Mel Kiper's Big Board

[Mario-Rijo]

Originally Posted by icehole3

Im not trying to bust your chops, but who's rankings are you looking at because Girlcheck cant be ranked that high, I was looking at NFL.com and there's about a half dozen centers on the free agent market. I can see the Bengals throwing some money at Saturday or a Birk. Even being as incompetent as they are they have been able to focus on one position group and grab a guy to fill a need thru free agency. They must resign Benson or this off season will be a failure IMO. As far the draft they need to stick to their draft board, when they reach they get burned. BPA on their board, grab the guy and just move onto the next round, remember whoever they draft will be holding out anyway.

DraftDaddy

That is the best lists I have seen to date, he's ranked 4th.

#1 - Jason Brown - Baltimore (likely to be retained)
#2 - Brad Meester - Jax (Currently a guard)
#3 - Jeff Saturday - Colts (Much Older)
#4 - Eric Ghiacuic
#5 - Matt Birk - Minnesota (Much Older)

A guy we have already sorta kinda been linked to only due to connections (Mcanally) is Richie Incognito of St. Louis but he's not currently a FA and I doubt I would want him if he were. He seems like a good run blocker but not sure he's a good fit in the passing game. Whoever we get needs to remain healthy and be able to pass block because Carson is too important.

I don't know about Benson, I just get this feeling that he won't have the same fire he came out with this season if he gets a big contract. I also had read where he and Marvin actually didn't see things eye to eye on several occassions. Plus the games he played the best there was an awful lack of effort & tackling against us. I'm just not sold.

[Emin3mShady07]

Originally Posted by AmarilloRed

Kiper has the top 3 WRs coming off the board by the time the Bears pick at #18. As Bears fans, we should hope that Florida's Percy Harvin doesn't go to the Jets at #17 as predicted by Mel.

I personally think that Jeremy Maclin will still be on the board when the Bears pick so if we get a guy like that and maybe sign TJ houshmanzadeh and voila, now Orton has some guys to throw to.

[icehole3]

Originally Posted by Mario-Rijo

DraftDaddy

That is the best lists I have seen to date, he's ranked 4th.

#1 - Jason Brown - Baltimore (likely to be retained)
#2 - Brad Meester - Jax (Currently a guard)
#3 - Jeff Saturday - Colts (Much Older)
#4 - Eric Ghiacuic
#5 - Matt Birk - Minnesota (Much Older)

A guy we have already sorta kinda been linked to only due to connections (Mcanally) is Richie Incognito of St. Louis but he's not currently a FA and I doubt I would want him if he were. He seems like a good run blocker but not sure he's a good fit in the passing game. Whoever we get needs to remain healthy and be able to pass block because Carson is too important.

I don't know about Benson, I just get this feeling that he won't have the same fire he came out with this season if he gets a big contract. I also had read where he and Marvin actually didn't see things eye to eye on several occassions. Plus the games he played the best there was an awful lack of effort & tackling against us. I'm just not sold.

I agree about Benson, even though Birk and Saturday are old, I would take a shot over Girlcheck, they dont get tossed around like a rag doll.

[Screwball]

Originally Posted by Redhook

I'm not sure what's happened to Geathers either. I do know he was mishandled mightily in 2007 switching between LB and DE. That was an ignorant move by the Bengals. Last year, though, I thought he would be back to a decent DE.

Geathers wasn't mishandled mightily in '07. He was forced to play at linebacker because the Bengals literally had 2 healthy ones left on their roster to play an entire game. You name the linebacker and he was injured that year. While Geathers certainly wasn't an ideal option, he was about the only one left.

I believe their D-Line is a bunch of average players, no difference makers. Not one guy on that line demands a double-team. I truely believe that if they Bengals can get one stud on that line it would make a world of difference. And it could be at any position, not necessarily an end.

