2014 Cincinnati Bearcats Football

[dougdirt]

So, this season has started out ok..... Gunner Kiel seems alright.

[Stray]

Welcome back, Munchie :thumbup:

[RedTeamGo!]

How bout them rockets? My alum is showing some fight!

Ps, I know gunner Kiel is a big transfer from ND and whatnot, but I would like to point out UT is missing 3 cornerbacks due to injury for this one.

[paintmered]

Toledo didn't have a strong defense (they are depleted with injuries), but Gunner absolutely shredded them tonight. Went for over 400 yards and 6 TDs in his debut. Tied the school record, even.

UC's defense needs to improve but I think they played vanilla schemes tonight. Very little blitzing and little pressure from the front four all night.

Bearcats may need to outscore everyone like they did in 2009.

[Roy Tucker]

I think OSU will have a tussle with UC. They can throw the ball.

[nmculbreth]

I know it's premature but it sure is nice to have a real QB at the helm again!

[Stray]

Lots of things to like about last night's game. Kiel and our receivers looked great. Loved Tubs' aggressiveness too.

I didn't like how many empty sets we ran that led to Kiel taking big hits though, but I guess that's part of the spread offense. He just can't take a beating like that all season, I doubt he'd hold up. Running game was kinda bad, and our defense against the run was very bad. Also our tackling sucked lol.

We're gonna need to keep Kiel healthy so we can outscore everyone this year. If we're not gonna be able to stop anyone, maybe we'll force a lot of turnovers.

[dougdirt]

We're gonna need to keep Kiel healthy so we can outscore everyone this year. If we're not gonna be able to stop anyone, maybe we'll force a lot of turnovers.
The 2005 Cincinnati Bengals plan? As long as it works, but it's tough to plan for lol

[wolfboy]

Not the best showing against a team on a 20 game losing streak. The defense was atrocious, McKay had two terrible drops, and Kiel looked human. The run game is still a question mark, but Tion Green is not the answer.

The positive: these issues can be fixed. The negative: at the Shoe in front of a 100k+ isn't the place to fix them. In a vacuum, UC and Ohio State are very close. But with UC's abysmal defense and the fact that this is at home for OSU, I don't think UC has much of a chance. It may be a shootout early, but I think Ohio State's depth is the difference in the game.

Losing at Ohio State isn't a deal killer on the access bowl, but it won't help. I don't see a team outside of the AAC taking the access bowl spot, but that's not a given for UC. ECU looks like the real deal. UCF is a solid squad. Memphis, Houston and Temple all look much improved. It should be an interesting season.

[Boston Red]

Losing at Ohio State isn't a deal killer on the access bowl, but it won't help. I don't see a team outside of the AAC taking the access bowl spot, but that's not a given for UC. ECU looks like the real deal. UCF is a solid squad. Memphis, Houston and Temple all look much improved. It should be an interesting season.

BYU has the inside track on the access bowl. Whoever wins the AAC is probably the next man up if BYU slips up, but it's BYU's to lose at this point.

[RedTeamGo!]

Pardon my ignorance, what is the access bowl?

[Boston Red]

Essentially, the top non-"Power 5" team gets a bid to a major bowl. I'm not sure how it's going to work mechanically, but the Orange, Sugar or Fiesta (maybe one other in the mix) will have to take a team from outside the power leagues every year.

[Sea Ray]

I think losing at OSU will be enough to knock UC from the "Access Bowl". I don't think they have the kind of team that'll even come close to such lofty heights this year but there's nothing wrong with that. They can still have a very good year and go to a decent Bowl

[wolfboy]

BYU has the inside track on the access bowl. Whoever wins the AAC is probably the next man up if BYU slips up, but it's BYU's to lose at this point.

BYU can get an at-large spot, but independents aren't eligible for the access bowl.

- - - Updated - - -


I think losing at OSU will be enough to knock UC from the "Access Bowl". I don't think they have the kind of team that'll even come close to such lofty heights this year but there's nothing wrong with that. They can still have a very good year and go to a decent Bowl

Then (assuming UC wins out otherwise) who goes?

[swaisuc]

Not the best showing against a team on a 20 game losing streak. The defense was atrocious, McKay had two terrible drops, and Kiel looked human. The run game is still a question mark, but Tion Green is not the answer.

