5/17/14 - Reds v. Phillies ("Cozart's batting where??" Edition)

[NebraskaRed]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bn3B-rHIcAA-isR.jpg

[757690]

Ummmmmm.... okay?

[Kc61]

No Heisey v LHP.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Price apparently HATES Homer. Mercy.

[Larkin Fan]

Yikes.

[CWRed]

Cozart is batting over .300 over the last 12-13 games from what the announcers said last night. But I think it's dumb because his OBP is atrocious all the time, but really with the hitters lately I am ok with shaking things up as long as it doesn't become a habit. Reminds me of Dusty...ick. Heisey is awful again this year against lefties as he has been his whole career, although so is Skippy. Hate not seeing Mes in there but I assume he will be brought back slowly and could be sore.

[Larkin Fan]

Guess we can't say that Price realizes that the SS doesn't have to bat second anymore, can we?

[Larkin Fan]

Cozart is batting over .300 over the last 12-13 games from what the announcers said last night. But I think it's dumb because his OBP is atrocious all the time, but really with the hitters lately I am ok with shaking things up as long as it doesn't become a habit. Reminds me of Dusty...ick. Heisey is awful again this year against lefties as he has been his whole career, although so is Skippy. Hate not seeing Mes in there but I assume he will be brought back slowly and could be sore.

I'm guessing Rocco isn't playing because Bailey has worked well with Barnhart, but in all honesty, Rocco needs to be in there regardless.

[757690]

I'm guessing Rocco isn't playing because Bailey has worked well with Barnhart, but in all honesty, Rocco needs to be in there regardless.

I understand Steve Carleton and Greg Maddox having personal catchers. Homer Bailey... not so much.

[mu4103]

No Heisey v LHP.

Schumaker is a .213 career hitter with 1 HR against lefties. Heisey is by far better defensively. Don't understand the Schumaker infatuation.

[Larkin Fan]

I understand Steve Carleton and Greg Maddox having personal catchers. Homer Bailey... not so much.

I completely agree. But it seems to be the pattern for Bailey's starts.

[mu4103]

Hamilton, Phillips, and Frazier are the only guys that can hit the ball in that line-up. Not sure Cozart should be playing Rec League softball w/out a personal hitter. This is a Dusty line-up.

[toledodan]

Hamilton, Phillips, and Frazier are the only guys that can hit the ball in that line-up. Not sure Cozart should be playing Rec League softball w/out a personal hitter. This is a Dusty line-up.

that line-up hurt my eyes when i read it. cozart in the 2 hole????

[marcshoe]

If you're going to use that combination of players, I understand Cozart hitting second. Otherwise, the bottom part of the lineup would just suck way too much.

[Raisor]

If you're going to use that combination of players, I understand Cozart hitting second. Otherwise, the bottom part of the lineup would just suck way too much.

Group the best hitters together.

[RedWilly]

Guys…. we won yesterday. We don't need to try to win tonight too. Stop being so selfish everyone.

[malcontent]

White Flag line-up, but where's Santiago?

[Red Raindog]

White Flag line-up, but where's Santiago?

he's hitting .200 -- too high?

:p

[Chuckie]

Soto being in the lineup at all is perhaps even worse than that.

Wait, Soto being on the team might be worse than that.

[Kc61]

Cozart is batting over .300 over the last 12-13 games from what the announcers said last night. But I think it's dumb because his OBP is atrocious all the time, but really with the hitters lately I am ok with shaking things up as long as it doesn't become a habit. Reminds me of Dusty...ick. Heisey is awful again this year against lefties as he has been his whole career, although so is Skippy. Hate not seeing Mes in there but I assume he will be brought back slowly and could be sore.

Heisey has been MUCH better against lefties than righties in 2012 and 2013. Over .800 against lefties the last two years.

Heisey has 14 PAs against lefties in 2014. Fairly small sample.

Heisey should be playing against lefties with Bruce out.

[PepperJack]

Day off for Mesoraco: Price said he was going to give Devin Mesoraco, fresh off the disabled list, either Saturday or Sunday off, and he decided to it would be Saturday. Tucker Barnhart caught Homer Bailey.

Brayan Pena has not caught Bailey, while Barnhart and Mesoraco entered Saturday having both caught him four times. Bailey's ERA is 3.86 with Barnhart and 5.73 with Mesoraco.

"Instead of total immersion, he's going to be our regular catcher, you're not going to see him catch two out of every five, but on his way back from rehab, I don't think it makes a great deal of sense to play him every day," Price said. "Pena will continue to catch Johnny Cueto, that's been a very good relationship. You'll see a lot of Devin Mesoraco."

[RedTeamGo!]

Cole Hamels - this should be an interesting game.

[Red Raindog]

Price is a genius

Cozart doubles

[kbrake]

SS should hit 2nd.

[RedWilly]

Better get to this guy early

[Red Raindog]

BP walk & swinging bunt hit for Todd --- better get him now

[Red Raindog]

run scores on dribbler to 2B ---

[kbrake]

Bailey better realize how fortunate he is haha.

