2013 - 2014 UC Basketball

[Todd Gack]

Am I the one really starting this thread? Tried looking for another one, but only found 12-13.

With that said, good win today, huh?

[paintmered]

Mick will have the luxury all season of choosing an opposing player and having him not score. Titus Rubles is that good of a defender. Oh, and #JustinJacksonMeanFace played one of his better games today. Really solid performance after two silly fouls early in the 1st half.

They're going to be a solid team that will continue to improve as the youngsters get time on the court.

[Boss-Hog]

After a less than stellar start, I was impressed that the defense clamped down for most of the second half. They won't be top tier or anything, but I'd be surprised if that NC State finishes 10th in the ACC as the "experts" projected.

[Stray]

Rubles is a totally different player. You can tell he put in a lot of work since last season.

As usual I think we'll go through serious scoring droughts with this team, but we are going to be really hard to score on.

[Stray]

Other than putting the ball through the hoop, we're really good at this basketball stuff.

[Reds4Life]

Getting tired of Cronin. He's never had a team that's played any offense at all. Part of that is poor coaching, the other is poor recruiting.

[Stray]

I'd be curious what would score more points in 40 minutes. Running offensive sets, or giving the ball to Kilpatrick and letting him throw up shots every possession.

[Wonderful Monds]

Does anyone know where they sell these throwback Oscar Robertson jerseys I've been seeing on campus the past week? Looks like they're made by Adidas so they're not authentic throwbacks or anything.

[Todd Gack]

Hey guys we won! If we hold all of our opponents in the 40's, I feel pretty good about our season!

[CoachBombay]

Great defensive win. But can we please stop dribbling the ball around the 3 point line. We got to the line 3 times. And this is with the new touch foul rules. They get the ball and immediately dribble looking to pass instead of anything else. I used to think shaq was going to be awesome. I dont think that anymore. He cant make layups and he turns the ball over way too much. Sanders...i dont even know anymore. He used to be able to knock down a 3. Hes missed every open 3 hes taken the last few games...and by alot .Rubles should never take a jumper use the pump fake and continue to get inside. The bigs need to stop coming all the way out to the 3 point line to catch the ball. If you cant receive the ball around the free throw line go set a pick and try again. If you get the ball at the 3 point line you arent doing any good. You eventually just give it back to the guard who has to move further away from the basket to get the ball back. This is a Great Defensive team who relys on getting points off turnovers, but scoring other than that is hard to come by. Someone has to step up and make some shots...And with SK getting triple teamed hes doing all he can by giving to the open man. Sanders needs to knock down those shots. No excuse. TC might be the guy to carry this team on his back

[texasdave]

Pitt with 11 field goals the entire game.

They out-Bearcatsed the Bearcats by going without a field goal for a stretch of 13:43.

Incredible. :eek:

[Stray]

Pitt with 11 field goals the entire game.

They out-Bearcatsed the Bearcats by going without a field goal for a stretch of 13:43.

Incredible. :eek:

They went over 8 minutes in the first half without a FG and over 13 minutes in the 2nd half without a FG. We still needed a put back with less than 5 seconds to win the game lol.

I'm not even sure what to make of that.

[Stray]

Aw yea nice win today!

[texasdave]

Bearcats topple #18 Memphis on the road by a 69-53 margin. Nice. I will be in the building on Tuesday against the Houston Cougars. Houston just knocked off UConn a couple of nights ago at home, so it should be an interesting contest.

[reds1869]

As a Xavier fan I can't believe the lack of interest from Bearcat fans this year. You all have a very nice team. Maybe this win will get some people on the bandwagon.

[Stray]

As a Xavier fan I can't believe the lack of interest from Bearcat fans this year. You all have a very nice team. Maybe this win will get some people on the bandwagon.

It's because Dusty is a terrible coach, I mean we don't want to give Mike Brown money, oh wait nevermind I mean we don't like Mick.

Tough to keep track of our reasons :laugh:

[Sea Ray]

Aw yea nice win today!

I loved it. I know very little about Memphis so maybe they had an off night but they didn't look very good in this game. Are they really that bad at shooting the rock? I hope this doesn't turn out to be a win over an overranked team when we assess these things in March

[wolfboy]

As a Xavier fan I can't believe the lack of interest from Bearcat fans this year. You all have a very nice team. Maybe this win will get some people on the bandwagon.

Bearcat fans post elsewhere.

[Boston Red]

Bearcat fans post elsewhere.

I think the comment was more about attendance than posts on this board.

[SeeinRed]

I think the comment was more about attendance than posts on this board.

I've been disappointed with attendance as a UC fan. Value wise, tickets give you pretty good bang for your buck. I personally think that fan support was hurt so bad with the Huggins fiasco that people just became apathetic through the rebuilding process. Couple that with what many felt was an underwhelming hire in Cronin, a style of play that most don't find exciting, and success of the pro teams in town you have a perfect storm of apathy.

5/3 Arena is not a great venue either and that does factor in. That is putting it nicely. The venue is subpar by today's standards and needs gutted to fix it. I believe that is the next project UC will tackle after Nippert.

Having said all that, fans in this city seem to hold grudges much longer than they should. Sure, I loved Huggins, but Mick has done an outstanding job. Not only had he been winning at a good clip, he has done it the right way. Any lingering bitterness towards the program is unfounded and very unfair to Mick and his team. Mick might not have been a flashy hire, but it's very easy to argue he was the right guy for the job.

Hopefully people notice what this team is doing and start showing up to support them. I'm just not optimistic that they will unfortunately, and I know that it is taking is toll on Mick. He is starting at a disadvantage in recruiting because of it. The selling he has to do is crazy.

