Ohio State Football 2015 [Defending National Champions]

[bucksfan2]

I got yelled at by my wife for my reaction when I saw the news. When further news came out I just shook my head.

I am not going to castigate a young man for doing something that I have done. The difference between JT and most of my friends is that JT got caught. I am not proud of some of the things I did in college, but that is part of growing up. I was thinking about blowing just over the legal limit, and from my understanding it is anything over two beers an hour and you will blow over the legal limit. If I go out to eat and I am driving my family I have two drinks and that is it. My wife doesn't drink much so she tends to drive.

I had an old college roommate criticize JT which I thought was hypocritical knowing all the stupid stuff we did. How many OSU fans in that stadium are yelling at a 20 year old kid but would blow over .8 on their ride home? Guy made a mistake, if it were JT Jones no one would know, but since it is a face of OSU people are up in arms.

[traderumor]

What amazes me most about the reactions is "how could he be so stupid?" I fear for my life anytime I leave a sporting event, watching folks swilling down beers like they are water, knowing I am going to be on the road with them very soon.

Oh, he's the OSU QB, just won the starting job, how could he be so stupid? I don't know, ask the guy with a good job, nice house, nice family, pretty wife why he's looking at kiddie porn. I really will never understand why people think that someone who has a coveted position is smarter and more moral than what, a second string offensive tackle? Just not following the outrage. Oh yea, there goes our defense of the national championship, daggone it JT, that's what really matters.

[traderumor]

So, Meyer pulls his summer financial aid, still considering his captaincy. I think anything less than castration will be viewed as failure to discipline, from what I'm reading since this happened.

The reality is that it looks like Meyer is handling the situation using policy (one game suspension), financial consequences, and considering the team and his own desires for his remaining a captain.

Its all about the winning though...just you wait and see. Oh, Aaron Hernandez. Its all relevant here.

[bucksfan2]

So, Meyer pulls his summer financial aid, still considering his captaincy. I think anything less than castration will be viewed as failure to discipline, from what I'm reading since this happened.

The reality is that it looks like Meyer is handling the situation using policy (one game suspension), financial consequences, and considering the team and his own desires for his remaining a captain.

Its all about the winning though...just you wait and see. Oh, Aaron Hernandez. Its all relevant here.

I don't like this. Actually I hate it. Punish Barrett for what he did. While some may disagree, Barrett missing a game pales in consideration to telling his parents, teammates, and Urban what he did. At this point his name has been drug through the mud enough, comparisons to Aaron Hernandez? But taking away summer financial aid is a little cruel to me. While I believe that college football players are compensated pretty well, Barrett has brought a ton of money into that university to have his summer aid pulled for a misdemeanor offense.

[Sea Ray]

I don't like this. Actually I hate it. Punish Barrett for what he did. While some may disagree, Barrett missing a game pales in consideration to telling his parents, teammates, and Urban what he did. At this point his name has been drug through the mud enough, comparisons to Aaron Hernandez? But taking away summer financial aid is a little cruel to me. While I believe that college football players are compensated pretty well, Barrett has brought a ton of money into that university to have his summer aid pulled for a misdemeanor offense.

I think the financial punishment is the least significant of all and here's why: It's been reported that he can "earn it back"...I doubt Barrett will have to write any checks. After this blows over, you can be assured that Barrett will have quietly "earned it back". It's all for show. No money will change hands

[IslandRed]

So, Meyer pulls his summer financial aid, still considering his captaincy. I think anything less than castration will be viewed as failure to discipline, from what I'm reading since this happened.

The reality is that it looks like Meyer is handling the situation using policy (one game suspension), financial consequences, and considering the team and his own desires for his remaining a captain.

Its all about the winning though...just you wait and see. Oh, Aaron Hernandez. Its all relevant here.

Some of this is just timing. After Meyer's new book and subsequent interviews, many people contrasted his tough-talking stances with his actual track record. He kind of painted himself into a corner for the next thing to come along, and it just so happened to be Barrett. If anything, Meyer might have overdone it as a result -- considering the current atmosphere within the NCAA regarding pay-for-play, yanking a guy's financial aid while leaving him on the team looks an awful lot like a fine. Probably a separate discussion, though.

[gonelong]

I think the financial punishment is the least significant of all and here's why: It's been reported that he can "earn it back"...I doubt Barrett will have to write any checks. After this blows over, you can be assured that Barrett will have quietly "earned it back". It's all for show. No money will change hands

As I understand it he will have to attend counseling, etc. so depending on your view/cynicism of that, it appears he actually has to do some things. On the flip-side, it does no good to dangle the carrot that someone could earn it back and then not make it an achievable goal to do so. I believe in giving people a path towards redemption and hoping they take it. He screwed up and now he has to pay the price. Not the first kid and won't be the last.

At the end of the day it probably comes down to your view of his transgression (boys will be boys/DUI limits are more strict than useful/what a serious lapse in judgement/he was a danger to himself and other/oh my god he could have wiped out the whole city).

He seems to understand he made a mistake and is owning up to it.

GL

[Sea Ray]

As I understand it he will have to attend counseling, etc. so depending on your view/cynicism of that, it appears he actually has to do some things. On the flip-side, it does no good to dangle the carrot that someone could earn it back and then not make it an achievable goal to do so. I believe in giving people a path towards redemption and hoping they take it. He screwed up and now he has to pay the price. Not the first kid and won't be the last.

At the end of the day it probably comes down to your view of his transgression (boys will be boys/DUI limits are more strict than useful/what a serious lapse in judgement/he was a danger to himself and other/oh my god he could have wiped out the whole city).

He seems to understand he made a mistake and is owning up to it.

GL

My guess is that he was going to be forced to do those things anyway. If we are to draw a parallel to the NFL, guys don't generally have a path to erase a fine.

[RedTeamGo!]

My guess is that he was going to be forced to do those things anyway. If we are to draw a parallel to the NFL, guys don't generally have a path to erase a fine.

You also have no idea that he will not have to pay money out of pocket for the couple weeks of financial aid he is going to lose. You are completely making it up.

[Sea Ray]

You also have no idea that he will not have to pay money out of pocket for the couple weeks of financial aid he is going to lose. You are completely making it up.

I said "I doubt". Did that wording give you the impression that I had proof? It's just a guess on my part.

[MWM]

I readily admit I have a hard time being objective about drunk driving given personal experience with one of my close friends when I was younger (although, I have not read the stories about where JT's BAC was. I also realize it doesn't take all that much to get to the legal limit and I do recognize the difference between being barely at the limit and being well above it). So if he was impaired, or even buzzed, while he was behind the wheel, I still have a real hard time with a 1 game suspension and losing some financial aid. DUI is far too often blown off as "something everybody does", which is not at all true. It's a serious issue not taken nearly serious enough, IMO. Having seen first hand what can happen, I don't have any hesitation to judge it harshly, even if it's for someone who plays for my favorite team.

[BuckeyeRed27]

I said "I doubt". Did that wording give you the impression that I had proof? It's just a guess on my part.

Jack Mewhort and Jake Stoneburner had this punishment 2 years ago and I believe they actually did lose their summer aid. What they did happened in the summer, not during the season, but it has been something that Urban has used before.

[GAC]

As I understand it he will have to attend counseling, etc. so depending on your view/cynicism of that, it appears he actually has to do some things. On the flip-side, it does no good to dangle the carrot that someone could earn it back and then not make it an achievable goal to do so. I believe in giving people a path towards redemption and hoping they take it. He screwed up and now he has to pay the price. Not the first kid and won't be the last.

At the end of the day it probably comes down to your view of his transgression (boys will be boys/DUI limits are more strict than useful/what a serious lapse in judgement/he was a danger to himself and other/oh my god he could have wiped out the whole city).

He seems to understand he made a mistake and is owning up to it.

GL

This!

The kid screwed up.... and he's owning up to what he did. The coach did the right thing. He got punished (and I think the corrective action is appropriate). Move on.

[Chip R]

I wonder if some would be so forgiving if he wore maize and blue instead of scarlet and gray?

[RiverRat13]

I wonder if some would be so forgiving if he wore maize and blue instead of scarlet and gray?

http://www.elevenwarriors.com/ohio-state-football/2015/10/62460/one-game-is-the-right-call-in-light-of-jt-barretts-suspension-a-look-at-precedent-set-for

[traderumor]

I wonder if some would be so forgiving if he wore maize and blue instead of scarlet and gray?I don't think this is "forgiving," its agreeing that the consequences are fair.

[Chip R]

I don't think this is "forgiving," its agreeing that the consequences are fair.

Perhaps "forgiving" isn't the right word. As the article posted by RiverRat13 - and responses in this thread by non-Buckeye fans - people are outraged that their rival's football player got away with OWI with only a 1 game suspension.


This!

The kid screwed up.... and he's owning up to what he did. The coach did the right thing. He got punished (and I think the corrective action is appropriate). Move on.

This is what I'm saying: If a Michigan player got into this kind of trouble, this would not be the response. He would, at the least, be poked fun at and the outrage would increase from there. But since it was the team's starting QB on an undefeated team, well, boys will be boys, I suppose.

[villain612]

If I was Michigan, I'd be upset that JT would be in the lineup against us too. lol

[WMR]

I'm actually amazed that anyone is seriously contending what I said.

I mean, Urban's tactics won a national championship. The juice was clearly worth the squeeze. What fanbase wouldn't make that deal?

The complete disregard of ethics was clearly worth it.

tOSU fans that I can muster a sliver of respect for have no issue with admitting that it's completely win at all costs. I respect those folks.

[Redsfaithful]

lol ethics when you're talking about college football where the whole system is set up to exploit unpaid labor.

Honestly, give me a break.

[Brutus]

I readily admit I have a hard time being objective about drunk driving given personal experience with one of my close friends when I was younger (although, I have not read the stories about where JT's BAC was. I also realize it doesn't take all that much to get to the legal limit and I do recognize the difference between being barely at the limit and being well above it). So if he was impaired, or even buzzed, while he was behind the wheel, I still have a real hard time with a 1 game suspension and losing some financial aid. DUI is far too often blown off as "something everybody does", which is not at all true. It's a serious issue not taken nearly serious enough, IMO. Having seen first hand what can happen, I don't have any hesitation to judge it harshly, even if it's for someone who plays for my favorite team.

Personally, I don't see why we as a society feel the need to have athletes punished in addition to whatever the legal system dishes out. If a coach doesn't punish someone that makes a mistake that has nothing to do with football, I see it as his own prerogative. I figure if the person makes a serious mistake, it will be reflected with how it's treated in the legal system. As it turns out, it appears whatever he did will not wind up with any jail time. I have a hard time finding fault with a minimal or no suspension for something that wasn't serious enough for jail time.

Sometimes I feel like the holier-than-thou society (not you, just our culture in general) wants to dish out larger punishments for athletes than society itself actually dictates for their crimes. As soon as people are accused now, we rush to want them suspended and get upset if the coach/team/organization takes a wait and see approach for the actual trial. The legal system has innocent until proven guilty, but sports fans insist on guilty before there's any time to determine innocence.

I sort of feel like the only reason people ultimately care that other athletes are suspended is because it's easier for us to point a finger at rival programs. We all want to think that our coach/our program has more integrity. I don't personally lose any sleep if an athlete is suspended or not for some sort of mistake outside the law. I never have understood why people get so passionate about it. I certainly won't find myself rooting for guys like Greg Hardy, mind you, but I'm always perplexed why people have to be given the satisfaction of J.T. Barrett (or whomever) paying the price on the field for his mistake.

[Assembly Hall]

Personally, I don't see why we as a society feel the need to have athletes punished in addition to whatever the legal system dishes out. If a coach doesn't punish someone that makes a mistake that has nothing to do with football, I see it as his own prerogative. I figure if the person makes a serious mistake, it will be reflected with how it's treated in the legal system. As it turns out, it appears whatever he did will not wind up with any jail time. I have a hard time finding fault with a minimal or no suspension for something that wasn't serious enough for jail time.

Sometimes I feel like the holier-than-thou society (not you, just our culture in general) wants to dish out larger punishments for athletes than society itself actually dictates for their crimes. As soon as people are accused now, we rush to want them suspended and get upset if the coach/team/organization takes a wait and see approach for the actual trial. The legal system has innocent until proven guilty, but sports fans insist on guilty before there's any time to determine innocence.

I sort of feel like the only reason people ultimately care that other athletes are suspended is because it's easier for us to point a finger at rival programs. We all want to think that our coach/our program has more integrity. I don't personally lose any sleep if an athlete is suspended or not for some sort of mistake outside the law. I never have understood why people get so passionate about it. I certainly won't find myself rooting for guys like Greg Hardy, mind you, but I'm always perplexed why people have to be given the satisfaction of J.T. Barrett (or whomever) paying the price on the field for his mistake.

Pretty good post there. But let me point out how the pro franchises deal with "off the field" issues. When it comes to sports, everyone involved is in the public eye and the "employer" feels the heat of what public sentiment is.

[RedTeamGo!]

I'm actually amazed that anyone is seriously contending what I said.

I mean, Urban's tactics won a national championship. The juice was clearly worth the squeeze. What fanbase wouldn't make that deal?

The complete disregard of ethics was clearly worth it.

tOSU fans that I can muster a sliver of respect for have no issue with admitting that it's completely win at all costs. I respect those folks.

