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Brutus
07-21-2013, 03:56 PM
I really could not care less what you or anyone else thinks is "relevant."

Your personal comments are rude, uncalled for and violate every notion on this site of what is proper posting.

I suggest you try and make your points in a more civil manner.

Perhaps you should practice what you preach, as your response was far more uncivil than mine. I was merely pointing out that your opinion is biased from the standpoint you have clearly and often in the past said you want pitchers pulled at first sign of trouble. That's very relevant here. Your response was completely and utterly rude and condescending. So if you want to talk about being civil, perhaps walking the walk would be a good start. It's ironic that you're preaching on civility yet you are guilty of the most hostile post in this thread.

I could not care less what you think is "proper" for Redszone. After all, it's not your forum and you don't make the rules or enforce them. So save yourself the time it took you to lecture, as it's not your authority to do so.

powersackers
07-21-2013, 03:58 PM
Are we watching Pit v. Cin or KC v. Brutus?

ProfessorTofty
07-21-2013, 03:58 PM
Robinson takes a four-pitch walk, and the top of the lineup will come up with a runner on.

Ironman92
07-21-2013, 03:59 PM
Votto = hero

bleedsred
07-21-2013, 03:59 PM
Wow, another 4 pitch walk from a guy who had given up only a few this year....

RiverRat13
07-21-2013, 03:59 PM
Rally time!

Stray
07-21-2013, 03:59 PM
rally brewin

mth123
07-21-2013, 03:59 PM
Ok. Choo with a hit.

ProfessorTofty
07-21-2013, 03:59 PM
And now Choo with a blast up the right field line and we've got 1st and 3rd. Second hit.

50YrRedsFan
07-21-2013, 04:00 PM
:DWe haven't had a hit since the first batter of the game.....amazingly inept offense.

I knew as soon as I posted this, we would get some hits.

Ironman92
07-21-2013, 04:00 PM
C'mon Heisey....a home run hear gets you 10 more starts without platoon

Kc61
07-21-2013, 04:00 PM
Perhaps you should practice what you preach, as your response was far more uncivil than mine. I was merely pointing out that your opinion is bias from the standpoint you have clearly and often in the past said you want pitchers pulled at first sign of trouble. That's very relevant here. Your response was completely and utterly rude and condescending. So if you want to talk about being civil, perhaps walking the walk would be a good start.

And I could not care less what you think is "proper" for Redszone. After all, it's not your forum and you don't make the rules or enforce them. So save yourself the time it took you to lecture, as it's not your authority to do so.

As I understand the rules of RedsZone, posts are not supposed to be personal. Yours was. It isn't the first time.

If you dispute this, if you think personal comments in posts are fair and appropriate, then I think you should inform the administrators here of your interpretation of the rules. I doubt they will agree.

But from a personal viewpoint, I won't stand for it. And I won't mince words dealing with anyone who treats me in an offensive way.

bleedsred
07-21-2013, 04:00 PM
Got to get this run in....

NebraskaRed
07-21-2013, 04:00 PM
We haven't had a hit since the first batter of the game.....amazingly inept offense.

Not fair. Locke is an amazing pitcher.

Ironman92
07-21-2013, 04:01 PM
Would you two take your peeing contest somewhere else?

Hollcat
07-21-2013, 04:02 PM
Surely Choo could run on this battery. Melancon is really slow to the plate.

Ironman92
07-21-2013, 04:02 PM
Heisey just missed that pitch

bleedsred
07-21-2013, 04:02 PM
HiC should sit on the fb

50YrRedsFan
07-21-2013, 04:02 PM
Not fair. Locke is an amazing pitcher.

We have good pitching also, but the Pirates managed to get 3 runs.

bleedsred
07-21-2013, 04:03 PM
3-2.... big pitch coming up

Raisor
07-21-2013, 04:03 PM
:DWe haven't had a hit since the first batter of the game.....amazingly inept offense.

I knew as soon as I posted this, we would get some hits.

You are an inept poster.

I knew as soon as I posted this you become M2

;)

Ironman92
07-21-2013, 04:03 PM
We have good pitching also, but the Pirates managed to get 3 runs.

Hurdle didn't leave the starter in after a line drive double and 113 pitches

powersackers
07-21-2013, 04:03 PM
Heisey with a good at bat no matter the outcome.

Stray
07-21-2013, 04:04 PM
Votto has a big opportunity here

mth123
07-21-2013, 04:04 PM
No place to put him.

ProfessorTofty
07-21-2013, 04:04 PM
Heh heh! Heisey gets ball four, and Votto has a chance to be a hero here. Bases loaded, no outs.

