Who is Redszone's #18 prospect? - RedsZone.com - Cincinnati Reds Fans' Home for Baseball Discussion

OnBaseMachine · 11-22-2008, 11:28 PM

Redszone's Top Prospects

Prospect #1 - Yonder Alonso
Prospect #2 - Todd Frazier
Prospect #3 - Neftali Soto
Prospect #4 - Drew Stubbs
Prospect #5 - Chris Valaika
Prospect #6 - Kyle Lotzkar
Prospect #7 - Daryl Thompson
Prospect #8 - Juan Francisco
Prospect #9 - Juan Duran
Prospect #10 - Chris Dickerson
Prospect #11 - Devin Mesoraco
Prospect #12 - Danny Dorn
Prospect #13 - Yorman Rodriguez
Prospect #14 - Zach Stewart
Prospect #15 - Josh Roenicke
Prospect #16 - Ramon Ramirez
Prospect #17 - Zach Cozart

OnBaseMachine · 11-22-2008, 11:33 PM

I again go with Carlos Fisher. Big frame, good strikeout totals along with groundball tendencies. Like Josh Roenicke, he's got a fresh arm since he didn't start pitching until just a few years ago.

AmarilloRed · 11-22-2008, 11:42 PM

Carlos Fisher showed a lot in his limited time in AAA.

mth123 · 11-23-2008, 03:39 AM

I've been touting Fisher as a sleeper for 2 years now and I like the kid a lot (see my Avatar), but he has bad stretches that scare the heck out of me and his performance in the AFL is a perfect example. I still think Fisher could be a solid middle inning guy, but I've dropped my expectations a bit.

So, I'm going with Chris Heisey at this spot. Right now, the difference that I can see between Heisey and Drew Stubbs lies mostly in hype and the hope that Stubbs adds some significant power. If it were me, I'd deal Stubbs and cash in on the hype and the potential to fill a need at a different spot and keep Heisey and likely end up with the same player. Stubbs status clearly gives him more value (I have him at number 4 as a result) to bring something back in trade, but IMO Heisey will be the same player at the big league level. I have Heisey at 12 on my personal list and go with him here.

Kc61 · 11-23-2008, 08:31 AM

I voted for Sam Lecure just edging out Fisher.

Folks may remember that Lecure had a big year in 2008. At AA, he dominated during June. After an injury he fell back a bit in July. Then in August he again was extremely effective and pitched 7 perfect innings on August 9.

In June, Lecure had a 1.73 ERA and a 4-1 record. Allowed no homers that month. 36 innings, 23 hits and 10 walks allowed. 31 Ks.

Overall he had 3.42 ERA and 128 Ks in 155 innings. 147 hits in those 155 innings. 1.32 WHIP, very good number for a starter.

Lecure really emerged last season and if he continues at AAA he could become a solid starting pitcher. So I think he deserves some votes.

Fisher has a more projectable frame and I understand why some prefer him. I'm voting Lecure instead because he still projects as a starter. Both of them should be in the top 20.

camisadelgolf · 11-23-2008, 01:58 PM

I want to vote for Ismael Guillon, but he isn't there.

If someone wants to argue that he doesn't belong on the list because he hasn't played professionally, Juan Carlos Sulbaran is already on the list.

And if someone wants to argue that he's too young, we've already got Yorman Rodriguez on the list.

OnBaseMachine · 11-23-2008, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by camisadelgolf

I want to vote for Ismael Guillon, but he isn't there.

If someone wants to argue that he doesn't belong on the list because he hasn't played professionally, Juan Carlos Sulbaran is already on the list.

And if someone wants to argue that he's too young, we've already got Yorman Rodriguez on the list.

I plan on adding Ismael Guillon and Junior Arias to the next poll.

fearofpopvol1 · 11-23-2008, 03:33 PM

Maloney, seriously. He deserves to be in there already.

camisadelgolf · 11-23-2008, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnBaseMachine

I plan on adding Ismael Guillon and Junior Arias to the next poll.