[Stray]

You know the more I watch them the more I think we can be dangerous in March. Our Freshman have been getting better, and offensively it's not like we're gonna get worse. We have guys that can score on the team, and working them into our rotation has helped. The way teams guard Kilpatrick it opens up everyone else.

Also, Justin Jackson has been great this year.

[dougdirt]

Having said all that, fans in this city seem to hold grudges much longer than they should. Sure, I loved Huggins, but Mick has done an outstanding job. Not only had he been winning at a good clip, he has done it the right way. Any lingering bitterness towards the program is unfounded and very unfair to Mick and his team. Mick might not have been a flashy hire, but it's very easy to argue he was the right guy for the job.

Hopefully people notice what this team is doing and start showing up to support them. I'm just not optimistic that they will unfortunately, and I know that it is taking is toll on Mick. He is starting at a disadvantage in recruiting because of it. The selling he has to do is crazy.

My best friend and his dad both jumped ship after the Andy Kennedy thing. They tried to hold on after Huggins, but when Kennedy also had problems and was let go, they were done and haven't ever come back. My best friend now roots for Xavier (he wound up going there for graduate school - so I can almost forgive him for it.... almost) and his dad simply doesn't watch college basketball anymore. I honestly think their story is one that holds true throughout the city.

[Roy Tucker]

Last time I went to a UC hoops game, my car got towed and I had to retrieve from the middle of crack alley (taking my 10 yr. old daughter) with a wad of cash. Coupling that with Clifton isn't the greatest place to go and UC's arena is mostly crappy seating, that was the last straw. I won't take tickets now even if they are free. I don't get mad, I just don't go.

[paintmered]

Justin Jackson was just named conference player of the week for the third consecutive week.

[dougdirt]

Justin Jackson was just named conference player of the week for the third consecutive week.

He can be really fun to watch. So much fire and energy.

[Redlegs23]

I'll be making the trip down for the Rutgers game this Saturday. I live 2 hours away so I'm usually only able to make 1-2 games per year.

I'm very excited about the future this team has. The three freshman have really impressed me, there's two more freshmen being redshirted, and we have two very talented freshmen coming in next year. 2-3 years from now this team has serious potential to be top 10 caliber. Thinking about the future with this group makes me giddy.

[texasdave]

Bearcats just missed a spot on the AP Top 25 this week. They came in at number 26.

[wolfboy]

Bearcats just missed a spot on the AP Top 25 this week. They came in at number 26.

Really not bad considering they had zero votes in the prior poll.

[Sea Ray]

Bearcats just missed a spot on the AP Top 25 this week. They came in at number 26.

Ironically, they're also #26 in the RPI. Odd that they're ahead of Xavier (in the AP poll) who blew 'em out of the arena in their head to head

[Redlegs23]

Ironically, they're also #26 in the RPI. Odd that they're ahead of Xavier (in the AP poll) who blew 'em out of the arena in their head to head

And they're also behind Memphis after taking it to Memphis at the Forum where they rarely lose.

I think that UC, Xavier, and Pitt will all be ranked in the next 2-3 weeks time. Both UC and Xavier have shown big improvements since the early season. Xavier looked terrible in their tournament where they went 0-3, but seem to have figured it out. UC's freshmen are gaining confidence and are turning them into a different team than what they were early in the season.

[wolfboy]

Ironically, they're also #26 in the RPI. Odd that they're ahead of Xavier (in the AP poll) who blew 'em out of the arena in their head to head

Some teams match up very poorly with others. The polls can't take that into account but the tournament does.

[texasdave]

Bearcats sitting pretty at #16 in the lastest SI Power Rankings.


Cincinnati Bearcats (13-2)
Mick Cronin has a rep as a strong defensive coach, but I'm still surprised to see the Bearcats ranked higher in adjusted defensive efficiency (5th) than Louisville is (14th) in January. Given the Cardinals' issues, how much Memphis has underwhelmed, and UConn's midseason swoon, it seems reasonable to call Cincy the new favorite to win the American Athletic Conference in its first year of existence. Following a 17-point loss to Xavier in mid-December, the Bearcats' defense locked down and has yet to allow an opponent to score more than 0.979 PPP.

Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/college-basketball/news/20140109/power-rankings-arizona-syracuse-wisconsin-san-diego-state/#ixzz2pxZjan00

[texasdave]

Bearcats crack the AP Top 25, settling in at Number 19.

[Sea Ray]

Bearcats crack the AP Top 25, settling in at Number 19.

Wow. That's quite a jump. Kudos to Mick and the gang...

[nmculbreth]

Another win.

I've been really, really impressed with the play of Justin Jackson this season. In the past I've been critical of the lack of player growth and development that taken place under Cronin's watch but Jackson has really made a huge leap forward this season.

[texasdave]

Bearcats struggle before putting Temple away late. The final score is 69-58. Sean Kilpatrick led the way with 23. Rubles and Jackson also in double figures. A win is a win.

[Stray]

17-2 works for me

[texasdave]

Bearcats go on the road and take care of business. 61-54. Wins are wins.

[nmculbreth]

Bearcats go on the road and take care of business. 61-54. Wins are wins.

Agreed. Not many pretty wins with this group but 17-2 at this point in the season is pretty impressive.

[Redlegs23]

Will be interesting to see the polls today. Should be in the 14-16 range. Take care of business against UCF and Temple this week and then the schedule starts getting pretty tough for the remainder of the season. Going 9-3 would be pretty solid in that stretch and would give them a good chance to win the conference.

[texasdave]

Bearcats in at #15. Nice.

[Sea Ray]

Bearcats in at #15. Nice.

I think they're over ranked there but it is nice I suppose. I doubt they're better than Ohio State, Iowa St and Duke. Their RPI is 21. That's probably a more accurate place for them.