Ironman92
07-21-2013, 04:04 PM
Heisey holds

Gizmo
07-21-2013, 04:04 PM
Heisey walked?!!?!??!!! Now we're gonna win.

50YrRedsFan
07-21-2013, 04:04 PM
good ab for Heisey....Time for Votto to step up...

Ironman92
07-21-2013, 04:04 PM
Cue the Pirates fans are thinking the worst here

bleedsred
07-21-2013, 04:04 PM
2 walks on the inning....just wow. Bases juiced for Votto, if he doesn't deliver the talking heads will be loud....

NebraskaRed
07-21-2013, 04:05 PM
We have good pitching also, but the Pirates managed to get 3 runs.

And the Reds won yesterday and the day before.

Brutus
07-21-2013, 04:05 PM
As I understand the rules of RedsZone, posts are not supposed to be personal. Yours was. It isn't the first time.

If you dispute this, if you think personal comments in posts are fair and appropriate, then I think you should inform the administrators here of your interpretation of the rules. I doubt they will agree.

But from a personal viewpoint, I won't stand for it. And I won't mince words dealing with anyone who treats me in an offensive way.

So in summation, your stance is that you are vehemently against personal posts being made on Redszone, and you're so adamant about enforcing a subjective post that may or may not, in your opinion, constitute a violation, that you will respond by making vicious personal attacks to counter said violation. Yep, sounds like you're truly concerned about the decorum of this board indeed.

You're flipping out about nothing. It was not meant to be an offensive comment. You're the one that is posting with malicious intent. I had no ill-will when I made the post I did. It was merely pointing out that you have, in fact, constantly been an advocate of quick triggers when removing pitchers. It's relevant to the conversation. Clearly you're the one here with an ax to grind, not me.

RedsBrick
07-21-2013, 04:05 PM
I think Hurdle's chews-per-minute has gone up by at least 20

ProfessorTofty
07-21-2013, 04:06 PM
Oh man. GBDP. Ouch.

Stray
07-21-2013, 04:06 PM
Ugh that was bad

Ironman92
07-21-2013, 04:06 PM
What's not to believe?

Wonderful Monds
07-21-2013, 04:06 PM
Uh, well.

Gizmo
07-21-2013, 04:06 PM
that hurt.

bleedsred
07-21-2013, 04:06 PM
So, what is Marty saying?

Stray
07-21-2013, 04:07 PM
BP will come through.

Wonderful Monds
07-21-2013, 04:07 PM
Thom Brenneman: Please shut the hell up.

powersackers
07-21-2013, 04:07 PM
Nice turn. Darn it.

joshua
07-21-2013, 04:07 PM
No one else I'd rather have at the plate right now.

Matt700wlw
07-21-2013, 04:07 PM
Wow.

Ironman92
07-21-2013, 04:07 PM
Nice!

Raisor
07-21-2013, 04:08 PM
At least a run scored

Gizmo
07-21-2013, 04:08 PM
Well, that was anti-climatic

Red in Chicago
07-21-2013, 04:08 PM
Pitiful

BluegrassRedleg
07-21-2013, 04:08 PM
Craptacular.

joshua
07-21-2013, 04:08 PM
Oh well. Only down one run. I think we got this.

Tom Servo
07-21-2013, 04:08 PM
44 runs batted in. Burn him at the stake.

Stray
07-21-2013, 04:08 PM
Can't ask for more. Loaded with nobody out and Votto at the plate. Our best player just needs to come through for us.

Ironman92
07-21-2013, 04:08 PM
At least a run scored

This game is going along like I'm at the stadium.

Raisor
07-21-2013, 04:09 PM
Much rather be down one run than two.

Gallen5862
07-21-2013, 04:09 PM
Take the conversation private Brutus and KC61.

Matt700wlw
07-21-2013, 04:09 PM
2 hits. Choo.

reds1869
07-21-2013, 04:09 PM
Melancon is pretty good at baseball. Guy is an absolute ground ball machine. Tough luck but still time to win.

Wonderful Monds
07-21-2013, 04:10 PM
44 runs batted in. Burn him at the stake.

RABBLE RABBLE 44 RBIS RABBLE RABBLE 100 GAMES

- Thom Brenneman

RedsBrick
07-21-2013, 04:10 PM
44 runs batted in. Burn him at the stake.

Come on, man. It's ok for folks to be critical of Votto. I don't think it's an unreal expectation for him to produce in that situation.

50YrRedsFan
07-21-2013, 04:10 PM
You are an inept poster.

I knew as soon as I posted this you become M2

;)

Bases loaded and 0 outs, and we get 1 run on a double play.