You are amazed that people questioned your comparison of Aaron Hernandez and JT Barrett?

You must be amazed by a lot of things.

[Chip R]

Personally, I don't see why we as a society feel the need to have athletes punished in addition to whatever the legal system dishes out. If a coach doesn't punish someone that makes a mistake that has nothing to do with football, I see it as his own prerogative. I figure if the person makes a serious mistake, it will be reflected with how it's treated in the legal system. As it turns out, it appears whatever he did will not wind up with any jail time. I have a hard time finding fault with a minimal or no suspension for something that wasn't serious enough for jail time.


That's an interesting viewpoint. Of course it's done for public relations. People see that playing extra-curricular sports is a privilege and not a right. Also, over the years, athletes have - and still do - committed crimes that were covered up. If they weren't covered up, the player got off scot-free because he was an athlete. So when an athlete does something illegal, people believe that the program has to levy punishment on its own because the courts may not. Even if the courts do manage to convict people may feel additional punishment is necessary because of the privilege thing. Coaches may also want to impose the additional punishment in order to instill a lesson in discipline to the player and his teammates. Young men at that age often feel invincible. Sometimes, above the law. Internal discipline can bring about a change in attitude. At the very least it shows the other players that if they screw up, the courts may be the least of their problems.

[villain612]

While they are all wrong and deserve punishment, not all OVI charges are of equal weight to me.

If Barrett had blown a .21 and had been recklessly operating a vehicle, swerving, and driving 90mph, I would be more outraged and support a more intense punishment.

[Chip R]

While they are all wrong and deserve punishment, not all OVI charges are of equal weight to me.

If Barrett had blown a .21 and had been recklessly operating a vehicle, swerving, and driving 90mph, I would be more outraged and support a more intense punishment.

If he had blown a .21 and been conscious I would have been amazed.

[Assembly Hall]

If he had blown a .21 and been conscious I would have been amazed.

I blew a .37 once, and was in the hospital!!!!!!!!! Damn Notre Dame/Michigan game!!!!!!!!

[villain612]

If he had blown a .21 and been conscious I would have been amazed.

Haha, fair point.

I blew a .27 once (not behind the wheel of a vehicle at all that night).

I was in a hospital though and barely conscious.

[RedTeamGo!]

I blew a .15 at a police station in Germany once, I had also smoked some funny things I picked up in Amsterdam. Good times. Good times.

[Assembly Hall]

Haha, fair point.

I blew a .27 once (not behind the wheel of a vehicle at all that night).

I was in a hospital though and barely conscious.

Pace yourself man!!!!!!! Pace yourself!!!!!!! Enjoy the ride!!!!!!!

[Assembly Hall]

I blew a .15 at a police station in Germany once, I had also smoked some funny things I picked up in Amsterdam. Good times. Good times.

Was the gestapo on hand? LOL

[villain612]

Pace yourself man!!!!!!! Pace yourself!!!!!!! Enjoy the ride!!!!!!!

I was 17 at the time too. Oye. Quite a story.

[Assembly Hall]

I was 17 at the time too. Oye. Quite a story.

LOL.......behave yourself!!!!!!!

[villain612]

On more team related issues, Nick Bosa tore his ACL and 5-star RB Kareem Walker decommited.

Lousy week for Buckeye fans.

[RedTeamGo!]

On more team related issues, Nick Bosa tore his ACL and 5-star RB Kareem Walker decommited.

Lousy week for Buckeye fans.

Bosa will be 100% by summer camp. I am not too concerned about Walker decommiting. The Buckeyes stole 4-star RB Antonio Williams away from Wisconsin a few weeks before Walker announced he is re-opening his recruitment. Hopefully he lands at Alabama instead of Michigan, though. I don't really want to hear scUM fans act like they won a championship by stealing a running back recruit away from OSU.

[Brutus]

That's an interesting viewpoint. Of course it's done for public relations. People see that playing extra-curricular sports is a privilege and not a right. Also, over the years, athletes have - and still do - committed crimes that were covered up. If they weren't covered up, the player got off scot-free because he was an athlete. So when an athlete does something illegal, people believe that the program has to levy punishment on its own because the courts may not. Even if the courts do manage to convict people may feel additional punishment is necessary because of the privilege thing. Coaches may also want to impose the additional punishment in order to instill a lesson in discipline to the player and his teammates. Young men at that age often feel invincible. Sometimes, above the law. Internal discipline can bring about a change in attitude. At the very least it shows the other players that if they screw up, the courts may be the least of their problems.

Oh, I definitely get it from an employer/institution standpoint. As AH mentioned, because of the way society treats these incidents, an employer is crazy not to react quickly. It's unfortunately the nature of the beast. But that's the part I don't get... why society itself is so passionate about it. I really think a lot has to do with subconscious feelings about sports, but I can't prove it. I'm sure there's psychology behind it, perhaps studies that have already been done, but it still amazes me nonetheless.

[Assembly Hall]

Oh, I definitely get it from an employer/institution standpoint. As AH mentioned, because of the way society treats these incidents, an employer is crazy not to react quickly. It's unfortunately the nature of the beast. But that's the part I don't get... why society itself is so passionate about it. I really think a lot has to do with subconscious feelings about sports, but I can't prove it. I'm sure there's psychology behind it, perhaps studies that have already been done, but it still amazes me nonetheless.

I dont know either Brutus. Society outlawed drinking and brought it back. For what? Money. Cant legislate morality. Everybody drinks. Not everyone to excess, but yes everyone. Barrett did nothing that most of us on here havent done. He just got caught.

[GAC]

Personally, I don't see why we as a society feel the need to have athletes punished in addition to whatever the legal system dishes out. If a coach doesn't punish someone that makes a mistake that has nothing to do with football, I see it as his own prerogative. I figure if the person makes a serious mistake, it will be reflected with how it's treated in the legal system. As it turns out, it appears whatever he did will not wind up with any jail time. I have a hard time finding fault with a minimal or no suspension for something that wasn't serious enough for jail time.

I understand your position; but let me throw this out there because it's kind of a "two-edged sword" (IMO) when it comes to a "celebrity" or high profile person (whether a collegiate or professional athlete) vs the general public.

If one of us "average joes" goes out on a Friday night and gets a OVI it's not a big deal on a "sensational" level because we're not high profile, in the "limelight", nor seen as being representative of anything, or a role model to others (other then family members, your kids). As it was once stated - "with great power comes great responsibility". In the case of a collegiate or professional athlete, you're not only seen as being representative of that respective institution, you're also looked up to, ADMIRED, a role model to many (especially youth). Yeah, you're basically being put on a pedestal by the public (fans); but I also don't see too many of those athletes complaining about that, nor the positive attention they receive. They relish in that status, and any "perks" that go with it. So it goes with the territory as far as I'm concerned.

So in that sense, I have no problem with the school/team taking some disciplinary action against the him. To do nothing wouldn't look good on the school, the coaching staff... and what kind of message does it send to the other players on the team?

Now when it comes to "screwing up" (OVI)...

Us "average joes", when it comes to the legal system, and standing before that judge, are going to bear the full blunt of any punitive action that the law dictates. There's no chance in hell you're going to possibly get any favoritism or preferential treatment, because you're a nobody. Oh sure, if you have the money you can hire a lawyer and MAYBE get it pleaded down - but anyone on here that's ever gotten a DUI knows what I'm talking about. They're going to nail you (and rightly so).

Has that always happened when it comes to a "high profile" person/person of stature, and especially an athlete? Nope. And many of us, when we've seen it occur will say it sure doesn't seem fair or right just because they have name recognition/status.

Some seem to downplay this and say it was only a "misdemeanor"" (which I understand, in the legal sense, that's what he was charged with). I don't care what he blew, he still failed the breathalyzer and got charged with OVI right?

The state of Ohio stipulates .... http://duiwise.com/drunk-driving-laws/ohio-ovi-dui-laws/


A first OVI conviction may result in a sentence of three days up to six months, a three-day driver intervention program, license suspension between six months to three years, a reinstatement fee of $450 and a fine between $250 and $1,000.

Everything is pretty much up to a Judge's discretion, and what kind of Judge you're standing before. I know numerous people (friends, co-workers, family members) who, over the last several years, got a first time OVI here in Ohio. Every single one of them lost their license for 6 months, had to attend a program/class, license suspended for 6 months, had to pay the $450 reinstatement fee, and spent three days in jail. In fact, I don't know of anyone around here, when charged, didn't get that. It's pretty standard. And I have no problem with that because I think we all take OVI seriously.

Now in Ohio though there is this aspect of the law.....


It may be possible to plead guilty to a “wet reckless” charge, otherwise known as reckless driving involving alcohol. This is generally the result of a plea agreement. A plea bargain might be arranged when the individual’s BAC is borderline, there has not been an accident and the defendant has no prior OVI convictions. However, if there is a subsequent OVI conviction, the earlier wet reckless will likely be considered a prior OVI conviction. This might increase the penalties for the newer conviction. An individual who is considering a plea bargain for a lesser charge will require the assistance of a lawyer to make arrangements for the plea deal.

It will just be interesting to see, when going before a Franklin Co. Judge - in the heart of Buckeye "country", and the fact it's OSU's starting QB - what he ends up with via the legal system. I betcha the ruling won't be the same if it was any of us "average joes" though.

Will the Judge ask for his autograph afterwards? LOL

[The Operator]

In what world was that not a fumble?

[RedTeamGo!]

I just honestly don't understand how anyone can think Cardale is better than JT.

[The Operator]

I just honestly don't understand how anyone can think Cardale is better than JT.They sputter like an old Ford Pinto with Cardale.

[villain612]

Hurry back JT.

Silver bullets looking good though.

[RedTeamGo!]

@11W: That's 22-straight wins for Urban Meyer, 29-straight in conference, as he becomes the first coach to win 47 of his first 50 at a school.

[Roy Tucker]

Barrett is a point guard. Cardale is a power forward.

[traderumor]

The biggest issue I see is that the coaching staff seem to have made the wrong call on running two distince offenses with Cardale vs. JT. They did not do that in the playoff run, they plugged and played, perhaps adjusting a few plays, but they were still running the stuff they had run all year. Then this season, they install two distinct offenses. Last night, Cardale did very well running and throwing on the run. The play calling was atrocious, no fault of his. Simply, they need to run their stuff. Oh, and please scrap the Braxton direct snaps. Everyone, including those who do not know much football, know what they are running there. It's ridiculous that six and seven figure coaches do such painfully obvious stupid things repeatedly. The whole Braxton direct snap play is one of them.

[BillDoran]

The biggest issue I see is that the coaching staff seem to have made the wrong call on running two distince offenses with Cardale vs. JT. They did not do that in the playoff run, they plugged and played, perhaps adjusting a few plays, but they were still running the stuff they had run all year. Then this season, they install two distinct offenses. Last night, Cardale did very well running and throwing on the run. The play calling was atrocious, no fault of his. Simply, they need to run their stuff. Oh, and please scrap the Braxton direct snaps. Everyone, including those who do not know much football, know what they are running there. It's ridiculous that six and seven figure coaches do such painfully obvious stupid things repeatedly. The whole Braxton direct snap play is one of them.

Do you honestly feel like you have enough knowledge to refer to the playcalling and player utilization as "atrocious," "ridiculous" and "painfully obvious?"

In having read some of the deeper analysis of strategy online (Smart Football, or even Kyle Jones at Eleven Warriors), it's pretty clear to me that the coaches are playing chess and the rest of us checkers. There are tiers of football knowledge and when you start talking about the interplay between offensive and defensive strategy (line slants, zone vs. power blocking, personnel packages, etc.), it can be much more complicated than what is immediately evident.

I presume your response will be along one of two lines: 1) You do understand what the coaches are doing, or 2) Are we supposed to sit on our hands when we notice something? To either I'd suggest perhaps a bit less indignance and a little more respect for the complexity.

If they are going to a different offensive scheme with Cardale in, it's because they - who spend their livelihoods studying these things - believe it gives them a better chance to win.

[traderumor]

Do you honestly feel like you have enough knowledge to refer to the playcalling and player utilization as "atrocious," "ridiculous" and "painfully obvious?"

In having read some of the deeper analysis of strategy online (Smart Football, or even Kyle Jones at Eleven Warriors), it's pretty clear to me that the coaches are playing chess and the rest of us checkers. There are tiers of football knowledge and when you start talking about the interplay between offensive and defensive strategy (line slants, zone vs. power blocking, personnel packages, etc.), it can be much more complicated than what is immediately evident.

I presume your response will be along one of two lines: 1) You do understand what the coaches are doing, or 2) Are we supposed to sit on our hands when we notice something? To either I'd suggest perhaps a bit less indignance and a little more respect for the complexity.

If they are going to a different offensive scheme with Cardale in, it's because they - who spend their livelihoods studying these things - believe it gives them a better chance to win.

Yea, I've said these things before in defense of GMs and other management for the Reds, or maybe the Bengals, but have come to realize that sometimes the "experts" have blind spots also, and also make big decisions (like having two offensive schemes) that are not the best. So appealing to "they are doing this for a living," I've blasted others in the way you just blasted me.