[Redlegs23]

I think UC is the better team than Ohio State at this point. Ohio State's best win is probably Marquette, who is 11-8 on the season. Not exactly a quality win. Their other two "best" wins are Notre Dame and Maryland, who are 11-7 and 11-8. They have one top 50 RPI win against North Dakota State, who checks in at #49. After dropping a game last night to Nebraska who was 8-8 and 0-4 in the Big Ten I'm convinced they don't belong in the top 25 until they show they can beat a quality opponent.

Same goes for Duke really. They have beat a couple decent teams in UCLA and Michigan, but they also have losses to Notre Dame and Clemson. At this point that resume does not deserve to be ranked ahead of UC.

Iowa State I would rank ahead of UC. They have some really nice wins, paired with a couple head scratcher losses against Oklahoma and Texas, but overall I would put them in the top 15.

If you were talking in terms of talent, then yeah, Ohio State and Duke should be ranked in the top 5, but at this point in the season neither of them deserve to be ranked any higher than they are.

[texasdave]

Bearcats are up to #11 in the CNNSI power rankings. I guess we will find out on the 30th when they travel to Louisville. That certainly would appear to be a solid test.

[SeeinRed]

Justin Jackson is quite simply playing his butt off tonight. Cincinnati is definitely playing like a top 15 team in the second half so far.

[texasdave]

Bearcats topple UCF 69-51 to run their record to 18-2. Justin Jackson with 6 blocked shots. Kilpatrick with 19 points.

Gary Clark, 6'7" signee is putting up some ridiculous numbers in high school. including a quadruple double: http://cincyontheprowl.com/2014/01/21/bearcats-signee-gary-clark-tearing-high-school-circuit/

[Stray]

Defensively we are about as good as you'll find in college hoops.

[Stray]

Almost got peppered, but we hung on. A win is a win.

[Boss-Hog]

Any word yet on Justin Jackson?

[dabvu2498]

Any word yet on Justin Jackson?

I just happened to be in the car to hear Cronin's post game.

It's the same ankle that's given him trouble in the past, which didn't sound good. But he also said Jackson wanted to come back after halftime, which did sound good.

Basically, he didn't give any info one way or the other.

[Redlegs23]

He was definitely hobbling around in the layup line at the half. My guess is that he will be out there Thursday, I just hope he's effective and it doesn't set him back. Jackson is the guy we can least afford to lose, especially with Lawrence out.

[WMR]

How is the Bearcats shooting this season? That has seemed to be their downfall in previous years... haven't got a chance to watch them yet.

[Newport Red]

He was definitely hobbling around in the layup line at the half. My guess is that he will be out there Thursday, I just hope he's effective and it doesn't set him back. Jackson is the guy we can least afford to lose, especially with Lawrence out.

When is Lawrence due back?

[texasdave]

After the Bearcats got thumped by New Mexico and Xavier, back-to-back, to fall to 7-2, did anyone think they would be sitting at 19-2? It has been a suprising and enjoyable season so far for me. Go Bearcats!

[Redlegs23]

When is Lawrence due back?

Cronin said on his radio show that he is probably a week away from being back. Not sure if that means back to activity or back to games, but Cronin is known for not pushing it with his guys. He typically will give them extra rest unless the player and doctor both show Cronin that they are ok and aren't going to hurt themselves worse.

Apparently Jackson was screaming and yelling at halftime of the last game that he was fine and wanted back in but Cronin sat him. It wouldn't surprise me if Jackson plays Thursday though, apparently this is an ankle sprain that they have been dealing with for a long time on and off.

[Redlegs23]

How is the Bearcats shooting this season? That has seemed to be their downfall in previous years... haven't got a chance to watch them yet.

Not bad really. Kilpatrick is their gunner. He went through a horrible stretch for about 3-4 games but has bounced back in a big way the last 3-4 games. Definitely a little streaky but right now he's shooting pretty confidently.

They also have a couple freshmen who have been knocking down the open looks, and a 6'4" junior that can knock it down when open.

They aren't going to kill anyone with the three ball, but for the most part their shooting is ok. Defense is what wins games for this squad.

[Redlegs23]

When is Lawrence due back?

The update from Cronin yesterday said that Lawrence has started jogging and will be back in two weeks.

[WMR]

I've always liked Cronin. He comes across as a real straight shooter sort of guy/coach.

[Boston Red]

17-7 UC at the under 8 minute timout. Nice start, but they should have a bigger lead. Could come back to haunt them on the road.

[Stray]

Typical ul/uc game. Love that we have a lead without kilpatrick doing much.

[Boston Red]

Quite the meltdown by UC there. Not over, though...

[Stray]

exhale...

[Reds4Life]

UC manages to pull out the win. They'll be top 10 now.

[dougdirt]

My heart rate is still about 175. It has been for about 25 minutes. I may not make it through the night.

[WMR]

Thought UC was gonna blow it there... Kilpatrick is nails.

[paintmered]

Sweet to get some redemption on the hard court in their house.

Onward and upwards, Cats.

[texasdave]

A win over Louisville is always extra sweet. 20-2. Go Cats!

[SeeinRed]

This team just has that special feel to it. I can't quite put my finger on it, but they are just one of those teams that you can't help but love.

I hope everyone takes time to enjoy this run. 13 in a row with 9 of those conference wins is very impressive no matter who you are.

Final thought, kudos to Louisville for not giving up when they were down 17 in the second half. That was an incredible run to get back into the game.

[Redlegs23]

That was fun. Beating Louisville is great and all, but beating them at the Yum center in front of 22,000 is incredible. That's not an easy feat when they throw that kind of pressure at you and the crowd's rocking. Senior leadership came through in a big way last night. I absolutely love this team, they have already exceeded my expectations coming into the season.