I rest my case.

VR
07-21-2013, 04:10 PM
It's time to replace Jacoby.

Blitz Dorsey
07-21-2013, 04:10 PM
It's like Votto's trying not to get pissed off at himself ... and it's taking his edge away.

A month ago, he's dropping 5 f-bombs after some meaningless strikeout. (And got a lot of national flack for it.) But right there, no big deal.

It's like he's trying to tone things down. I don't like it. I like the ultra-intense Votto.

He just gave that AB away and anyone who follows Votto knows nothing makes him more upset than that. But he just acted like it didn't bother him at all. (I know it bothers him. Which is my point. It's like he's trying to suppress his true emotions. I wonder if the flack he got nationally for dropping F-bombs earlier in the season is the root of this.)

bleedsred
07-21-2013, 04:11 PM
I must say that was disappointing...only thing worse would have been a Votto k then Phillips double play....or 3 ks in a row by Votto, Phillips, and then Bruce....So let us just say it could have been worse....

wvreds
07-21-2013, 04:11 PM
That was a "slap in my face" kind of inning

Raisor
07-21-2013, 04:11 PM
Bases loaded and 0 outs, and we get 1 run on a double play.

I rest my case.

Does that mean you're done for the year?

See you next season!

Tom Servo
07-21-2013, 04:11 PM
Come on, man. It's ok for folks to be critical of Votto. I don't think it's an unreal expectation for him to produce in that situation.
Sure, be critical. Votto didn't deliver, and it sucked. But Thom's incessant harping on the RBI number puts him up there as about the worst announcer in baseball.

Wonderful Monds
07-21-2013, 04:12 PM
Curtis Partchin'

Blitz Dorsey
07-21-2013, 04:13 PM
Sure, be critical. Votto didn't deliver, and it sucked. But Thom's incessant harping on the RBI number puts him up there as about the worst announcer in baseball.

Yep, Thom is probably the only one who was frustrated right there. (I agree he puts too much emphasis on RBIs though.)

RedsBrick
07-21-2013, 04:13 PM
Sure, be critical. Votto didn't deliver, and it sucked. But Thom's incessant harping on the RBI number puts him up there as about the worst announcer in baseball.

My bad...I didn't realize you were referrencing Brennaman. My apology.

BluegrassRedleg
07-21-2013, 04:13 PM
Would love to see it broken down how many times they've had bases loaded and 0 outs and came out with 1 run or less this season.

NebraskaRed
07-21-2013, 04:13 PM
Bases loaded and 0 outs, and we get 1 run on a double play.

I rest my case.

And the jury has reached its verdict: This post has been found overly dramatic.

LoganBuck
07-21-2013, 04:13 PM
I didn't realize that Partch was a Daywalker.

Raisor
07-21-2013, 04:14 PM
The Reds might very well lose this game.

On the other hand they may not.

50YrRedsFan
07-21-2013, 04:14 PM
Does that mean you're done for the year?

See you next season!

No, I think I will stay a post more:D

Stray
07-21-2013, 04:15 PM
The Reds might very well lose this game.

On the other hand they may not.

John Madden is that you?

Matt700wlw
07-21-2013, 04:15 PM
It's time to replace Jacoby.

As Lance would say, what's the downside?

There isn't one.

reds1869
07-21-2013, 04:15 PM
Yep, Thom is probably the only one who was frustrated right there. (I agree he puts too much emphasis on RBIs though.)

Everyone was frustrated, but Thom acts like Joey sneaks into his house and kicks his dog every evening. His family's blasting of Votto and slobbering all over BP is over the top.

CySeymour
07-21-2013, 04:15 PM
If there were a runner on 3rd and no outs and Votto grounded out for an RBI, Thom would have lauded Votto for getting the RBI.

PuffyPig
07-21-2013, 04:16 PM
Come on, man. It's ok for folks to be critical of Votto. I don't think it's an unreal expectation for him to produce in that situation.

We are all disappointed with the result.

But baseball is not a game where results can be expected per se.

You have a pitcher who figures prominently into the equation. And batters, even the best ones, fail more often than they succeed.

I will only get critical of players who fail over large sample sizes. It's impossible to judge players over one play.

No matter how disappointed I am.

Blitz Dorsey
07-21-2013, 04:16 PM
What do you guys think of Partch? Could he be a cheap guy that is a mainstay in the bullpen the next few years? (By "mainstay" just mean he will be always on the Reds' roster, not necessarily that he will have a late-inning role.)

I like him. He can hum that fastball at 96-97 consistently.