[RedWilly]

Heads up base running by frazier

[Tom Servo]

Hamels made his MLB debut May 12, 2006, almost exactly 8 years ago, against the Reds.

[marcshoe]

The Phillies have the look of a team lost in its struggles.

[Red Raindog]

a run -- wish it was more - but a run

[Chuckie]

Cozart = catalyst.

[RedWilly]

Hamels made his MLB debut May 12, 2006, almost exactly 8 years ago, against the Reds.

I was at this game. Had no idea who hamels was till I talked to a buddy of mine who told me about what a big prospect the reds were facing that night

[_Sir_Charles_]

Hopefully that doesn't come back to hurt us. Rollins should've been out. Miscommunication between Barnhart & Frazier.

[Tom Servo]

This could be starting better for Homer.

[kbrake]

If people still don't think Bailey has been unlucky in 2014 I hope they're watching this inning.

[_Sir_Charles_]

1st & 2nd. Heck of an effort from Frazier to get to the ball and nice try for the sweep tag by Soto. No dice.

[Red Raindog]

Hopefully that doesn't come back to hurt us. Rollins should've been out. Miscommunication between Barnhart & Frazier.

:pray:

[_Sir_Charles_]

1 down as the Oscar winner pops out to Cozart

[kbrake]

I feel like a few years ago and this game would be 3-1

[_Sir_Charles_]

Fly out to Ludwick. 2 down but Rollins advances to third.

Inning SHOULD be over.

[Red Raindog]

this defense is almost as fun to watch as the starting pitching

[_Sir_Charles_]

*whew* Ground out to Frazier to end the inning. 2 nice diving stabs by Todd at the hot corner.

[Tom Servo]

Hamels made his MLB debut May 12, 2006, almost exactly 8 years ago, against the Reds.
This fact I cited didn't make me feel too much like I'm really getting older, but hearing that Ryan Howard is 34 did.

[_Sir_Charles_]

this defense is almost as fun to watch as the starting pitching

Exactly. I'll never get that "boring" sentiment to low scoring games. Not with the pitching and defense this club puts on display day in and day out.

[Chuckie]

It's unbelievable this guy is on the team. Walt asleep at the wheel once again.

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Hey, but he grew up on a farm in Puerto Rico!

[kbrake]

This fact I cited didn't make me feel too much like I'm really getting older, but hearing that Ryan Howard is 34 did.

Whoa whoa whoa hold up. Ryan Howard is 34??

[Chuckie]

Course, we're already over our allotment of runs. I should just enjoy it.

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Whoa whoa whoa hold up. Ryan Howard is 34??

He plays like he's 37.

[RedTeamGo!]

Neftali Soto is hilariously bad. His swing goes through the exact same part of the zone every time. This man gets paid for this.

[Chuckie]

The front office was so impressed with Soto's inability to hit Triple-A pitching last year that they decided to give him an extended look on the big club this year. Makes sense.

[RedWilly]

Mr. Come Right At You walks the pitcher

[kbrake]

Soto is really bad but it isn't like there are a ton of trade options in May. I am sure Walt will improve the spot as soon as he can.

[Chuckie]

Soto still living off his "one-hit wonder" year of 2011.

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Soto is really bad but it isn't like there are a ton of trade options in May. I am sure Walt will improve the spot as soon as he can.

It's annoying when he stands pat on things like this though. Even a casual baseball fan could probably see Soto belongs nowhere near an MLB roster.

[RedTeamGo!]

Yeah, I don't think there is much to be done, just pointing out that Soto is so bad it is amusing.

[_Sir_Charles_]

It's unbelievable this guy is on the team. Walt asleep at the wheel once again.

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Hey, but he grew up on a farm in Puerto Rico!

Seriously Chuckie....who SHOULD be here in place of Soto? Have you looked at the Louisville roster? Besides, we do need someone who can cover 1b for now. I understand the desire by some to bring up Lutz, but maybe they don't want to do that and instead want him to get some AAA time first before forcing the issue with him again.

[kbrake]

I think they want Lutz to be able to develop which makes sense for right now. As far as a RH bat off the bench I just don't see a ton of options right now.

[Chuckie]

Seriously Chuckie....who SHOULD be here in place of Soto? Have you looked at the Louisville roster? Besides, we do need someone who can cover 1b for now. I understand the desire by some to bring up Lutz, but maybe they don't want to do that and instead want him to get some AAA time first before forcing the issue with him again.

I'd much rather have Lutz. They brought him up last year, but this year (when he's raking at AA) they don't? And they prefer having Soto up here? Makes no sense at all.

[Red Raindog]

Homer should be smart enough to not walk the 8 hole guy ---

[Chuckie]

Great play by Barnhart. How did Soto miss the tag?

Jeez. If he just leaves the glove down, he's out.

Doesn't matter. Hamels K's. Well, it would have been nice having the pitcher leadoff the next inning though.

[Red Raindog]

not sure Gwynn was safe there

[kbrake]

I'd much rather have Lutz. They brought him up last year, but this year (when he's raking at AA) they don't? And they prefer having Soto up here? Makes no sense at all.