Agreed. However, I think Pat Sims could make a world of difference if he builds on the flashes of brilliance he showed this past season. I was none too happy when the Bengals allowed the Saints to move ahead of them to draft Sedrick Ellis, but the fact they kept their 3rd and were able to grab Rivers + Sims is looking like a great move right now. But yeah, another beast on the defensive line would be huge for this defense (which, in fact, finished 12th in ypg allowed, albeit only 21st in Aikman Efficiency Ratings).

[icehole3]

Thats why I wouldnt be upset at all if they drafted Raji. Here's my fav 5

1. Curry
2. Rey Rey
3. Raji
4. Oher
5. Jenkins

[Redhook]

Originally Posted by Screwball

Geathers wasn't mishandled mightily in '07. He was forced to play at linebacker because the Bengals literally had 2 healthy ones left on their roster to play an entire game. You name the linebacker and he was injured that year. While Geathers certainly wasn't an ideal option, he was about the only one left.

He was playing out of position, regardless of how many guys were injured. On top of that, the beast that John Thornton is played out of position as well at DE. So, the Bengals had two guys out of position instead of signing another LB.

That year was obviously a disaster for the Bengals linebackers. They messed up by not keeping Simmons and then it went downhill from there. I just don't believe in taking a strength, Geathers at DE, and turning it into a weakness.

Agreed. However, I think Pat Sims could make a world of difference if he builds on the flashes of brilliance he showed this past season. I was none too happy when the Bengals allowed the Saints to move ahead of them to draft Sedrick Ellis, but the fact they kept their 3rd and were able to grab Rivers + Sims is looking like a great move right now. But yeah, another beast on the defensive line would be huge for this defense (which, in fact, finished 12th in ypg allowed, albeit only 21st in Aikman Efficiency Ratings).

I'm liking Rivers and Sims as well. Their defense is turning the corner. They're close to being pretty darn good. Getting one "stud" would make a world of difference. I hope they find one.

[Boss-Hog]

Originally Posted by Screwball

But yeah, another beast on the defensive line would be huge for this defense (which, in fact, finished 12th in ypg allowed, albeit only 21st in Aikman Efficiency Ratings).

It's important to note that they were something like 21st in yards allowed entering the last game of the season, and a good game against the Chiefs propelled them all the way up to 12th. They certainly look to be headed in the right direction, but I mention this as a cautionary reminder of how close the end of the season rankings are - enough so that a good game against a bad offense can catapult you from below average to slightly above average. They were will pretty poor in terms of points allowed, but the offense certainly had a lot to do with that.

[OesterPoster]

Originally Posted by Emin3mShady07

I personally think that Jeremy Maclin will still be on the board when the Bears pick so if we get a guy like that and maybe sign TJ houshmanzadeh and voila, now Orton has some guys to throw to.

No way. As a general rule, WRs in the NFL take more than 1 year to have a significant impact. We drafted Simpson and Caldwell fairly high last year, so they should be ready to make an impact in '09. Caldwell even started to appear "ready" towards the end of '08. As someone else stated, I don't think it matters who Carson is throwing to. Give him time, and he'll find the open receiver. Draft heavy on the OL, DL, or LB with the first 3-4 picks.

Of course, Mike Brown could "shock" us all and go RB, WR, TE with the first 3 picks.

[Screwball]

Originally Posted by Redhook

He was playing out of position, regardless of how many guys were injured. On top of that, the beast that John Thornton is played out of position as well at DE. So, the Bengals had two guys out of position instead of signing another LB.

That year was obviously a disaster for the Bengals linebackers. They messed up by not keeping Simmons and then it went downhill from there. I just don't believe in taking a strength, Geathers at DE, and turning it into a weakness.

I see what you're saying, but they just had no other choice. I'm sure the last thing the Bengals' staff wanted to do was to sign him to a big contract extension and then take him out of position. But when even the guys you pick up off the scrap heap are getting injured (e.g., LaMarr Marshall), you sometimes have to make tough choices. Good point though about Simmons. I had forgotten about him. They certainly could've used him in '07, although it should be noted that he hasn't played a snap since the Bengals cut him.

