Jimenez to Tribe - RedsZone.com - Cincinnati Reds Fans' Home for Baseball Discussion

nate · 07-30-2011, 07:55 PM

Check it.

LvJ · 07-30-2011, 07:58 PM

That's a good haul.

Brutus · 07-30-2011, 07:59 PM

No idea what the Rockies would have needed to top the Indians' offer, but if the Reds didn't do a deal because of reluctance to keep prospects -- Mesoraco or otherwise, shame on them.

It's time the Reds stand up and address the things clearly lacking. Top-end starting pitchers chief among them.

MikeThierry · 07-30-2011, 08:02 PM

Nice pickup by the Indians.

dougdirt · 07-30-2011, 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brutus the Pimp

No idea what the Rockies would have needed to top the Indians' offer, but if the Reds didn't do a deal because of reluctance to keep prospects -- Mesoraco or otherwise, shame on them.

It's time the Reds stand up and address the things clearly lacking. Top-end starting pitchers chief among them.

I would keep Mesoraco rather than trade him in a package for Ubaldo.... but I think the Reds could have kept him and still topped the offer the Indians made. You have to wonder though, if the Reds simply having better top end guys (rumored with Mesoraco/Chapman) left the Indians looking elsewhere rather than taking less touted Reds.

Brutus · 07-30-2011, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dougdirt

I would keep Mesoraco rather than trade him in a package for Ubaldo.... but I think the Reds could have kept him and still topped the offer the Indians made. You have to wonder though, if the Reds simply having better top end guys (rumored with Mesoraco/Chapman) left the Indians looking elsewhere rather than taking less touted Reds.

I tend to agree they probably could have topped the deal even without Mesoraco, but I would hate to think the Reds didn't do the deal because of that.

At this point, I don't care how good a prospect Mesoraco is or how good he could wind up being (and I think his ceiling is legit), but he's still unproven and it's time the Reds start favoring players that have actually performed at a high level if they want to get into the playoffs again and have success.

SirFelixCat · 07-30-2011, 08:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brutus the Pimp

I tend to agree they probably could have topped the deal even without Mesoraco, but I would hate to think the Reds didn't do the deal because of that.

At this point, I don't care how good a prospect Mesoraco is or how good he could wind up being (and I think his ceiling is legit), but he's still unproven and it's time the Reds start favoring players that have actually performed at a high level if they want to get into the playoffs again and have success.

This seems pretty short-sighted to me. Obviously, we all want the Reds to acquire help that helps the big club, but shrugging off Mes would be beyond foolish, imo.

It's pretty much a given that this season is lost, so as long as moves are made that improve this team for 2012 and beyond, fine. But I'm not too broken up not mortgaging the future for Jimenez. :shrug:

Tom Servo · 07-30-2011, 08:17 PM

I just get the feeling that there's a reason (beyond your typical 'wanting to get better for the future' reasoning) why the Rockies are willing to trade Jimenez to begin with. Guess we'll see.

Brutus · 07-30-2011, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SirFelixCat

This seems pretty short-sighted to me. Obviously, we all want the Reds to acquire help that helps the big club, but shrugging off Mes would be beyond foolish, imo.

It's pretty much a given that this season is lost, so as long as moves are made that improve this team for 2012 and beyond, fine. But I'm not too broken up not mortgaging the future for Jimenez. :shrug:

But this is a move that would help them 2012 and beyond. He's under control for 2012 and 2013... so if the Reds don't want to trade for a rental, and don't want to trade for a guy that is affordable and under control for a few more years, who exactly do the Reds trade for?

Hoarding prospects will never get the Reds anywhere. Each window of opportunity will pass, the Reds will simply find themselves having to sell off, and at most the Reds might dabble in contention once in a while. They still have a good core... this kind of trade would send them into 2012 with something they don't have right now: a clear No. 1 starter.

I understand the reluctance to trade guys like Mesoraco, but sooner or later, unless you're the Phillies (apparently), you gotta part with your top prospects.

REDblooded · 07-30-2011, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brutus the Pimp

But this is a move that would help them 2012 and beyond. He's under control for 2012 and 2013... so if the Reds don't want to trade for a rental, and don't want to trade for a guy that is affordable and under control for a few more years, who exactly do the Reds trade for?

Hoarding prospects will never get the Reds anywhere. Each window of opportunity will pass, the Reds will simply find themselves having to sell off, and at most the Reds might dabble in contention once in a while. They still have a good core... this kind of trade would send them into 2012 with something they don't have right now: a clear No. 1 starter.

I understand the reluctance to trade guys like Mesoraco, but sooner or later, unless you're the Phillies (apparently), you gotta part with your top prospects.