The positive: these issues can be fixed. The negative: at the Shoe in front of a 100k+ isn't the place to fix them. In a vacuum, UC and Ohio State are very close. But with UC's abysmal defense and the fact that this is at home for OSU, I don't think UC has much of a chance. It may be a shootout early, but I think Ohio State's depth is the difference in the game.

Losing at Ohio State isn't a deal killer on the access bowl, but it won't help. I don't see a team outside of the AAC taking the access bowl spot, but that's not a given for UC. ECU looks like the real deal. UCF is a solid squad. Memphis, Houston and Temple all look much improved. It should be an interesting season.

The good news is that ECU comes to Cincy so we will have a chance to give them a 2nd loss h2h. I think if we win that game (and the conference), we have a great shot at the access bowl, but with Marshall's horrific schedule we probably only have room for 1 loss if they go undefeated. That means beating OSU or running the rest of them including @Miami FL and the entire AAC schedule. I can see them putting us in over an undefeated Marshall with 1 loss, but not 2. So if we have something like a 10-2 AAC champs year, we need to root for a Marshall loss.

[wolfboy]

The good news is that ECU comes to Cincy so we will have a chance to give them a 2nd loss h2h. I think if we win that game (and the conference), we have a great shot at the access bowl, but with Marshall's horrific schedule we probably only have room for 1 loss if they go undefeated. That means beating OSU or running the rest of them including @Miami FL and the entire AAC schedule. I can see them putting us in over an undefeated Marshall with 1 loss, but not 2. So if we have something like a 10-2 AAC champs year, we need to root for a Marshall loss.

I agree that Marshall has the best shot of any team outside of the AAC. That being said, I think Marshall drops a game or two, even with its terrible schedule.

[Sea Ray]

Then (assuming UC wins out otherwise) who goes?

I just don't think UC is nearly good enough to run the table so I don't think OSU will decide their fate. As for projecting who will get this bid, it's way too early. I'd say East Carolina's a good bet. Possibly Boise St or Wyoming. All in all I think the winner of UC's conference has the inside track. I just don't think UC will be that team because of their defense. Hope I'm wrong...

[Boston Red]

Wyoming is not good. I'm a big fan of Craig Bohl and all, but not this year.

[Hoosier Red]

Just terrible news. Walk-on running back Chamoda Kennedy-Palmore, was killed when a vehicle turned across two lanes of traffic and hit his motorcycle around 1:30 p.m
http://www.cincinnati.com/story/news/traffic/2014/09/25/vine-street-closed-after-motorcycle-accident/16211427/

[Reds4Life]

The game last night was one of the worst defensive games I have seen in years, Hank Hughes should be getting his boxes ready to clean out his office. Sure, OSU has better talent, I get that, but it seems nobody on our entire defensive squad can tackle someone correctly. Stunning. That's a pure coaching issue. The defense has been horrid all year.

Gunner is the real deal, he doesn't look like a kid that's only played in 3 college games in his life, and he played very well last night. The problem is, he'll have to throw 4TD's a game because we have a defense that couldn't stop a plastic bag from floating in the wind.

[RedTeamGo!]

Gunnar looks solid, but at least 2 of his long Tds came from horrendous defense by the Buckeyes.

[Boston Red]

That offensive pass interference call on UC when the Ohio State DB was beat and just grabbed the receiver was a killer. OSU was obviously going to keep scoring, and that play killed the drive that would have given UC a chance to draw even. OSU was clearly the better team, but if they call that play correctly the game could have stayed VERY interesting right down to the wire.

[paintmered]

Agreed. UC wasn't going to overcome its defensive schemes (just unacceptable to give up 700 yards to anyone). But for the second time in two B1G away games, the B1G refs made some very significant calls that shouldn't have gone against the Bearcats. Both times, it killed all of UC's momentum at best and took points off the board at worst.

Never again should we agree to play with B1G refs away from Nippert.

[dougdirt]

This defense is so bad it hurts. I went to the Miami game and just watching them in person you could see just how slow they were. When you combine that with their inability to tackle and the size.... it's bad. Real bad.

The offense looks good for the most part. The receivers have plenty of speed, Kiel is a true high caliber quarterback and he seems to make good decisions so far.

[Red Buckeye]

Agreed. UC wasn't going to overcome its defensive schemes (just unacceptable to give up 700 yards to anyone). But for the second time in two B1G away games, the B1G refs made some very significant calls that shouldn't have gone against the Bearcats. Both times, it killed all of UC's momentum at best and took points off the board at worst.

