Seattle fires Jim Mora, ESPN reporting Pete Carroll next.

[Hoosier Red]

I really don't understand how people can argue with the Rooney rule unless they believe that the # of minority coaches was not a problem. It's a legitimate viewpoint to think that but the 32 NFL owners did not. They wanted to create a system where more minority candidates were getting opportunities.

So without forcing a single team to hire someone less qualified, the number of minority coaches has gone from 2 to 6 inside of 5 years.

[Chip R]

Originally Posted by BRM

How many people believe the bolded part?

Mark McGwire?

[jimbo]

Originally Posted by Hoosier Red

They wanted to create a system where more minority candidates were getting opportunities.

I would rather they create a system where more qualified candidates were getting opportunities.

[bucksfan2]

Originally Posted by Hoosier Red

I really don't understand how people can argue with the Rooney rule unless they believe that the # of minority coaches was not a problem. It's a legitimate viewpoint to think that but the 32 NFL owners did not. They wanted to create a system where more minority candidates were getting opportunities.

So without forcing a single team to hire someone less qualified, the number of minority coaches has gone from 2 to 6 inside of 5 years.

The problem I have with the system is on full display this off season. If you want to hire a coach like Shanahan, Cowher, Carroll, or Holmgren why should you have to interview anybody else? You are hiring these guys based upon pedigree, wins, style, etc.

If Leslie Frazier wants to become a NFL head coach, which I think he does, then let him interview for an actual job that he can get.

[Sea Ray]

Originally Posted by Hoosier Red

I really don't understand how people can argue with the Rooney rule unless they believe that the # of minority coaches was not a problem. It's a legitimate viewpoint to think that but the 32 NFL owners did not. They wanted to create a system where more minority candidates were getting opportunities.

So without forcing a single team to hire someone less qualified, the number of minority coaches has gone from 2 to 6 inside of 5 years.

Because it makes a mockery of the entire process. I present to you exhibit A and B:


1) Seahawks

2) Redskins

Read the two articles I posted if you want to know what a mockery this was.

If a team wants to hire a white coach then it is a burden for a minority candidate to be called in. Just ask Leslie Frazier

The Rooney Rule doesn't keep teams from hiring the white boys

[gonelong]

Originally Posted by Sea Ray

Because it makes a mockery of the entire process. I present to you exhibit A and B:


1) Seahawks

2) Redskins

Read the two articles I posted if you want to know what a mockery this was.

If a team wants to hire a white coach then it is a burden for a minority candidate to be called in. Just ask Leslie Frazier

The Rooney Rule doesn't keep teams from hiring the white boys[/quote]

It wasn't meant to. It was meant to give minorities access to the process. Coaches are hired-to-be-fired.

The guy that interviews has a chance to make an impression on a number of people. He has access. I'd rather be considered as an after-thought or a courtesy than not at all, because that gives me a chance, no matter how small. That's a burden I'll gladly shoulder.

In a year or two's time, many of those folks that were part of the process may have moved to another team and have a voice in the hiring of that teams next coach.

If Leslie Frazier doesn't want to be bothered with opportunity, then he can pound sand. I'd be damn happy to interview for a scarce position that I knew was already all but locked-up if the chances the position would be open again in 3 years was 50/50.

GL

[Hoosier Red]

Originally Posted by jimbo

I would rather they create a system where more qualified candidates were getting opportunities.

Fine, but that's not what the owners wanted. They were not forced to implement this rule, they wanted to open up the opportunities to minority coaches because they realized that more qualified coaches were not getting as many chances.

[Hoosier Red]

Originally Posted by Sea Ray

Because it makes a mockery of the entire process. I present to you exhibit A and B:


1) Seahawks

2) Redskins

Read the two articles I posted if you want to know what a mockery this was.

If a team wants to hire a white coach then it is a burden for a minority candidate to be called in. Just ask Leslie Frazier

The Rooney Rule doesn't keep teams from hiring the white boys

Which is exactly why its the correct way of doing things.

Consider from 2003(when the Rooney Rule was instituted) through 2006, the number of minority coaches went from 2 to 6.

That tells me that simply making sure that minority candidates are being included in the process but are not given preferential treatment means that the rule is working exactly as they want it to.

Sorry if it means the Redskins and Cowboys have to spend an extra $500 on a hotel room.


Again, if it was an imposition to Leslie Frazier he could have politely declined.
There are many situations which I've pointed out where it is useful for minority candidates to interview.

[jimbo]

Originally Posted by Hoosier Red

Fine, but that's not what the owners wanted. They were not forced to implement this rule, they wanted to open up the opportunities to minority coaches because they realized that more qualified coaches were not getting as many chances.

I disagree with all of this. The rule was never intended to give more qualified coaches chances, but rather minorities, qualified or not. The NFL was pretty much pressured into it by civil rights lawyers who threatened them with a major lawsuit if they didn't start hiring more black coaches. The PR from something like that would have been disastrous, so they had to come up with something.

[jimbo]

Originally Posted by Hoosier Red

Consider from 2003(when the Rooney Rule was instituted) through 2006, the number of minority coaches went from 2 to 6.

That tells me that simply making sure that minority candidates are being included in the process but are not given preferential treatment means that the rule is working exactly as they want it to.

Or, it could simply mean that the organizations who hired these coaches felt they were the most qualified, and would have interviewed and hired them regardless if the Rooney Rule was in effect or not.

[Hoosier Red]

Originally Posted by jimbo

Or, it could simply mean that the organizations who hired these coaches felt they were the most qualified, and would have interviewed and hired them regardless if the Rooney Rule was in effect or not.

All right I don't want to be argumentative so my last words on this.

If you are correct, then for 20 years, 4 black coaches were hired and if I understand correctly never more than 2 were coaching at one time.

The Rooney Rule is passed which makes no requirement to hire black coaches, but rather simply to interview one. And within 4 years the number of coaches goes from 2-6 and it's simply a coincidence?

They were all on the verge of being offered jobs anyway? To me that's more naive than believing Pete Rose never gambled on baseball.