The things I am pointing out seem to be at a basic level, but, ok, I'll play along. To what great chess move do we owe the direct snaps to Braxton that are easily defended by good defenses, bad defenses and everything in between? Is this the genious notion of "getting him touches" so that he will then run down the middle of the field later and be willing to bang his head hard on the turf after a long ball? Why did, when I noted the basic thing that "they need to do some QB runs and move him out of the pocket" do they make that very adjustment in the second half, with good results? I do get my thumb out of my butt every once in awhile, or maybe its just blind squirrel phenomenon, I don't know, there, boss.

BTW, attempting to knock me down with "I've read on the internet and these guys are really, really smart" is ironic. I'll see if you can figure out why.

[BillDoran]

Yea, I've said these things before in defense of GMs and other management for the Reds, or maybe the Bengals, but have come to realize that sometimes the "experts" have blind spots also, and also make big decisions (like having two offensive schemes) that are not the best. So appealing to "they are doing this for a living," I've blasted others in the way you just blasted me.

The things I am pointing out seem to be at a basic level, but, ok, I'll play along. To what great chess move do we owe the direct snaps to Braxton that are easily defended by good defenses, bad defenses and everything in between? Is this the genious notion of "getting him touches" so that he will then run down the middle of the field later and be willing to bang his head hard on the turf after a long ball? Why did, when I noted the basic thing that "they need to do some QB runs and move him out of the pocket" do they make that very adjustment in the second half, with good results? I do get my thumb out of my butt every once in awhile, or maybe its just blind squirrel phenomenon, I don't know, there, boss.

BTW, attempting to knock me down with "I've read on the internet and these guys are really, really smart" is ironic. I'll see if you can figure out why.


It's probably a personal issue, and thus not relevant to the board, but it's just really abrasive when people come on with the "Coach is so dumb talk." It's one thing to say, "I don't get what they're doing because of X." It's another to suggest things are "ridiculous" and "painfully obvious."

I do think either Braxton's arm is effed up to where he can't throw the ball at all, or they're going to holding onto a package where he comes out slinging it like 1984 Dan Marino. I also think there were promises made about number of touches when he agreed to switch (same as I think Cardale may have received certain promises), but, here's the thing, I don't actually know. One further, I don't pretend I do.

Regarding your accuracy, I suspect deep-down you do know which of the two it is, but nonetheless will continue to grace us with your awesome football insights.

Speaking of irony, "genious" is most often spelled "genius."

That said, I think we're on the same page. Another largely uninspiring victory. I suspect if the offense doesn't return to Rutgers and Penn State levels with the return of J.T., we may be in trouble against Sparty and ttun. And for a defense that's 14th in the country in yards allowed and 6th in scoring, they certainly don't look consistently dominant.

[traderumor]

It's probably a personal issue, and thus not relevant to the board, but it's just really abrasive when people come on with the "Coach is so dumb talk." It's one thing to say, "I don't get what they're doing because of X." It's another to suggest things are "ridiculous" and "painfully obvious."

I do think either Braxton's arm is effed up to where he can't throw the ball at all, or they're going to holding onto a package where he comes out slinging it like 1984 Dan Marino. I also think there were promises made about number of touches when he agreed to switch (same as I think Cardale may have received certain promises), but, here's the thing, I don't actually know. One further, I don't pretend I do.

Regarding your accuracy, I suspect deep-down you do know which of the two it is, but nonetheless will continue to grace us with your awesome football insights.

Speaking of irony, "genious" is most often spelled "genius."

That said, I think we're on the same page. Another largely uninspiring victory. I suspect if the offense doesn't return to Rutgers and Penn State levels with the return of J.T., we may be in trouble against Sparty and ttun. And for a defense that's 14th in the country in yards allowed and 6th in scoring, they certainly don't look consistently dominant.As is it equally abrasive when someone appeals to athletic coaches and management as having a knowledge that is inaccessible to the common man. They are not doing the X's and O's in Latin to keep us poor peasants dumb so we can imagine they are so much above us in their knowledge of their craft.

As for grading my spelling, have you ever heard of a typo. Yes, it is a personal thing, and I didn't appreciate it at all. Its a message board, I didn't walk into the coach's meeting and start spouting off my vast knowledge. Not that I wouldn't love to hear the coach talk on some of my questions.

[dougdirt]

I just honestly don't understand how anyone can think Cardale is better than JT.

Because one guy is a quarterback and the other guy is a running back who can throw the ball a little bit.

With that said, JT, as the Buckeyes are currently constructed, may be the better option.

[jojo]

Buckeye fans sanctimoniously sniping at one another over typos...this is already far more entertaining and interesting than the buckeye's extended preseason has been thus far.

http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/drink/popcorn-and-drink-smiley-emoticon.gif (http://www.sherv.net/)

[RedTeamGo!]

Buckeye fans sanctimoniously sniping at one another over typos...this is already far more entertaining and interesting than the buckeye's extended preseason has been thus far.

http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/drink/popcorn-and-drink-smiley-emoticon.gif (http://www.sherv.net/)

Auburn is 5-4 and nearly lost to something called Jacksonville St :laugh::laugh::laugh:

[RedTeamGo!]

the other guy is a running back who can throw the ball a little bit.

This is such a ridiculous statement I'm not even going to attempt to argue with you.

[BillDoran]

Buckeye fans sanctimoniously sniping at one another over typos...this is already far more entertaining and interesting than the buckeye's extended preseason has been thus far.

http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/drink/popcorn-and-drink-smiley-emoticon.gif (http://www.sherv.net/)

Suppose you have to get your jollies somewhere, now that Gus's magic offense looks solved. Feel free to get on the bandwagon of the reigning national champion as we look to do it again. :thumbup:

It hasn't been a perfect season (well, except in the win column), but I think most Buckeye fans are enjoying the ride without having to fall back on hackneyed excuses about conferences and schedules (which looks like a straw man after last season's romp through the playoffs).

[jojo]

Auburn is 5-4 and nearly lost to something called Jacksonville St :laugh::laugh::laugh:

So? Do you actually have a relevant point?

[RedTeamGo!]

So? Do you actually have a relevant point?

Yes, I was responding to your post in which you were trolling buckeye fans in the OSU thread.

[jojo]

Suppose you have to get your jollies somewhere, now that Gus's magic offense looks solved. Feel free to get on the bandwagon of the reigning national champion as we look to do it again. :thumbup:

It hasn't been a perfect season (well, except in the win column), but I think most Buckeye fans are enjoying the ride without having to fall back on hackneyed excuses about conferences and schedules (which looks like a straw man after last season's romp through the playoffs).

Of course buckeye fan can't be bothered about conferences and schedules.

[jojo]

Yes, I was responding to your post in which you were trolling buckeye fans in the OSU thread.

Clearly you responded by trying to talk SEC football in an osu thread but again, so? Did you actually have a relevant point?

[BillDoran]

Of course buckeye fan can't be bothered about conferences and schedules.

Do you remember last year when these exact same arguments were levied? :party:

I'll hang up and listen.

[RedTeamGo!]

Clearly you responded by trying to talk SEC football in an osu thread but again, so? Did you actually have a relevant point?

You are trolling. You and your team are irrelevant. I will just wait for you to apologize while I enjoy the undefeated defending first ever legit national champion Ohio State Buckeyes.

[jojo]

You are trolling. You and your team are irrelevant. I will just wait for you to apologize while I enjoy the undefeated defending first ever legit national champion Ohio State Buckeyes.

It wasnt trolling to point out how poorly two posters were treating each other. If it was anything, it was an act of love. Now it is funny how defensive your posts have been and how you can't seem to talk about your buckeyes without making references to other conferences and disparaging remarks about others. That is a tell and a preseason the extends to turkey day is still yawn inducing.

[Roy Tucker]

Ah, it's that time of year again with a Big 10 vs. SEC sniping outbreak.

Frankly, the Buckeyes have been largely underwhelming against a middling schedule. But they have won, so I won't complain. Much. The MSU and UM games will make or break the season.

[jojo]

Ah, it's that time of year again with a Big 10 vs. SEC sniping outbreak.

Frankly, the Buckeyes have been largely underwhelming against a middling schedule. But they have won, so I won't complain. Much. The MSU and UM games will make or break the season.

The Big 10 vs SEC sniping is only coming from one direction. I find it completely inappropriate, especially in this thread. Frankly, for shame.

[RedTeamGo!]

The Big 10 vs SEC sniping is only coming from one direction. I find it completely inappropriate, especially in this thread. Frankly, for shame.

One direction? You came into the thread and made a sniping comment about Ohio state's "season long preseason."

You're a joke.

[jojo]

One direction? You came into the thread and made a sniping comment about Ohio state's "season long preseason."

You're a joke.

I made a legit point. And you, again with the direct personal attacks.

[Hillsdale87]

Because one guy is a quarterback and the other guy is a running back who can throw the ball a little bit.

With that said, JT, as the Buckeyes are currently constructed, may be the better option.

65% completion percentage and 34 TD passes last year. Barrett may not have the arm strength to be an NFL QB, but he'd be a legitimate college QB even without his legs. His ball placement and accuracy are great.

I still wish the Buckeyes could have made it work with Cardale. Those last 3 games last year were so fun.

[Revering4Blue]

Ohio State has tied a modern era record with 29 straight conference wins, based on the current conference landscape. Florida State did the same from 1992-95 in the ACC. The Buckeyes play at Illinois next week.

Urban Meyer is 47-3 in his first 50 games at Ohio State, also setting a modern era record. (There were some better 50-game starts more than 100 years ago).

http://www.coachingsearch.com/article?a=The-10-most-interesting-stats-from-college-footballs-Week-10

[GAC]

Do you remember last year when these exact same arguments were levied? :party:

I'll hang up and listen.

Yeah, he loves to troll (LOL).

He made this comment last year (which is Base Clogger's sig - LOL)


and buckeye fans only a week and a half away from another embarrassing loss they'll be forever unable to reconcile though one would think they should be well used to the modern buckeye brand.

Put him on Ignore folks. You'll be better off. ;)

[Assembly Hall]

Well, I see where the Bucks fell to #2 in the AP poll.

[jojo]

Yeah, he loves to troll (LOL).

He made this comment last year (which is Base Clogger's sig - LOL)

Put him on Ignore folks. You'll be better off. ;)

Or you could address that actual point and not default to personal attacks. The actual MO of many has been revealed.

[BillDoran]

Or you could address that actual point and not default to personal attacks. The actual MO of many has been revealed.

It's been addressed. You're willfully not listening.

Ohio State had a similar schedule last season, yet WON THE WHOLE DANG THING. :jump:

This makes your argument rather irrelevant, not that it'll stop you. But I suppose you have to find something to do with your season nowadays.

[traderumor]

Yeah, he loves to troll (LOL).

He made this comment last year (which is Base Clogger's sig - LOL)



Put him on Ignore folks. You'll be better off. ;)Its worked wonders for me!

[traderumor]

Apparently Buckeyes fans are supposed to just sit around in some sort of Happy Clappy group and high five that they won! Woo hoo!

[jojo]

It's been addressed. You're willfully not listening.

Ohio State had a similar schedule last season, yet WON THE WHOLE DANG THING. :jump:

This makes your argument rather irrelevant, not that it'll stop you. But I suppose you have to find something to do with your season nowadays.

And again, no it hasnt. So again, how is a preseason that extends into Turkey day more interesting than buckeye fans arguing about typos? It's not and hence the personal attacks directed at the messenger.

[BillDoran]

In hearing Cardale's post-game comments after Minnesota, it seems he's realized he'll likely serve at the remainder of his Buckeye career as the backup. A sobering conclusion (though not entirely completed) to one of the most interesting chapters and characters in Buckeye history. Not that it isn't already apparent, but I think the magnitude of what he accomplished in the run to the national championship will continue to grow with time. In many ways, such a likable guy, such an example of the growth and maturity you hope to see in college students that I think, like Hillsdale pointed out, we hoped it could have ended differently. No matter the ultimate end, I think #12 has secured a place in the lore of the storied program.

[gonelong]

The stadium is packed for home games, road games, and TV numbers are among the tops in the NCAA. Every Ohio State game is interesting. Every single one. All. Of. Them.

I consider tOSUs back-loaded schedule to be a severe handicap. Early losses can be overcome, late losses are killers. (Alabama's loss is against a 3 loss team at home, completely forgiven). I'd much rather not have to face MichSt and Mich@Mich in back-to-back weeks. tOSU will likely have to win 5 consecutive games against Top10-15 ranked teams to win the whole thing this year. That's a gauntlet of 5 games few will have to face this season. One loss in any of those games and the NC is out the window.

IMO Mich and OSU should have been put in separate divisions and be the B1G opener for both squads. Both would generally be ranked highly headed into each season so a win would propel one of them higher in the rankings with an early season "signature" win. They other would be able to recover if they lost and they could potentially meet again in the B1G championship game. Some will yell "tradition" ... tradition went out the window (correctly) when the B1G added 4 teams, split the league in half, and added a conference championship game (a decade too late). I hope we don't have to wait another decade until the B1G sees how the rankings game is played.

GL

[bucksfan2]

In hearing Cardale's post-game comments after Minnesota, it seems he's realized he'll likely serve at the remainder of his Buckeye career as the backup. A sobering conclusion (though not entirely completed) to one of the most interesting chapters and characters in Buckeye history. Not that it isn't already apparent, but I think the magnitude of what he accomplished in the run to the national championship will continue to grow with time. In many ways, such a likable guy, such an example of the growth and maturity you hope to see in college students that I think, like Hillsdale pointed out, we hoped it could have ended differently. No matter the ultimate end, I think #12 has secured a place in the lore of the storied program.