Never again should we agree to play with B1G refs away from Nippert.


It wasn't the refs fault UC lost. They are inferior to Ohio State, plain and simple. UC fans need to accept that their team will always be second fiddle in Ohio to the beloved Buckeyes-Ohio's Team. Gunner Kiel looked good though. I do wonder why he opted to play for a team that will never be in the College Playoffs though with all that talent. Seems like a waste to me.

[paintmered]

It wasn't the refs fault UC lost. They are inferior to Ohio State, plain and simple. UC fans need to accept that their team will always be second fiddle in Ohio to the beloved Buckeyes-Ohio's Team. Gunner Kiel looked good though. I do wonder why he opted to play for a team that will never be in the College Playoffs though with all that talent. Seems like a waste to me.

Every response I have for this will get me banned. Instead I will simply say, good game and good day.

[RedTeamGo!]

Ya'll lost by 22, gave up 45 1st downs, and 710 yards. You didn't lose because of the refs.

[Boston Red]

It wasn't the refs fault UC lost. They are inferior to Ohio State, plain and simple. UC fans need to accept that their team will always be second fiddle in Ohio to the beloved Buckeyes-Ohio's Team. Gunner Kiel looked good though. I do wonder why he opted to play for a team that will never be in the College Playoffs though with all that talent. Seems like a waste to me.
Yikes. Brutal post. You should probably go play in traffic.

[paintmered]

Where did I suggest that UC was superior or that its defense was going to be good enough? That is independent of the trend that UC gets homered at B1G stadiums. The conference even issued a formal apology for the joke that was the trip to Champaign last year. And it happened again last night.

My criticism of B1G corruption should not be confused with UC should have won the game or was the better team. To beat your chest otherwise only reinforces your ugliness as a fan base.

[wolfboy]

It wasn't the refs fault UC lost. They are inferior to Ohio State, plain and simple. UC fans need to accept that their team will always be second fiddle in Ohio to the beloved Buckeyes-Ohio's Team. Gunner Kiel looked good though. I do wonder why he opted to play for a team that will never be in the College Playoffs though with all that talent. Seems like a waste to me.

Is this what this board has become?

[top6]

It wasn't the refs fault UC lost. They are inferior to Ohio State, plain and simple. UC fans need to accept that their team will always be second fiddle in Ohio to the beloved Buckeyes-Ohio's Team. Gunner Kiel looked good though. I do wonder why he opted to play for a team that will never be in the College Playoffs though with all that talent. Seems like a waste to me.

You make me embarrassed to be an Ohio State fan. Of course that's true about most Ohio State fans.

[Roy Tucker]

The pros must be drooling over Gunner Kiel. He is the real deal. I wonder how long he'll play for UC?

Seems I read something lately where Tuberville asked his defensive coaches if they needed to move some offensive guys over. After watching OSU repeatedly gash the UC defense, it may not be a bad idea. They've got a lot of offense.

[LoganBuck]

Ohio State fans need to stay off the Bearcats thread. You are not promoting the civil troll free environment that is complained about on the Ohio State threads. The Bearcats came out of last night, knowing they have work to do, so did Ohio State.

[wolfboy]

Ya'll lost by 22, gave up 45 1st downs, and 710 yards. You didn't lose because of the refs.

And even with those tremendous gifts, UC was in it for most of the game. We aren't the only ones that need a lot of work.

[paintmered]

Seems I read something lately where Tuberville asked his defensive coaches if they needed to move some offensive guys over. After watching OSU repeatedly gash the UC defense, it may not be a bad idea. They've got a lot of offense.

Actually, they may have to move some of the defensive guys over to offense. The majority of starters on the offensive line coming out of camp are now out with season-ending injuries. They only dressed six O-lineman yesterday, which means none of them got a breather (insert time of possession joke here) after their tackle blew out his ACL.

[RedTeamGo!]

And even with those tremendous gifts, UC was in it for most of the game. We aren't the only ones that need a lot of work.

I agree, Osu has a lot of work to do.

[RedTeamGo!]

Where did I suggest that UC was superior or that its defense was going to be good enough? That is independent of the trend that UC gets homered at B1G stadiums. The conference even issued a formal apology for the joke that was the trip to Champaign last year. And it happened again last night.

My criticism of B1G corruption should not be confused with UC should have won the game or was the better team. To beat your chest otherwise only reinforces your ugliness as a fan base.