Kingspoint
07-21-2013, 04:17 PM
Come on, man. It's ok for folks to be critical of Votto. I don't think it's an unreal expectation for him to produce in that situation.Agree. 44 RBI's through 100 games from your best player who makes $20M per year is worse than not getting it done. It's simply poor production.

PuffyPig
07-21-2013, 04:17 PM
The Reds might very well lose this game.

On the other hand they may not.

It's basically 50/50. They'll either win or they will lose.

Wonderful Monds
07-21-2013, 04:17 PM
For guy who throws in the upper 90s, Partch sure doesn't inspire a lot of confidence in me.

mth123
07-21-2013, 04:18 PM
Curtis Partch is under-rated. He's got stuff.

Tom Servo
07-21-2013, 04:18 PM
Everyone was frustrated, but Thom acts like Joey sneaks into his house and kicks his dog every evening. His family's blasting of Votto and slobbering all over BP is over the top.
The way they play favorites in general is infuriating. Bruce was the goat up until this season, and now it's Votto.

Crumbley
07-21-2013, 04:18 PM
If there were a runner on 3rd and no outs and Votto grounded out for an RBI, Thom would have lauded Votto for getting the RBI.

Probably. Without context, all we'd have is a pile of numbers.

Stray
07-21-2013, 04:18 PM
changeup changeup changeup...Marte wasn't close to hitting any of them.

Blitz Dorsey
07-21-2013, 04:18 PM
For guy who throws in the upper 90s, Partch sure doesn't inspire a lot of confidence in me.

Why is this?

malcontent
07-21-2013, 04:18 PM
Hey, Partch has a changeup!

ProfessorTofty
07-21-2013, 04:18 PM
Partch strikes 'em out, and the Reds have one last shot here. Be great to see one of those Bruce longballs here-- the homer has been conspicuously lacking this series for the Reds.

Wonderful Monds
07-21-2013, 04:18 PM
Agree. 44 RBI's through 100 games from your best player who makes $20M per year is worse than not getting it done. It's simply poor production.

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m69a1g5C0u1rvzw0uo1_500.gif

Raisor
07-21-2013, 04:19 PM
Agree. 44 RBI's through 100 games from your best player who makes $20M per year is worse than not getting it done. It's simply poor production.

Assuming you believe RBI is the be all.

Tom Servo
07-21-2013, 04:19 PM
Agree. 44 RBI's through 100 games from your best player who makes $20M per year is worse than not getting it done. It's simply poor production.
Quick question: Who has been batting right in front of Votto for the vast majority of those 100 games? I think you know the answer.

dougdirt
07-21-2013, 04:19 PM
What do you guys think of Partch? Could he be a cheap guy that is a mainstay in the bullpen the next few years? (By "mainstay" just mean he will be always on the Reds' roster, not necessarily that he will have a late-inning role.)

I like him. He can hum that fastball at 96-97 consistently.

I think pitching twice in the span of a month doesn't do much good for him.

Good fastball. I don't trust the offspeed stuff. When it is there, it can be good. But it isn't there often enough. 6th inning type for now. Or on this team, a long man who pitches 2-4 times a month.

Wonderful Monds
07-21-2013, 04:19 PM
Why is this?

....I don't actually know. :lol:

Brutus
07-21-2013, 04:19 PM
Agree. 44 RBI's through 100 games from your best player who makes $20M per year is worse than not getting it done. It's simply poor production.

Votto is fourth in baseball in runs created. That seems to be the kind of production the Reds are paying for.

bleedsred
07-21-2013, 04:19 PM
Impressive outings by Hoover and Partch....bodes well for the second half.

9th inning prediction: Cozart will drive in a huge run

malcontent
07-21-2013, 04:20 PM
Everyone was frustrated, but Thom acts like Joey sneaks into his house and kicks his dog every evening. His family's blasting of Votto and slobbering all over BP is over the top.
He probably cleans out the piggy bank, too.

PuffyPig
07-21-2013, 04:20 PM
Agree. 44 RBI's through 100 games from your best player who makes $20M per year is worse than not getting it done. It's simply poor production.

His OPS of .952 with RISP suggests otherwise.

Blitz Dorsey
07-21-2013, 04:20 PM
Grilli throws one to the backstop on the first pitch.

mth123
07-21-2013, 04:21 PM
What do you guys think of Partch? Could he be a cheap guy that is a mainstay in the bullpen the next few years? (By "mainstay" just mean he will be always on the Reds' roster, not necessarily that he will have a late-inning role.)

I like him. He can hum that fastball at 96-97 consistently.

I think he has a future as a decent middle to back of the pen arm. Probably not a closer. Hopefully some team thinks he's worth dealing for in return for a bat they are looking to dump.