[CoachBombay]

My heart rate is still about 175. It has been for about 25 minutes. I may not make it through the night.

haha I was the same. If it wasnt for the bourbon I wouldnt have made it :beerme:

[Sea Ray]

Thought UC was gonna blow it there... Kilpatrick is nails.

He sure is. It's been a long long time since we've had a player like that

[Newport Red]

I guess the Temple game was just a run through.

[Sea Ray]

It looks like quite a few teams above UC in the polls took on a loss this week so I think we could be looking at a nice jump

[paintmered]

I guess the Temple game was just a run through.

That 2nd half in Philly doesn't happen if Jackson hadn't sprained his ankle and watched from the bench. It forced Cronin to move Rubles to the 5 defensively when he otherwise would have been guarding Pepper. UC lacks depth in the front court due to NCAA clearinghouse issues and the Lawrence injury, which makes Jackson all the more vital. Nyarsuk isn't athletic enough to be relied on for more than 10-12 minutes.

Help and depth is on the way for next year though. UC is going to be as long and athletic at the wings and on the posts as they've been in my memory.

[Stray]

Ugly game, but after the big Louisville game it's not surprising we were flat. A win is a win.

[paintmered]

Yep, classic hangover game. And for some reason, UC typically struggles against USF.

[wolfboy]

Yep, classic hangover game. And for some reason, UC typically struggles against USF.

UC does not match up well with teams that have size and strength inside. Glad they pulled it out.

[nmculbreth]

Up to #7 in the AP poll.

[Stray]

I like how our runs are always over like 8-12 minutes lol. If they showed our 2 minute scoring run it'd be 4-0 :thumbup:

This is a good game. Both teams playing tough defense.

[texasdave]

Bearcats scratch their way back from five down at the half (31-26) to beat a solid UConn club (ranked #22) by a final of 63-58. Sean Kilpatrick was the man - 26 points, 12 rebounds and 6 assists. Justin Jackson chipped in with 15 points. UC runs their record to 22-2 with their 15th win in a row.

[Stray]

Loving this team. No idea how we've managed to get to this record, but I know that whatever 5 are out there are going to do whatever it takes to win. Playing harder than the other team is good enough more often than not.

[oregonred]

UC is a lot of fun to watch this year. Hoping this is the year they can break through in the tourney. Cronin has done a great job. Hope UC fans start showing up again.

[Todd Gack]

UC up to a 4 point dog today.

Don't get your hopes up too much. Seems like Vegas knows something.

[SeeinRed]

UC up to a 4 point dog today.

Don't get your hopes up too much. Seems like Vegas knows something.

SMU is a good team with a good coach. No surprise that they could be favored at home with UC coming off another hard fought and emotional win just 2 days ago. I do think UC will have to bring their best effort to win this game. It would not surprise me at all to see UC lose this one. I don't think the general public has any idea just how good SMU can be. As a UC fan, I really don't feel good about this game. SMU and their fans are very excited for the opportunity to beat Cincinnati. Should be a very good game.

[tomnuetten]

doesn´t look good at the moment!

smu with great defence, uc only with no idea´s... throwing 3pointers against defenders

come on uc

[Boston Red]

UC up to a 4 point dog today.

Don't get your hopes up too much. Seems like Vegas knows something.

Thanks for the hot tip of the day. That line looked bizarre, and when a line looks bizarre, my experience is that you should take the side that doesn't look right. My guess is that the books got a lot of Joe Public's money on this one.

[oregonred]

Never easy being the hunted against a team with nothing to lose.

[texasdave]

UC gets back onto the smiling side of the scoreboard with a 73-62 win at home over Houston. What is anybody's assessment of Jermaine Lawrence? Preseason reports had me expecting more.

[paintmered]

UC gets back onto the smiling side of the scoreboard with a 73-62 win at home over Houston. What is anybody's assessment of Jermaine Lawrence? Preseason reports had me expecting more.

He was progressing nicely early in the season against inferior competition. But his development was interrupted due to injury, and he's since given back those maturity gains. His injury hit at the worst possible moment for his development. And now that he's facing quality opponents, his deficiencies are all the more glaring.

I wouldn't count on him for quality minutes on either end of the floor for the rest of the year even though UC will have no other choice but to throw him in there and hope for the best. I still expect him to improve his game and strength over the off-season and into next year (assuming there are no more health issues). He'll be one of the better front count players to don the UC jersey in recent years by the time he graduates.

[Stray]

Big game today on CBS.

I think Louisville is going to be a lot better than the last time we faced them, and I think they'll make more 3s. Gotta survive their runs and find a way to win it late.

[Reds Freak]

I'm sure it's darn near impossible to officiate a game well between two teams this physical, but this has been a brutal performance. Guys are getting mugged in the lane without a call but you can't put a hand on the guy on the perimeter.

[dabvu2498]

I like replay as an officiating tool, but let's play the game. This is taking wayyyyyyyy too long.

[dougdirt]

26 seconds. Down 1. Let's get a bucket and take the W.

[Stray]

Bah

Good game though. This kinda stuff only helps you get ready for March.

[dabvu2498]

Bah

Good game though. This kinda stuff only helps you get ready for March.

Yeah. That game was played at a high, high level. Not pretty, but both teams competed like crazy.

[Wonderful Monds]

Refs completely handed the momentum and the game to Louisville with their incompetence and stopping the game for nearly 10 minutes. &$@#%*!! game.

[Stray]

Yeah. That game was played at a high, high level. Not pretty, but both teams competed like crazy.