I heard the offensive PI on the radio, so I didn't actually see it, the Osu announcing team said it was offensive PI before the ref announced it though fwiw (very little). I saw most of the game on tv and did not think it was a poorly officiated game. I think that's a cop out, honestly.

I am confused as to why cinci fans are shocked Osu fans are talking a little smack (I am not including myself) - I have seen a lot of cinci fans on facebook post the following image the last couple of years and say they have taken over as the best squad in Ohio:

7961

Also, when Braxton Miller went down with his season ending injury a Bearcats fan on redszone celebrated the injury shamelessly. I am sure that rubbed some Osu fans the wrong way.

[Boston Red]

I heard the offensive PI on the radio, so I didn't actually see it, the Osu announcing team said it was offensive PI before the ref announced it though fwiw (very little).

I thought it was offensive PI until I saw the replay. Basically, it would have been a tie game but for the OSU DB's jersey grab, and the UC player got called for pushing the OSU's player's hand away. It was a terrible call. Otherwise, I thought the officiating was fine. The TD called back was debatable, but it wasn't a BAD call. Just could have gone either way.

Again, OSU was clearly superior, but if they just avoid making that call on Cincinnati (not even asking for the defensive holding), it would have prevented unfairly derailing a key UC drive and would have made the outcome much more interesting.

[wolfboy]

I heard the offensive PI on the radio, so I didn't actually see it, the Osu announcing team said it was offensive PI before the ref announced it though fwiw (very little). I saw most of the game on tv and did not think it was a poorly officiated game. I think that's a cop out, honestly.

I am confused as to why cinci fans are shocked Osu fans are talking a little smack (I am not including myself) - I have seen a lot of cinci fans on facebook post the following image the last couple of years and say they have taken over as the best squad in Ohio:

7961

Also, when Braxton Miller went down with his season ending injury a Bearcats fan on redszone celebrated the injury shamelessly. I am sure that rubbed some Osu fans the wrong way.

I am confused why you, presumably a grown adult, would use someone's juvenile behavior to justify more juvenile behavior. But I guess we were just raised differently.

[RedTeamGo!]

I am confused why you, presumably a grown adult, would use someone's juvenile behavior to justify more juvenile behavior. But I guess we were just raised differently.

I have not done anything juvenile. But, yes, it is very mature to question how someone was raised and their age over a disagreement about a football game.

[Brutus]

I didn't agree with the tone of his post, nor the overall message.

However, he's right about one thing... lose by 22 points and surrender 50 and 710 yards, you lose the right to in any way, shape or form complain about refs. If one bad call is the reason the game got away, then simply the team isn't good enough.

[wolfboy]

I didn't agree with the tone of his post, nor the overall message.

However, he's right about one thing... lose by 22 points and surrender 50 and 710 yards, you lose the right to in any way, shape or form complain about refs. If one bad call is the reason the game got away, then simply the team isn't good enough.

That makes no sense whatsoever. Give up that much on defense, you lose the right to blame the refs. I agree with that. But it makes no sense at all to say it's out of line to complain about the refs. If the refs sucked, the refs sucked - doesn't matter how many yards the defense gave up. And whether folks are complaining about or blaming the refs, I really don't understand why Ohio State fans feel entitled to play forum police in a UC thread.

[Boston Red]

However, he's right about one thing... lose by 22 points and surrender 50 and 710 yards, you lose the right to in any way, shape or form complain about refs. If one bad call is the reason the game got away, then simply the team isn't good enough.

If Greg Oden fouls out of the 2007 NCAA championship game on a bad call in the midst of an Ohio State run when they're down 2, and Florida then immediately goes on a run and ultimately wins the game by 15 points, I'm pretty sure you'd be upset about that call and wonder whether the outcome might have been a bit different minus that key call even though Florida was clearly the superior team (pardon the run-on sentence). Same thing here.

[reds1869]

If Greg Oden fouls out of the 2007 NCAA championship game on a bad call in the midst of an Ohio State run when they're down 2, and Florida the immediate goes on a run and ultimately wins the game by 15 points, I'm pretty sure you'd be upset about that call and wonder whether the outcome might have been a bit different minus that key call even though Florida was clearly the superior team (pardon the run-on sentence). Same thing here.

Kind of like if Oden isn't whistled for what should have been a flagrant foul and OSU goes on to beat Xavier. But I digress. :) I agree with your point.

