Votto on same page as Ramirez?

[40YrRedsFan]

Quote from Aramis Ramirez on stating he will opt for free agency this winter instead of exercising his option with the Cubs for 2012:
"We were the worst team in 2006, and in 2007 we went to the playoffs," he said. "So you can get better if you want to. But you have to go out and get some quality players. It's my priority to stay here, but they have to show me they want to be better."
Ramirez's stats this year: 2011: 25 HR, .308 BA (6th), 92 RBI (8th)
My guess is Votto is thinking the exact same thing about his time in Cincy.

[Stray]

A little different, but maybe the same thinking. In Chicago they have all of the money to spend, but it's like they try to sign guys to laughably bad contracts. For now I'll take Votto at his word, he's never given us a reason not to.

Regardless of records this year, I have no doubt that we are a lot closer than they are in Chicago.

[brm7675]

Originally Posted by 40YrRedsFan

Quote from Aramis Ramirez on stating he will opt for free agency this winter instead of exercising his option with the Cubs for 2012:
"We were the worst team in 2006, and in 2007 we went to the playoffs," he said. "So you can get better if you want to. But you have to go out and get some quality players. It's my priority to stay here, but they have to show me they want to be better."
Ramirez's stats this year: 2011: 25 HR, .308 BA (6th), 92 RBI (8th)
My guess is Votto is thinking the exact same thing about his time in Cincy.

Why? the talent is here, a few tweeks is all we need, the Cubs need a total overhaul, have some horrible contracts and only really 2 players to build around, the situations are nothing alike.

[mroby85]

Originally Posted by brm7675

Why? the talent is here, a few tweeks is all we need, the Cubs need a total overhaul, have some horrible contracts and only really 2 players to build around, the situations are nothing alike.

I think this teams talent is over-estimated if you take Votto out of the equation. If he were to go somewhere like New York, Boston, or Anaheim the talent levels aren't even close to that of Cincinnati, and would definitely enhance his chances of winning a world series, so the situations are somewhat alike since they're both wanting the best opportunity to win.

[brm7675]

Originally Posted by mroby85

I think this teams talent is over-estimated if you take Votto out of the equation. If he were to go somewhere like New York, Boston, or Anaheim the talent levels aren't even close to that of Cincinnati, and would definitely enhance his chances of winning a world series, so the situations are somewhat alike since they're both wanting the best opportunity to win.

Yankees are a good team, and so are the Angles but I do think as our youth matures and gets better the Reds will be at that level also.

[Jefferson24]

Originally Posted by brm7675

Why? the talent is here, a few weeks is all we need, the Cubs need a total overhaul, have some horrible contracts and only really 2 players to build around, the situations are nothing alike.

I don't think the talent is here. There are some talented players but top to bottom this team is not talented enough to contend, heck even .500 is a struggle. I think they over achieved last year. You run this exact same group out there in 2012 you will get 2011 results.

[texasdave]

Originally Posted by mroby85

I think this teams talent is over-estimated if you take Votto out of the equation. If he were to go somewhere like New York, Boston, or Anaheim the talent levels aren't even close to that of Cincinnati, and would definitely enhance his chances of winning a world series, so the situations are somewhat alike since they're both wanting the best opportunity to win.

Exactly. Take Votto away and they aren't even a .500 club. Oh, wait. they already aren't a .500 club, even with him.

[texasdave]

A cleanup hitter and an ace. Just a few "tweaks".

[brm7675]

This team has the record they have in big part due to horrible managing, not because the talent on the field. Get a good field manager, hitting coach and a GM willing to do what needs to be done and this team is as good as just about any in the NL outside of maybe Philly.

[Tadasimha]

Originally Posted by 40YrRedsFan

Quote from Aramis Ramirez on stating he will opt for free agency this winter instead of exercising his option with the Cubs for 2012:
"We were the worst team in 2006, and in 2007 we went to the playoffs," he said. "So you can get better if you want to. But you have to go out and get some quality players. It's my priority to stay here, but they have to show me they want to be better."
Ramirez's stats this year: 2011: 25 HR, .308 BA (6th), 92 RBI (8th)
My guess is Votto is thinking the exact same thing about his time in Cincy.

More importantly - do the Reds make a move for Ramirez this off-season and release Rolen?

[Vottomatic]

Man. I remember early in the season when some were questioning if Ramirez power was gone. He must have had a good second half. Hard to believe he finished 6th in the NL in batting average? Hmmm. It seemed like everytime I watched him against Reds pitching, he did nothing. But oh well. The numbers speak for themselves.

I don't see the Reds releasing Rolen. I think the Reds are too loyal for that. Plus, I think they value Rolen's leadership. What they really need to do, is platoon Rolen with the future, Francisco, move Rolen down in the batting order (like 6th or 7th), and get a legit cleanup hitter behind Votto. If Rolen comes out healthy, tearing the cover off the ball, hitting HR's like Berkman did this year..........then you can consider moving him back up to 4th or 5th in the batting order. But if you went out and got a legit cleanup hitter, you probably don't want to mess with things.

I don't go after Ramirez. We already have 1 old guy. And Ramirez is probably looking for that contract that takes him into his golden years.