You don't see the case to develop him further as a player? If he is up here getting a few AB's a week or playing as much as Soto has it would just hurt him long term.

That being said I could be talked him to giving him a shot to platoon in LF with Ludwick.

[_Sir_Charles_]

I'd much rather have Lutz. They brought him up last year, but this year (when he's raking at AA) they don't? And they prefer having Soto up here? Makes no sense at all.

But as I said, they may not want to do that. Lutz has never even been in AAA yet. If they truly think Lutz may be something worthwhile...then it could very easily be a choice of going with Soto because they don't want to rush Lutz. I think Lutz is the better player too....but if they feel it'll hurt his development...I'm fine with him staying down there. Plus he JUST came back from an injury like this week IIRC.

[VottoFan54]

Seriously Chuckie....who SHOULD be here in place of Soto? Have you looked at the Louisville roster? Besides, we do need someone who can cover 1b for now. I understand the desire by some to bring up Lutz, but maybe they don't want to do that and instead want him to get some AAA time first before forcing the issue with him again.

Can't one of the catchers play first?

[Chuckie]

You don't see the case to develop him further as a player? If he is up here getting a few AB's a week or playing as much as Soto has it would just hurt him long term.

That being said I could be talked him to giving him a shot to platoon in LF with Ludwick.

I could definitely see the case of wanting to let Lutz develop in the minors ... if there wasn't a glaring need for him with the big club right now. Having Soto on the team just makes no sense to me. Either bring Lutz up or make a minor trade to find a competent backup first basemen. This is what GMs are supposed to do. Not sit around and allow players that shouldn't be on the team to be on the team.

[Chuckie]

Can't one of the catchers play first?

Yes, Pena did just that last night.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Great play by Barnhart.

Tucker has been VERY impressive since he's come up. I thought Hanigan was the best Reds defensive catcher since JB....Tucker is better than Hanigan by quite a bit IMO with the glove.

[kbrake]

I could definitely see the case of wanting to let Lutz develop in the minors ... if there wasn't a glaring need for him with the big club right now. Having Soto on the team just makes no sense to me. Either bring Lutz up or make a minor trade to find a competent backup first basemen. This is what GMs are supposed to do. Not sit around and allow players that shouldn't be on the team to be on the team.

I'd want Lutz to replace Bernadina more than Soto honestly.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Yuck. 9 pitches, 3 k's.

[Tom Servo]

Hamels just made the Reds his b that inning.

[RedWilly]

What. Just. Happened.

[Chuckie]

Tucker has been VERY impressive since he's come up. I thought Hanigan was the best Reds defensive catcher since JB....Tucker is better than Hanigan by quite a bit IMO with the glove.

I wouldn't say he's better defensively than Hanigan by quite a bit, but he's definitely extremely impressive defensively.

I'm a bit worried Barnhart will never hit well enough to be a No. 1 catcher at the MLB level. But he can be a damn good No. 2. And with Mesoraco around for (hopefully) years to come, that's all the Reds need. Mez/Barnhart is going to be a fun tandem for years. And I love having Pena this year and next as well. Reds are in great shape at the catching position.

[Red Raindog]

what. Just. Happened.

gm ga gn x3

[Chuckie]

Hamels just made the Reds his b that inning.

Buddy?

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Whew, that woulda been a HR at GABP.

[VottoFan54]

Yes, Pena did just that last night.

I just briefly looked through the box score from last night, I must have missed that.

[Red Raindog]

Tucker has been VERY impressive since he's come up. I thought Hanigan was the best Reds defensive catcher since JB....Tucker is better than Hanigan by quite a bit IMO with the glove.

I wonder if Mes has a 1B glove? I like Tucker's D a bunch but he would need to out hit Cozart

[_Sir_Charles_]

I wouldn't say he's better defensively than Hanigan by quite a bit, but he's definitely extremely impressive defensively.

I'm not so sure. He's MUCH faster behind the dish. Lots of mobility. He's quite good at framing. He blocks freaking everything. And his arm makes Hanigan's look like a wet noodle...and that's saying something. His pop and release is MUCH quicker than Ryan's too. I can't find a weakness in his defensive game.

Yes, his bat is very meh. I see a career backup catcher when I see him. I was only pointing out the elite level of his defense. I've been blown away by him.

[RedWilly]

[QUOTE=Chuckie;3087905]Buddy?

Buckaroo?

[Red Raindog]

ouch on that missed call blue

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got him anyway -- just added two pitches

[kbrake]

I'm not so sure. He's MUCH faster behind the dish. Lots of mobility. He's quite good at framing. He blocks freaking everything. And his arm makes Hanigan's look like a wet noodle...and that's saying something. His pop and release is MUCH quicker than Ryan's too. I can't find a weakness in his defensive game.

Yes, his bat is very meh. I see a career backup catcher when I see him. I was only pointing out the elite level of his defense. I've been blown away by him.

I think he looks like a guy whose bat could just develop late. I wouldn't be shocked if he turned into a very good all around MLB catcher.

[_Sir_Charles_]

1-2-3 for Homer. Nice bounce off the mound for Phillips.