[dougdirt]

I heard the offensive PI on the radio, so I didn't actually see it, the Osu announcing team said it was offensive PI before the ref announced it though fwiw (very little). I saw most of the game on tv and did not think it was a poorly officiated game. I think that's a cop out, honestly.

I am confused as to why cinci fans are shocked Osu fans are talking a little smack (I am not including myself) - I have seen a lot of cinci fans on facebook post the following image the last couple of years and say they have taken over as the best squad in Ohio:

7961

Also, when Braxton Miller went down with his season ending injury a Bearcats fan on redszone celebrated the injury shamelessly. I am sure that rubbed some Osu fans the wrong way.

And when that image came out Cincinnati was a vastly better squad than they are this year. The only place they weren't better was the quarterback position. They had better receivers and a better backfield. The defense wasn't good, but it certainly wasn't this years squad with no size or speed to speak of. They had a few playmakers on those teams on the defensive side of the ball.

I can promise you that I never once celebrated Braxton Miller, or anyone getting hurt (in a sporting event).

[Boston Red]

Kind of like if Oden isn't whistled for what should have been a flagrant foul and OSU goes on to beat Xavier. But I digress. :) I agree with your point.

Well, the analogy doesn't quite hold there, because in that game the clearly superior team ended up losing the game. :p

[wolfboy]

Kind of like if Oden isn't whistled for what should have been a flagrant foul and OSU goes on to beat Xavier. But I digress. :) I agree with your point.

Xavier fans and OSU fans running the conversation in a UC thread. Oy vey.

[Boston Red]

Xavier fans and OSU fans running the conversation in a UC thread. Oy vey.

This is REDSzone with about 4 active topics on this particular board. If you want a conversation that only includes UC fans, you should probably go to a UC board.

[wolfboy]

This is REDSzone with about 4 active topics on this particular board. If you want a conversation that only includes UC fans, you should probably go to a UC board.

It was a joke jefe. Cool your jets.

[Brutus]

If Greg Oden fouls out of the 2007 NCAA championship game on a bad call in the midst of an Ohio State run when they're down 2, and Florida then immediately goes on a run and ultimately wins the game by 15 points, I'm pretty sure you'd be upset about that call and wonder whether the outcome might have been a bit different minus that key call even though Florida was clearly the superior team (pardon the run-on sentence). Same thing here.

Well that's a slightly different situation because you're referring to the difference of a single call versus a call that relegated a team's best player to the bench for the rest of the game. And I'd probably go on a tangent about that because I dislike basketball officiating as a whole because the game is open to subjective officiating (not the officials' fault entirely) for the reason you just mentioned... such calls can drastically impact a team's ability to compete.

The situation here is not really anything like what you described. We're talking about one call in a 60 minute football game with no players coming off the field. Brush it off, strap 'em up and go play football. If you can't recover from one penalty, you simply aren't good enough.

[Brutus]

That makes no sense whatsoever. Give up that much on defense, you lose the right to blame the refs. I agree with that. But it makes no sense at all to say it's out of line to complain about the refs. If the refs sucked, the refs sucked - doesn't matter how many yards the defense gave up. And whether folks are complaining about or blaming the refs, I really don't understand why Ohio State fans feel entitled to play forum police in a UC thread.

Ohio State fans have just as much as a right to chime in on the game as Cincinnati fans do they not?

But in general, fans complain way too much about officiating. That's not a Cincinnati thing. It just applied here because when you lose by 22 points, officiating should be the last thing mentioned as to causes.

[Boston Red]

Well that's a slightly different situation because you're referring to the difference of a single call versus a call that relegated a team's best player to the bench for the rest of the game. And I'd probably go on a tangent about that because I dislike basketball officiating as a whole because the game is open to subjective officiating (not the officials' fault entirely) for the reason you just mentioned... such calls can drastically impact a team's ability to compete.

The situation here is not really anything like what you described. We're talking about one call in a 60 minute football game with no players coming off the field. Brush it off, strap 'em up and go play football. If you can't recover from one penalty, you simply aren't good enough.

No, it's pretty similar. I mean, Oden would have had 4 other fouls. It's just one bad call. Don't foul four other times. Obviously that one bad call just means you're not good enough.

That call essentially doomed the most important drive of the game. All the momentum was on UC's side. Do they win the game without that call? Likely not, but with that call they basically had no chance. And make no mistake, it was a horrendous call.

[RedTeamGo!]

