Cop Beats Up on 15-year-old Girl

[Ravenlord]

Originally Posted by Caveat Emperor

Word.

99.9% of police officers are out there working hard to keep the rest of us safe and doing a great job at it. It's a real pity that the .1% will do things like this and give the police a bad name.

that number is considerably larger than 0.1%.

[Redsfaithful]

A badge and a gun doesn't make one worthy of respect, at least no more respect than anyone deserves. There's nothing special about being a cop. It's not like the guy had the job forced on him, he chose it despite being completely ill suited for the position. Hopefully he sees serious jail time, but I'm not holding my breath.

Also, there's nothing mystical or special about "authority" that demands respect if it's not earned. Cops are there to serve us, and they're certainly not there to mete out any punishment. Too many forget they are just parts of the process, cogs in a much bigger machine.

[Caveat Emperor]

Originally Posted by Redsfaithful

Also, there's nothing mystical or special about "authority" that demands respect if it's not earned. Cops are there to serve us, and they're certainly not there to mete out any punishment. Too many forget they are just parts of the process, cogs in a much bigger machine.

I see what you're getting at, but I think you're wrong here.

Theoretically, what you say is true -- police officers are "public servants" and they do serve the people. However, they're also given the responsibility of keeping order and making sure the laws we have agreed to live under (via our elected representatives) are followed and enforced. Thus, they "serve" us not by always being at our beck and call or providing services to us individually, but by making sure that we (along with everyone else) live up to our end of the proverbial social contract.

As such, I think it's misguided to say that a police officer should have to earn respect. The whole rule of law breaks down if compliance with reasonable police authority is not mandated. I'm not saying that a police officer should have limitless power over people, but the system doesn't work if people are always free to ignore or oppose reasonable exercise of authority. It's nice to think that respect should be earned, but that simply isn't practical when you're talking about people who are charged with enforcing laws and investigating crime. That authority has to be unilaterally recognized independent of any previous contact with police or contact with individual police officers -- otherwise you're back to the issue of noncompliance ("I don't have to do what you say just because you say it"), which breaks the system down again.

We sacrifice a bit of liberty for security, safety, and orderly society. I know what Mr. Franklin has to say about that concept, but I think it's certainly preferable to the alternative.

[Razor Shines]

Originally Posted by Redsfaithful

A badge and a gun doesn't make one worthy of respect, at least no more respect than anyone deserves. There's nothing special about being a cop. It's not like the guy had the job forced on him, he chose it despite being completely ill suited for the position. Hopefully he sees serious jail time, but I'm not holding my breath.

I'm guessing you don't think that the military deserves respect either? I have to really disagree with you. I think there is something special about being a police officer or serving in the military. It is true that no one forces it on them, but I think that's of what makes it special. If you choose to put yourself in harms way to serve others, well I think that's somewhat special.

I do agree that this guy should serve some real jail time. Although this guy would have lost my respect after getting a DUI. There is no way he should have been allowed to stay on the force after, but lucky for him the union was there to save his job.

[GoReds33]

This girl did need a good butt kicking, IMO. The fact that it was a cop is the only part I disagree with. If this were me, I know my dad wouldn't hesitate to give me a good punishing.

However, the first part of what the cop did was by the book. He made an attempt to subdue the subject without provoiding room for her to do something further. It was the way he treated her when she was on the ground that I am in complete disagreement with. I am sure he won't get any type of punishment, however.

[Joseph]

Originally Posted by Redsfaithful

A badge and a gun doesn't make one worthy of respect, at least no more respect than anyone deserves. There's nothing special about being a cop. It's not like the guy had the job forced on him, he chose it despite being completely ill suited for the position. Hopefully he sees serious jail time, but I'm not holding my breath.

Also, there's nothing mystical or special about "authority" that demands respect if it's not earned. Cops are there to serve us, and they're certainly not there to mete out any punishment. Too many forget they are just parts of the process, cogs in a much bigger machine.

My dad was a detective. Two uncles were cops. Got a brother in law going through the academy now to be a state trooper. To say my perspective is slanted would be an understatement.

