Yasmani Grandal to start season in Double-A

[Scrap Irony]

I said great doug. Read my posts above for clarification.

Again, so as to not be mistaken nor misquoted nor misunderstood-- Mesoraco might be a great offensive catcher at an 800 OPS, but would likely be below average at any other position he might be able to play defensively.

Therefore, having he or Grandal as anything more than a back-up at another spot would be a poor idea. IMO.

That would make two prospects we disagree on, doug-- Alonso and Mesoraco. Alonso, you profile as a 900 OPS slugger and Mesoraco an 850 OPS guy.

Would that be their beginning OPS in Cincinnati, peak year(s), or career?

[Slyder]

Wasn't skipping Bakersfield mentioned for a few guys because of the reputation of Bakersfield being one of the worst stadiums in the minors? Maybe part of the reason why is they don't want to risk injury to some spects?

[texasdave]

Originally Posted by Slyder

Wasn't skipping Bakersfield mentioned for a few guys because of the reputation of Bakersfield being one of the worst stadiums in the minors? Maybe part of the reason why is they don't want to risk injury to some spects?

Here's a thought. If the Reds don't want to risk one of their major prospects getting hurt why don't they spend some money and fix the playing field instead of jumping them a level? Crazy, I know. Instead just jump people up a level higher than they should be and risk derailing their development. Now maybe skipping a level isn't such a big deal. But it still seems to me the prudent thing would be to improve the quality of the playing surface. I would think the organization would owe that much to whomever does eventually have to play there.

[dougdirt]

Originally Posted by texasdave

Here's a thought. If the Reds don't want to risk one of their major prospects getting hurt why don't they spend some money and fix the playing field instead of jumping them a level? Crazy, I know. Instead just jump people up a level higher than they should be and risk derailing their development. Now maybe skipping a level isn't such a big deal. But it still seems to me the prudent thing would be to improve the quality of the playing surface. I would think the organization would owe that much to whomever does eventually have to play there.

This can be two fold. First, it does seem that the "fix" would not be cheap, at all. Something like a million bucks for two years is a lot of money, especially when you don't own the team or facility. But, if it saves just one player a serious injury, then it could be worth it. As for skipping players over the level, the Reds certainly wouldn't be the first organization to skip players over the California League, though the other teams that do it generally do it with pitchers because they don't want them to deal with the "Coors" effect nearly every night. I believe that there is generally a thing or five to learn at each level, but that doesn't always apply to everyone. Perhaps Grandal is that advanced.

[cinreds21]

Here's something I thought of just now. Say it's June and Hernandez or Hanigan goes down for at least a month with an injury. Mes is have a good year in Louisville, but Grandal is having as good a year in Carolina. With the 40 full, do you call up Grandal over Mes because he is already on the 40?

[Scrap Irony]

Possible, depending on how the other guys on the 40-man are playing. A very real possibility, actually, especially considering how difficult the catching position is and the injury histories of both Hernandez and Hanigan.

[lollipopcurve]

Mes is have a good year in Louisville, but Grandal is having as good a year in Carolina. With the 40 full, do you call up Grandal over Mes because he is already on the 40?

Highly unlikely, IMO. A move would be made to open a spot on the 40 -- for either Mesoraco or Miller before Grandal. A couple months in, there will be an injury or a subpar performance by a marginal guy that allows them to make this move without sacrificing much, if anything.

[camisadelgolf]

Originally Posted by cinreds21

Here's something I thought of just now. Say it's June and Hernandez or Hanigan goes down for at least a month with an injury. Mes is have a good year in Louisville, but Grandal is having as good a year in Carolina. With the 40 full, do you call up Grandal over Mes because he is already on the 40?

No way. That would be sending a bad message to all the minor leaguers. "Listen, you've dedicated years to our organization, and you've shown that you're ready, but the truth is that we're more about business than we are about being fair, so we're going to give him a shot before you." It would potentially deflate the morale of so many players.

[mth123]

Originally Posted by cinreds21

Here's something I thought of just now. Say it's June and Hernandez or Hanigan goes down for at least a month with an injury. Mes is have a good year in Louisville, but Grandal is having as good a year in Carolina. With the 40 full, do you call up Grandal over Mes because he is already on the 40?

I think this is interesting. The Reds are so deep, that anyone removed from the 40 man would likely be claimed on waivers. Danny Rae is the only one that wouldn't bother me too much, but chances are he goes at the end of spring if Willis or Hermida makes the roster. After that, it would sting a little.