His legacy is secure in Columbus.

The game Sat night was pretty much a microcosm of Cardale's struggles this season. They had two empty trips in the RZ (a fumble and a missed FG) Cardale under threw a wide open Samuel causing a broken up pass. The game could have been 38-14 or even worse but the offense continues to shoot itself in the foot with Cardale at the helm. One thing I just don't understand is the reluctance to run the zone read with Cardale when it has been successful.

Tim Beck and Ed Wariner may have forgotten more about football than I know, but I think it is perfectly ok to call out their play calling. I still don't think they have gotten the hang of it this season. It took Herman some time to get the play calling clicking as well.

[Brutus]

It's been addressed. You're willfully not listening.

Ohio State had a similar schedule last season, yet WON THE WHOLE DANG THING. :jump:

This makes your argument rather irrelevant, not that it'll stop you. But I suppose you have to find something to do with your season nowadays.

It's amazing how many times one person attempts to hijack a thread with their trolling attempts, and then turns around and deflects it on others as if it's their fault.

You're right though, it's become a common theme to attack Ohio State. When people can't attack the quality, they have to revert back "but, but, schedule."

[jojo]

Wake up the rest of the country when the preseason ends.

[villain612]

Yes, we all know that Ohio State couldn't possibly hang in the SEC...

http://giant.gfycat.com/FoolhardyCircularKusimanse.gif

[BuckeyeRed27]

Wake up the rest of the country when the preseason ends.

You missed it, it happened the Wednesday before Labor Day weekend.
I wouldn't look at the results out of Auburn though...might want to keep sleeping.

[redrum]

Perhaps they should be lauded for scheduling so many trap games.

[traderumor]

It's amazing how many times one person attempts to hijack a thread with their trolling attempts, and then turns around and deflects it on others as if it's their fault.

You're right though, it's become a common theme to attack Ohio State. When people can't attack the quality, they have to revert back "but, but, schedule."

Its funny, the schedule talk has been pretty light until the playoff rankings came out. Now, from talking head to internet board poster, all this stumping for their candidate going on and everyone starts touting how their fav is worthy while those ahead of them "haven't played anyone."

[RedTeamGo!]

OSU haters grasping for straws and OSU fans have the best response ever: "Yeaahhhhh....OSU won the first ever legit national championship in history after beating the best the SEC had to offer and the best QB in the country, you have nothing."

[jojo]

You missed it, it happened the Wednesday before Labor Day weekend.
I wouldn't look at the results out of Auburn though...might want to keep sleeping.

For some teams....also, it's amazing how often buckeye fan makes reference to things related to the SEC.

[jojo]

OSU haters grasping for straws and OSU fans have the best response ever: "Yeaahhhhh....OSU won the first ever legit national championship in history after beating the best the SEC had to offer and the best QB in the country, you have nothing."

osu has won the only legit national championship in history? Lets pause for a moment and come back to reality. Last season simply was the first championship format in which a committee selected 4 scores instead of 2 to participate.

[RedTeamGo!]

For some teams....also, it's amazing how often buckeye fan makes reference to things related to the SEC.

He's not referencing the SEC, he's referencing your favorite team, Auburn, because they are absolute garbage this season.

[jojo]

He's not referencing the SEC, he's referencing your favorite team, Auburn, because they are absolute garbage this season.

And yet another SEC related reference. Somewhere another angel just get its wings.

[RedTeamGo!]

And yet another SEC related reference. Somewhere another angel just get its wings.

I forgot, you can't talk about a team in the sec without talking about the entire conference. It's the only conference where fans root for the conference in lieu of their team, like this guy:

10013

[cumberlandreds]

****** WARNING*** Stick to the topic. This is about Ohio State football not any other conference or team. Thank you, The management.

[Sea Ray]

OSU haters grasping for straws and OSU fans have the best response ever: "Yeaahhhhh....OSU won the first ever legit national championship in history after beating the best the SEC had to offer and the best QB in the country, you have nothing."

No question that OSU earned the national championship on the field in the playoffs last yr. It's also much easier to get to the playoffs and when issues like what happened to Barrett when their opponents are Minnesota and Illinois. If Alabama had been hit with OSU's problems they would have had to beat LSU with their #2 QB. And if they'd lost, they'd be w/o a prayer of making the playoffs.

Once again I want to make the following very, very clear: This scheduling problem is not the fault of OSU. It's the fault of the rest of their league. The league as a whole has let them down. Remember this when Iowa goes to the Rose Bowl and ends up getting annihilated by a team like Utah.

[BillDoran]

In addition to the successful season on the field, Ohio State is putting together incredible recruiting classes for 2016 and 2017.

The most immediate of the two classes recently took a hit (lost the top RB in the country), but still ranks second overall. Two difference-maker (both top 26, 247 cumulative) DEs, two top-5 TEs, a likely immediate playmaker at WR in the mold of Michael Thomas. For whatever reason, Urban & co. have had a hard time recruiting DTs in recent recruiting cycles. They haven't landed a big, big fish there yet (though they have a potential star committed) but are hunting whales, bringing in a who's who of DTs for visits in the coming weeks.

The 2017 class is the one that has a chance to be really special. Currently no. 1 in team rankings, they've got quite possibly the best Ohio OL recruit since Orlando Pace committed. A trio of high profile (all top 50) DBs have committed. They have a QB-RB duo out of Akron Hoban that will be integral pieces of the program. They're also thought to be the favorites for the best WR and safety in the country as well.

Reigning national champions, presently undefeated and recruiting at unprecedented levels. Future so bright :cool:

[RedTeamGo!]

No question that OSU earned the national championship on the field in the playoffs last yr. It's also much easier to get to the playoffs and when issues like what happened to Barrett when their opponents are Minnesota and Illinois. If Alabama had been hit with OSU's problems they would have had to beat LSU with their #2 QB. And if they'd lost, they'd be w/o a prayer of making the playoffs.

Once again I want to make the following very, very clear: This scheduling problem is not the fault of OSU. It's the fault of the rest of their league. The league as a whole has let them down. Remember this when Iowa goes to the Rose Bowl and ends up getting annihilated by a team like Utah.

I question Cardale more than anyone, but he's not your typical QB2, he is 11-0 as a starter, including stepping in and beating Wisconsin, Alabama, and Oregon.

[villain612]

When they scheduled Virginia Tech, they were a perennial Top 25 team. it's not OSU's fault they dropped off a cliff.

Over the next few years they have series' against Oklahoma, TCU, Oregon, etc. If you go back to the last decade, they also had early season matchups against the likes of Texas and USC. Ohio State has generally been pretty good about their non-conference schedule.

[BuckeyeRed27]

No question that OSU earned the national championship on the field in the playoffs last yr. It's also much easier to get to the playoffs and when issues like what happened to Barrett when their opponents are Minnesota and Illinois. If Alabama had been hit with OSU's problems they would have had to beat LSU with their #2 QB. And if they'd lost, they'd be w/o a prayer of making the playoffs.

Once again I want to make the following very, very clear: This scheduling problem is not the fault of OSU. It's the fault of the rest of their league. The league as a whole has let them down. Remember this when Iowa goes to the Rose Bowl and ends up getting annihilated by a team like Utah.

Would it have been easier to beat Kentucky, Vanderbilt or South Carolina?
Minnesota is on par with this years versions of Auburn or Arkansas yet I don't think you will be as critical of Alabama being "let down" by these opponents.

[Brutus]

Ohio State's non-conference opponents the last 10 years:

Texas (x2)
USC (x2)
San Diego State (x2)
Cincinnati (x2)
Washington
Navy (x2)
Miami FL (x2)
Colorado
UCF
California (x2)
Virginia Tech (x2)

Ohio State's non-conference opponents the next 10 years:

Oklahoma (x2)
Army
Cincinnati
TCU (x2)
Oregon State
Oregon (x2)
Boston College (x2)
Notre Dame (x2)
Texas (x2)


If there is a single team in America that should not have its scheduling questioned, it's OSU. College football is incredibly difficult to find any scheduling consistency since games are scheduled 5-10 years in advance. When your conference goes into a down period, it's especially bad. Unfortunately people have tried picking the playoffs by the ability to schedule quality teams years in advance instead of concentrating on who actually are the best teams. Last year, people tried the same song and dance by focusing on OSU's schedule instead of whether they actually were one of the four best teams. Fortunately, the playoff committee didn't listen to the bitter scheduling narratives and instead put in what they saw as clearly one of the four best teams. We see how that worked out.

[kaldaniels]

No question that OSU earned the national championship on the field in the playoffs last yr. It's also much easier to get to the playoffs and when issues like what happened to Barrett when their opponents are Minnesota and Illinois. If Alabama had been hit with OSU's problems they would have had to beat LSU with their #2 QB. And if they'd lost, they'd be w/o a prayer of making the playoffs.

Once again I want to make the following very, very clear: This scheduling problem is not the fault of OSU. It's the fault of the rest of their league. The league as a whole has let them down. Remember this when Iowa goes to the Rose Bowl and ends up getting annihilated by a team like Utah.

I see no scheduling problem. It is what it is.

OSU does what they are supposed to do, they get a shot in the playoffs. It's that simple.

I hope the Big 10 improves, but what can you do about it?

[Assembly Hall]

Once again I want to make the following very, very clear: This scheduling problem is not the fault of OSU. It's the fault of the rest of their league. The league as a whole has let them down. Remember this when Iowa goes to the Rose Bowl and ends up getting annihilated by a team like Utah.

I have no problem with tOSU's schedule whatsoever. And the rest of the league, for the most part, is up to snuff as well with OOC games. But please quit picking on Iowa. They beat Pitt, beat Wisconsin in Madison, and spanked Northwestern(the team that beat Stanford) on the road.

[bucksfan2]

I have no problem with tOSU's schedule whatsoever. And the rest of the league, for the most part, is up to snuff as well with OOC games. But please quit picking on Iowa. They beat Pitt, beat Wisconsin in Madison, and spanked Northwestern(the team that beat Stanford) on the road.

I have a little beef with OSU's schedule. Its more the system that has become of college football. But there was a time, not that long ago, when OSU would routinely play two other power conference foes in a given year. Now I understand that Northern Illinois is about equal to playing the Vanderbuilts of the world, but I would like to see them start playing at least two power conference schools a year. Look scheduling a home and home with Texas is great, but throw in a Pitt or Virginia to bolster the schedule. Schedule a top tier non conference program and then schedule a middle of the pack one, and if that middle of the pack one is good it bolsters your schedule even more.

[Sea Ray]

When they scheduled Virginia Tech, they were a perennial Top 25 team. it's not OSU's fault they dropped off a cliff.

Over the next few years they have series' against Oklahoma, TCU, Oregon, etc. If you go back to the last decade, they also had early season matchups against the likes of Texas and USC. Ohio State has generally been pretty good about their non-conference schedule.

Ohio State can only schedule one, maybe two "good teams" in any given year. The problem is not with Ohio State. As long as the Big Ten stays weak, so will OSU's schedule

[RedTeamGo!]

Ohio State can only schedule one, maybe two "good teams" in any given year. The problem is not with Ohio State. As long as the Big Ten stays weak, so will OSU's schedule

You keep saying the big ten is weak, and yet they have 6 top 25 teams, with two in the top 10.

[Sea Ray]

Would it have been easier to beat Kentucky, Vanderbilt or South Carolina?
Minnesota is on par with this years versions of Auburn or Arkansas yet I don't think you will be as critical of Alabama being "let down" by these opponents.

We can go round and round on whether South Carolina is better than Minnesota. I'll just refer you to a computer. Sagrin has OSU's schedule as #68. Alabama's is the 5th hardest:

http://sagarin.com/sports/cfsend.htm

Go argue with the computer if it suits you

I think it's very clear that Alabama's schedule has been much, much more difficult than OSU's.

[Sea Ray]

You keep saying the big ten is weak, and yet they have 6 top 25 teams, with two in the top 10.

I'll refer you to Sagrin as well. I can't find a single Big Ten team with a strength of schedule better than 50. I think that's because the conference is weak. Do you have another explanation?

http://sagarin.com/sports/cfsend.htm

[Assembly Hall]

Ohio State can only schedule one, maybe two "good teams" in any given year. The problem is not with Ohio State. As long as the Big Ten stays weak, so will OSU's schedule

LOL........so playing Michigan, Michigan St., and Penn State is weak?

[RedTeamGo!]

I'll refer you to Sagrin as well. I can't find a single Big Ten team with a strength of schedule better than 50. I think that's because the conference is weak. Do you have another explanation?

http://sagarin.com/sports/cfsend.htm

It always comes back to sagarin, didn't that website just say Tennessee is the 2nd best team in the sec? Lol.

It just doesn't jive with the rankings, if they are so bad why are they getting ranked so high?

[Sea Ray]

I have no problem with tOSU's schedule whatsoever. And the rest of the league, for the most part, is up to snuff as well with OOC games. But please quit picking on Iowa. They beat Pitt, beat Wisconsin in Madison, and spanked Northwestern(the team that beat Stanford) on the road.

