Albert Pujols wins NL MVP award - RedsZone.com - Cincinnati Reds Fans' Home for Baseball Discussion

Matt700wlw · 11-17-2008, 02:24 PM

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?...=.jsp&c_id=mlb

OnBaseMachine · 11-17-2008, 02:32 PM

He deserved it. Good job by the writers IMO. It's interesting though, a couple years ago Pujols said Ryan Howard didn't deserve to win the MVP because his team failed to make the playoffs. Two years later he finds himself in the same situation.

pahster · 11-17-2008, 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnBaseMachine

He deserved it. Good job by the writers IMO. It's interesting though, a couple years ago Pujols said Ryan Howard didn't deserve to win the MVP because his team failed to make the playoffs. Two years later he finds himself in the same situation.

Maybe they could trade trophies.

:

blumj · 11-17-2008, 02:52 PM

Two 1st place votes for Lidge, one guy had Pujols in 7th.

RedsManRick · 11-17-2008, 06:03 PM

Ryan Howard 2nd. Chase Utley 15th.

Howard: 700 PA, .251/.339/.543, 48 HR, 105 R, 146 RBI, 1/2 SB, poor defense at 1B
Utley: 707 PA, .292/.380/.535, 33 HR, 113 R, 104 RBI, 14/16 SB, and GG caliber defense at 2B.

The BBWAA is freaking clueless and an insult to the intelligent fan.

BRM · 11-17-2008, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedsManRick

Ryan Howard 2nd. Chase Utley 15th.

Howard: 700 PA, .251/.339/.543, 48 HR, 105 R, 146 RBI, 1/2 SB, poor defense at 1B
Utley: 707 PA, .292/.380/.535, 33 HR, 113 R, 104 RBI, 14/16 SB, and GG caliber defense at 2B.

The BBWAA is freaking clueless and an insult to the intelligent fan.

It's the counting stats. You know that. Howard's RBI total is just too much for the average journalist to overlook.

M2 · 11-17-2008, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedsManRick

Ryan Howard 2nd. Chase Utley 15th.

Howard: 700 PA, .251/.339/.543, 48 HR, 105 R, 146 RBI, 1/2 SB, poor defense at 1B
Utley: 707 PA, .292/.380/.535, 33 HR, 113 R, 104 RBI, 14/16 SB, and GG caliber defense at 2B.

The BBWAA is freaking clueless and an insult to the intelligent fan.

I'm with you. All the BBWAA ever does is prove itself inept. Ask most any Phillies fan and they'll tell you Utley is, by far, their best player.

I still say blue ribbon expert panel (kind of like a Supreme Court for baseball) and public arguments for the leading candidates is the way to go.

RedsManRick · 11-17-2008, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BRM

It's the counting stats. You know that. Howard's RBI total is just too much for the average journalist to overlook.

Oh I know. But Ryan Howard's RBI totals are in very large part to Chase Utley's OBP... Journalists are just too busy writing stories to do any analysis. RBI are more narrative friendly than defense or OBP.

blumj · 11-17-2008, 07:01 PM

Except, they're actually getting the right winners this year, even if they seem to be getting there backwards. And I think that is the most important part. No undeserving winners so far, and, for them, that's very good. Just as long as they don't make a liar out of me tomorrow. And don't go to their website, it'll blind you.

RedEye · 11-17-2008, 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnBaseMachine

He deserved it. Good job by the writers IMO. It's interesting though, a couple years ago Pujols said Ryan Howard didn't deserve to win the MVP because his team failed to make the playoffs. Two years later he finds himself in the same situation.

I think there's a strong argument that Pujols should actually have won both of them. Howard's 2006 was great, but Albert's was downright miraculous. At least they got it right this year, when it really shouldn't have been close.

bucksfan2 · 11-18-2008, 08:45 AM

Is Howard one of the most over rated players in baseball? The guy had a .339 OBP which is very low for an MVP caliber player. Without a hot September would Howard have gotten a single first place vote? Its kind of ironic that Utley is the best Phillie however Howard and Rollins have won MVP's and Utley hasn't

edabbs44 · 11-18-2008, 08:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bucksfan2

Is Howard one of the most over rated players in baseball? The guy had a .339 OBP which is very low for an MVP caliber player. Without a hot September would Howard have gotten a single first place vote? Its kind of ironic that Utley is the best Phillie however Howard and Rollins have won MVP's and Utley hasn't

Without a hot September from Howard the Phillies may have been watching the playoffs from home.

blumj · 11-18-2008, 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by edabbs44

Without a hot September from Howard the Phillies may have been watching the playoffs from home.