It was pretty if you like missed shots and defense :laugh:

[Orenda]

this is why sport is great, they always say it doesn't come down to one play, which is usually true, but that last possession was awesome.

player pulls up for what looks to be a jumper only to dish off in what usually is an out of control or errant pass, but in this game it froze the nearest help side defender just enough to make him a step and half slow to contest the russ smith jumper. who, namely, should've done everybody a favor and at least had the courtesy to turn off the lights. ballgame.

[Stray]

Nice to see our big 3 playing well on their senior night.

[texasdave]

Cats put up 97 on Memphis on Senior Night. 97-84. Nice win.

[dougdirt]

How many players are more important to their team than Sean Kilpatrick is to Cincinnati? Doug McDermott? Anyone else?

[wolfboy]

Great crowd tonight. Also great to see the seniors go out on a high note.

[Stray]

SK is on a very short list of all time Cincinnati greats. Seems like he's been here forever, but I'll really miss cheering this group on when it ends.

Oh and a memo to the rest of college basketball, if you let us score 95+ points in less than 8 overtimes you're not gonna win. Cannot believe we put up 97 in regulation...mind boggling lol.

[Stray]

Won at least a share of the AAC title with our win today. Need UCONN to beat Louisville to win it outright.

[bucksfan2]

SK is on a very short list of all time Cincinnati greats. Seems like he's been here forever, but I'll really miss cheering this group on when it ends.

Oh and a memo to the rest of college basketball, if you let us score 95+ points in less than 8 overtimes you're not gonna win. Cannot believe we put up 97 in regulation...mind boggling lol.

It was fun watching SK's development. It has been a long time since I have seen a player like SK on the court. Its hard to believe that when he first came to UC Cronin red-shirted him even when the team needed extra offense.

He should bet POY in the American conference but I have a feeling Russ Smith is going to get that because he is a bigger name. He should get some serious consideration for 1st team all American but i don't think that will happen because he doesn't have a big enough name. This season has been a pleasure to watch him take the ball in his hands and ice games. Kudos to SK on his Cincinnati career and hopefully he gets a chance at the next level.

[texasdave]

Congratulations on a great season so far. They well exceeded my expectations.

[Assembly Hall]

How many players are more important to their team than Sean Kilpatrick is to Cincinnati? Doug McDermott? Anyone else?

Stauskus, Parker, Napier, etc. Lots of guys are most important to their teams. BTW.....Great job Bearcats.

[texasdave]

Bearcats win a coin toss and get the #1 seed. They will play the winner of Temple-UCF.

[Stray]

Stauskus, Parker, Napier, etc. Lots of guys are most important to their teams. BTW.....Great job Bearcats.

Michigan has GR3, Duke has Hood, but I agree on Napier. We rely on Kilpatrick more than any team should rely on one player.

[Assembly Hall]

Michigan has GR3, Duke has Hood, but I agree on Napier. We rely on Kilpatrick more than any team should rely on one player.

Smart? BTW Kilpatrick should be a first team All-American.

[Stray]

Napier won AAC POY. Justin Jackson won DPOY, and SK got Sportsman of the Year? Whatever that is.

Napier over SK is lame, had it been Russ it still woulda been lame, just not as much.

[CoachBombay]

Napier won AAC POY. Justin Jackson won DPOY, and SK got Sportsman of the Year? Whatever that is.

Napier over SK is lame, had it been Russ it still woulda been lame, just not as much.

I mean, Napier did lead his team to 4th place. Thats pretty good right?

[nmculbreth]

Napier won AAC POY. Justin Jackson won DPOY, and SK got Sportsman of the Year? Whatever that is.

Napier over SK is lame, had it been Russ it still woulda been lame, just not as much.

I don't typically get bent out of shape about post season awards but Napier over Kilpatrick for POY is mind boggling.

[texasdave]

USA Today revealed their Men's All-Americans in basketball.

Shabazz Napier, Russdiculous Smith and Sean Kilpatrick all made the 1st-team squad.

[dougdirt]

The game tonight was tough to watch,but at this point in the year, a win is a win and you take it. Villanova wasn't so lucky today.

[Stray]

Gotta be able to score 60 points if you wanna win big games in March. I wasn't positive we were offensively challenged, luckily Doris Burke drove that point home tonight :D

[dougdirt]

That was painful at the end. Seriously, just lose by 30 so I don't have to lose weeks off of my life having watched that.

[Roy Tucker]

Mick's teams play just barbed-wire killer defense. I just wish they could shoot the ball. UConn played equivalent defense and has a better offense.

Lack of offense (besides SK) will eventually get them in the NCAAs.

[Stray]

We got a 5 seed and have to play Harvard all the way out in Spokane Washington. That's a scary matchup for us, Harvard is good.

[nmculbreth]

UC gets a 5th seed out west, draws Harvard and gets Michigan State waiting in the round of 32 if they manage to win.

Good grief.

[dougdirt]

UC gets a 5th seed out west, draws Harvard and gets Michigan State waiting in the round of 32 if they manage to win.

Good grief.
At some point you need to beat a team that is good. Might as well start right out of the gate. End of the day, I am not concerned with our draw. Michigan State going back six weeks is 8-7 with losses to Michigan, Georgetown, Wisconsin, Nebraska, Michigan, Illinois and Ohio State. They win 3 games in a row and all of a sudden everyone at ESPN is picking them to win the tournament? Come on, man.

Cincinnati is just as good or better than every team that beat Michigan State in the last six weeks and I would argue they are easily better than any of them with the exception of perhaps Michigan (who has been blown out in each of their last four losses spanning six weeks - and they barely escaped an overtime game against a 15-17 Purdue team three weeks ago).