We'll see if you're correct on Iowa. They have yet to play in the Big Ten championship game or a Bowl. If they get blown out in those two games my criticism will be justified. I know you saw their Bowl game with Tennessee last year. As a UT fan, I'd love to play them again. They're not that much different than they were a yr ago

[Sea Ray]

It always comes back to sagarin, didn't that website just say Tennessee is the 2nd best team in the sec? Lol.

It just doesn't jive with the rankings, if they are so bad why are they getting ranked so high?

Don't like Sagrin? Fine. How 'bout this one:

https://www.teamrankings.com/college-football/ranking/schedule-strength-by-other

Or this one:

http://www.gberatings.com/sos/

You'll have to do some serious Googling to find a site that says OSU's schedule has been tough to this point

And by the way, actually look at the Sagrin ratings. Your comment on Tennessee exposes the fact that you popped off before doing so

[Sea Ray]

LOL........so playing Michigan, Michigan St., and Penn State is weak?

Of all the teams on OSU's schedule, Mich and Mich St are the only ones I'm interested in watching for 60 mins. I'm not impressed with Penn State. I am quite confident that OSU is a very, very good team. When they play MSU and UM, it'll be more about those teams than OSU.

[Assembly Hall]

We'll see if you're correct on Iowa. They have yet to play in the Big Ten championship game or a Bowl. If they get blown out in those two games my criticism will be justified. I know you saw their Bowl game with Tennessee last year. As a UT fan, I'd love to play them again. They're not that much different than they were a yr ago

Big difference with Iowa this year.....they are undefeated.

[Sea Ray]

Big difference with Iowa this year.....they are undefeated.

Do you think they'll be exposed vs OSU and in their Bowl game?

[Assembly Hall]

Do you think they'll be exposed vs OSU and in their Bowl game?

I dont know. They held IU's passing game in check Saturday. I watched them spank Northwestern as well. The only two games I watched them play all year.

[Sea Ray]

I dont know. They held IU's passing game in check Saturday. I watched them spank Northwestern as well. The only two games I watched them play all year.

Full disclosure: you think IU is better than Tennessee. I don't hold them in as high esteem. I doubt they'd take Alabama, FL or Oklahoma to the wire. I don't think Iowa has any impressive wins so far. To their credit they've won all their games.

[bucksfan2]

Full disclosure: you think IU is better than Tennessee. I don't hold them in as high esteem. I doubt they'd take Alabama, FL or Oklahoma to the wire. I don't think Iowa has any impressive wins so far. To their credit they've won all their games.

Iowa beat Pitt. Pitt is the same team that ND is getting a ton of credit for beating.

[villain612]

Iowa beat Northwestern 40-10.

Northwestern beat Stanford, who is now a top ten team.

[Assembly Hall]

Full disclosure: you think IU is better than Tennessee. I don't hold them in as high esteem. I doubt they'd take Alabama, FL or Oklahoma to the wire. I don't think Iowa has any impressive wins so far. To their credit they've won all their games.

Let's back up the bus. Is this the Alabama team that lost at home to a 3 loss team? Is this the Oklahoma team that got beat by a Texas team? I will give you Florida. But dont sell the Hoosiers short, they have plenty of short comings but they are a dangerous team to play.

As far as Iowa, I, imo, think they have the most impressive resume of all the B1G schools...they just arent getting attention. They have won in hostile environments against some pretty fine opponents.

[Sea Ray]

Iowa beat Pitt. Pitt is the same team that ND is getting a ton of credit for beating.

Can I play?

OK, South Carolina beat North Carolina who beat Pitt. So does that mean that SC is on a par with ND and Iowa?

[Sea Ray]

Iowa beat Northwestern 40-10.

Northwestern beat Stanford, who is now a top ten team.

That's definitely the best Big Ten win of the yr

[Assembly Hall]

Can I play?

OK, South Carolina beat North Carolina who beat Pitt. So does that mean that SC is on a par with ND and Iowa?

Now you are selling North Carolina short.

[traderumor]

The good news is that Ohio State doesn't need the style points and "strength of schedule" arguments this year, this squad earned its street cred. and just needs to win their games. If they lose, they are going to a bowl game, not a playoff game. All the posturing in the playoff rankings is moot for this season.

Alabama's loss is equivalent to the Buckeyes Va. Tech loss last year, but then as happens with the SEC, where talk is cheap, how good is LSU really? The rankings BS is about as fun as eating boogers, it just makes your head spin because there is so much bias in the way it is handled, and that is said with my favorite team getting the benefit of the doubt in rankings every year. But everyone has their flavor and there really not any objective measures out there, because even the models at some point start using subjective means to arrive at their pecking order.

[villain612]

Can I play?

OK, South Carolina beat North Carolina who beat Pitt. So does that mean that SC is on a par with ND and Iowa?

South Carolina is 3-6, so I'd say no.

[Sea Ray]

Now you are selling North Carolina short.

I didn't even get into NC. It was made clear that this thread is only about Big Ten football. If you want to hear my opinion on NC, let's talk about it on another thread.

[Brutus]

Scheduling also is a product of the system we have. Previously, when we had a system that only hand-picked the two most prestigious profiles every year, September football was non-existent because no one would play each other. At least Ohio State had home and home games with Texas, Miami, USC, Virginia Tech, etc. Very few programs would even schedule those types of clashes. Now there's a four-team playoff, you're actually beginning to see more future schedules that are appealing. Look at the Big Ten teams' future schedules coming up in the next five years... you'll see some amazingly difficult schedules.

I think if we found an 8-team playoff, you'd see college football scheduling become pretty awesome.

[RedTeamGo!]

That's definitely the best Big Ten win of the yr

That is probably the best OOC win in the country, not just the Big 10. Either that or Clemson over ND.

I would say Memphis over Ole Miss, but Ole Miss is clearly not a very good team.

[dougdirt]

This is such a ridiculous statement I'm not even going to attempt to argue with you.

That's fine, but one guy attempts a pass 74% of the time and the other just 59% of the time. One guy looks to pass a lot more often. He looks more like a quarterback. That's why some people prefer him to play quarterback. Probably.

[Revering4Blue]

That's fine, but one guy attempts a pass 74% of the time and the other just 59% of the time. One guy looks to pass a lot more often. He looks more like a quarterback. That's why some people prefer him to play quarterback. Probably.

If J.T, a true dual-threat, were my QB, I wouldn't have him throw the ball 74% of the time, either. It doesn't mean he can't throw the ball. There is a difference. A Running back playing QB was Steve Bellisari, and that's not J.T by a longshot.

[RedTeamGo!]

That's fine, but one guy attempts a pass 74% of the time and the other just 59% of the time. One guy looks to pass a lot more often. He looks more like a quarterback. That's why some people prefer him to play quarterback. Probably.

Guys that are "running backs that throw the ball sometimes" don't have 2500 passing yards and 34 passing touchdowns in 11 games in their freshman season.

[RedTeamGo!]

OSU #3
Iowa #5
MSU #13
Michigan #14
Northwestern #18
Wisconsin #25

B1G is soooooo weak

[oregonred]

Playing out the current seeds, tOSU would have to finish with maybe the toughest five game stretch in recent history...

#14 MSU
#13 UM
#5 Iowa
#2 Bama
#1 Clemson

[villain612]

That's fine, but one guy attempts a pass 74% of the time and the other just 59% of the time. One guy looks to pass a lot more often. He looks more like a quarterback. That's why some people prefer him to play quarterback. Probably.

Barrett is actually a pretty accurate passer. I see the point you are trying to make but give him credit for completing 65% of his passes during his career. Not everyone can do that.

Your "running back who is playing QB" comparison would be more accurate if you were talking about someone like Eric Crouch. A guy with a 51% career completion percentage and less TD passes in his career than Barrett had last season but still managed to win the Heisman as a quarterback.

[dougdirt]

Barrett is actually a pretty accurate passer. I see the point you are trying to make but give him credit for completing 65% of his passes during his career. Not everyone can do that.

Your "running back who is playing QB" comparison would be more accurate if you were talking about someone like Eric Crouch. A guy with a 51% career completion percentage and less TD passes in his career than Barrett had last season but still managed to win the Heisman as a quarterback.

My point was more that one guy stays in the pocket and throws it a lot more than the other guy. He *looks* more like a guy who is actually a quarterback because of that. I'd put good money down that Cardale Jones is a better NFL quarterback than JT Barrett is. I'd probably start Barrett on this Buckeyes team though, it's not built for Jones right now.

[RedTeamGo!]

My point was more that one guy stays in the pocket and throws it a lot more than the other guy. He *looks* more like a guy who is actually a quarterback because of that. I'd put good money down that Cardale Jones is a better NFL quarterback than JT Barrett is. I'd probably start Barrett on this Buckeyes team though, it's not built for Jones right now.

That is more reasonable, but that is not really what you said in the original post.

You responded to the statement "I honestly cannot understand why anyone would want Cardale over JT" by saying something along the lines of "Cardale is actually a quarterback while Barrett is a running back that can throw a little."

Cardale/Barrett comparisons aside, Barrett is a quarterback, and a damned good one.

[dougdirt]

That is more reasonable, but that is not really what you said in the original post.

You responded to the statement "I honestly cannot understand why anyone would want Cardale over JT" by saying something along the lines of "Cardale is actually a quarterback while Barrett is a running back that can throw a little."

Cardale/Barrett comparisons aside, Barrett is a quarterback, and a damned good one.

It's pretty much what I said in my original post. One guy runs a lot. The other doesn't. That's why some prefer Cardale Jones at quarterback. Because he throws the ball.

[RedTeamGo!]

It's pretty much what I said in my original post. One guy runs a lot. The other doesn't. That's why some prefer Cardale Jones at quarterback. Because he throws the ball.

Barrett throws the ball plenty, 2500 passing yards, 34 passing tds, 65 completion % as a redshirt freshman. Running backs that throw a little dont do that.

[GAC]

I see no scheduling problem. It is what it is.

OSU does what they are supposed to do, they get a shot in the playoffs. It's that simple.

And you nailed it.

I don't known why certain SEC fans keep bringing this scheduling "problem" up, in reference to the B10, when they know that every conference (team) is putting those weak (smaller) teams on their non-conference schedule? Go back and look at the SEC non-conference schedule over the last 10 weeks. They've got opponents like Middle Tennessee, Jacksonville State, Austin Peay, Northwestern State, UL Martin, Eastern MIchigan, the list goes on and on, but I'll stop there.

Upcoming, on Nov 21st ..... Charleston Southern at Alabama, Idaho at Auburn, Florida Atlantic at Florida, Georgia Southern at Georgia.

So give it a rest (though that's probably not going to happen) LOL

[GAC]

Playing out the current seeds, tOSU would have to finish with maybe the toughest five game stretch in recent history...

#14 MSU
#13 UM
#5 Iowa
#2 Bama
#1 Clemson

Bring-em on. They did it last year, though I readily admit it's harder to repeat. But this is how I like to see championship ball played (regardless of who it is). Run that gauntlet (LOL).

[Assembly Hall]

And you nailed it.

I don't known why certain SEC fans keep bringing this scheduling "problem" up, in reference to the B10, when they know that every conference (team) is putting those weak (smaller) teams on their non-conference schedule? Go back and look at the SEC non-conference schedule over the last 10 weeks. They've got opponents like Middle Tennessee, Jacksonville State, Austin Peay, Northwestern State, UL Martin, Eastern MIchigan, the list goes on and on, but I'll stop there.

Upcoming, on Nov 21st ..... Charleston Southern at Alabama, Idaho at Auburn, Florida Atlantic at Florida, Georgia Southern at Georgia.

So give it a rest (though that's probably not going to happen) LOL

Loved your post. But honestly it aint just SEC fans cutting on the Bucks.

[traderumor]

My point was more that one guy stays in the pocket and throws it a lot more than the other guy. He *looks* more like a guy who is actually a quarterback because of that. I'd put good money down that Cardale Jones is a better NFL quarterback than JT Barrett is. I'd probably start Barrett on this Buckeyes team though, it's not built for Jones right now.You are confusing categories. College QB is a category, NFL QB is a category. One is doing well in one category, conjecture and experience says the other will be a better NFL QB. Two separate categories, I believe the logical fallacy involved is conflation.

[dougdirt]

You are confusing categories. College QB is a category, NFL QB is a category. One is doing well in one category, conjecture and experience says the other will be a better NFL QB. Two separate categories, I believe the logical fallacy involved is conflation.

Generally speaking "college QB" is new. At least with what we are seeing now compared to 15 years ago. Sure, there have always been running oriented quarterbacks in college, but there used to be a lot more drop back guys. Now those guys are fewer and fewer. A lot of people still think of a quarterback as a guy who drops back with the plan of throwing the ball every down. That's what a lot of people *WANT* to see still because it's what they are used to. They don't like the new thing. New things are scary.

[traderumor]

Generally speaking "college QB" is new. At least with what we are seeing now compared to 15 years ago. Sure, there have always been running oriented quarterbacks in college, but there used to be a lot more drop back guys. Now those guys are fewer and fewer. A lot of people still think of a quarterback as a guy who drops back with the plan of throwing the ball every down. That's what a lot of people *WANT* to see still because it's what they are used to. They don't like the new thing. New things are scary.Are you too young to remember the wishbone and option QBs of the 70s and 80s? College QB is a very old category. Drop back types would be the exception for college QB, esp. in the modern era (70s ff.)