[_Sir_Charles_]

1 down. Ludwick flies out to right.
2 down. Schumaker jammed and flies out to left.

[kbrake]

OK quick predictions for this Soto AB. I'll say single.

[Red Raindog]

OK quick predictions for this Soto AB. I'll say single.

K

[Tom Servo]

I will also say K.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Single to left for Neftali.

Shame on both of you.

[Tom Servo]

OK quick predictions for this Soto AB. I'll say single.
So...what happens next?

[Red Raindog]

OK quick predictions for this Soto AB. I'll say single.

is there a lag with my TV?

:p

[kbrake]

You guys just are not drinking enough.

[Red Raindog]

I'm glad we got to him early because he looks like he's on it now.

[_Sir_Charles_]

But nothing doing as Tucker grounds out to end the inning. Both these pitchers are rollin'.

[Chuckie]

Wow, I turn away for a couple minutes and Soto gets a hit.

[Tom Servo]

They cut away before the Phils phans started pelting the Reds fans with batteries.

[Kc61]

Tomorrow, Reds will need to send down a position player. Either Votto goes on DL or, if not, Barnhart, Soto, or Bernadina goes down. This is to make room for Cingrani.

[Tom Servo]

Ugh.

[Larkin Fan]

Crap.

[Tom Servo]

I hate the Phillies.

[DocRed]

Homer.....:/

[Chuckie]

With our offense, this game feels like it's pretty much over.

[DocRed]

With our offense, this game feels like it's pretty much over.

I have more confidence in our offense then Homer to be honest..

[Tom Servo]

Ugh. 2 run HR. 4-1 game.

[Larkin Fan]

Crapazoidal maniacs.

[DocRed]

I have more confidence in our offense then Homer to be honest..

ughh...Homer

[Roy Tucker]

When Homer goes bad, he really goes bad.

[redsfaninbsg]

Reds offense right now is at the worst I've seen it as a fan. I'm sure somebody can show me numbers to prove otherwise but I really feel like it's a miracle if this team scores right now.

[Tom Servo]

Man, that pitch was on a tee.

[malcontent]

Game, given Price's lineup.

[DocRed]

Homer needs a veteran catcher...clearly he needs direction.

[Tom Servo]

Uncle.

[Chuckie]

Did Bailey do anything in the offseason to improve? There was talk that he worked out like crazy coming into 2013. His game is just way off this year. Very disappointing.

[Larkin Fan]

Oh boy. Ondrusek is warming. Contrary to popular belief, it CAN get worse...

[_Sir_Charles_]

Well, maybe I shouldn't leave again. Sheesh. I go to start dinner before this half of the inning starts. I come back, 4-1. Ugh.

[757690]

Did Bailey do anything in the offseason to improve? There was talk that he worked out like crazy coming into 2013. His game is just way off this year. Very disappointing.

He improved his ability to count to 100 million.

[DocRed]

I will be shocked (and pleased) if Homer finishes the season below a 4.00 ERA....I just don't see it happening.

[Chuckie]

Oh boy. Ondrusek is warming. Contrary to popular belief, it CAN get worse...

This is the perfect kind of game to use Ondrus(...)

It's pretty much over. Might as well wave the white flag officially and put Logan on the mound.

[Roy Tucker]

My daughter wants to watch "The Vow". Maybe I'll let her.

[Chuckie]

He improved his ability to count to 100 million.

True. Hopefully he didn't lose the drive after inking that deal.

[DocRed]

He improved his ability to count to 100 million.

50 million per no hitter.....nice coin.

[Chuckie]

At least Homer is being pitch efficient. Only 91 pitches through 3.2 innings.

Wow, another run. Hanging curve to Ruiz. Homer is done.

[Chuckie]

Just SMH at Homer. I hope his contract doesn't become an albatross.

[DocRed]

Getting pulled in the 4th for Ondrusek...yikes! :X

[Red in Chicago]

i'm not sure what was worse - seeing godzilla this afternoon, or homer's outing…

[Larkin Fan]

Well, if this game doesn't dispel the notion that Homer needs to work with Barnhart to pitch well, I'm not sure what will.

[SirFelixCat]

Coming in late here...WTF re: the lineup? Homer piss off Price? Oof.


And well, Homer...oof.


Well, back to my game of The Huntershttp://www.boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/113873/the-hunters-german-u-boats-at-war-1939-43.

[kbrake]

Homer was really bad tonight. Against that lineup he simply can't have a night like this. That being said questioning his contract or acting like he got the contract because of two no hitters is ridiculous. Only Reds fans could turn no hitters into a way to complain about a pitcher.

[Tom Servo]

Just SMH at Homer. I hope his contract doesn't become an albatross.
I still think he turns it around this year, but even if he doesn't, sometimes pitcher's just don't have a good year. We saw that with Bronson in 2011.

[redsfaninbsg]

Just be happy Mesoraco hit a 3-run bomb yesterday. This offense is disastrous.

[kbrake]

And if the Reds lose 2-1 this game would be on Price. If Homer gives up 5 in 3.2 innings this game is on Homer.