Wonderful Monds
07-21-2013, 04:21 PM
Grilli aims one at Jay's dome

Blitz Dorsey
07-21-2013, 04:21 PM
Jay just looks like he's in one of those funks.

Prove me wrong.

Kingspoint
07-21-2013, 04:22 PM
I must say that was disappointing...only thing worse would have been a Votto k then Phillips double play....or 3 ks in a row by Votto, Phillips, and then Bruce....So let us just say it could have been worse....
I only got paralyzed from the waist down. I could have been paralyzed from the neck down. Guess it could have been worse.

Wonderful Monds
07-21-2013, 04:22 PM
pffffffffft

Blitz Dorsey
07-21-2013, 04:23 PM
Swings at a ball over his head. Terrible AB. Pretty much like all of his ABs lately.

Kingspoint
07-21-2013, 04:23 PM
An ugly at-bat by Bruce.

Wonderful Monds
07-21-2013, 04:23 PM
I only got paralyzed from the waist down. I could have been paralyzed from the neck down. Guess it could have been worse.

I'm gonna call you Sunshine from now on

RedsBrick
07-21-2013, 04:23 PM
We are all disappointed with the result.

But baseball is not a game where results can be expected per se.

You have a pitcher who figures prominently into the equation. And batters, even the best ones, fail more often than they succeed.

I will only get critical of players who fail over large sample sizes. It's impossible to judge players over one play.

No matter how disappointed I am.

Being critical of a player and basing his entire career on one play are two completely different things. No one is judging Votto on one AB. I'm guessing, however, that 90% of Reds' fans expected a little more there.

Yes, I expected our perennial All-Star, MVP player to deliver something more than a GDP with the bases loaded, no outs. Sorry. Doesn't mean I want to trade Votto.

BluegrassRedleg
07-21-2013, 04:23 PM
Assuming you believe RBI is the be all.

Not generally speaking, but if you're batting in the 3 hole, it certainly is paramount.

Personally, I think he needs to be in the 2 hole. That's what kind of hitter he is now.

Blitz Dorsey
07-21-2013, 04:23 PM
Atta boy Fraz. Base knock.

ProfessorTofty
07-21-2013, 04:23 PM
Okay, Todd Frazier on with a single. Just need one run here to keep us in the game and send it to extras.

Brutus
07-21-2013, 04:23 PM
The peaks and valleys of Jay Bruce rival the Himalayas.

Kingspoint
07-21-2013, 04:24 PM
Maybe Hanahan ties this thing up.

Wonderful Monds
07-21-2013, 04:24 PM
Todd gets on, unfortunately the Rube Goldberg Out Machine is up.

powersackers
07-21-2013, 04:24 PM
Need the SI cover jinx now.

Blitz Dorsey
07-21-2013, 04:24 PM
That should have been a balk on the 1-0 pitch from Grilli. He didn't stop when he was bringing his hands down.

bleedsred
07-21-2013, 04:25 PM
I only got paralyzed from the waist down. I could have been paralyzed from the neck down. Guess it could have been worse.

I would bet that those paralyzed neck down would love to be paralyzed waist down...same same glad Reds down 1 run vs 2

Raisor
07-21-2013, 04:25 PM
Not generally speaking, but if you're batting in the 3 hole, it certainly is paramount.

Personally, I think he needs to be in the 2 hole. That's what kind of hitter he is now.

I'm not going to derail the thread. Suffice it to say that I disagree with this type of thinking. My views can be found in the ORG

Blitz Dorsey
07-21-2013, 04:26 PM
Cozart fouls off a pitch on 3-2, would have been ball 4.

bleedsred
07-21-2013, 04:27 PM
How about another game winner Mes?

Kingspoint
07-21-2013, 04:28 PM
Let's go, Mes!

Wonderful Monds
07-21-2013, 04:28 PM
LETS GO DEVO MESORACO
http://vimeo.com/64715511

Blitz Dorsey
07-21-2013, 04:28 PM
Oh, the ump is hungry! Two balls clearly outside. What a punk.

Playadlc
07-21-2013, 04:28 PM
The Pirates annoy me.

50YrRedsFan
07-21-2013, 04:29 PM
Reds pitchers struck out 16 Pirates today.

Blitz Dorsey
07-21-2013, 04:29 PM
Oh well, we won the series.

Tom Servo
07-21-2013, 04:29 PM
We're bad again.

RedsBrick
07-21-2013, 04:30 PM
At the end of the day, the Reds took a series from a quality team.

mth123
07-21-2013, 04:30 PM
Oh well. Won the series.

powersackers
07-21-2013, 04:30 PM
Three hits. Hard to make a fun game out of that. But we did it.