Michigan State can beat Cincinnati. But Cincinnati could easily beat them too.

As for Harvard....they are 0-3 versus RPI top 50 teams, losing to Colorado, UConn and Yale (15-13). Oh, and they lost to Florida Atlantic (10-22) at the end of January. By 15 points. Sure, there is a chance, but I will take them and our defense + SK all day long. Only one team can win them all, but this team should be able to beat Harvard.

[ervinsm84]

At some point you need to beat a team that is good. Might as well start right out of the gate. End of the day, I am not concerned with our draw. Michigan State going back six weeks is 8-7 with losses to Michigan, Georgetown, Wisconsin, Nebraska, Michigan, Illinois and Ohio State. They win 3 games in a row and all of a sudden everyone at ESPN is picking them to win the tournament? Come on, man.

Cincinnati is just as good or better than every team that beat Michigan State in the last six weeks and I would argue they are easily better than any of them with the exception of perhaps Michigan (who has been blown out in each of their last four losses spanning six weeks - and they barely escaped an overtime game against a 15-17 Purdue team three weeks ago).

Michigan State can beat Cincinnati. But Cincinnati could easily beat them too.

As for Harvard....they are 0-3 versus RPI top 50 teams, losing to Colorado, UConn and Yale (15-13). Oh, and they lost to Florida Atlantic (10-22) at the end of January. By 15 points. Sure, there is a chance, but I will take them and our defense + SK all day long. Only one team can win them all, but this team should be able to beat Harvard.
MSU is top 10 in kenpom. #2 on inpredictable.com that regresses the betting market and is listed as 9-2 to win the title. This isn't just lol espn hype. They also have 2 1st rd picks in this years draft whereas we have a likely second rounder at best.

Sure UC could win bc it's 1 game and weird stuff happens but we'll be at least 6-7 point dogs vs them. Hell they were 4 pt favs on a neutral vs 2 seed mich yesterday at tip off.

It's also obv still way more likely than not that msu doesn't win a title though, but thats more about the structure of the tournament.

Hafvard is also top 35 in kpom and I think top 25 in sagarin. For perspective Evey other 12 seed is 42 or worse. That's a tough draw. Line reflects this as well with UC only a 3.5 pt favorite.

On the optimistic side we did probably get weakest overall collection of 1,2, and 3 seeds.

[Chip R]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiRJaa1wbzg

[dougdirt]

MSU is top 10 in kenpom. #2 on inpredictable.com that regresses the betting market and is listed as 9-2 to win the title. This isn't just lol espn hype. They also have 2 1st rd picks in this years draft whereas we have a likely second rounder at best.

Sure UC could win bc it's 1 game and weird stuff happens but we'll be at least 6-7 point dogs vs them. Hell they were 4 pt favs on a neutral vs 2 seed mich yesterday at tip off.

It's also obv still way more likely than not that msu doesn't win a title though, but thats more about the structure of the tournament.

Hafvard is also top 35 in kpom and I think top 25 in sagarin. For perspective Evey other 12 seed is 42 or worse. That's a tough draw. Line reflects this as well with UC only a 3.5 pt favorite.

On the optimistic side we did probably get weakest overall collection of 1,2, and 3 seeds.

Michigan State may have some fantasy rankings that say they are one of the best teams in the country, but I just can't sit here and say that one of the best teams in the country is 8-7 over their last 15 games. If they were truly as good as people are saying, they would be 12-3 or 13-2 in that span. They aren't. They have been very mediocre over the last 7 weeks of basketball.

The rankings systems don't think the AAC is any good. Apparently neither does the selection committee. Maybe I am crazy, but I think that at least at the top, those teams are pretty good and can play with anyone. And really, playing with anyone is all that you can ask for.

[wolfboy]

Michigan State may have some fantasy rankings that say they are one of the best teams in the country, but I just can't sit here and say that one of the best teams in the country is 8-7 over their last 15 games. If they were truly as good as people are saying, they would be 12-3 or 13-2 in that span. They aren't. They have been very mediocre over the last 7 weeks of basketball.

The rankings systems don't think the AAC is any good. Apparently neither does the selection committee. Maybe I am crazy, but I think that at least at the top, those teams are pretty good and can play with anyone. And really, playing with anyone is all that you can ask for.

It's amazing to me that the AAC includes two of the last three NCAA champs (UConn '11, UL '13), yet has to fight for respect. But what do I know, right?

[dabvu2498]

If we're going based on the recent past, UC is 5-4 in their last 9 games. And I don't think they've had the injuries to overcome that MSU has dealt with.

[dougdirt]

If we're going based on the recent past, UC is 5-4 in their last 9 games. And I don't think they've had the injuries to overcome that MSU has dealt with.

Which is a perfect point for a head-to-head matchup, but if they didn't have to play Michigan State, would everyone be picking UC to win the tournament? That is my point. I don't doubt Michigan State is a good team. I just doubt, a lot, that they are remotely close to the best team.

[dabvu2498]

Which is a perfect point for a head-to-head matchup, but if they didn't have to play Michigan State, would everyone be picking UC to win the tournament? That is my point. I don't doubt Michigan State is a good team. I just doubt, a lot, that they are remotely close to the best team.

That's a pretty favorable region for them. I think that's probably the biggest reason you're seeing "everyone" predicting them to do well. Of course, people are also assuming they're healthy.

Here's games missed by guys in their regular rotation:
Harris: 3
Payne: 7
Appling: 3
Dawson: 10
Trice: 2
Kaminski: 7

They've had 11 different guys start games for them this year. That's a lot to overcome.

[dougdirt]

I didn't realize it was as bad as that. Still, Kaminski is averaging just 13 minutes, 8th most on the team. While he may be in the rotation, he isn't a key player.