[Red Raindog]

Well, maybe I shouldn't leave again. Sheesh. I go to start dinner before this half of the inning starts. I come back, 4-1. Ugh.

exactly I did too!

[Larkin Fan]

Typical Ondrusek. Uncorks a wild pitch for his first pitch.

[DocRed]

I still think he turns it around this year, but even if he doesn't, sometimes pitcher's just don't have a good year. We saw that with Bronson in 2011.

Which is fine.....when you aren't making $17.5M per year in a small to mid market team.

[RedTeamGo!]

i'm not sure what was worse - seeing godzilla this afternoon, or homer's outing…

Godzilla was so bad it is comparable to Homer's start? Yikes.

[Tom Servo]

Which is fine.....when you aren't making $17.5M per year in a small to mid market team.
Technically he doesn't start earning in that range until 2016.

[757690]

I still think he turns it around this year, but even if he doesn't, sometimes pitcher's just don't have a good year. We saw that with Bronson in 2011.

Bronson was sick that year. Kissing disease, rumors have it.

Healthy, good pitchers have off years, but healthy, very good pitchers usually don't. And yes, "very good" is code for $100M pitchers.

[Kc61]

I still think he turns it around this year, but even if he doesn't, sometimes pitcher's just don't have a good year. We saw that with Bronson in 2011.

Arroyo had been ill if I recall correctly. Mono, wasn't it?

[RedTeamGo!]

Which is fine.....when you aren't making $17.5M per year in a small to mid market team.

It has been a quarter of the season. Homer will get it together.

[Roy Tucker]

Not a good inning.

Where's the wine?

[RedTeamGo!]

I think everyone would feel better if they just accept mediocrity for the rest of the season.

[DocRed]

It has been a quarter of the season. Homer will get it together.

I hope you are right...but I wouldn't bet for it.

[dabvu2498]

Letting LogO hit? Ugh.

[Mutaman]

I still think he turns it around this year, but even if he doesn't, sometimes pitcher's just don't have a good year. We saw that with Bronson in 2011.

Didn't Bronson have Mono in 2011? Haven't heard any physical excuses for Homer's problems this season, other than some minor stuff in spring training.

[joshua]

With the injuries, the bullpen and Bailey this season so far has been like watching a car accident in slow motion.

[malcontent]

Who was it that had the nightmare about Bailey signing for $100M?

Well, at least this won't take long given Price's lineup and Hamels.

[jojo]

i'm not sure what was worse - seeing godzilla this afternoon, or homer's outing…

Was Godzilla not good?

[DocRed]

Didn't Bronson have Mono in 2011? Haven't heard any physical excuses for Homer's problems this season, other than some minor stuff in spring training.

Between the ears

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Was Godzilla not good?

Got 72% on Rotten Tomatoes...so actually thought it was good.

[RedTeamGo!]

Between the ears

We are talking about 9 games. Pitchers have slumps too. If he does this all season then you might be on to something.

[malcontent]

Between the ears.
And Kremchek can't do anything for that.

[DocRed]

We are talking about 9 games. Pitchers have slumps too. If he does this all season then you might be on to something.

Well, we have his entire career to look at. Career 4.28 ERA. At his best he is a 3.50 ERA guy....I think that is his peak.

[Red Raindog]

Not a good inning.

Where's the wine?

I have it and I'm not sharing tonight because I'm going to need a lot

[Reds/Flyers Fan]

Godzilla was so bad it is comparable to Homer's start? Yikes.

Godzilla was pretty good. This team, not so much.

[Tom Servo]

Bronson was sick that year. Kissing disease, rumors have it.

Healthy, good pitchers have off years, but healthy, very good pitchers usually don't. And yes, "very good" is code for $100M pitchers.
Arroyo is just one example though. Look at Cole Hamels 2009. Jon Lackey 2010 and 2011. AJ Burnett 2010 and 2011. Ubaldo Jimenez 2012. Gimme some time and I can find even more.

[Red Raindog]

Between the ears

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Got 72% on Rotten Tomatoes...so actually thought it was good.

my 17 year old grandson loved it == YMMV

[757690]

Arroyo is just one example though. Look at Cole Hamels 2009. Jon Lackey 2010 and 2011. AJ Burnett 2010 and 2011. Ubaldo Jimenez 2012. Gimme some time and I can find even more.

So far, you've only mentioned guys who got hurt, but I'll gladly be proven wrong. Have fun :)

[RedTeamGo!]

Well, we have his entire career to look at. Career 4.28 ERA. At his best he is a 3.50 ERA guy....I think that is his peak.

If at best he is a 3.50 ERA guy then how did he have a 3.31 era last year?

[757690]

Cody Asche sounds like first name of a Japanese player.

[Red in Chicago]

Was Godzilla not good?

i'll just say that we left disappointed.

[Tom Servo]

So far, you've only mentioned guys who got hurt, but I'll gladly be proven wrong. Have fun :)
Show me where Hamels, Burnett, or Jimenez missed any time during or after those bad seasons?

[DocRed]

Arroyo is just one example though. Look at Cole Hamels 2009. Jon Lackey 2010 and 2011. AJ Burnett 2010 and 2011. Ubaldo Jimenez 2012. Gimme some time and I can find even more.