Gizmo
07-21-2013, 04:30 PM
Reds pitchers struck out 16 Pirates today.

could strike out 27 and still lose 50-0....

ProfessorTofty
07-21-2013, 04:30 PM
Ugh. Well, that's disappointing. Would have loved to have had the sweep, though gotta say, still pleased to have 2 of 3 against the Pirates. Fantastic pitching by the Pirates today-- really just shut the Reds down.

Wonderful Monds
07-21-2013, 04:30 PM
Dusty gets a share of the blame today IMO

Seriously mismanaged Homer

Kingspoint
07-21-2013, 04:31 PM
His OPS of .952 with RISP suggests otherwise.
Those are Walks. He's not doing his job. He's not driving in runs. 44 RBI's through 100 games is inept from the three hole.Anyone else in baseball hitting from the #3 hole making as much as Votto does who has 44 RBI's or less?

powersackers
07-21-2013, 04:31 PM
Mismanaged a quality start?

Kc61
07-21-2013, 04:32 PM
Dusty gets a share of the blame today IMO

Seriously mismanaged Homer

I agree, but I guess the Pirates felt pretty bad about yesterday. So they even it out today.

I think we'll now see what the Reds are made of. If this is an old fashioned losing West Coast trip, the Reds will be in some trouble. If they can play above .500 ball on this trip, they will show me something.

RedsBaron
07-21-2013, 04:32 PM
Man this was a game I would have hated to attend. I love the Reds but this game would have depressed me.

EMAW
07-21-2013, 04:32 PM
Dusty gets a share of the blame today IMO

Seriously mismanaged Homer

What? Amazing!

RedEye
07-21-2013, 04:33 PM
Dusty almost always leaves his SP in too long.

That said, if you told me last Thursday the Reds would win 2 of 3 in this series, I would have been happy. Just hard when the last game is the loss; feels like a missed chance instead of a series win.

Kc61
07-21-2013, 04:35 PM
Dusty almost always leaves his SP in too long.

That said, if you told me last Thursday the Reds would win 2 of 3 in this series, I would have been happy. Just hard when the last game is the loss; feels like a missed chance instead of a series win.

I think today may have been influenced by the Giants series upcoming and the doubleheader.

He let Bailey throw an awful lot of pitches. But the tip off may have been using Partch. Shows a concern for resting the bullpen.

Hope on balance it turns out to be correct. Tuesday with Cingrani and Reynolds could be one of those turning point days, one way or the other.

BluegrassRedleg
07-21-2013, 04:36 PM
I think Homer was fine. Still had good velocity, stuff. They just had an amazing AB my McHenry and strung some hits together. Sometimes just gotta credit the opponent. I guess I need to do the same with the Votto DP, but we've seen the Reds offense screw-up so many "can't miss" scoring opps this season, it's harder to do.

Kingspoint
07-21-2013, 04:36 PM
At the end of the day, the Reds took a series from a quality team.Had to. They were at home and five games back. Winning the series was the minimum.

PuffyPig
07-21-2013, 04:42 PM
Those are Walks. He's not doing his job. He's not driving in runs. 44 RBI's through 100 games is inept from the three hole.Anyone else in baseball hitting from the #3 hole making as much as Votto does who has 44 RBI's or less?

I'm not sure you have a complete understanding of baseball. Votto's job is to help create runs.

Walks are good with runners in scoring position. It might explain why the hitter hitting behind leads the NL in RBI's. After all basebal is a team game.

oregonred
07-21-2013, 04:42 PM
Dodgers are on fire and now only 4 back of the Reds in the loss column. This is a huge week just to maintain hold on the #5 playoff slot with 4 in LA next weekend after a brutal 4 games in 3 days in SF.

2 out of 3 was the minimum, but another stinker and uninspiring getaway day for the Reds. Very important week coming up with the LA series.

Brutus
07-21-2013, 04:45 PM
Today, given the way Homer was pitching and where in the Pirates lineup they were, as well as the inconsistency of the pen, I'd leave him in 10 out of 10 times in that same situation. I may have considered taking him out after the second groundball single, but nonetheless I think Dusty played it right leaving him in.

oregonred
07-21-2013, 04:46 PM
Actually LA could be in first by the end of the day. So shaping up to be a Pirates/Reds/Dbacks/Nats battle for the two wild cards. Reds need to avoid letting the Giants get back into the mix.

