Rolen Talks Revived

[redsfandan]

Originally Posted by Kc61

Third base may not be the highest order of need, but it would be an improvment. It could not, however, be the only upgrade. It would hopefully be one of several.

I agree. It may not be top priority but it would help. My main concern would be:

Originally Posted by RANDY IN CHAR NC

If they trade for Rolen and re-sign Gonzalez, they can have a great defensive left side of the infield on the DL next season. I have always liked Rolen, but a 35 year old third baseman with a history of back problems sounds scary to me.

[TheNext44]

The key to this deal, if it happens, is the money. Rolen is worth money, if the Reds have it to spend, but I think it would put the Reds near their limit. If they can give better prospects and split the money, I'd do it, unless the prospects are expected to contribute next year.

I think the Reds finally realized that they can't compete with EE's glove at 3B. Rolen's glove will be a more important upgrade than his bat.

[nate]

Originally Posted by SirFelixCat

Agreed. And 3b is not the issue w/ this team right now. Plain and simple.

I'd argue that 3b and CF are the biggest problems with the offense to date.

Split           G GS   PA   AB   R   H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS  BB  SO   BA  OBP  SLG   OPS  TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB ROE BAbip tOPS+ sOPS+
as DH           9      38   32   5  11  3  0  3   7  1  0   5   8 .344 .447 .719 1.166  23   1   1  0  0   0   0  .381   225   192
as P           86     203  171  11  25  4  1  3  13  0  0   6  59 .146 .174 .234  .408  40   5   0 25  1   0   2  .200    15   134
as C           95     387  331  31  98 16  2  3  30  4  5  45  38 .296 .379 .384  .762 127   6   2  4  5   6   2  .322   118   115
as PH          80     143  124  15  27 10  2  2  11  3  0  19  44 .218 .322 .379  .701  47   3   0  0  0   3   0  .321    98   114
as 2B          95     410  363  54 100 16  3 16  69 15  8  33  41 .275 .334 .468  .802 170  13   3  3  8   3   4  .268   125   112
as 1B          95     413  360  54 109 18  1 16  63  5  1  46  70 .303 .389 .492  .881 177   8   5  2  0   5   4  .339   148   110
as Infield     95    2006 1759 210 467 90  8 47 227 27 15 185 279 .265 .340 .406  .746 714  38  23 19 20  19  21  .289   111    98
at Def. Pos.   95    1628 1451 184 386 75  8 25 149 40 17 122 199 .266 .324 .380  .705 552  29  12 24 19  13  16  .290    99    93
at Off. Pos.   95    1626 1430 172 346 66  6 55 183 12  9 157 320 .242 .324 .412  .736 589  23  21  9  9   9  17  .273   108    87
as RF          95     408  362  42  79 16  2 19  51  5  3  42  79 .218 .302 .431  .733 156   6   2  1  1   2   3  .226   106    86
as SS          95     396  360  42  86 27  1  4  31  7  3  22  55 .239 .290 .353  .643 127   6   5  6  3   4   4  .270    82    82
as LF          95     405  363  47  84 19  2 12  35  1  2  30  96 .231 .298 .394  .692 143   4   6  2  4   1   3  .278    95    79
as Outfield    95    1248 1122 146 265 51  6 33 105 25 11  94 240 .236 .299 .381  .680 427  14  10 14  8   3  12  .271    92    77
as 3B          95     400  345  29  74 13  1  8  34  1  3  39  75 .214 .306 .328  .633 113   5   8  4  4   1   7  .248    80    70
as CF          95     435  397  57 102 16  2  2  19 19  6  22  65 .257 .297 .322  .620 128   4   2 11  3   0   6  .300    76    66

Hey, at least our pitchers are good hitters!

[redsfandan]

Fwiw, that chart isn't exactly the best way to point to the difference between EE & Rolen. Rolen would replace EE. Only EE. That chart includes everyone that has had any time at 3rd (Hairston, Rosales, Sutton, etc).

[mth123]

This is just what the Jays have been waiting for. Rolen has a healthy stretch and some sucker with a history with him comes along and takes him off their hands before his back explodes again. All things considered, I'd rather have EdE.

How quickly we forget Jr. landing on the DL again and again and again.

[Kc61]

Originally Posted by RANDY IN CHAR NC

If they trade for Rolen and re-sign Gonzalez, they can have a great defensive left side of the infield on the DL next season. I have always liked Rolen, but a 35 year old third baseman with a history of back problems sounds scary to me.

Gonzo is not going to be the primary shortstop next year. It would be ridiculous for that to happen. He's had too many injuries, too much mileage to be the primary shortstop next year. And his contract is up.

Anything's possible, but that's not a realistic scenario.

As for third base, it's not as if EE has been injury free this season. Worst case, we have another mix and match year at third. And it's not like Griffey at all. Rolen isn't getting a lengthy extension, this is for a couple of years.

I'm not ecstatic about this possibility, but it would be a reasonable risk, a decent move for 2010 if the price is not too high.

[Chip R]

Originally Posted by Kc61

Gonzo is not going to be the primary shortstop next year. It would be ridiculous for that to happen.