Arroyo is a good comparison as his stats are similar to Homer's (career 4.19 ERA vs 4.28). However Bronson only averaged about 10Million a year in his prime with Cincinnati. I would have MUCH less problems with Homer at that price....$17.5M a year is overpriced for what you are getting IMO.

[RedTeamGo!]

Randy Johnson in 1998 and 2003

[Roy Tucker]

I have it and I'm not sharing tonight because I'm going to need a lot

That's ok. Enjoy. We're having a nice Malbec. Grilling steaks now.

"The Vow" won. Root the boys on for me.

[RedTeamGo!]

It is like rooting for the Washington Generals at this point tonight.

[Tom Servo]

Arroyo is a good comparison as his stats are similar to Homer's (career 4.19 ERA vs 4.28). However Bronson only averaged about 10Million a year in his prime with Cincinnati. I would have MUCH less problems with Homer at that price....$17.5M a year is overpriced for what you are getting IMO.
10 mil, 17 mil...it ain't my money.

Again, so far, it's 9 starts. Frustrating, but not panic time.

[757690]

Show me where Hamels, Burnett, or Jimenez missed any time during or after those bad seasons?

I don't have time in a game thread to link to all the stories, but all those guys saw doctors around those years. I don't know if they missed starts but they were hurt. Arroyo didn't miss time in his injured year either.

[DocRed]

10 mil, 17 mil...it ain't my money.

Again, so far, it's 9 starts. Frustrating, but not panic time.

Agree...its 9 games. But again, I am looking at his career stats and extrapolating from there. Just doesn't add up to me. I wouldn't be shocked to see his name on his trading block come August.

[Ironman92]

I understand Steve Carleton and Greg Maddox having personal catchers. Homer Bailey... not so much.

You blew it on this post! Lol

But I do agree with your thought.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Btw, Kershaw pitching tonight against the hapless Diamondbacks. Knocked him out of the game in the 2nd after putting up 7 runs on him. Even good pitchers have bad outings.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Marshall really struggling to locate his breaking stuff. No outs, bases loaded. Ugh.

HBP, BB, BB

Tapper back to Sean. 1 down after getting the guy at home.

[DocRed]

Btw, Kershaw pitching tonight against the hapless Diamondbacks. Knocked him out of the game in the 2nd after putting up 7 runs on him. Even good pitchers have bad outings.

I get that....but are you seriously comparing Kershaw to Bailey's troubles?

[indyscott]

Btw, Kershaw pitching tonight against the hapless Diamondbacks. Knocked him out of the game in the 2nd after putting up 7 runs on him. Even good pitchers have bad outings.

The problem is those good pitchers have a lot of great outings.

[757690]

According to PitchFX, Marshall has lost around 1 MPH on his pitches since coming back from his injuries. It might not seem like a lot, but it seems to be making a big difference.

[Kc61]

Btw, Kershaw pitching tonight against the hapless Diamondbacks. Knocked him out of the game in the 2nd after putting up 7 runs on him. Even good pitchers have bad outings.

Yes and sometimes, as in Bailey's case, they have a 5.44 ERA about a quarter of the season in.

I'm ok saying that Bailey is a good pitcher who isn't having a good year. But he isn't having a good year.

[_Sir_Charles_]

I get that....but are you seriously comparing Kershaw to Bailey's troubles?

Homer's been improving the past several starts. He had one bad inning tonight. That's all I'm saying. People are acting like he's horrific.

[5TimeWSChamps]

$100 mil based on future production. The Reds have had awful luck with contracts

[Kc61]

Homer's been improving the past several starts. He had one bad inning tonight. That's all I'm saying. People are acting like he's horrific.

Would you agree Bailey isn't having a good year?

[CrackerJack]

Agree...its 9 games. But again, I am looking at his career stats and extrapolating from there. Just doesn't add up to me. I wouldn't be shocked to see his name on his trading block come August.

Has Homer ever been a consistent pitcher throughout a season? I would've preferred he was on the trading block this past off-season, never was a fan of that contract/signing or the timing of it. Games like tonight facing a bad team are exactly why - can't trust him in the post season either.

[_Sir_Charles_]

10-1 now. :(

[757690]

Homer's been improving the past several starts. He had one bad inning tonight. That's all I'm saying. People are acting like he's horrific.

Other than that, how was the play Mrs. Lincoln?

[_Sir_Charles_]

Would you agree Bailey isn't having a good year?

Of course. That's obvious. But I also think he's got PLENTY of time to turn it around. Tonight, he was actually pretty good outside of that one inning where the wheels just completely came off. He was cruising prior to that.

[DocRed]

Homer's been improving the past several starts. He had one bad inning tonight. That's all I'm saying. People are acting like he's horrific.

Don't disagree with any of that. I am simply of the opinion (right or wrong, and I am wrong a lot ;)) that he is overpaid. $17.5M for a career 4.28 ERA which says nothing about this year's struggles really.

[RedTeamGo!]

That career ERA has been inflated by being brought up wayyyyy too early.