Raisor
07-21-2013, 04:47 PM
[(H + BB + HBP - CS - GIDP) times (Total bases + .26[BB - IBB + HBP] + .52[SH + SF + SB])] divided by (AB + BB + HBP + SH+ SF)


This is how runs are created.

If the Reds had a team obp of 1.000 they would score an infinite number of runs. However, they'd never win a game because they would still be hitting in the top of the first of the first game of the season.

mth123
07-21-2013, 04:50 PM
I think today may have been influenced by the Giants series upcoming and the doubleheader.

He let Bailey throw an awful lot of pitches. But the tip off may have been using Partch. Shows a concern for resting the bullpen.

Hope on balance it turns out to be correct. Tuesday with Cingrani and Reynolds could be one of those turning point days, one way or the other.

Leake went 5.2 on Friday. Ondrusek, Simon, Parra, Lecure and Chapman all pitched. Latos went 5 yesterday. Hoover, Lecure, Simon, Ondrusek and Chapman all pitched. West Coast swing coming up with a double header where an unproven minor leaguer is throwing one game and a rookie who has been lasting barely 5 is going the other.

Homer was throwing well. The second and third of those four straight hits were routine ground balls that ended up as hits (one didn't get out of the IF). The 4th hit that produced the 3rd run was a line shot and he pulled him. It didn't work out, but I don't think it was a huge mistake.

OnBaseMachine
07-21-2013, 04:52 PM
Man this was a game I would have hated to attend. I love the Reds but this game would have depressed me.

I was there. I feel like Dusty and Votto Punched me in the gut.

Falls City Beer
07-21-2013, 05:05 PM
I think today may have been influenced by the Giants series upcoming and the doubleheader.

He let Bailey throw an awful lot of pitches. But the tip off may have been using Partch. Shows a concern for resting the bullpen.

Hope on balance it turns out to be correct. Tuesday with Cingrani and Reynolds could be one of those turning point days, one way or the other.

I think you are absolutely right about the rationale. But IMO, you gotta smoke em when you got em. The bullpen had had four days off prior to this weekend.

westofyou
07-21-2013, 05:11 PM
I was there. I feel like Dusty and Votto Punched me in the gut.

But the rest of the team that didn't get hit all game was just a smack in the kisser?

Kc61
07-21-2013, 05:13 PM
I think you are absolutely right about the rationale. But IMO, you gotta smoke em when you got em. The bullpen had had four days off prior to this weekend.

I agree. To me, it was questionable to allow Bailey to stay in after the double by McHenry (whose name I'm misspelling). But I understand those who think it was ok.

But to allow that third run, I can't defend that. Bailey should have been out by then IMO.

SporkLover
07-21-2013, 05:17 PM
Productive series. Whittling away the Pirates lead... Cards remain 5 games ahead of the reds.

All three teams playing some on the fence teams over the next few series, Cards probably have the tougher week ahead going from the Braves to the 5 games against Bucs, then to the Reds.

There is the opening!

Ironman92
07-21-2013, 06:26 PM
It's time to replace Jacoby.

I'll assume this was retro 2010

RedsBrick
07-21-2013, 06:30 PM
[(H + BB + HBP - CS - GIDP) times (Total bases + .26[BB - IBB + HBP] + .52[SH + SF + SB])] divided by (AB + BB + HBP + SH+ SF)


This is how runs are created.

If the Reds had a team obp of 1.000 they would score an infinite number of runs. However, they'd never win a game because they would still be hitting in the top of the first of the first game of the season.

Didn't Matt Damon solve that equation in Good Will Hunting?

OnBaseMachine
07-21-2013, 08:09 PM
But the rest of the team that didn't get hit all game was just a smack in the kisser?

Frustrating game all around. Reds had a great chance to sweep.

VR
07-21-2013, 10:23 PM
I'll assume this was retro 2010

I think that speaks volumes.

Kingspoint
07-22-2013, 10:30 AM
I'm not sure you have a complete understanding of baseball. Votto's job is to help create runs.

Walks are good with runners in scoring position. It might explain why the hitter hitting behind leads the NL in RBI's. After all basebal is a team game.Changing the subject doesn't give him any more RBI's than the disappointing 44 through 100 games the $20M/#3 hole hitter has to this day. Some situatons call for expanding the strikezone. Every at-bat in one's life is a different situation and should be approached differently. Edgar Martinez, the best hitter since Joe Dimaggio, was the best at this over the last 50 years. Joey could learn a lot fom him.

Kingspoint
07-22-2013, 10:35 AM
[(H + BB + HBP - CS - GIDP) times (Total bases + .26[BB - IBB + HBP] + .52[SH + SF + SB])] divided by (AB + BB + HBP + SH+ SF)


This is how runs are created.