I think it's a bit premature for Arias. If you're going to add Junior Arias, you might want to consider adding other players with similar hype (and signing bonuses) such as Tzu-Kai Chiu and Yen-Wen Kuo.

OnBaseMachine · 11-23-2008, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by camisadelgolf

I think it's a bit premature for Arias. If you're going to add Junior Arias, you might want to consider adding other players with similar hype (and signing bonuses) such as Tzu-Kai Chiu and Yen-Wen Kuo.

Chiu and Kuo don't have the upside of an Arias or Guillon.

camisadelgolf · 11-23-2008, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OnBaseMachine

Chiu and Kuo don't have the upside of an Arias or Guillon.

For argument's sake, I'd say that at least 80% of the prospects currently on the list don't have the upside that Guillon does.

I don't have anything against Arias. I just don't see how you could argue for him at this point with the lack of information and hype on him. At least Yorman Rodriguez received nearly $3mm, which is about ten times more than what Arias received. A $3,000,000 signing bonus is typically an early first round draft pick. Even Guillon received a signing bonus worthy of a late first rounder, iIrc. Arias, on the other hand, received $300,000 signing bonus, which normally equates to a third round draft pick.

SMcGavin · 11-23-2008, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fearofpopvol1

Maloney, seriously. He deserves to be in there already.

I dunno, Juan Carlos Sulbaran signed for a lot of money and one of the minor league publications wrote a nice blurb about him. And Juan Duran and Yorman Rodriguez got a bunch of money too, plus someone who's paid to hype prospects said they are going to be awesome. Compared to all that Maloney's habit of "getting guys out" is pretty boring.

BRM · 11-24-2008, 09:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMcGavin

I dunno, Juan Carlos Sulbaran signed for a lot of money and one of the minor league publications wrote a nice blurb about him. And Juan Duran and Yorman Rodriguez got a bunch of money too, plus someone who's paid to hype prospects said they are going to be awesome. Compared to all that Maloney's habit of "getting guys out" is pretty boring.

It's all about projections. And most project Maloney to be a decent #5. That's why there's no "excitement" for him IMO.

SMcGavin · 11-24-2008, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BRM

It's all about projections. And most project Maloney to be a decent #5. That's why there's no "excitement" for him IMO.

I know. If I had Maloney pegged as a back of the rotation starter (say I was predicting a 5.00 ERA from him during his prime), I'd still rank him way higher than Juan Carlos Sulbaran.

tripleaaaron · 11-24-2008, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SMcGavin

I know. If I had Maloney pegged as a back of the rotation starter (say I was predicting a 5.00 ERA from him during his prime), I'd still rank him way higher than Juan Carlos Sulbaran.

Why? Because he is closer to getting smacked around in the show, or do you think that Sulbaran has less talent than Maloney?

View Poll Results: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect?
Alex Buchholz	7	7.14%
Dallas Buck	6	6.12%
Carlos Fisher	20	20.41%
Ryan Hanigan	7	7.14%
Chris Heisey	9	9.18%
Danny Ray Herrera	0	0%
Sean Henry	0	0%
Evan Hildenbrandt	4	4.08%
Jeremy Horst	0	0%
Ben Jukich	0	0%
Sam Lecure	2	2.04%
Matt Maloney	25	25.51%
Robert Manuel	0	0%
Adam Rosales	1	1.02%
Jordan Smith	0	0%
Juan Carlos Sulbaran	7	7.14%
Justin Turner	8	8.16%
Pedro Viola	0	0%
Brandon Waring	1	1.02%
Sean Watson	0	0%
Travis Wood	1	1.02%
Voters: 98. You may not vote on this poll