[dougdirt]

Are you too young to remember the wishbone and option QBs of the 70s and 80s? College QB is a very old category. Drop back types would be the exception for college QB, esp. in the modern era (70s ff.)

I'm too young to remember it, but I know it existed.

More people want to see a quarterback drop back and throw the ball. When people think of a quarterback, that's what they think about. They don't think about a guy taking a snap and doing the read option.

[Sea Ray]

OSU #3
Iowa #5
MSU #13
Michigan #14
Northwestern #18
Wisconsin #25

B1G is soooooo weak

So all I need to find is a week with 6 ranked teams and I can pop off about my conference? The fact that you did exactly that shows why it was such a feat that the SEC had 10 teams in the top 25 earlier this yr.

In fact I can't follow all your logic:



Arizona St may prove to be fool's gold and Wisconsin is rebuilding.

So is Wisconsin a good team or not?


I agree much of the b1g sucks this year

So, much of it sucks but it's not weak. OK

Here's the truth:

The conference looked weak prior to Big Ten play. Now that they've been playing themselves for a couple months, some have creeped into the top 25. When they again play outside the conference (Bowl season) we'll again see how they fare. They'll either go back to looking weak or they'll show that they've improved. That's why we watch the Bowls

[dougdirt]

They'll either go back to looking weak or they'll show that they've improved. That's why we watch the Bowls

That's not why I watch bowl games.

[Sea Ray]

Generally speaking "college QB" is new. At least with what we are seeing now compared to 15 years ago. Sure, there have always been running oriented quarterbacks in college, but there used to be a lot more drop back guys. Now those guys are fewer and fewer. A lot of people still think of a quarterback as a guy who drops back with the plan of throwing the ball every down. That's what a lot of people *WANT* to see still because it's what they are used to. They don't like the new thing. New things are scary.

Dropback guys have never been the path to win championships in college football. That's why guys like Tom Brady, Dan Marino and Peyton won very little in college. I want my college team to have guys like Tee Martin, Tim Tebow, Cam Newton and Vince Young lead them. In the pros I want Tom Brady, Peyton and Kurt Warner. Two completely different games. In the NFL I want a guy to sit in the pocket and make quick reads and throw accurate darts. I rarely want them running 'cause they'll end up like RG3 and Vick...on IR

- - - Updated - - -


That's not why I watch bowl games.

It's one of the reasons I watch. I want to see who's really good and who just accumulated a decent record due to a weak schedule

[bucksfan2]

So all I need to find is a week with 6 ranked teams and I can pop off about my conference? The fact that you did exactly that shows why it was such a feat that the SEC had 10 teams in the top 25 earlier this yr.

In fact I can't follow all your logic:



So is Wisconsin a good team or not?



So, much of it sucks but it's not weak. OK

Here's the truth:

The conference looked weak prior to Big Ten play. Now that they've been playing themselves for a couple months, some have creeped into the top 25. When they again play outside the conference (Bowl season) we'll again see how they fare. They'll either go back to looking weak or they'll show that they've improved. That's why we watch the Bowls

I am going to go out on a limb here, but the first 2016 College Football Poll will include Alabama, LSU, Auburn, Florida, Georgia, Ole Miss, Ohio State, Michigan, Michigan State, ND, FSU, Clemson, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma St, TCU, USC, and Oregon. Power names always make the early polls, beating your chest over 10 SEC teams making an early poll is as relevant as Auburn's #6 ranking this year.

[Sea Ray]

I am going to go out on a limb here, but the first 2016 College Football Poll will include Alabama, LSU, Auburn, Florida, Georgia, Ole Miss, Ohio State, Michigan, Michigan State, ND, FSU, Clemson, Baylor, Oklahoma, Oklahoma St, TCU, USC, and Oregon. Power names always make the early polls, beating your chest over 10 SEC teams making an early poll is as relevant as Auburn's #6 ranking this year.

No question early polls are not as relevant as later ones but even so, rarely if ever has a conference gotten 10 teams into the top 25.

[dougdirt]

Dropback guys have never been the path to win championships in college football. That's why guys like Tom Brady, Dan Marino and Peyton won very little in college. I want my college team to have guys like Tee Martin, Tim Tebow, Cam Newton and Vince Young lead them. In the pros I want Tom Brady, Peyton and Kurt Warner. Two completely different games. In the NFL I want a guy to sit in the pocket and make quick reads and throw accurate darts. I rarely want them running 'cause they'll end up like RG3 and Vick...on IR

- - - Updated - - -



It's one of the reasons I watch. I want to see who's really good and who just accumulated a decent record due to a weak schedule

It doesn't matter what you want in college football. You asked why someone would prefer Cardale Jones. I gave you a reason why some people would prefer him, even though I said I'm not sure I'd start him. You then began arguing with me about how I'm wrong.

And if you think a bowl game or even a few games is going to tell you which conference is better... I don't even know what to tell you.

[traderumor]

I'm too young to remember it, but I know it existed.

More people want to see a quarterback drop back and throw the ball. When people think of a quarterback, that's what they think about. They don't think about a guy taking a snap and doing the read option.

Well, I can only speak for myself and not "more people," but I want a QB who can direct a team down the field to get the offense in the end zone. How he does it, there are many ways to skin that cat, but in the end, I just want the cat skinned.

Now, if I'm an NFL talent evaluator, I probably want what you say because it has been demonstrated that a strong armed, drop back QB who can read defenses is necessary. But, I could honestly care less if my team ever produces an NFL QB. I care that they win and are playing for championships.

[traderumor]

No question early polls are not as relevant as later ones but even so, rarely if ever has a conference gotten 10 teams into the top 25.Early season rankings. We are 75% complete and the rankings are at least more meaningful. For example, by reputation, the Buckeyes have been ranked in the top 5 and ended up a mediocre team. The SEC propaganda machine could convince people that the South won the Civil War, so it isn't surprising that voters are swayed by all the SEC talk about how good all their teams are. You know, like that thrilling Florida 9 to 7 win over Vandy to clinch their division. That's some good football right there.

[Sea Ray]

It doesn't matter what you want in college football. You asked why someone would prefer Cardale Jones. I gave you a reason why some people would prefer him, even though I said I'm not sure I'd start him. You then began arguing with me about how I'm wrong.

And if you think a bowl game or even a few games is going to tell you which conference is better... I don't even know what to tell you.

You're confused. I didn't ask anything about Cardale Jones. I was never arguing with you. That has to be the first time I've ever been confused with that particular RZ participant. We couldn't be more different

[dougdirt]

You're confused. I didn't ask anything about Cardale Jones. I was never arguing with you. That has to be the first time I've ever been confused with that particular RZ participant. We couldn't be more different

My bad. I'm all over the place today.

I do think you two could be more different though. Maybe not by too much, but I'm guessing at least some. I mean you both post on REdszone, so if one of you didn't, you could be more different.

[Sea Ray]

My bad. I'm all over the place today.

I do think you two could be more different though. Maybe not by too much, but I'm guessing at least some. I mean you both post on REdszone, so if one of you didn't, you could be more different.

On RZ people can always find an exception to statements. Yes, we do both post on RZ and we are Reds fans

[dougdirt]

Yes, we do both post on RZ and we are Reds fans

Yes, but you are a cat....

[bucksfan2]

No question early polls are not as relevant as later ones but even so, rarely if ever has a conference gotten 10 teams into the top 25.

Who cares if the SEC got 10 in an early season poll? The SEC was the greatest conference in the history of college football until Zeke Elliot ran 85 yards through the heart of the south.

While Bowl Records are a flawed way to judge a conference, the B1G stood up pretty well last bowl season, don't you think?

There was a time Skip Bayless had 4 SEC West teams in the playoff. Too many people get all hyped up over preseason rankings and name programs that the forget to look at everything. I think CFP committee is flawed as well, but they start the season ranking teams based upon what has happened during the season, as well as a little divine inspiration that mandates ND's foes get lofty ratings regardless of how good they are.

[Sea Ray]

Who cares if the SEC got 10 in an early season poll? The SEC was the greatest conference in the history of college football until Zeke Elliot ran 85 yards through the heart of the south.

While Bowl Records are a flawed way to judge a conference, the B1G stood up pretty well last bowl season, don't you think?

There was a time Skip Bayless had 4 SEC West teams in the playoff. Too many people get all hyped up over preseason rankings and name programs that the forget to look at everything. I think CFP committee is flawed as well, but they start the season ranking teams based upon what has happened during the season, as well as a little divine inspiration that mandates ND's foes get lofty ratings regardless of how good they are.

As I recall the Big Ten was pretty much .500. Ohio State was great. I know Iowa was horrible

[bucksfan2]

As I recall the Big Ten was pretty much .500. Ohio State was great. I know Iowa was horrible

Wisconsin and MSU looked pretty good in their bowls, no?

[villain612]

The dropoff of classic dropback QB's in college is due to the growth in popularity of the spread offense over the last 15 years. You can get away with the spread in college because it's much easier to exploit speed advantages than in the NFL. I see the point about Jones being more suited for the NFL than Barrett, but JT is still very solid at quarterbacking.

[Sea Ray]

Wisconsin and MSU looked pretty good in their bowls, no?

Sure did

[BillDoran]

Wisconsin and MSU looked pretty good in their bowls, no?

2014-2015 Bowl Records by Conference, Overall (by Ranked Teams)

Pac-12
6-3 (5-2)
SEC
7-5 (2-5)
B1G
6-5 (4-1)
ACC
4-7 (2-2)
Big 12
2-5 (1-2)

Source (http://www.cleveland.com/datacentral/index.ssf/2015/01/conference_bowl_records_2014-1_1.html)

[jojo]

Sagarin indicates that the buckeyes have the 68th toughest schedule..... they have yet to face an opponent that would be considered a compelling game.

[kaldaniels]

I've never gotten an answer to this.

Why do the computers favor the SEC so much over the Big Ten? I mean I think the SEC is stronger...but there are only a handful of OOC games that are compelling and should matter when determining the strength of a conference via computers. I'm just looking for a real world answer here...no conference chest thumping :D

[RedTeamGo!]

I've never gotten an answer to this.

Why do the computers favor the SEC so much over the Big Ten? I mean I think the SEC is stronger...but there are only a handful of OOC games that are compelling and should matter when determining the strength of a conference via computers. I'm just looking for a real world answer here...no conference chest thumping :D

BS Preseason rankings

[IslandRed]

The dropoff of classic dropback QB's in college is due to the growth in popularity of the spread offense over the last 15 years. You can get away with the spread in college because it's much easier to exploit speed advantages than in the NFL. I see the point about Jones being more suited for the NFL than Barrett, but JT is still very solid at quarterbacking.

I agree there aren't as many pro-style college offenses as there used to be, but one could just as easily argue that the reverse is also true: the dearth of excellent dropback passers encourages teams to find an offensive system that can succeed without one. In the old days, plenty of teams did so, but the schemes tended to less balanced and more limited. What's different these days with the spread is that it can be effective both running and passing. That's helped it win converts from more traditional offensive styles.

[Assembly Hall]

I've never gotten an answer to this.

Why do the computers favor the SEC so much over the Big Ten? I mean I think the SEC is stronger...but there are only a handful of OOC games that are compelling and should matter when determining the strength of a conference via computers. I'm just looking for a real world answer here...no conference chest thumping :D

Study this.....

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2547339-ap-preseason-poll-2015-complete-college-football-rankings-released

[kaldaniels]

Study this.....

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2547339-ap-preseason-poll-2015-complete-college-football-rankings-released

Yeah. But I always thought the computers (at least most of them) were poll independent. Could be wrong on that.

[Assembly Hall]

Yeah. But I always thought the computers (at least most of them) were poll independent. Could be wrong on that.

Computers only spit out what us humans put in them!!!!!

[villain612]

It's interesting to note that the S&P+ currently projects Ohio State with only a 37% win probability in Ann Arbor.

That could change over the next few weeks, but not a reassuring sign.

[Assembly Hall]

It's interesting to note that the S&P+ currently projects Ohio State with only a 37% win probability in Ann Arbor.

That could change over the next few weeks, but not a reassuring sign.

Really looking forward to the IU/Michigan game this week-end. I want to see how the Wolves stack up, then I will give my honest opinion of how the Bucks will do in the Big House.

[Brutus]

It's interesting to note that the S&P+ currently projects Ohio State with only a 37% win probability in Ann Arbor.

That could change over the next few weeks, but not a reassuring sign.

There are far more accurate measurements out there, almost all of which have Ohio State as a favorite. By their own admission, their rankings are a work in progress.

Vegas will have OSU around a 5 point favorite (ish).

[villain612]

There are far more accurate measurements out there, almost all of which have Ohio State as a favorite. By their own admission, their rankings are a work in progress.

Vegas will have OSU around a 5 point favorite (ish).

Yeah, I expect that number to change in the next few weeks.

The Buckeye team now is not the same Buckeye team that struggled against Hawaii, Northern Illinois, and Indiana. I think the Jones-led offense is bringing their numbers down. Isn't red zone efficiency and turnovers a huge part of S&P? If so, that's where the heart of the matter is with the early season skewing.