Couldn't you say that about any player who had any hot month for every playoff team that was in a close race? How are they in the position to make the playoffs without having Utley all season before Howard got hot?

edabbs44 · 11-18-2008, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blumj

Couldn't you say that about any player who had any hot month for every playoff team that was in a close race? How are they in the position to make the playoffs without having Utley all season before Howard got hot?

Howard had 3 months with a .930+ OPS, including a ridiculous 1.274 OPS in Sept.

He wasn't exactly invisible all season. I think he contributed to their pre-Sept success just a bit.

blumj · 11-18-2008, 08:48 PM

Sure, he did. But the impression the MVP voting gives is that Howard contributed much, much, more than Utley, which doesn't seem right at all.

11-17-2008, 02:24 PM	#1
Matt700wlw Making sense of it all Join Date: Jan 2004 Posts: 26,130	Albert Pujols wins NL MVP award http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?...=.jsp&c_id=mlb __________________ An excited shade of Red

11-17-2008, 02:32 PM	#2
OnBaseMachine Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 34,655	Re: Albert Pujols wins NL MVP award He deserved it. Good job by the writers IMO. It's interesting though, a couple years ago Pujols said Ryan Howard didn't deserve to win the MVP because his team failed to make the playoffs. Two years later he finds himself in the same situation. __________________ I miss Adam Dunn.

11-17-2008, 02:52 PM	#4
blumj Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 4,331	Re: Albert Pujols wins NL MVP award Two 1st place votes for Lidge, one guy had Pujols in 7th. __________________ "Reality tells us there are no guarantees. Except that some day Jon Lester will be on that list of 100-game winners." - Peter Gammons

11-17-2008, 06:03 PM	#5
RedsManRick Stat Wanker Hodiernus Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 14,915	Re: Albert Pujols wins NL MVP award Ryan Howard 2nd. Chase Utley 15th. Howard: 700 PA, .251/.339/.543, 48 HR, 105 R, 146 RBI, 1/2 SB, poor defense at 1B Utley: 707 PA, .292/.380/.535, 33 HR, 113 R, 104 RBI, 14/16 SB, and GG caliber defense at 2B. The BBWAA is freaking clueless and an insult to the intelligent fan. __________________ Games are won on run differential -- scoring more than your opponent. Runs are runs, scored or prevented they all count the same. Worry about scoring more and allowing fewer, not which positions contribute to which side of the equation or how "consistent" you are at your current level of performance.

11-17-2008, 07:01 PM	#9
blumj Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 4,331	Re: Albert Pujols wins NL MVP award Except, they're actually getting the right winners this year, even if they seem to be getting there backwards. And I think that is the most important part. No undeserving winners so far, and, for them, that's very good. Just as long as they don't make a liar out of me tomorrow. And don't go to their website, it'll blind you. __________________ "Reality tells us there are no guarantees. Except that some day Jon Lester will be on that list of 100-game winners." - Peter Gammons

11-18-2008, 08:45 AM	#11
bucksfan2 Waitin til next year Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Cincinnati Posts: 9,616	Re: Albert Pujols wins NL MVP award Is Howard one of the most over rated players in baseball? The guy had a .339 OBP which is very low for an MVP caliber player. Without a hot September would Howard have gotten a single first place vote? Its kind of ironic that Utley is the best Phillie however Howard and Rollins have won MVP's and Utley hasn't

11-18-2008, 08:48 PM	#15
blumj Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 4,331	Re: Albert Pujols wins NL MVP award Sure, he did. But the impression the MVP voting gives is that Howard contributed much, much, more than Utley, which doesn't seem right at all. __________________ "Reality tells us there are no guarantees. Except that some day Jon Lester will be on that list of 100-game winners." - Peter Gammons

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