If the Reds had to overpay a bit with a two or three for one deal even for a slight upgrade it might be worth it as opposed to losing guys anyway with nothing in return. After Herrera my order of guys to let go would include Miguel Cairo (won't happen) Jordan Smith, Chris Valaika, Phil Valiquette, Carlos Fisher and Matt Maloney. If Daryl Thompson is not healthy he'd jump to the front of the line.

[Scrap Irony]

I'll agree with the three-for-one type deal to perhaps upgrade a major league problem spot. (A Heisey/Smith/Cordero swap for Beltran could still make sense, dangit!)

Or they could move a couple of prospects for lower level guys in the hopes of not having to protect someone and solidifying Bakersfield/ Dayton AND balancing out prospects through the farm. A Valaika for talented but enigmatic High A starter could work out.

[medford]

I've got to believe there are 29 teams out there scouting the Reds this ST with an eye towards a potential deal for an arm before spring training expires.

[Mario-Rijo]

Originally Posted by Scrap Irony

I'll agree with the three-for-one type deal to perhaps upgrade a major league problem spot. (A Heisey/Smith/Cordero swap for Beltran could still make sense, dangit!)

Or they could move a couple of prospects for lower level guys in the hopes of not having to protect someone and solidifying Bakersfield/ Dayton AND balancing out prospects through the farm. A Valaika for talented but enigmatic High A starter could work out.

Can't fool with Beltran, he isn't doing that great health wise already.

[Mario-Rijo]

Originally Posted by mth123

I think this is interesting. The Reds are so deep, that anyone removed from the 40 man would likely be claimed on waivers. Danny Rae is the only one that wouldn't bother me too much, but chances are he goes at the end of spring if Willis or Hermida makes the roster. After that, it would sting a little.

If the Reds had to overpay a bit with a two or three for one deal even for a slight upgrade it might be worth it as opposed to losing guys anyway with nothing in return. After Herrera my order of guys to let go would include Miguel Cairo (won't happen) Jordan Smith, Chris Valaika, Phil Valiquette, Carlos Fisher and Matt Maloney. If Daryl Thompson is not healthy he'd jump to the front of the line.

I'd have to go something more like:

Herrera
Cairo
Fisher
Maloney
Valaika
Thompson
Smith
Valiquette

[mth123]

Originally Posted by Mario-Rijo

I'd have to go something more like:

Herrera
Cairo
Fisher
Maloney
Valaika
Thompson
Smith
Valiquette

Jordan Smith and those horrid K-Rates remid me of somebody who could never succeed in the big leagues over the long haul. Valaika is a guy with no power, no speed, poor on base skills and below average defense. He can't really play the only spot where his bat would be decent. Those are easy to find. After Danny Rae and Cairo who are obvious, they should be the first to go IMO. I can see Valiquette having some value as a hard throwing lefty, but I like the Maloney and his ability to go 180 innings if need be better. I'm probably over-rating Fisher, but there is something about him that makes me think he could be a decent 7th inning guy if he got a full season's look.

[Mario-Rijo]

Originally Posted by mth123

Jordan Smith and those horrid K-Rates remid me of somebody who could never succeed in the big leagues over the long haul. Valaika is a guy with no power, no speed, poor on base skills and below average defense. He can't really play the only spot where his bat would be decent. Those are easy to find. After Danny Rae and Cairo who are obvious, they should be the first to go IMO. I can see Valiquette having some value as a hard throwing lefty, but I like the Maloney and his ability to go 180 innings if need be better. I'm probably over-rating Fisher, but there is something about him that makes me think he could be a decent 7th inning guy if he got a full season's look.

I get what you are saying on Smith, let's just say I am on the fence about him right now, something tells me there is more to him. Valaika we totally disagree on, but we always have pretty much. He has some pop in his bat, I think he is a natural hitter and those guys don't tend to need to walk as much as the average hitter to have a decent OBP% (though anyone should really be at somewhere in the 8% or better realm). HIs speed might not be great but it's not non existent. And his defense is better than you give him credit for, but you have always had extremely high expectations when it comes to defense. Not everyone is Roberto Alomar at the big league level. I was watching the top 10 right now 2nd baseman the other day and about 50% of them weren't gold glove level players. If Dan Uggla can continue to put a 2nd baggers glove on then anyone can. Sure Uggla makes up for it with his bat but he could do that from LF.

Maloney I like but he is never gonna get many innings in Cincy and he probably shouldn't either. Fisher could eventually figure it out someday he has some velocity and at times a nice curve but his control is below average and often erratic.