No, it's pretty similar. I mean, Oden would have had 4 other fouls. It's just one bad call. Don't foul four other times. Obviously that one bad call just means you're not good enough.

That call essentially doomed the most important drive of the game. All the momentum was on UC's side. Do they win the game without that call? Likely not, but with that call they basically had no chance. And make no mistake, it was a horrendous call.

Does anyone have footage of the "horrendous call?"

I cannot find it anywhere.

The play-by-play guys said it was the right call on the radio.

[wolfboy]

Ohio State fans have just as much as a right to chime in on the game as Cincinnati fans do they not?

Yes. They also apparently have the right to tell Cincinnati fans what they should and should not talk about.

[Boston Red]

The play-by-play guys said it was the right call on the radio.

The Ohio State play-by-play guy said that. The Big Ten Network announcers had a differing opinion.

[wolfboy]

Does anyone have footage of the "horrendous call?"

I cannot find it anywhere.

The play-by-play guys said it was the right call on the radio.

I couldn't find it either. This article has a pretty good summary of the play: http://www.cleveland.com/osu/index.ssf/2014/09/best_play_calls_by_buckeyes_ye.html FWIW, Thom Brennaman initially thought the call was correct as well, but quickly changed his tune when he saw the replay. I don't think it changes the result, but it was a really bad call.

[RedTeamGo!]

The Ohio State play-by-play guy said that. The Big Ten Network announcers had a differing opinion.

As I said previously, I was driving when the play occurred so that is my only frame of reference. I tried to find a clip of it online yesterday to no avail.

[Sea Ray]

I was listening to the game here in Cincinnati and they thought it was a terrible call

[RedFanAlways1966]

They both committed a penalty on the play. Problem was only one of those penalties was seen by the ref. And of course the penalty that was called was a reaction to the 1st penalty. Two wrongs do not make a right... do not push at the DB that is holding you. Easy for me to say of course.

There are penalties (yes, plural) on every stinking play in football. Maybe there is an actual penalty free play once out of every 150 plays. Most of the time someone is holding on a play. Or a WR/DB is grabbing/pushing when the rules say he should not be grabbing/pushing. Just the way it rolls. Most of the time it evens out of the course of a game. And on that one play... maybe the UC receiver does not catch the ball if he does not push off on the DB. Even if the ref throws a flag on the DB and they only get a 15-yd penalty. It should have been called defensive interference. But it does not give the WR a free pass to push the DB nor did it decide the game. Most of us would have pushed off to if the DB was holding us. No doubt about it.

[wolfboy]

They both committed a penalty on the play. Problem was only one of those penalties was seen by the ref. And of course the penalty that was called was a reaction to the 1st penalty. Two wrongs do not make a right... do not push at the DB that is holding you. Easy for me to say of course.

There are penalties (yes, plural) on every stinking play in football. Maybe there is an actual penalty free play once out of every 150 plays. Most of the time someone is holding on a play. Or a WR/DB is grabbing/pushing when the rules say he should not be grabbing/pushing. Just the way it rolls. Most of the time it evens out of the course of a game. And on that one play... maybe the UC receiver does not catch the ball if he does not push off on the DB. Even if the ref throws a flag on the DB and they only get a 15-yd penalty. It should have been called defensive interference. But it does not give the WR a free pass to push the DB nor did it decide the game. Most of us would have pushed off to if the DB was holding us. No doubt about it.

Wait, so you're saying that if the DB yanks his jersey and the receiver tries to push his arm off from its grip, that's offensive pass interference? I'm no official, but that sounds insane. I just can't even believe that we're debating whether it was a bad call. Every single newspaper I've read that covered the game thought it was a bad call, including Columbus newspapers.

[RedFanAlways1966]

Wait, so you're saying that if the DB yanks his jersey and the receiver tries to push his arm off from its grip, that's offensive pass interference? I'm no official, but that sounds insane. I just can't even believe that we're debating whether it was a bad call. Every single newspaper I've read that covered the game thought it was a bad call, including Columbus newspapers.