They played with Payne for losses to Wisconsin, Nebraska, Michigan, Illinois and Ohio State all in the last 5 weeks.

Dawson was back for the Illinois and Ohio State losses in the last 2 weeks.

They have dealt with some injuries, but still, I think people are really overreacting to winning the Big 10 tournament. Good team, sure. Having every ESPN expert pick you to win the entire tournament? Please. Has that happened since UNLV was undefeated and entering the tournament? I doubt it. If everyone picked Florida? Sure, I can understand that. If everyone picked Wichita State, I could understand that some. But they didn't. They picked Michigan State and that is just insane. If one guy, maybe even two picked them, sure, still a reach IMO, but sure. But all five? Crazy.

[dabvu2498]

Having every ESPN expert pick you to win the entire tournament?

Katz didn't pick them to make the Final 4. Neither did Myron Metcalf. They both have Iowa St.

[dougdirt]

Katz didn't pick them to make the Final 4. Neither did Myron Metcalf. They both have Iowa St.

Those guys weren't on the TV show were they? That is what I was very poorly referencing. Even still, they had 7 experts pick two teams, neither of which is a 1 or 2 seed. That seems wild to me.

Of course Nate Silver's method has a #4 seed as the run away favorite to win the tournament (Louisville with a 24% chance, with Florida being the second best chance at 14%).

[dabvu2498]

Those guys weren't on the TV show were they? That is what I was very poorly referencing.


That's what you get for watching that stuff!!! Vitale will rot your brain!!!

[dougdirt]

That's what you get for watching that stuff!!! Vitale will rot your brain!!!

Oh I didn't watch that. I just have twitter and follow a bunch of sports types.

[ervinsm84]

Michigan State may have some fantasy rankings that say they are one of the best teams in the country, but I just can't sit here and say that one of the best teams in the country is 8-7 over their last 15 games. If they were truly as good as people are saying, they would be 12-3 or 13-2 in that span. They aren't. They have been very mediocre over the last 7 weeks of basketball.

The rankings systems don't think the AAC is any good. Apparently neither does the selection committee. Maybe I am crazy, but I think that at least at the top, those teams are pretty good and can play with anyone. And really, playing with anyone is all that you can ask for.
Those aren't fantasy rankings. Its the betting market that sets lines and the best computer models (btw both of which get ignored by the committee). They are effectively the sabermetrics of basketball. But bury your head in the sand if you choose.
I'm sure you can find a way to make some money off the market mispricing a team this poorly.

[RedTeamGo!]

Oh I didn't watch that. I just have twitter and follow a bunch of sports types.

You are underrating how effective a Tom Izzo coached team is come tourney time.

Every player that stays for his senior year makes a final four at least once during his time at MSU. For Payne and a few others this is the season. You got a taste of what an Izzo coached team is capable of in the B1G tourney.

also, this:

http://kenpom.com/

Ranked 10th best team in the country by kenpom.

MSU is not my pick to win it all though, I am going with Arizona. Best defense in the country according to kenpom.

[ervinsm84]

Also I think I read that Izzo is 18-3 in the second game of a tournament weekend. Small sample size but I think he's probably pretty elite at game prepping on a short turnaround.

[Sea Ray]

As West Virginia prepares for an NIT game as a middling seed, it's nice to see that we don't hear talk of fans missing Huggins anymore. We're better off with Mick...:thumbup:

[dougdirt]

Those aren't fantasy rankings. Its the betting market that sets lines and the best computer models (btw both of which get ignored by the committee). They are effectively the sabermetrics of basketball. But bury your head in the sand if you choose.
I'm sure you can find a way to make some money off the market mispricing a team this poorly.

Sorry, but they are fantasy rankings because they are based on things that happened in November and December just as much as they are what happened in February and March. What a team has done more recently is a lot more valuable than what they did in November. The betting market means nothing. It is based on what bettors will do and tries to be set at a line where there is nearly a 50/50 split on bets on the game. It is not based on who is best.

I will fully admit that I don't get into college basketball to the point of study that I do with baseball, but even sabermetrics in baseball can be misleading at times. I'm smart enough to understand that a team that is 8-7 in their last 15 games shouldn't be one of the favorites to win the national title. That isn't to say that they can't or that they won't, it is to say that it isn't likely. Nate Silver's odds put them at 1%. Louisville is the favorite at 24%. Plenty of teams are between the two of them too. I don't know what his system has done historically, but it seems to jive with the reality that my brain says is there than the one that has a team that is 8-7 over their last 15 games as a favorite to win the title does.


You are underrating how effective a Tom Izzo coached team is come tourney time.

Every player that stays for his senior year makes a final four at least once during his time at MSU. For Payne and a few others this is the season. You got a taste of what an Izzo coached team is capable of in the B1G tourney.

also, this:

http://kenpom.com/

Ranked 10th best team in the country by kenpom.

MSU is not my pick to win it all though, I am going with Arizona. Best defense in the country according to kenpom.

No, I am not underrating Tom Izzo. I know full well his history. I also know that since these seniors haven't made the Final Four, that you know, maybe, just maybe, it says something about them and even Izzo/others catching up.

[ervinsm84]

Sorry, but they are fantasy rankings because they are based on things that happened in November and December just as much as they are what happened in February and March. What a team has done more recently is a lot more valuable than what they did in November. The betting market means nothing. It is based on what bettors will do and tries to be set at a line where there is nearly a 50/50 split on bets on the game. It is not based on who is best.