Or they could play for your mlb squad...

Brutus · 07-30-2011, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by REDblooded

Or they could play for your mlb squad...

Counting on rookies to come up and fill holes right away often doesn't work well.

Ask the Phillies about Domonic Brown. They tried that, and it wound up not working so they traded for Pence and sent Brown back to the minors.

Brutus · 07-30-2011, 08:26 PM

BTW, for what its' worth, Ubaldo is still pitching tonight in Colorado, at least for now. So apparently the trade isn't 'final'

MikeS21 · 07-30-2011, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brutus the Pimp

BTW, for what its' worth, Ubaldo is still pitching tonight in Colorado, at least for now. So apparently the trade isn't 'final'

Nope, and ESPN is still reporting the Reds and Rockies are talking.

http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/68...ay-sources-say

Story was updated at 8:07 PM tonight, Cincinnati time.

BuckeyeRedleg · 07-30-2011, 08:50 PM

So that's what it looks like to go for it. Must be nice. And it's the Tribe of all teams. My goodness.

I really wanted the Reds to land this guy. Oh well.

wheels · 07-30-2011, 08:51 PM

This is not a done deal, but even if it was, giving up White and Pomeranz seems a little steep.

Does Cleveland plan on ponying up to keep him in a couple of years? They haven't shown the inclination to do so in the recent past.

And what of Ubaldo's health? The Rockies aren't even allowing a physical. Why not?

07-30-2011, 07:55 PM	#1
nate High five! Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Anaheim, CA Posts: 6,776	Jimenez to Tribe Check it. __________________ "Bring on Rod Stupid!"

07-30-2011, 07:58 PM	#2
LvJ Time is the Revelator. Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Chattanooga, TN Posts: 7,276	Re: Jimenez to Tribe That's a good haul. __________________ Hide your power alleys; Hide your wife

07-30-2011, 07:59 PM	#3
Brutus Et tu, Brutus? Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Atlanta, Ga. Posts: 8,941	Re: Jimenez to Tribe No idea what the Rockies would have needed to top the Indians' offer, but if the Reds didn't do a deal because of reluctance to keep prospects -- Mesoraco or otherwise, shame on them. It's time the Reds stand up and address the things clearly lacking. Top-end starting pitchers chief among them. __________________ "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

07-30-2011, 08:02 PM	#4
MikeThierry Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: St. Louis, Mo Posts: 3,137	Re: Jimenez to Tribe Nice pickup by the Indians. __________________ “Our next home stand follows this road trip.” “I just want to tell everyone Happy Easter and Happy Hanukkah.” says on the day before Easter Mike Shannon

07-30-2011, 08:17 PM	#8
Tom Servo thirsty and miserable Join Date: May 2006 Location: NJ/NY Posts: 5,422	Re: Jimenez to Tribe I just get the feeling that there's a reason (beyond your typical 'wanting to get better for the future' reasoning) why the Rockies are willing to trade Jimenez to begin with. Guess we'll see. __________________ "Since I've been with the Reds in 1989, we've never had a farm system this loaded," Bowden said. "If we were the New York Yankees and had unlimited dollars, we could have traded for Colon, (Jeff) Weaver, Rolen, (Cliff) Floyd, (Kenny) Rogers and Finley and gotten them all -- and still held onto our top five prospects. That's an amazing statement."

07-30-2011, 08:26 PM	#12
Brutus Et tu, Brutus? Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Atlanta, Ga. Posts: 8,941	Re: Jimenez to Tribe BTW, for what its' worth, Ubaldo is still pitching tonight in Colorado, at least for now. So apparently the trade isn't 'final' __________________ "No matter how good you are, you're going to lose one-third of your games. No matter how bad you are you're going to win one-third of your games. It's the other third that makes the difference." ~Tommy Lasorda

07-30-2011, 08:50 PM	#14
BuckeyeRedleg Will post for food Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Dublin, OH Posts: 5,099	Re: Jimenez to Tribe So that's what it looks like to go for it. Must be nice. And it's the Tribe of all teams. My goodness. I really wanted the Reds to land this guy. Oh well.

07-30-2011, 08:51 PM	#15
wheels Dented and Spent Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Columbus, Ohio Posts: 6,539	Re: Jimenez to Tribe This is not a done deal, but even if it was, giving up White and Pomeranz seems a little steep. Does Cleveland plan on ponying up to keep him in a couple of years? They haven't shown the inclination to do so in the recent past. And what of Ubaldo's health? The Rockies aren't even allowing a physical. Why not? __________________ "Opening Day.... Pfffft! We get all excited, thinking they're gonna have some kinda great year....Same thing over and over. Disappointment. What time do you want me to come over?" - My Dad. Opening Day 2012.

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