No debate. It was a MISSED CALL on the 1st penalty (the DB). The ref (who seemed to wake up lol) saw the receiver "push". We know, thanks to replay, that he "pushed" to get the DB off of him. Bad call, MISSED call. Yes sir. If you saw the play once the WR made his move to break free from pass interference, it can be seen as offensive pass interference. Even Thom saw it that way until he saw the replay. It was blown by the ref. No doubt. But you cannot deny that the WR technically committed a foul in his attempt to break free. He did and that is my point. I do not blame him and would have done the same. And the ref blew it. Yes, I am being technical. But let fact be fact that technically the WR committed a violation. Even though 999 times out of 1000 refs will call that defensive interference. And I agree with that call. They blew it. And of course if it had been OSU on offense and UC on defense and the whole thing happened the same... OSU fans would be screaming the same as you.

[wolfboy]

No debate. It was a MISSED CALL on the 1st penalty (the DB). The ref (who seemed to wake up lol) saw the receiver "push". We know, thanks to replay, that he "pushed" to get the DB off of him. Bad call, MISSED call. Yes sir. If you saw the play once the WR made his move to break free from pass interference, it can be seen as offensive pass interference. Even Thom saw it that way until he saw the replay. It was blown by the ref. No doubt. But you cannot deny that the WR technically committed a foul in his attempt to break free. He did and that is my point. I do not blame him and would have done the same. And the ref blew it. Yes, I am being technical. But let fact be fact that technically the WR committed a violation. Even though 999 times out of 1000 refs will call that defensive interference. And I agree with that call. They blew it. And of course if it had been OSU on offense and UC on defense and the whole thing happened the same... OSU fans would be screaming the same as you.

I'm sorry man, I just don't follow you here.

[RedFanAlways1966]

I'm sorry man, I just don't follow you here.

No prob, wolfboy. I thought (and I am not an expert or a ref) that the UC receiver actions to free himself from the obvious defensive penalty could be seen as a penalty. And there are lots of things that happen each play that could technically be a penalty. It can be such a subjective thing in football. I totally agree that the ref responsible for that part of the field totally blew it and should have flagged OSU and not UC. My point being that the UC player did something (in order to free himself from a DB that was in total violation of the rules) that could draw a flag. Total BS call from what I, you and most rationale thinkers saw in the replay. However, the WR did something that could be seen as a penalty. He only did it b/c he was the victim of an obvious penalty. Ticky-tacky, sure. And maybe what he did was not a penalty (that subjective thing again). Kind of like the guy that gets a personal foul b/c he reacts to a personal foul being done to him. Still no excuse for that ref to miss the DB's blatant interference.

[Boston Red]

Damn, what's happened to UC? They looked pretty darned good through the middle of the third quarter at OSU. They've been awful since then. It's hard to even fathom how awful that defense is.

[Stray]

awesome to see Munchie get a TD

[dougdirt]

awesome to see Munchie get a TD

Big time. Not so awesome to see Kiel go out though. Has anyone had as much bad luck with quarterback injuries as UC has over the last handful of years?

[Roy Tucker]

One thing that was dumb was not taking a knee the last 2-3 plays of the game. Instead, a backup running back Banschbach gets blown up and injured.

[Sea Ray]

Here we are just weeks away from signing day and scout.com has UC 84th in recruiting; only 13 mediocre recruits. How does Tommy T hang onto his job? With the way he's coached this team on the field, if his recruiting is that bad then why is he still here? No way UC can compete with recruiting classes like that

[wolfboy]

Here we are just weeks away from signing day and scout.com has UC 84th in recruiting; only 13 mediocre recruits. How does Tommy T hang onto his job? With the way he's coached this team on the field, if his recruiting is that bad then why is he still here? No way UC can compete with recruiting classes like that

He lost several very good recruits out of this class at the last minute including Jeremy Larkin to........Northwestern. No offense, but if programs like USF and UCF are keeping top recruits away from Florida, Florida State, and Miami and Houston is keeping big recruits at home away from the likes of the 50 Texas teams, then TT has no excuse for losing talent to Northwestern. Of course, an utter embarrassment of a season doesn't help either.

[Z-Fly]

He lost several very good recruits out of this class at the last minute including Jeremy Larkin to........Northwestern. No offense, but if programs like USF and UCF are keeping top recruits away from Florida, Florida State, and Miami and Houston is keeping big recruits at home away from the likes of the 50 Texas teams, then TT has no excuse for losing talent to Northwestern. Of course, an utter embarrassment of a season doesn't help either.

Does anyone know of a good forum for UC Football?

[Boston Red]

http://bearcatnews.com/forum/football

[paintmered]

Does anyone know of a good forum for UC Football?

Bearcat Banter (http://cincinnati.csnbbs.com)