[Brutus]

Yeah, I expect that number to change in the next few weeks.

The Buckeye team now is not the same Buckeye team that struggled against Hawaii, Northern Illinois, and Indiana. I think the Jones-led offense is bringing their numbers down. Isn't red zone efficiency and turnovers a huge part of S&P? If so, that's where the heart of the matter is with the early season skewing.

They are, and they're also raw numbers and they admit that they still don't have a very intuitive way of combining "explosiveness" and special teams with things like redzone numbers and overall efficiency. Most of the best-correlated power ratings also regress the data since 8-10 game samples are still a little shaky, something the S&P rating doesn't do.

I think the S&P number is a great analytic for measuring efficiency, but it's still behind on being a good predictor of future success.

I believe most of the books right now are sitting at 5.5-6 points for the game, albeit that's down from the nearly 20 points it was at before the season. Ohio State would be a touchdown favorite or so on a neutral field. FWIW, I think ESPN's FPI and a sportsbook I saw currently has OSU around a 67-70 percent favorite right now.

[bucksfan2]

Can someone explain to me what is happening with Dontre Wilson? I saw him last game without pads and he isn't listed on the depth chart for the Illinois game. Is he injured?

[Danny Serafini]

He's having foot problems

[BillDoran]

He's having foot problems

Seems him and Johnnie Dixon may both be long-term injury casualties. Wilson has had two surgeries on what was originally thought to be a pretty simple fracture of a right metatarsal. Since the break, he's accumulated six catches for 63 years in the 15 games Ohio State has played. Urban and WR Coach Zach Smith were optimistic he'd be a factor this year, after getting his weight up to 195 lbs., but injuries and suspension have limited his productivity.

Dixon has had knee tendinitis issues since high school. Thus far, he's had one catch in his Buckeye career. It sounds like the talent is there, but the willingness of his body to cooperate may not be.

[GAC]

Loved your post. But honestly it aint just SEC fans cutting on the Bucks.

True. And I've criticized the Buckeyes myself as far as their non-conference scheduling. But I believe in being inclusive. It's just not the Buckeyes, so why just single them out when they aren't alone?

We all know what's going on here. It's really all about the money, and getting into that post-season/championship game (as far as the bigger, established schools go). And the way you accomplish that is by avoiding losses. Yeah, a one loss team can still make it (depending on who their loss was to); but overall, you're trying to avoid it. So unless that other "power-house" school(s) are in your conference, you're not going to see, for the most part, the bigger conferences scheduling to play each other in the regular season. Yes there are exceptions; but it's rare (i.e Wisconsin vs Alabama this year).

I love college football. In fact, more then the NFL. And even though I'm a B10 guy (lived in central Ohio all my life), I especially love watching SEC games. They're a primo conference, and I've always said that. And while there has always been competitive rivalries between the fans of all the various conferences - back in the 60s/70s, it was the PAC-10 for me, and facing them in the Rose Bowl, where the B10 didn't do too good overall - you won't see me over on the SEC thread trying to rag on their team(s)/conference. But that's just me.

For me... last weekend, I was glued to the TV for the Alabama-LSU game, as well Oklahoma State-TCU and CLemson-Florida State. It just doesn't get any better in my book.

This weekend, the games I want to watch the most are Oklahoma-Baylor, Alabama-Mississippi State, NC State-Florida State.

I've been kinda bummed that the last three weeks the Buckeyes have been coming on a 8 PM. I'm so wiped out from watching football all day Saturday I only make it through 3 quarters of the OSU game before I fall asleep. And it's not due to the level of their competition, but because it's past my bedtime (LOL). Glad to see they're playing a noon today.

[GAC]

Wisconsin and MSU looked pretty good in their bowls, no?

Which conference beat the most ranked teams in their bowl games? ;)

[jojo]

Loved your post. But honestly it aint just SEC fans cutting on the Bucks.

And it aint SEC fans who are continually referencing the SEC either....

[Assembly Hall]

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/eye-on-college-football/25371309/watch-jt-barrett-to-police-during-dui-stop-im-the-qb-of-ohio-state

[redrum]

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/eye-on-college-football/25371309/watch-jt-barrett-to-police-during-dui-stop-im-the-qb-of-ohio-state

Somewhat disappointing that JT played that card, but props to the police for not being swayed.

[villain612]

Barrett's body was halfway in the endzone with the ball in his hands and its not a TD. Replay fail.

[RedTeamGo!]

Barrett's body was halfway in the endzone with the ball in his hands and its not a TD. Replay fail.

That was ridiculous.

With that said, OSU's kicking game is awful.

[Assembly Hall]

IU ran the ball down Michigan's throat. I dont see a problem with the Bucks beating the Wolves in the Big House.

[Chip R]

Michigan got very lucky.

I wonder if IU should have let Michigan score on them on that last drive of regulation. Following it online it looked like there was a little under 2 minutes left when Michigan got to the 2 yard line. If IU let them tie it up they had plenty of time to get into FG range. It doesn't seem like either team had trouble moving the ball. That said that was a heckuva goal line stand.

[redrum]

Michigan got very lucky.

I wonder if IU should have let Michigan score on them on that last drive of regulation. Following it online it looked like there was a little under 2 minutes left when Michigan got to the 2 yard line. If IU let them tie it up they had plenty of time to get into FG range. It doesn't seem like either team had trouble moving the ball. That said that was a heckuva goal line stand.

They also got some big time help from the men in stripes. The bogus offensive pass interference call and phantom forward-progress-stopped call on a fumbled return cost IU two possessions deep in Michigan territory.

[traderumor]

Somewhat disappointing that JT played that card, but props to the police for not being swayed.

Officer: "Hold on son, let me call Woody for you. Oh wait, he's dead. Now, here's your ticket and you need a ride home."

[Assembly Hall]

They also got some big time help from the men in stripes. The bogus offensive pass interference call and phantom forward-progress-stopped call on a fumbled return cost IU two possessions deep in Michigan territory.

Yepper. I am still fuming.

[traderumor]

As a Buckeye fan, glad ttun won to keep their ranking.

Another Buckeyes related thought: I scratch my head at Buckeyes fans who want them to roll over every team with a 40 something to 3 score, but want the Big 10 to get respect as a conference. You can't have it both ways folks. They were dominating with the run, the defense was stout, special teams had a blocked punt and a fumble recovery. The weak link was pass protection. I thought a 28-3 win with a jobbed TD not counted was a solid performance. But I know Buckeyes fans were generally disappointed, and perhaps the playoff committee as well.

[villain612]

Joey Bosa is a man amongst boys:


https://mtc.cdn.vine.co/r/videos/C5D9638B761277385424456818688_47fc905144a.3.0.2758 469393873807252.mp4?versionId=EynVi9TkSmUt2VMOplgA ML_8vPoTrIQo

[traderumor]

Joey Bosa is a man amongst boys:


https://mtc.cdn.vine.co/r/videos/C5D9638B761277385424456818688_47fc905144a.3.0.2758 469393873807252.mp4?versionId=EynVi9TkSmUt2VMOplgA ML_8vPoTrIQo

My favorite of his man-handling was in OT against Penn St. last year when he rushed the offensive lineman into the QB and buckled his legs to end the game.

[dougdirt]

I scratch my head at Buckeyes fans who want them to roll over every team with a 40 something to 3 score

Look around college football on Saturday. A whole lot of highly ranked teams either lost to teams that they should have beaten or barely scraped by teams they should have dominated. The Buckeyes game was never in doubt and the other team needed four touchdowns to take the victory at the end of the game. Just win the game and the rest will take care of itself.

[GAC]

Look around college football on Saturday. A whole lot of highly ranked teams either lost to teams that they should have beaten or barely scraped by teams they should have dominated. The Buckeyes game was never in doubt and the other team needed four touchdowns to take the victory at the end of the game. Just win the game and the rest will take care of itself.

I agree. Over the last month I've seen a lot of hype by the media and so-called experts (talkin' you ESPN) when it came to teams like TCU, LSU, and even Baylor. They ranked LSU at #2 and they went out and lost back-to-back games. All the experts were playing up TCU's offense (which is impressive) - but they can't play defense (LOL). Same with Baylor. Both teams got exposed IMO. And Baylor has to travel to #4 Oklahoma State this next week, and then to TCU. If Baylor can beat Oklahoma State (which I doubt), then that opens the door for the Fighting Irish to enter the play-off picture. But ND ends the season at #7 Stanford.


For most of the season I've always thought that Michigan State didn't deserve the "generous" ranking they were getting. Too many close calls IMO (Purdue, Rutgers). It finally caught up to them vs a bad Nebraska team. Iowa is good, but I don't know if they deserve a #6 ranking either. Just my opinion.

I have no issue with Clemson being #1. And the same with 'Bama at #3, even though they have that one loss. IMO, the Tide is for real. Clemson? Again, IMO, they haven't looked that good the last two weeks. They could have easily lost that game to FSU (who kept shooting themselves in the foot) ... and I certainly wasn't impressed with their win over a bad Syracuse team this past weekend. They finish against a bad Wake Forest, and then South Carolina. If things stay where they are, I think North Carolina could give Clemson a game in the ACC championship.

So there are still a lot of scenarios (possibilities) still open when it comes to that four team playoff.

OSU has two tough opponents coming up. But I think they beat the Spartans next weekend at home. Certainly, IMO, not by the 13 points they're giving the Spartans at this stage though. But anything is possible. I think OSU's toughest opponent to reaching the play-offs is the Wolverines. No, Michigan hasn't looked that impressive the last week or so ... run D is iffy, and they still have problems offensively - and on paper OSU is the better team. But I throw all that out when it comes to the "game". If they make it to the B10 championship, I really don't see OSU losing to Iowa. Iowa finds ways to win, but they've had quite a few close calls vs teams they should have dominated IF they are as good as their ranking.

[BillDoran]

Joey Bosa is a man amongst boys:


https://mtc.cdn.vine.co/r/videos/C5D9638B761277385424456818688_47fc905144a.3.0.2758 469393873807252.mp4?versionId=EynVi9TkSmUt2VMOplgA ML_8vPoTrIQo


My favorite of his man-handling was in OT against Penn St. last year when he rushed the offensive lineman into the QB and buckled his legs to end the game.

I don't believe I've ever seen a more dominant defensive lineman in college. Not sure what he'll do in the pros, but he creates havoc on every college play. Really fun to watch.

[BuckeyeRed27]

I'm heading to Columbus on Saturday for my first home game since 2008. This is going to be a tough week of work to get through.

[villain612]

I don't believe I've ever seen a more dominant defensive lineman in college. Not sure what he'll do in the pros, but he creates havoc on every college play. Really fun to watch.

What's so spectacular about his domination is that he is also consistently drawing double and triple teams lol.

[traderumor]

What's so spectacular about his domination is that he is also consistently drawing double and triple teams lol.He just is too quick to consistently block. Also, cudos to Fickell and Ash for moving him around on the line to counteract the blocking schemes designed to contain him.

[BillDoran]

He just is too quick to consistently block. Also, cudos to Fickell and Ash for moving him around on the line to counteract the blocking schemes designed to contain him.

I also think his technique is outstanding, and some of the credit there has to go to Larry Johnson, Sr. Other than Tom Herman, I think he might be the most important hire during Urban's tenure (certainly arguments to be made for Ash and Warinner, as well). He adds a bit more continuity to the program. We knew Herman would take off. Ash may go this offseason. Always whispers about Fickell. Despite some talk that there might be interest from Maryland, hope Johnson sticks around for a long time. He's been turning out stud D-Linemen for decades.

[villain612]

Ohio State has the 2nd best defense in the country in points per game.

[Roy Tucker]

I'm heading to Columbus on Saturday for my first home game since 2008. This is going to be a tough week of work to get through.

I've got my alumni tix for this game so I'll be there too. I had Michigan tickets last year. I think I've gotten bumped up in seniority. Or maybe they're trying to squeeze more money out of me.

[BuckeyeRed27]

I've got my alumni tix for this game so I'll be there too. I had Michigan tickets last year. I think I've gotten bumped up in seniority. Or maybe they're trying to squeeze more money out of me.

It's looking like I'll need to dust off my jacket for this one. Not sure my California blood is ready for the low of 27.

[bucksfan2]

I've got my alumni tix for this game so I'll be there too. I had Michigan tickets last year. I think I've gotten bumped up in seniority. Or maybe they're trying to squeeze more money out of me.

I am done with alumni tickets. I got Virginia Tech last year, was all pumped about it, but at $105/ticket, having to look around a column in B deck isn't right.

[Assembly Hall]

I am done with alumni tickets. I got Virginia Tech last year, was all pumped about it, but at $105/ticket, having to look around a column in B deck isn't right.

Just go to Bloomington every other year......plenty of space available!!!!!!!!!!

[traderumor]

Ohio State has the 2nd best defense in the country in points per game.Because they haven't played anybody ;)

[Roy Tucker]

I am done with alumni tickets. I got Virginia Tech last year, was all pumped about it, but at $105/ticket, having to look around a column in B deck isn't right.

That's a deal. This years MSU game tix are a cool $150 per each. Amatuer athletics at it's best.

[villain612]

"I think people are still unsure of what we got and this is a statement game," Elliott said. "It's a game we've been waiting for all season and it's a game against what other people will recognize as good competition. It's a game that we have go out there and show who we are and what we can do."

