the 6 untouchables

[Kc61]

Most of the guys being mentioned are not untouchables IMO. In fact, most of the guys in the Reds system are very tradeable. Good, but not the kind of player likely to be dominant.

Chapman is probably untouchable.

After that I don't call anyone untouchable.

If I had to make a list it would be:

Chapman
Yorman Rodriguez
Francisco
Juan Duran
Donnie Joseph -- not untouchable but possibly a Reds mainstay in the near future.
Maybe Mesoraco because of his position.

Even this group is a stretch for untouchable status.

There are other guys who I would hold onto because they haven't had time to show us their ceiling as yet. Like Boxberger, for example.

[kaldaniels]

Originally Posted by Kc61

Most of the guys being mentioned are not untouchables IMO. In fact, most of the guys in the Reds system are very tradeable. Good, but not the kind of player likely to be dominant.

Chapman is probably untouchable.

After that I don't call anyone untouchable.

If I had to make a list it would be:

Chapman
Yorman Rodriguez
Francisco
Juan Duran
Donnie Joseph -- not untouchable but possibly a Reds mainstay in the near future.
Maybe Mesoraco because of his position.

Even this group is a stretch for untouchable status.

There are other guys who I would hold onto because they haven't had time to show us their ceiling as yet. Like Boxberger, for example.

I was debating taking Duran as one of my 6, but in the spirit of the question, I chose Frazier, as I didn't think Duran would be plucked by the opposing GM...but Frazier might.

[Kc61]

Originally Posted by kaldaniels

I was debating taking Duran as one of my 6, but in the spirit of the question, I chose Frazier, as I didn't think Duran would be plucked by the opposing GM...but Frazier might.

I'm taking the question at face value. To me, Duran is not someone you would trade. He comes highly touted. He hasn't had a chance to show his ability as yet.

I'd want to hold onto Duran and Rodriguez, both, and see what they've got.

[kaldaniels]

Originally Posted by Kc61

I'm taking the question at face value. To me, Duran is not someone you would trade. He comes highly touted. He hasn't had a chance to show his ability as yet.

I'd want to hold onto Duran and Rodriguez, both, and see what they've got.

What is your face value of the question?

[Kc61]

Originally Posted by kaldaniels

What is your face value of the question?

The face value is that the question asks who is "untouchable."

I take that to mean, who shouldn't be traded.

I do not take it to mean, what is your current top prospects list. That could be a different question, depending on the individual prospect.

[dougdirt]

I think the only true untouchable is Chapman, but I would be very hesitant to trade these guys as well: Devin Mesoraco, Yorman Rodriguez, Zack Cozart and Billy Hamilton. Not the 'best' prospects, but guys that aren't as easily replaced in the system. Mesoraco is showing some skills right now that no other catcher in the system can come close to matching. Yorman Rodriguez and Billy Hamilton are two super athletes and the system is bare of them beyond those two. Zack Cozart is a guy who I think could be every bit the player that Orlando Cabrera has been for the Reds so far, but with more upside moving forward and is the only real option for SS in the system for the next 2-3 years.

[kaldaniels]

Originally Posted by Kc61

The face value is that the question asks who is "untouchable."

I take that to mean, who shouldn't be traded.

I do not take it to mean, what is your current top prospects list. That could be a different question, depending on the individual prospect.

The thing is that wasn't the question exactly. In the question given there is a major league gm waiting to pick his top guy that you don't protect.

[Kc61]

Originally Posted by kaldaniels

The thing is that wasn't the question exactly. In the question given there is a major league gm waiting to pick his top guy that you don't protect.

Doesn't change my view. Those are the six I would protect.

I think Doug adds a good one in Hamilton. He'd be my seventh. I want to keep him as well, to see how he develops. Seems like he has a lot of talent.

[TRF]

Chapman and Yorman...




then much lower I'd add:

Mesoraco IF his numbers hold up (.800+ OPS at AA, but he's going to have to pick it up a bit to reach .800)

Juan Duran. Youth, big time power potential. You don't Shell out 2M for guys you intend to trade. The Reds see him as the future in the OF, probably LF.

Donnie Joseph. Sick numbers. at Low A, continued into High A. K machine.

Then you have a group of 10-12 guys, all interchangeable. Maybe JF? Soto? one of the SS's? No one screams untouchable. Frazier and Alonso both are struggling. Valaika is solid, but not a sexy can't miss guy. Hamilton is raw, and lacks power potential. None of the pitchers, Wood, Maloney, LeCure, Klinker, Fairel, JCS etc. scream untouchable.

[Vottomatic]

Originally Posted by TRF

Chapman and Yorman...




then much lower I'd add:

Mesoraco IF his numbers hold up (.800+ OPS at AA, but he's going to have to pick it up a bit to reach .800)

Juan Duran. Youth, big time power potential. You don't Shell out 2M for guys you intend to trade. The Reds see him as the future in the OF, probably LF.

Donnie Joseph. Sick numbers. at Low A, continued into High A. K machine.

Then you have a group of 10-12 guys, all interchangeable. Maybe JF? Soto? one of the SS's? No one screams untouchable. Frazier and Alonso both are struggling. Valaika is solid, but not a sexy can't miss guy. Hamilton is raw, and lacks power potential. None of the pitchers, Wood, Maloney, LeCure, Klinker, Fairel, JCS etc. scream untouchable.

I agree with this. I named 6 because I thought we had to.

My list would be Chapman and Mesoraco.

[HokieRed]

Still think that if you're writing off the top six in the organization, it's very likely the return's not going to be much more than something you already have or can acquire through some other means. That said, I'd be hard put to trade Chapman in any reasonably forseeable transaction. Upside and potential impact are just too great.

[nemesis]

Hamilton reminds me of Andrus. I could see Hamilton swiping 50 - 60 bases over a full season. He could develop gap power and certainly has the speed to be a triples machine. His OBP is going to be his key. His toolset is that of a lead-off guy. He needs to develop his pitch selection for him to be successful Major Leaguer. Yorman and Duran fall into the same boat for me. Both are so young that even if it takes 5 more years to develop they'd only be 22 and 23 yrs old. This is why I like the Latin American signings. Gives the team a longer window of opportunity with each player.

In A ball or lower you have:

CF Yorman
LF Duran
SS/2B/CF Hamilton
RF Silva
SS Gregorious
2B H. Rodriguez
C/2B Bardhardt
2B Sierra
OF Bowe
OF Morrison
SS Arias
SS Valor
SP Guillon
SP Johnson
SP Sulbaran
SP Cline
SP Tuttle
RP Corcino
RP Adames
RP Driessen
RP Clarke
RP R. Rodriguez

All these kids have had success. Everyone of them is 20 or younger. Thats 23 of them. Granted they are a long way away from the majors. But add in a fresh draft class this week, International signings in a couple weeks and the DSL and VSL players and your talking 40 players with plus tools and pitches. The untouchable list could get very big very quickly...

[JayBruce]

Untouchable?

AVG OBP SLG OPS
.243 .316 .412 .728

Born: 08/12/1985

[JayBruce]

Career:

AVG OBP SLG OPS
.261 .333 .410 .743

How you even consider parting with this gentleman?

[dougdirt]

Originally Posted by JayBruce

Career:

AVG OBP SLG OPS
.261 .333 .410 .743

How you even consider parting with this gentleman?

Above average defensive shortstop with solid pop and solid plate discipline when your current SS is only signed through the end of the year makes him a tough move.