[indyscott]

I'm not sure where throwing 91 pitches and not making it through 4 innings is just having one bad inning.

[Red Raindog]

According to PitchFX, Marshall has lost around 1 MPH on his pitches since coming back from his injuries. It might not seem like a lot, but it seems to be making a big difference.

something is --- I wonder if he will be on the DL again soon

[757690]

Marshall's curve has been sloppy this year, and that's his out pitch. If he can't get that back into form, he's done, imo.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Just batting practice off Marshall right now. Yuck.

[Kc61]

Of course. That's obvious. But I also think he's got PLENTY of time to turn it around. Tonight, he was actually pretty good outside of that one inning where the wheels just completely came off. He was cruising prior to that.

I agree that he has time to turn it around.

Reds need to play better soon because they have a tough schedule now, lot of road games, at Nats, they have seven with LA in the next several weeks, a Cards series.

[NebraskaRed]

Marshall rockin' a 12.15 ERA now.

[RedTeamGo!]

I'm not sure where throwing 91 pitches and not making it through 4 innings is just having one bad inning.

I noticed you didn't make a peep during his last outing where he gave up 1 run in 7 1/3

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I think Marshall is done.

[DocRed]

That career ERA has been inflated by being brought up wayyyyy too early.

Career 4.03 ERA when you take away his first 2 years stats.

[_Sir_Charles_]

I'm not sure where throwing 91 pitches and not making it through 4 innings is just having one bad inning.

It was. He got screwed in the first by a dropped pop up by Barnhart/Frazier, then a poor throw on the following play by Frazier (although a heck of a stop). That inning escalated his pitch count and he threw VERY well. Just some crappy luck that inning.

I'm not trying to make excuses...he's stunk so far this year, but prior to tonight...he was showing signs of getting it back together.

[malcontent]

Price is a veritable genius. Rests Mez, Pena and Heisey for Lee tomorrow....and gets the Phillies to score tomorrow's runs tonight.

[NebraskaRed]

Price is a veritable genius. Rests Mez, Pena and Heisey for Lee tomorrow....and gets the Phillies to score tomorrow's runs tonight.

Rocoo, Pena, and Heisey being in the game wasn't going to stop Bailey giving up 6 in one inning, and Marshall giving up 5 in another.

[RedTeamGo!]

Career 4.03 ERA when you take away his first 2 years stats.

That is a pretty significant drop, and he was only 23 in his third year.

[indyscott]

I noticed you didn't make a peep during his last outing where he gave up 1 run in 7 1/3

- - - Updated - - -

I think Marshall is done.

I don't spend a lot of time on these boards. That was a great outing. He has stunk it up pretty much the rest of the year.
Is that better?

[RedTeamGo!]

I don't understand why any player signs a contract with the Reds. The moment you sign on the dotted line you have to be perfect at all times or the fanbase will eat you alive.

- - - Updated - - -


I don't spend a lot of time on these boards. That was a great outing. He has stunk it up pretty much the rest of the year.
Is that better?

Ah, so you basically only show up when something negative happens? Cool.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Sam LeCure however..... :thumbup:

[DocRed]

That is a pretty significant drop, and he was only 23 in his third year.

Well 4.28 to 4.03....OK I like your enthusiasm! :)

[indyscott]

I don't understand why any player signs a contract with the Reds. The moment you sign on the dotted line you have to be perfect at all times or the fanbase will eat you alive.

- - - Updated - - -

No I pretty much show up when I have time. I didn't realize I needed to spend a specific amount if time here to state an obvious opinion shared by many others.


Ah, so you basically only show up when something negative happens? Cool.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Don't sweat it indyscott. You're fine. Guys are just grumpy tonight....for obvious reasons.

[Ironman92]

As a very true and loyal fan of the Reds and still watching every pitch of this game......

I think I deserve to watch Chris Heisey pitch the 8th

[RedTeamGo!]

Well 4.28 to 4.03....OK I like your enthusiasm! :)

His first 2 years consisted of 17 total starts. Context is fun. His first full season at age 23 he had an ERA of 4.53 and it decreased every season after.

[Red Raindog]

As a very true and loyal fan of the Reds and still watching every pitch of this game......

I think I deserve to watch Chris Heisey pitch the 8th

I vote Skip

[_Sir_Charles_]

As a very true and loyal fan of the Reds and still watching every pitch of this game......

I think I deserve to watch Chris Heisey pitch the 8th

LOL. That would be entertaining. :O)

[_Sir_Charles_]

Billy got all of that one. hehehe.

[DocRed]

I still watch these blowouts hoping for offense from our starters to boost their stats. I am a STAT JUNKIE....in case you haven't figured it out. :P

[_Sir_Charles_]

So close to extra bases for Zack.

[mu4103]

I vote Skip
Watching those throws come from right field. Skip has a weak arm.

[_Sir_Charles_]

I still watch these blowouts hoping for offense from our starters to boost their stats. I am a STAT JUNKIE....in case you haven't figured it out. :P

Have you considered checking yourself into Saber-rehab?

[Ironman92]

Billy got all of that one. hehehe.