Saturday can't get here fast enough.

[bucksfan2]

That's a deal. This years MSU game tix are a cool $150 per each. Amatuer athletics at it's best.

I fully understand the need/desire to price the tickets as high as they do. The OSU football team supports pretty much the entire athletic department, the largest athletic department in the country. I wouldn't have a problem paying $150 a ticket for MSU as long as I knew what kind of seats I was getting. I do have a problem with them charging you full ticket value for an obstructed view seat.

[Roy Tucker]

I fully understand the need/desire to price the tickets as high as they do. The OSU football team supports pretty much the entire athletic department, the largest athletic department in the country. I wouldn't have a problem paying $150 a ticket for MSU as long as I knew what kind of seats I was getting. I do have a problem with them charging you full ticket value for an obstructed view seat.

Yeah, I don't like those underneath seats. I've had a few of those. Mine are in 7C this year. Upper deck in the curve of the U shoe. Great for the north end of the field, lousy for the south. If it wasn't MSU, I would have sold them to my neighbor. But big games are fun. When 110k people get revved up, the place can really rock. Just hope the weather is ok. I've sat through some late November games in some pretty brutal weather.

[villain612]

Some really great signs at College Gameday in Columbus today :laugh:

http://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/s--_1iBbgV7--/1528882908060352686.jpg

[RedTeamGo!]

Why is OSU so bad offensively in the first half of games? The playcalling is just soooo bad.

[RiverRat13]

Why is OSU so bad offensively in the first half of games? The playcalling is just soooo bad.

Can't pass protect which limits what they can do offensively. They aren't running the table being one dimensional like this.

[villain612]

This playcalling is garbage. Zero shots down the field.

[traderumor]

This playcalling is garbage. Zero shots down the field.

Hey, are you qualified to make such a statement? These guys are professional experts, playing chess and you're watching playing checkers. ;)

With that said, I have no idea why any coordinator/play caller would go in to any game not planning to balance run/pass calls. MSU is selling out on the run, so you hand off. They are pursuing, so you run to the short side of the field and do not try any misdirection plays. They are penetrating, so you don't run any screens. But, I'm just playing checkers. This guy's playing chess and I just have no idea of the inner complexities that are making him be predictable in his play calling.

[villain612]

MSU's front 7 is really good but their secondary is lousy. The one time we took a shot downfield, Miller was wide open. How about a few slants. Or if the blitz is tough, a screen or something. On 3rd and 9 we ran a speed option. Is this real life?

[RedTeamGo!]

I really don't get the playcalling on offense.

The Bosa offsides penalty was devastating to that defensive stand. Good grief.

[RiverRat13]

I really don't get the playcalling on offense.
.

They can't throw it. They haven't been able to all year.

The better team won.

[dougdirt]

I hate freezing the kicker. It gives them a free shot to test things out.

Terrible play calling. They threw, what, two passes over 10 yards in the air? You've got to do better than that.

Welp, better luck next year.

[MWM]

Who was that team in red on the field in Colu,bus today? They deserved to lose.

[Larkin Fan]

What a horrible game. Terrible play calling. Terrible effort on the field. Just embarassing.

[dougdirt]

Now that Ohio State has lost, the SEC is the best again, right? Is this the right thread for that, or should it go in the SEC thread? Who decides these things?

[traderumor]

Great defense played by Michigan State. Sure, the play calling was predictable and overly conservative. I expect some changes internally after an entire year of seeing the unimaginative offensive game plans and very limited play calling. I mean, seriously, their playbook has consisted of about 6 plays.

Mark Dantonio--The Urbanator

[gonelong]

Congrats to Michael State, they played a better game and earned the win. tOSU played not to lose IMO and you can't do that against a Michael State. My heart didn't want to believe it, but my head saw this coming. My neighbor has been bugging me about getting Big 10 cha ml pins hip tickets for a few weeks and I told him, "after the MSU" game.

[traderumor]

Now that Ohio State has lost, the SEC is the best again, right? Is this the right thread for that, or should it go in the SEC thread? Who decides these things?

No, the SEC top 10 team went to OT against a FCS team, their former #2 team is losing their third straight, and the current #2 Alabama team was beaten by a team forced into the top 25 after losing.

The best is whoever you want it to be in college football.

- - - Updated - - -


Congrats to Michael State, they played a better game and earned the win. tOSU played not to lose IMO and you can't do that against a Michael State. My heart didn't want to believe it, but my head saw this coming. My neighbor has been bugging me about getting Big 10 cha ml pins hip tickets for a few weeks and I told him, "after the MSU" game.

I think your autocorrect has been drinking with JT...

[villain612]

I would have called better plays tonight, for way less money too.

[The Operator]

Congrats to Michael State, they played a better game and earned the win. tOSU played not to lose IMO and you can't do that against a Michael State. My heart didn't want to believe it, but my head saw this coming. My neighbor has been bugging me about getting Big 10 cha ml pins hip tickets for a few weeks and I told him, "after the MSU" game.I hate Michael State!!!!

[traderumor]

I would have called better plays tonight, for way less money too.

Right, me too. Daggone it, call plays that work! By the way, I just did a triple jump on your checkerboard.

[Assembly Hall]

And Iowa is chomping at the bit!!!!!!

[villain612]

Right, me too. Daggone it, call plays that work! By the way, I just did a triple jump on your checkerboard.

I watched the whole game and counted two pass attempts over 15 yards. 3rd and 9 and they ran a speed optiom. Michael Thomas and Braxton Miller only targeted a handful of times. I mean, we can blame the weather all ay but Michigan State took shots downfield with a backup QB.

[gonelong]

We started the year with 3 QBS everybody wanted and we end the year with 3 QBs nobody wants. I have to wonder if JT is still not 100%.

Michael State. This is why I don't usually post from my phone.

GL

[Assembly Hall]

We started the year with 3 QBS everybody wanted and we end the year with 3 QBs nobody wants. I have to wonder if JT is still not 100%.

Michael State. This is why I don't usually post from my phone.

GL

You sound like a certain guy I know that refers to "Gumps". You guys got beat. The season aint over, you just dont control your own destiny. And Sparty is smiling.

[Revering4Blue]

Cardale Jones tweets that he's played his last game in Columbus
By Tom Fornelli | Staff Writer
November 21, 2015 7:33 pm ET

It appears that Ohio State's 17-14 loss to Michigan State on Saturday was the last time Cardale Jones will don the Ohio State jersey in front of the Buckeye faithful.

Shortly after the conclusion of the game, Jones tweeted the following:

Last time walking down them steps and into The Shoe, wish the results were different tho pic.twitter.com/BalXhHTOS7
— Cardale Jones (@CJ12_) November 22, 2015

Now, it seems pretty clear that what Jones, a redshirt junior, is saying is he won't be playing for Ohio State next season. What isn't as clear, however, are what his plans are.

It's possible that he could be leaving school to enter the NFL Draft, or he could be planning on a transfer.

I guess we'll have to wait for him to clarify his intentions in another tweet after the season.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/eye-on-college-football/25384422/cardale-jones-tweets-that-hes-played-his-last-game-in-columbus

[traderumor]

I watched the whole game and counted two pass attempts over 15 yards. 3rd and 9 and they ran a speed optiom. Michael Thomas and Braxton Miller only targeted a handful of times. I mean, we can blame the weather all ay but Michigan State took shots downfield with a backup QB.Dantonio is a Tressel disciple. He made him proud today.

[RedTeamGo!]

You sound like a certain guy I know that refers to "Gumps". You guys got beat. The season aint over, you just dont control your own destiny. And Sparty is smiling.

With regard to the playoff, the season is over, and honestly I'm glad. This team would have lost in embarrassing fashion to Bama or Clemson.

[RedTeamGo!]

Wow, Elliot just torched the OSU coaching staff after the game and declared for the NFL.

This game is going to be devastating for recruiting.

[dabvu2498]

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/eye-on-college-football/25384422/cardale-jones-tweets-that-hes-played-his-last-game-in-columbus

Elliot did it also.

[The Operator]

Wow, Elliot just torched the OSU coaching staff after the game and declared for the NFL.

This game is going to be devastating for recruiting.What did he say?

[Revering4Blue]

What did he say?

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/eye-on-college-football/25384461/ezekiel-elliott-rips-ohio-state-coaches-theres-no-chance-i-come-back

[Stray]

Lotta dudes get sat down for a game if they do what Elliot did. I don't know that Meyer will, but he probably should imo. I know Ohio State doesn't lose often, but you'd like for your players to handle it a little better than that. If play calling sucks then you should, yanno, tell the coaches. Throwing your coaches under the bus and declaring for the draft in the same interview before the season has even ended is such a bad, selfish look.

[The Operator]

Lotta dudes get sat down for a game if they do what Elliot did. I don't know that Meyer will, but he probably should imo. I know Ohio State doesn't lose often, but you'd like for your players to handle it a little better than that. If play calling sucks then you should, yanno, tell the coaches. Throwing your coaches under the bus and declaring for the draft in the same interview before the season has even ended is such a bad, selfish look.Yea, he doesn't make himself look very good there.

I agree that the playcalling sucked, but that is hardly the time or the place. Any chance that little tantrum scares some NFL teams?

[villain612]

I am on my phone so I cant link everything Elliot said but he was right. Had 2 carries in the second half.

[Stray]

Yea, he doesn't make himself look very good there.

I agree that the playcalling sucked, but that is hardly the time or the place. Any chance that little tantrum scares some NFL teams?

I doubt that it affects his draft stock at all. If he has questionable maturity it'd have come up in the predraft process anyway. And honestly, if teams think he can be a solid RB then it doesn't matter all that much anyway.

But it affects Ohio State. If players start torpedoing the coaching staff at the first sign of trouble then your entire platform wasn't too stable to begin with. That's why Meyer should sit him and let his guys know that Ohio State doesn't work like that.

Declaring for the draft was probably the worst part imo. Throwing coaches under the bus is bad, but that can be chalked up to frustration. Declaring before your season has even ended shows that it's always been more about you than the team. That's a crappy thing to do.

[gonelong]

You sound like a certain guy I know that refers to "Gumps". You guys got beat. The season aint over, you just dont control your own destiny. And Sparty is smiling.

I know we got beat. I watched the game and dId the math and everything. The run for a NC is over, the season rolls on. Michigan week and a bowl game to look forward to. I can't make heads or tails of what the heck you are getting at. Don't be coy, come right out and say it.

GL

[IslandRed]

There are all kinds of reasons people say it's difficult to repeat, and very little of it has to do with a presumption of a talent dropoff. Different team, different year, same story. Not an OSU fan, but they'll be back.

[Redsfaithful]

Everything Elliott said was correct. What really hurts recruiting is the offensive playcalling on display today.

[BillDoran]

I think the aftermath may be more disappointing than the game itself.

It really sucks to see these kids act like insolent brats at the first sign of turbulence.

[gonelong]

I think the aftermath may be more disappointing than the game itself.

It really sucks to see these kids act like insolent brats at the first sign of turbulence.

There has been turbulence all season (and in past seasons) with the back getting minimal touches in games. Hyde had the same gripe often, specifically in a loss to MSU.

As much work as they put in each season I completely understand their frustration over the coaches poor showing today (and really all season). I'd be cheesed too if I blocked and ran like Zeke does and they just refused to give me the ball. I'd like to think I would be able to hold my tongue after a game like that but I am not all that sure I would have been able to at that age. It's not the touches as much as not getting the chance to compete for the win.

I suspect he will wish he hadn't been so forthcoming with his opinion, but it's out there now. Not a good look at all. I'm not saying I'm ok with it, but I understand.

[gonelong]

Dantonio is a Tressel disciple. He made him proud today.

Dantonio has been impressive at MSU and really has that program in a great place. They have a confident swagger about them that you can tell is genuine. The sustained success he has had at MSU is something I would not have thought was possible.

[RedTeamGo!]

Everything Elliott said was correct. What really hurts recruiting is the offensive playcalling on display today.

Beck has to go and Warriner has to go back to being oline coach only. No idea who they can bring in, but there has to be someone out there better.

[Hillsdale87]

I think the aftermath may be more disappointing than the game itself.

It really sucks to see these kids act like insolent brats at the first sign of turbulence.

I think this has been coming all year. The players have to be frustrated with he coaches' inability to put together a game plan, and today's was just embarrassing. Players get called out when they play badly. Coaches shouldn't be immune. Elliott was right. Every time they get in rhythm the coaches try something cute and it knocks them back out. The coaching has cost the team all season.

[Hillsdale87]

Beck has to go and Warriner has to go back to being oline coach only. No idea who they can bring in, but there has to be someone out there better.

Who could have thought that hiring the offensive coordinator of a juggernaut like Nebraska wouldn't lead to an explosive offense?

[RedTeamGo!]

This game will be devastating for recruiting IMO.

There were a lot of big recruits at this game on the fence.

I also think the offensive playcalling this year is why Kareem Walker jumped ship.

[BillDoran]

Who could have thought that hiring the offensive coordinator of a juggernaut like Nebraska wouldn't lead to an explosive offense?

Tom Herman's Cyclone offenses were hardly dynamic (though he is a MENSA member).

[MWM]

Didn't OSU play Michigan State in the big 10 championship game a couple of years ago? I had no idea they were in the same division.