Oh and yes, the beast that is John Thornton (lol) needs to be cut yesterday. From hearing his interviews to reading his blog he genuinely seems like a smart, good guy. However, he's just not really any good. He's sort of like the Juan Castro of the Bengals. He doesn't really add anything on the field anymore, but he's such "good people" off the field, they keep him around and still give him playing time.

Originally Posted by Boss-Hog

It's important to note that they were something like 21st in yards allowed entering the last game of the season, and a good game against the Chiefs propelled them all the way up to 12th. They certainly look to be headed in the right direction, but I mention this as a cautionary reminder of how close the end of the season rankings are - enough so that a good game against a bad offense can catapult you from below average to slightly above average. They were will pretty poor in terms of points allowed, but the offense certainly had a lot to do with that.

I think that's a good point, which is why I also added that they were 21st in the Aikman Efficiency Ratings. I don't honestly believe the Bengals have the 12th best defense in the NFL, but I do think they're (finally) showing a little bit of fight and competence. I was actually pretty proud of the fact that even though they had nothing to play for (and some Bengals fans actually wanted the team to lose), the defense still played hard and didn't mail it in at the end of the season. Zimmer, IMO, has/had a lot to do with that. As long as he's around and they upgrade the D-Line, I think this unit has a chance to legitimately be one of the 12 best in the NFL.

[Sea Ray]

[QUOTE=Mario-Rijo;1794377A guy we have already sorta kinda been linked to only due to connections (Mcanally) is Richie Incognito of St. Louis but he's not currently a FA and I doubt I would want him if he were. He seems like a good run blocker but not sure he's a good fit in the passing game. Whoever we get needs to remain healthy and be able to pass block because Carson is too important.

I don't know about Benson, I just get this feeling that he won't have the same fire he came out with this season if he gets a big contract. I also had read where he and Marvin actually didn't see things eye to eye on several occassions. Plus the games he played the best there was an awful lack of effort & tackling against us. I'm just not sold.[/QUOTE]


I don't think pass blocking is a priority when evaluating a center. I mainly want to a center to be able to stand his ground and not get bullrushed in either a running or passing situation.

I'm OK with age in my next center. Ideally I'd like to see a guy like Saturday brought in while we draft a stud to groom. Heck, I may even be talked into bringing Braham back if that means I don't have to see Ghiacuic in Bengal stripes again. He's the worst O-lineman I've seen play for Cincinnati since Rod Jones

As for Benson, I'd like to have him back but he's not a must. I don't break the bank for him. You can always find RBs especially when you have the entire off season to shop. The next Cedric Benson will seriously consider Cincinnati because of the chance to play. There will be some talented RBs cut between now and the start of the 2009 season. Remember when Garrison Hearst fell into our laps? It happens

[Sea Ray]

Originally Posted by Screwball

I think that's a good point, which is why I also added that they were 21st in the Aikman Efficiency Ratings. I don't honestly believe the Bengals have the 12th best defense in the NFL, but I do think they're (finally) showing a little bit of fight and competence. I was actually pretty proud of the fact that even though they had nothing to play for (and some Bengals fans actually wanted the team to lose), the defense still played hard and didn't mail it in at the end of the season. Zimmer, IMO, has/had a lot to do with that. As long as he's around and they upgrade the D-Line, I think this unit has a chance to legitimately be one of the 12 best in the NFL.

No way they ended the year with the 12th best defense but the impressive thing is how would that defense look if it had Joseph, Rivers, Ndukwe, White, Geathers and Rucker? I also think Eric Henderson can make a difference in pass rushing situations but he may be one of those guys who can't seem to stay healthy in the NFL.

[OesterPoster]

Originally Posted by OesterPoster

No way. As a general rule, WRs in the NFL take more than 1 year to have a significant impact. We drafted Simpson and Caldwell fairly high last year, so they should be ready to make an impact in '09. Caldwell even started to appear "ready" towards the end of '08. As someone else stated, I don't think it matters who Carson is throwing to. Give him time, and he'll find the open receiver. Draft heavy on the OL, DL, or LB with the first 3-4 picks.