If the Reds had a team obp of 1.000 they would score an infinite number of runs. However, they'd never win a game because they would still be hitting in the top of the first of the first game of the season.
That's great if baseball was played in a vaccuum and every situation called for the same approach, but it doesn't. Every situation calls for a different approach. It's what made Larkin the Hall-of-Famer that he was.

Tom Servo
07-22-2013, 10:47 AM
Edgar Martinez, the best hitter since Joe Dimaggio
http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/confused.gif

Raisor
07-22-2013, 11:41 AM
That's great if baseball was played in a vaccuum and every situation called for the same approach, but it doesn't. Every situation calls for a different approach. It's what made Larkin the Hall-of-Famer that he was.

If a player could turn on greatness when greatness is needed, why would he turn it off at other times?

Leave the greatness switch turned on, baby!

westofyou
07-22-2013, 12:55 PM
Votto had 46 RBI at this point in 2009.

Kingspoint
07-22-2013, 03:43 PM
http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/confused.gifThe stats back it up.

Kingspoint
07-22-2013, 03:48 PM
Votto had 46 RBI at this point in 2009.

No, he did not.

Votto had 65 RBI's through his first 98 games in 2009.

He has 44 RBI's through his first 98 games in 2013.

We wouldn't be having this conversation if Votto was doing this year what he had done in 2009.

Tom Servo
07-22-2013, 04:06 PM
The stats back it up.
Which stats? The slash line is awesome, I'll give you that. But just in the past two decades alone you have Barry Bonds, Albert Pujols, Frank Thomas, Vladimir Guerrero, Larry Walker, Manny Ramirez, Chipper Jones, Jeff Bagwell, and others with similar lines + more power. And do I even have to mention Stan Musial, Mickey Mantle, Willie Mays, etc, etc, etc?

Kingspoint
07-22-2013, 05:05 PM
Those on steroids are eliminated first and foremost.

Kingspoint
07-22-2013, 05:12 PM
Frank Thomas did not sustain his hitting ability. He had five, six good years and then he couldn't sustain it.

Musial was the same time as Dimaggio (Musial was the greatest hitter who ever played in the Majors). Since Dimaggio.

Martinez was a better hitter than Mantle and Mays.

Martinez was much better than Jones.

When you look at right-handed batters and the disadvantages they had vs a left-handed batter, it's there where Martinez excels as a hitter.

While most will believe that Mantle and Mays were better than Martinez because of the Homeruns they hit, Martinez won two batting titles as a Right-Handed batter, a near impossible feat in the strong-hitting American League. Martinez would have eaten up earlier decades where pitchers went 9 innings on a regular basis. Martinez ate pitchers up who faced him repeatedly in a game. He made them throw him a pitch that he wanted.

Falls City Beer
07-22-2013, 09:07 PM
Hank Aaron and Albert Pujols are both better hitters than Martinez, who I agree is underrated.

Ironman92
07-22-2013, 09:10 PM
Edgar was one of my favorite players....I always blame the cruddy Mariners for letting him rot in the minors keeping him from going for 3,000 hits .....but your Frank Thomas argument is flat out false. Thomas had 7 seasons over 1.000 OPS and 9 over .950!

Kingspoint
07-23-2013, 02:39 AM
Edgar was one of my favorite players....I always blame the cruddy Mariners for letting him rot in the minors keeping him from going for 3,000 hits .....but your Frank Thomas argument is flat out false. Thomas had 7 seasons over 1.000 OPS and 9 over .950!Few people realize that the Mariners let Martinez rot in the Minors for several seasons. It was a travesty at the time. I was trying to go by memory on Thomas with how many seasons he had of greatness. After his first seven full seasons where he was Ruthian in his production, he had four of five seasons where he "only" had OPS's of .861, .885, .758, & .834. After getting used to such greatness from Thomas, he seemed almost mortal for those five years during the downside of his career (ages 30-34). Again, Thomas also batted Right-Handed, which made what he did that much more impressive. Frank Thomas was amazing. Edgar Martinez and Frank Thomas accomplished what they did during the steroid era going up against both pitchers on steroids all while outproducing other batters on steroids, though they couldn't outproduce Bonds. Frank Thomas is probably the closest I would compare to Edgar Martinez over the last 60 years, not counting those whose careers were coming to an end 60 years ago.

Kingspoint
07-23-2013, 02:42 AM
Hank Aaron and Albert Pujols are both better hitters than Martinez, who I agree is underrated.I'm certain that 95-98% of people would agree with you on this.

Raisor
07-23-2013, 05:31 AM
Edgar is my all time favorite non-Red