's ready for the NBA. Cal did that with Dajuan Wagner.

[Brutus]

Originally Posted by Hoosier Red

My latest post deals with one of my absolute pet peeves of college athletics.

http://www.crimsoncast.com/2012/01/p...ersity-take-2/

That's you? Dude... I'm Kyle from Galen's Bracketology podcasts

[Razor Shines]

Originally Posted by traderumor

You beg the question that reliance on treys is reflected by lots of attempts. It was demonstated today and Thursday by low percentage on threes and two losses. The high percentage on threes is what turns an ordinary team into a threat.

The second half looked better because they drained a few threes. And the Bucks had already done their heavy lifting.

But what do I know. I obviously don't have a clue.

How many of IUs games have you watched? They only made 5 3s when they beat OSU in Bloomington. The second half was better because they didn't turn it over nearly as many times and while OSU had a strong shooting second half there wasnt anyone shooting like Smith did in the first half.

They haven't needed to shoot the 3 extremely well to win every game this season.


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[Razor Shines]

As for the coaches, the only time I've cared a great deal about NCAA violations was a when it was Sampson.


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[fearofpopvol1]

Originally Posted by WVRed

Funny you should mention that. Bob Knight has never been in trouble with the NCAA and had high graduation rates. Does that mean he is clean? Glass houses...

What does Bob Knight have to do with Cal?

Call it what you want, but I'll stick to what I said in the previous response:


Welcome to the world of Atlantic 10 (or even C-USA) basketball. In order to survive in college coaching, you have to take risks on talented athletes, some of which aren't so talented in the classroom. I'm sure you could dig up similar articles on other coaches.

That being said, before the fall semester, UK had twice posted 3.0+ GPA's since Cal came to Lexington. This past semesters GPA was actually down to 2.7, and that is the LOWEST it has been since Cal has been here.

What has Cal's graduation rate looked like with his players? How many players has he coached that have been ruled ineligible due to academics (both at UK and his other coaching jobs)? Why is it that a program like Duke has had plenty of success on the court and in the classroom? Do you think Cal puts winning on the court above the classroom? Or is it all about the $$?

I can't speak for the Camby situation, but the Derrick Rose scandal did not break until Cal was hired at Kentucky.

There's pretty good reason to believe that Cal knew what was coming (in both cases) and that's why he bolted. The investigation had already been underway quietly.

[WMR]

You know that Memphis offered Cal more money than Kentucky, right?

There was no reason for Cal to leave besides UK being his dream job.

His #1 recruiting class would have been intact (and actually a better class because he would have kept Xavier Henry).

[WMR]

None of our "one and done" players have hurt our APR, besides Orton who Cal did not even recruit.

Even the much attacked by other fan bases Eric Bledsoe would have been fully eligible for his sophomore season.

[redsfanmia]

Who really cares? Kentucky is the greatest basketball school and John Calipari has never done anything wrong ever. Lets get this thread back the topic of Hoosier basketball.

[fearofpopvol1]

Originally Posted by WMR

You know that Memphis offered Cal more money than Kentucky, right?

There was no reason for Cal to leave besides UK being his dream job.

His #1 recruiting class would have been intact (and actually a better class because he would have kept Xavier Henry).

It's a good narrative, but the fact remains that Memphis was under fire for the scandals that took place on his watch. I'd say it's pretty likely he left Memphis before he had no job.

[redsfanmia]

Originally Posted by fearofpopvol1

It's a good narrative, but the fact remains that Memphis was under fire for the scandals that took place on his watch. I'd say it's pretty likely he left Memphis before he had no job.

Come on man....you know that Calipari has never been in trouble with the NCAA and his TWO vacated final four's had nothing to do with him. Let it die Kentucky fan will not be convinced just like we will never be convinced, let it go.

[WVRed]

Originally Posted by fearofpopvol1

What does Bob Knight have to do with Cal?

It's simple, don't throw rocks if you live in a glass house. You want to go after Cal even though he was cleared by the NCAA. Bob Knight is also clean by NCAA standards. Doesn't make the system right.

What has Cal's graduation rate looked like with his players? How many players has he coached that have been ruled ineligible due to academics (both at UK and his other coaching jobs)? Why is it that a program like Duke has had plenty of success on the court and in the classroom? Do you think Cal puts winning on the court above the classroom? Or is it all about the $$?

If graduation rate is all you have, you're really grasping at straws. As for Duke, Duke is actually a pretty solid academic university, unlike UK which is a state flagship college. To play at Duke, you have to cut the grades, similar to Notre Dame.

There's pretty good reason to believe that Cal knew what was coming (in both cases) and that's why he bolted. The investigation had already been underway quietly.

That's an assumption and nothing factual.

Just seriously let it go. If anything comes up where Cal is actually proven guilty there is a UK thread that I am sure you and the other Ohio State, UC, etc fans will be there to discuss ad nauseum. I'm done debating in this thread regarding Cal.

[fearofpopvol1]

Originally Posted by redsfanmia

Come on man....you know that Calipari has never been in trouble with the NCAA and his TWO vacated final four's had nothing to do with him. Let it die Kentucky fan will not be convinced just like we will never be convinced, let it go.

There has been a lot of foul play with regard to players on his watch. We can agree to disagree on the accountability of a coach in those situations.

[fearofpopvol1]

Originally Posted by WVRed

It's simple, don't throw rocks if you live in a glass house. You want to go after Cal even though he was cleared by the NCAA. Bob Knight is also clean by NCAA standards. Doesn't make the system right.

To me, it's an effort to try to point something that isn't relevant to the conversation. If I had brought up Knight, that would be one thing. Cal's actions have nothing to do with Knight's actions. Therefore, it's a moot point.

If graduation rate is all you have, you're really grasping at straws. As for Duke, Duke is actually a pretty solid academic university, unlike UK which is a state flagship college. To play at Duke, you have to cut the grades, similar to Notre Dame.

All of that I'm aware of. It didn't answer my original question(s).

That's an assumption and nothing factual.

He did it at UMASS, why wouldn't he have done it at Memphis? The timing sure was interesting.