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11-22-2008, 11:28 PM	#1
OnBaseMachine Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 34,656	Who is Redszone's #18 prospect? Redszone's Top Prospects Prospect #1 - Yonder Alonso Prospect #2 - Todd Frazier Prospect #3 - Neftali Soto Prospect #4 - Drew Stubbs Prospect #5 - Chris Valaika Prospect #6 - Kyle Lotzkar Prospect #7 - Daryl Thompson Prospect #8 - Juan Francisco Prospect #9 - Juan Duran Prospect #10 - Chris Dickerson Prospect #11 - Devin Mesoraco Prospect #12 - Danny Dorn Prospect #13 - Yorman Rodriguez Prospect #14 - Zach Stewart Prospect #15 - Josh Roenicke Prospect #16 - Ramon Ramirez Prospect #17 - Zach Cozart __________________ I miss Adam Dunn.

11-22-2008, 11:33 PM	#2
OnBaseMachine Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 34,656	Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect? I again go with Carlos Fisher. Big frame, good strikeout totals along with groundball tendencies. Like Josh Roenicke, he's got a fresh arm since he didn't start pitching until just a few years ago. __________________ I miss Adam Dunn.

11-22-2008, 11:42 PM	#3
AmarilloRed Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Amarillo,Texas Posts: 3,997	Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect? Carlos Fisher showed a lot in his limited time in AAA.

11-23-2008, 03:39 AM	#4
mth123 The Big Dog Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 12,686	Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect? I've been touting Fisher as a sleeper for 2 years now and I like the kid a lot (see my Avatar), but he has bad stretches that scare the heck out of me and his performance in the AFL is a perfect example. I still think Fisher could be a solid middle inning guy, but I've dropped my expectations a bit. So, I'm going with Chris Heisey at this spot. Right now, the difference that I can see between Heisey and Drew Stubbs lies mostly in hype and the hope that Stubbs adds some significant power. If it were me, I'd deal Stubbs and cash in on the hype and the potential to fill a need at a different spot and keep Heisey and likely end up with the same player. Stubbs status clearly gives him more value (I have him at number 4 as a result) to bring something back in trade, but IMO Heisey will be the same player at the big league level. I have Heisey at 12 on my personal list and go with him here. __________________ "All I can tell them is pick a good one and sock it." --BABE RUTH Having better players makes "the right time" or "the big hit" happen a lot more often. PLUS PLUS Last edited by mth123; 11-23-2008 at 03:55 AM.

11-23-2008, 08:31 AM	#5
Kc61 Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Posts: 10,837	Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect? I voted for Sam Lecure just edging out Fisher. Folks may remember that Lecure had a big year in 2008. At AA, he dominated during June. After an injury he fell back a bit in July. Then in August he again was extremely effective and pitched 7 perfect innings on August 9. In June, Lecure had a 1.73 ERA and a 4-1 record. Allowed no homers that month. 36 innings, 23 hits and 10 walks allowed. 31 Ks. Overall he had 3.42 ERA and 128 Ks in 155 innings. 147 hits in those 155 innings. 1.32 WHIP, very good number for a starter. Lecure really emerged last season and if he continues at AAA he could become a solid starting pitcher. So I think he deserves some votes. Fisher has a more projectable frame and I understand why some prefer him. I'm voting Lecure instead because he still projects as a starter. Both of them should be in the top 20. Last edited by Kc61; 11-23-2008 at 08:52 AM.

11-23-2008, 01:58 PM	#6
camisadelgolf Vampire Weekend @Bernie's Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 11,311	Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect? I want to vote for Ismael Guillon, but he isn't there. If someone wants to argue that he doesn't belong on the list because he hasn't played professionally, Juan Carlos Sulbaran is already on the list. And if someone wants to argue that he's too young, we've already got Yorman Rodriguez on the list.

11-23-2008, 03:33 PM	#8
fearofpopvol1 Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: New York, NY Posts: 8,634	Re: Who is Redszone's #18 prospect? Maloney, seriously. He deserves to be in there already.