However to say there is nothing special about being a cop....borders on insulting.

I'm not insinuating this cop is worthy of respect. I'm not saying she has issues with this cop in particular as her authority figure, but authority in general.

If there were no police to keep at least some semblance of peace and order, I bet a surprising number of people you and I care about wouldn't be around. People are screwed up to say the least, and these cops who put on that badge and the uniform do a helluva lot to be sure you and I aren't subjected to it.

[RedsBaron]

I have known a few police officers (and judges for that matter) whom I did not respect as people, but their position does deserve respect. I have a lot of admiration for most police officers.
All that said, I hope that the officer in the video (unless the video somehow has been "doctored" and doesn't tell the full story) is both prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law and is forever barred from ever again being a police officer.
What the 15 year old girl did was wrong and I can understand the officer losing his temper, unprofessional as that would have been. I can even understand, if not condone, a brief angry physical response, but that video depicts repeated punches by the officer on a 15 year old who was no threat. That is inexcusable. That officer is not someone who should be wearing a badge (and a gun), with the legal authority to order anyone to do anything. He appeared in that video to be more suited to be one of Hitler's Brownshirts or Stalin's goons.

[wally post]

Originally Posted by Joseph

My dad was a detective. Two uncles were cops. Got a brother in law going through the academy now to be a state trooper. To say my perspective is slanted would be an understatement.

However to say there is nothing special about being a cop....borders on insulting.

I'm not insinuating this cop is worthy of respect. I'm not saying she has issues with this cop in particular as her authority figure, but authority in general.

If there were no police to keep at least some semblance of peace and order, I bet a surprising number of people you and I care about wouldn't be around. People are screwed up to say the least, and these cops who put on that badge and the uniform do a helluva lot to be sure you and I aren't subjected to it.

+1. I have a few NYPD pals and I can't imagine what they go through. Yes, there are bad apples - Obviously this police officer has a problem and I hope he suffers for what he did to her - that was clearly out of line. But, just as clearly, they have a difficult job.

[TeamSelig]

would love to see how much respect you give to the police when the time comes that you need them

[The Baumer]

ALWAYS respect or ALWAYS be a communist.

NO IN BETWEEN.

[Ravenlord]

Originally Posted by The Baumer

ALWAYS respect or ALWAYS be a communist.

NO IN BETWEEN.

that doesn't even make sense.

and how on earth has this thread stayed open this long?

[Razor Shines]

Originally Posted by Ravenlord

that doesn't even make sense.

and how on earth has this thread stayed open this long?

I'm going to jump out on a limb and say that he was being sarcastic. Characterizing some people's (mine included) opinion as what he stated. And let's be honest this:

ALWAYS respect or ALWAYS be a communist.

NO IN BETWEEN.

Has been stated as an opinion over and over in this thread.

[klw]

For some reason I thought of this. Does include profanity. there is a higher quality version but has profanity in the shown link

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9gCCj...eature=related

[Caveat Emperor]

Originally Posted by Ravenlord

that doesn't even make sense.

and how on earth has this thread stayed open this long?

It's a political thread only in the abstract -- proper exercises of state authority and state action, social contract, etc.

The minute that changes, or if the tone ceases to be civil, this thread can and will be DFA'd.

[Redsfaithful]

Caveat, good point, and I see what you are saying and don't disagree. I just don't understand the special reverence some people hold for the law and for certain occupations like policing and the military. I have a great deal of respect for police officers and soldiers who operate ethically and properly, but any random officer or soldier starts out at neutral.

Also, cops have brought this on themselves by not demanding that their unions come down hard on this type of behavior. There's an us vs. them mentality with every cop I've ever known (and hey I'm even related to one, how about that) that doesn't help out at all. The vast majority aren't crooked or abusive, but the vast majority also look the other way at crap like this, or think you should never rat out a "brother" when you see improper behavior. Until that changes most of the public will have a mostly negative view of police officers. I'm not holding my breath on that either though.