I will fully admit that I don't get into college basketball to the point of study that I do with baseball, but even sabermetrics in baseball can be misleading at times. I'm smart enough to understand that a team that is 8-7 in their last 15 games shouldn't be one of the favorites to win the national title. That isn't to say that they can't or that they won't, it is to say that it isn't likely. Nate Silver's odds put them at 1%. Louisville is the favorite at 24%. Plenty of teams are between the two of them too. I don't know what his system has done historically, but it seems to jive with the reality that my brain says is there than the one that has a team that is 8-7 over their last 15 games as a favorite to win the title does.



No, I am not underrating Tom Izzo. I know full well his history. I also know that since these seniors haven't made the Final Four, that you know, maybe, just maybe, it says something about them and even Izzo/others catching up.


You're 100% wrong about setting a line with their goal being to get 50/50 action.

And you're wrong about silver's model having MSU at 1% equity. Its 6% and also tied for the 4th best odds of any team by his model. Louisville isn't 24% either. He has them at 15%

[dougdirt]

Youre wrong again Doug. Kpom gives more weight to recent games.

You're also 100% wrong about setting a line with their goal being to get 50/50 action.

And you're wrong about silver's model having MSU at 1% equity. Its 6% and also tied for the 4th best odds of any team by his model.

Lots of wrong on my part. I am convinced that Silver's model tricked me.

I am not wrong about the goal of the betting line. If the bets aren't near 50% for both sides, there is a chance of someone taking a bath. That is why lines move, to get the bets at 50-50. They don't move because of some magical information that changes between games (well, sometimes it does), but because more money is coming in for one side than the other, so the line moves to try and even things out.

I still stand by my line of thinking though that a team that is 8-7 over the last 15 games shouldn't be considered one of the favorites. Math or not, that logic just doesn't make an ounce of sense.

Again, I am not saying there aren't a good team. I am saying they shouldn't be one of the favorites.

[Boston Red]

Vegas plays the games. They don't just collect juice.

[ervinsm84]

Vegas plays the games. They don't just collect juice.

This.

The sports book has a main goal to maximize return. Different books have different levels of tolerance as far as how much risk they are willing to take when they "take a side."

Also even with line movements and changing the juice amounts from -110 to +150 its EXTREMELY difficult to ever get 50/50 action. Also the more you move the line, you then are open to getting middled which is a nightmare.

[texasdave]

Cincinnati by double digits today. 71-59 or something along those lines.

[Sea Ray]

Cincinnati by double-digits today. 71-59 or something along those lines.

Interesting that a lot of the so called experts including all the pundits at CBS are calling on Harvard to win. Despite the fact that they have only played two top 50 teams this year and lost both times. I'd love for Mick and co to stick it to these folks today

[Hoosier Red]

Good lord Cats. MAKE YOUR FREE THROWS!

[Sea Ray]

Good lord Cats. MAKE YOUR FREE THROWS!

Free throws? They're not making any shots

[texasdave]

Maybe I had the score right but the teams backwards. Well, there is 20 minutes to go and I still think the Bearcats are the better team.

[RedTeamGo!]

Penty of time

[Kingspoint]

93 seconds and Cincinnati down by 3 and no possession.

Here we go again.

[Kingspoint]

Another upset!

Wow!

[texasdave]

That didn't go so well. You have to be able to score the basketball.

[Stray]

Sad for our seniors. Gonna miss this group.

But yeah, eventually we're gonna have to add offense to the list of things we are good at. The hustle and defense are cool and all, but it'll never be enough on its own.

[dabvu2498]

Whoever filled out UC's book is in deep. That's just beyond pitiful.

[Roy Tucker]

Sad for our seniors. Gonna miss this group.

But yeah, eventually we're gonna have to add offense to the list of things we are good at. The hustle and defense are cool and all, but it'll never be enough on its own.

Yep. A likable UC team, but man, they shoot like my daughter's soccer team did when they had a basketball team. Lots of athletes but what a lot of clanks and bonks.

[vaticanplum]

#gocrimson

[ducks]

[nmculbreth]

This pretty much sums it up:

Mo Egger ‏@MoEgger1530 - Rooting for this team was like being the parent of a dumb child. Love 'em to death, admire their effort, but God they're frustrating.

[texasdave]

A six-minute scoreless stretch in both halves. No new news there.

[BRM]

Whoever filled out UC's book is in deep. That's just beyond pitiful.

What happened?

[dabvu2498]

What happened?

2:33 p.m.: This never happens in NCAA Tournament games. Cincinnati was just given a technical foul for not having Jermaine Sanders in the scorebook. I wouldn't want to be the person who messed that up. Mick Cronin can't be thrilled. -- Jeff Borzello

[BRM]

2:33 p.m.: This never happens in NCAA Tournament games. Cincinnati was just given a technical foul for not having Jermaine Sanders in the scorebook. I wouldn't want to be the person who messed that up. Mick Cronin can't be thrilled. -- Jeff Borzello

Wow! You're right, someone is in deep trouble for that one.

[Wonderful Monds]

2:33 p.m.: This never happens in NCAA Tournament games. Cincinnati was just given a technical foul for not having Jermaine Sanders in the scorebook. I wouldn't want to be the person who messed that up. Mick Cronin can't be thrilled. -- Jeff Borzello

Just classic Cincinnati sports.

[texasdave]

No Kilpatrick, Jackson or Rubles next season. Mick is going to have to coach his butt off. I am expecting a ton of games in the 50s again.

[Todd Gack]

I'm not sure who it was, but these are the type of players Mick recruits:

WIth out 1:15 remaining, Harvard scores and the UC player rolls the ball up the court and Caupain or someone waits until it gets to half court to pick up the ball. Think about what's wrong with that for a second.

[Orenda]

shaq Thomas still the best "prospect" on the roster imo

[Stray]

Kilpatrick is a 1st team All American, awesome.