That was a Janish, a weak one at that

[NebraskaRed]

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m4wwxhVQMe1qzjzyyo2_500.gif

I'm just going to start posting some gifs from the Bad News Bears, because why not.

[Ironman92]

Watching those throws come from right field. Skip has a weak arm.

Yeah....I don't want any little kids getting hurt in the OF bleachers off of Skip's 77 mph fastball

[_Sir_Charles_]

Heisey in right, Skip at 2nd, Santiago at 3rd. LeCure still in.

[NebraskaRed]

http://stream1.gifsoup.com/view3/2965591/bad-news-bears-o.gif

[_Sir_Charles_]

That's just what the Reds need. A cooler of beer in the dugout.

[NebraskaRed]

http://remotecontrol.mtv.com//wp-content/uploads/rc/2013/10/BNB.gif

[_Sir_Charles_]

You know things are going bad when LeCure gets touched up. :(

[Ironman92]

Heisey Heisey Heisey

[Ironman92]

Reds bullpen = F

[Ironman92]

If the Reds hitters and the bullpen pitchers switched roles.....would it be any different?

[757690]

I'm guessing Marshall goes on the DL tomorrow when Cingrani comes back.

[Red Raindog]

Watching those throws come from right field. Skip has a weak arm.

has pitched twice in majors -- last time 2013 - 2 innings no runs!

[Red Raindog]

I'm guessing Marshall goes on the DL tomorrow when Cingrani comes back.

+1

[Ironman92]

Marlon Byrd in a 12-1 game just went home to first in 3.90

[NeilHamburger]

I don't understand why any player signs a contract with the Reds. The moment you sign on the dotted line you have to be perfect at all times or the fanbase will eat you alive.

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Ah, so you basically only show up when something negative happens? Cool.

You show me any city in this country where a guy signs a 100 million dollar contract, has an ERA over 5 over half way through May, and there aren't people upset and I will be shocked.

Can you imagine the crap Tanaka would be getting in NYC if this is how he looked? He would be called a fat toad.

[Ironman92]

has pitched twice in majors -- last time 2013 - 2 innings no runs!

Don't want to see it.....we want Heisey's 87 mph cheese

[_Sir_Charles_]

Somebody help me out here. I'm stumped.

Why am I still watching this? :O)

[NebraskaRed]

The second Bad News Bears movie isn't bad. That one where they go to Japan is outright horrible.

[Ironman92]

You show me any city in this country where a guy signs a 100 million dollar contract, has an ERA over 5 over half way through May, and there aren't people upset and I will be shocked.

Can you imagine the crap Tanaka would be getting in NYC if this is how he looked? He would be called a fat toad.

Thin toads are well thought of

[Red Raindog]

Somebody help me out here. I'm stumped.

Why am I still watching this? :O)

I'm watching Onegin on the tube & this debacle on my iPad & drinking

[Ironman92]

Somebody help me out here. I'm stumped.

Why am I still watching this? :O)

You are waiting on LeCure and Heisey to switch positions

[NebraskaRed]

Wikipedia says there was a Bad News Bears tv series. I had no idea.

[_Sir_Charles_]

Wikipedia says there was a Bad News Bears tv series. I had no idea.

Neither did the tv viewing audience.

[Ironman92]

We
Got
This.

[Ironman92]

I can't believe all the Phillies fans still behind home plate

[_Sir_Charles_]

We
Got
This.

I'm with ya brother! We got this L. :(

[Ironman92]

I'm with ya brother! We got this L. :(

Nonsense poopy pants

[NebraskaRed]

Ramon Santiago fails to start the comeback.

[Ironman92]

Santiago with a deep fly out to SS

[_Sir_Charles_]

I'm about as positive minded as they come...to the point of being delusional. You know it's bad if I say it's over. LOL.

[NebraskaRed]

Chris Heisey fails to start the comeback.

[Ironman92]

Heisey with a deep fly to Ruiz in fair territory ( no idea how he does that so regularly lol)

[_Sir_Charles_]

Heisey hit that one like a pitcher....does that come close enough for you ironman92? :O)

[Red Raindog]

2012 season (97 wins) record after 41 games = 22-19

2014 = 19-22 (likely anyway)

see hope is not lost

ignore that DL behind the curtain folks

*COUGH*

[Ironman92]

Chris Heisey fails to start the comeback.

Mad cause he didn't get to pitch

[Ironman92]

Heisey hit that one like a pitcher....does that come close enough for you ironman92? :O)

No....I'm just disappointed beyond reconciliation

[NebraskaRed]

Ryan Ludwick has started the comeback.

[_Sir_Charles_]

BB to Luddy. Here we go!

[Ironman92]

BB to Luddy. Here we go!

I'll be surprised if he doesn't steal 2nd, 3rd and home

[NebraskaRed]

If Skip hits a HR that touches the liberty bell, it's worth 11 runs.

[Ironman92]

Ryan Ludwick has started the comeback.

He also was inserted into Guinness Book of World Records for having the shortest arms of any man over 6'2

[Ironman92]

If Skip hits a HR that touches the liberty bell, it's worth 11 runs.

Link?