A lot of us thought it would be ridiculous to bring in a leadoff hitter who couldn't get on base but that's what happened.

[Kc61]

Originally Posted by mth123

This is just what the Jays have been waiting for. Rolen has a healthy stretch and some sucker with a history with him comes along and takes him off their hands before his back explodes again. All things considered, I'd rather have EdE.

How quickly we forget Jr. landing on the DL again and again and again.

The Reds signed Griffey for what, seven years. Very different from a short-term contract with Rolen that expires after 2010. If the Reds give Rolen a lengthy extension, then you're right, but nobody said that's happening.

[SirFelixCat]

Originally Posted by nate

I'd argue that 3b and CF are the biggest problems with the offense to date.

Split           G GS   PA   AB   R   H 2B 3B HR RBI SB CS  BB  SO   BA  OBP  SLG   OPS  TB GDP HBP SH SF IBB ROE BAbip tOPS+ sOPS+
as DH           9      38   32   5  11  3  0  3   7  1  0   5   8 .344 .447 .719 1.166  23   1   1  0  0   0   0  .381   225   192
as P           86     203  171  11  25  4  1  3  13  0  0   6  59 .146 .174 .234  .408  40   5   0 25  1   0   2  .200    15   134
as C           95     387  331  31  98 16  2  3  30  4  5  45  38 .296 .379 .384  .762 127   6   2  4  5   6   2  .322   118   115
as PH          80     143  124  15  27 10  2  2  11  3  0  19  44 .218 .322 .379  .701  47   3   0  0  0   3   0  .321    98   114
as 2B          95     410  363  54 100 16  3 16  69 15  8  33  41 .275 .334 .468  .802 170  13   3  3  8   3   4  .268   125   112
as 1B          95     413  360  54 109 18  1 16  63  5  1  46  70 .303 .389 .492  .881 177   8   5  2  0   5   4  .339   148   110
as Infield     95    2006 1759 210 467 90  8 47 227 27 15 185 279 .265 .340 .406  .746 714  38  23 19 20  19  21  .289   111    98
at Def. Pos.   95    1628 1451 184 386 75  8 25 149 40 17 122 199 .266 .324 .380  .705 552  29  12 24 19  13  16  .290    99    93
at Off. Pos.   95    1626 1430 172 346 66  6 55 183 12  9 157 320 .242 .324 .412  .736 589  23  21  9  9   9  17  .273   108    87
as RF          95     408  362  42  79 16  2 19  51  5  3  42  79 .218 .302 .431  .733 156   6   2  1  1   2   3  .226   106    86
as SS          95     396  360  42  86 27  1  4  31  7  3  22  55 .239 .290 .353  .643 127   6   5  6  3   4   4  .270    82    82
as LF          95     405  363  47  84 19  2 12  35  1  2  30  96 .231 .298 .394  .692 143   4   6  2  4   1   3  .278    95    79
as Outfield    95    1248 1122 146 265 51  6 33 105 25 11  94 240 .236 .299 .381  .680 427  14  10 14  8   3  12  .271    92    77
as 3B          95     400  345  29  74 13  1  8  34  1  3  39  75 .214 .306 .328  .633 113   5   8  4  4   1   7  .248    80    70
as CF          95     435  397  57 102 16  2  2  19 19  6  22  65 .257 .297 .322  .620 128   4   2 11  3   0   6  .300    76    66

Hey, at least our pitchers are good hitters!

Kinda skewed seeing as EdE has missed 1/2 the season and can't account for a healthy chunk of time @ 3B, no?

[Falls City Beer]

Originally Posted by Kc61

The Reds signed Griffey for what, seven years. Very different from a short-term contract with Rolen that expires after 2010. If the Reds give Rolen a lengthy extension, then you're right, but nobody said that's happening.

9 years. Post-age-30 seasons.

[SirFelixCat]

Originally Posted by Kc61

The Reds signed Griffey for what, seven years. Very different from a short-term contract with Rolen that expires after 2010. If the Reds give Rolen a lengthy extension, then you're right, but nobody said that's happening.

I fear Rolen and his lack of health the last handful of years. That said, as long as the Reds don't give up anything major for him, I would think that Frazier would be ready to take over in late 2010 or 2011 for sure, right?

[redsfandan]

Rolen didn't miss that much time before his current contract started. So I wouldn't be surprised if his next contract addresses injury concerns.

[Chip R]

Originally Posted by SirFelixCat

I fear Rolen and his lack of health the last handful of years. That said, as long as the Reds don't give up anything major for him, I would think that Frazier would be ready to take over in late 2010 or 2011 for sure, right?

It'd be nice if Frazier actually played 3rd lately. I can't imagine he's so good at 3rd that he could play at the major league level without having played there for awhile.

[mth123]

Originally Posted by Kc61

The Reds signed Griffey for what, seven years. Very different from a short-term contract with Rolen that expires after 2010. If the Reds give Rolen a lengthy extension, then you're right, but nobody said that's happening.

I'm not worried about his next contract. I just think at his salary he'll be the key acquisition for 2010 and could very easily spend most of it on the DL. I'll pass.

[redsfandan]

Like others have mentioned, this only works if there are also other moves made as well. It's something entirely different if it's the only move.