Of course, Mike Brown could "shock" us all and go RB, WR, TE with the first 3 picks.

Oops, just realized you're a Bears fan...so yeah, go ahead and pick Maclin.

[bucksfan2]

Originally Posted by icehole3

Thats why I wouldnt be upset at all if they drafted Raji. Here's my fav 5

1. Curry
2. Rey Rey
3. Raji
4. Oher
5. Jenkins

What scares me about Raji is McShay said he could turn into a starting DT. Which to me means he isn't ready yet. I wouldn't want to spend a high pick on a player who isn't ready at a very difficult position to draft.

Rey Rey is a game changer. You find the ball and you find him. Too often that gets pushed aside when combine numbers come in.

I love Jenkins. Partly because he is my favorite player, besides Troy Smith, to play for the Bucks. I think he can be a very good cover corner but at the same time I think he could be a great safety. A game changing safety in the mold of Polamalu or Reed.

The Benglas should draft OT first unless they feel there will be a better value pick in the second round. I have a dream that Laurainitis slips to the Bengals in round 2.

[Mario-Rijo]

Originally Posted by icehole3

Thats why I wouldnt be upset at all if they drafted Raji. Here's my fav 5

1. Curry
2. Rey Rey
3. Raji
4. Oher
5. Jenkins

My current fav 5 based on what I think would make the Bengals kick themselves for later are like this. If all were ava. at #6.

#1 - Rey Muauluga (Ray Lewis/Troy Polamalu combo clone)
#2 - Aaron Curry (Derrick Thomas-esque?)
#3 - Aaron Maybin (Like him but need to know more for sure)
#4 - B.J. Raji (I have questions about his work ethic but beyond that a beast)
#5 - Malcolm Jenkins (Gonna be a safe and quality pick regardless)

Not sure there is an elite offensive tackle in the group, they all have sizable question marks.

But I would rank them as such on potential.

Oher (Greatest potential to boom and to bust, could also end up at guard)
A. Smith (An elite RT prospect but can he be a LT and if so how good)
Monroe (How is his work ethic and character and can he hold up physically)
J. Smith (RT or RG, I doubt he has the goods to be a LT, how did he handle Orakpo?)

A. Smith is a likely top 5 pick the other 3 guys 10-20 range.

My current mock top 10:
#1 - Lions - Matthew Stafford - It's about greatest potential and he has the arm strength and enough of all other aspects to be elite.
#2 - Rams - Andre Smith LT - How can you pass on him with all the line issues they have had the past few years.
#3 - Chiefs - Aaron Curry OLB - Perfect fit to replace an old Donnie Edwards.
#4 - Seahawks - Malcolm Jenkins S - The Hawks need a FS and Malcolm is right up their alley.
#5 - Browns - Michael Crabtree - Black Hole opposite Edwards is now filled.
#6 - Bengals - Rey Muauluga - Probably wishful thinking he lasts this long but hey I like to dream.
#7 - Packers Trade w/ Raiders - B.J. Raji DT - The new man in GB is Dom Capers as defensive coordinator, NT in a 3-4 is the hardest spot to fill. If no trade is made I can see Aaron Maybin for the pack at #9 with Raji possibly going 8th to Jags.
#8 - Jags - Michael Oher OT - Raji a good fit here also but Oher is a great fit as Jax needs OL.
#9 - Raiders - Jeremy Maclin WR - Raiders need WR's and Al Loves speed, they also aren't afraid to reach.
#10 - 49ers - Mark Sanchez QB - Time to turn the page on Alex Smith and that allows Hill to return as a 1 yr stopgap to give the offense a little continuity in the meantime.

[WMR]

I've been pimping Rey for a year and a half now. Really hope the Bungles draft him. Would be awesome to see him paired with Rivers. The new Takeo and Simmons.