2018 NFL Season Thread

[Sea Ray]

So this happened today.


https://twitter.com/SNFonNBC/status/1071876595919523841?s=09

Not Belichick and Brady's best day. Brady left 3 easy pts on the board at the end of the 1st half and as for coaching...why in the world is Gronk in there on that play? Miami had the ball 70 yds away from the end zone. That's NOT Hail Mary territory.

[WrongVerb]

So this happened today.


https://twitter.com/SNFonNBC/status/1071876595919523841?s=09

Number 62 of the Dolphins shouldn't ever have to buy a beer again in the city of Miami.

[CTA513]

So this happened today.


https://twitter.com/SNFonNBC/status/1071876595919523841?s=09

Gronk shouldn't have been on the field when they needed to gain about 70 yards on 1 play.
Most QBs can't throw it that far so you have to expect something shorter that gets tossed around and that makes Gronk being on the field pointless.
Extra DBs would have made more sense.

[CTA513]

Look what Saquon Barkley has done so far in his rookie season for a 5-8 Giants team: 1,124 rushing yards (5.4 YPC), 9 TDs and 78 catches for 629 yards and 4 TDs.

He also leads in the NFL with 14 runs of 20+ yards and 6 runs of 40+ yards

[RichRed]

So this happened today.


https://twitter.com/SNFonNBC/status/1071876595919523841?s=09

Watching Gronk dive helplessly at the feet of Drake as he crossed the goal line is one of my favorite images of this NFL season.

[Assembly Hall]

Watching Gronk dive helplessly at the feet of Drake as he crossed the goal line is one of my favorite images of this NFL season.

Hell, it is one of my favorite images in NFL history.

[Boston Red]

The Cowboys have essentially wrapped up the NFC East with three games to go. Did NOT see that coming 6 weeks ago!

[Chip R]

Watching Gronk dive helplessly at the feet of Drake as he crossed the goal line is one of my favorite images of this NFL season.

That was great but the better one was before that when he lost his footing. If he didn't do that he may have been able to knock Drake out of bounds.

[Sea Ray]

The Cowboys have essentially wrapped up the NFC East with three games to go. Did NOT see that coming 6 weeks ago!

Amazing the difference Amari Cooper has made for this team. They're also benefiting from being in the worst division

[GAC]

I look at the standings and laugh as I see such mediocrity with 17 of 32 teams under .500.

[Kingspoint]

Number 62 of the Dolphins shouldn't ever have to buy a beer again in the city of Miami.

Wasn't that "32", Kenyan Drake?

[IslandRed]

Wasn't that "32", Kenyan Drake?

I think he means the lineman who busted it 40 yards downfield and threw the block on the DB that left Drake 1-on-1 with Gronkowski.

[Kingspoint]

I think he means the lineman who busted it 40 yards downfield and threw the block on the DB that left Drake 1-on-1 with Gronkowski.

I missed that.

[Chip R]

Reggie McKenzie has been fired as Raiders "GM".

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/25500888/raiders-fire-general-manager-reggie-mckenzie

[Slyder]

Reggie McKenzie has been fired as Raiders "GM".

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/25500888/raiders-fire-general-manager-reggie-mckenzie

He always seemed to find contributors late, which is GREAT for most GMs but his early rounds are more misses. He wasn't horrible with Free Agents either. Carr and He from Chicago are about the only remarkable guys from his draft (Conley could still get there). That's terrible rate for drafting (especially as high as we were most years).

I defended him for years to be rewarded with the first playoff appearance since the Gruden Bowl. But the wheels completely fell apart and it was time for a change. I don't know if I believe there was any conflict between McKenzie and Gruden but it was time for someone else. I'll remember him most for 2016 and getting us out of salary cap and draft pick hell that he inherited from Al and Hue believing this team was Carson Palmer away from playoffs.

[WVRed]

At this rate I’m wondering if Zimmer will be available if the Bengals decide to move on from Marvin:

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/25509082/minnesota-vikings-fire-oc-john-defilippo

[WrongVerb]

I think he means the lineman who busted it 40 yards downfield and threw the block on the DB that left Drake 1-on-1 with Gronkowski.

Exactly. I love that type of stuff. So fundamental in one respect, and executed to perfection in another. (It's the same reason why my all time favorite Reds defensive play is Davis throwing out Bonilla in the 1990 playoffs.)

[Kingspoint]

If the Bears' Head Coach doesn't win Coach-of-the-Year, they need to take away everyone's right to vote who has a say in it.

[IslandRed]

Leftover thought from the Dolphins-Pats game: I'm not a Fins fan, but even so, their jerseys are so much better with that throwback aqua instead of the lighter whatever-it-is shade.

[Kingspoint]

Leftover thought from the Dolphins-Pats game: I'm not a Fins fan, but even so, their jerseys are so much better with that throwback aqua instead of the lighter whatever-it-is shade.

So, you're saying your wife never once convinced you to throw a sweater over your shoulders and tie the arms in front even once in the '90's while wearing teal and all other shades of pastels?

[Boston Red]

If the Bears' Head Coach doesn't win Coach-of-the-Year, they need to take away everyone's right to vote who has a say in it.

If the Cowboys win their last three, Jason Garrett should be in the mix, too.

[IslandRed]

So, you're saying your wife never once convinced you to throw a sweater over your shoulders and tie the arms in front even once in the '90's while wearing teal and all other shades of pastels?

Funny thing is, she was the South Florida-raised Dolphins fan. Don't think she ever forgave them for shoving Don Shula out the door.

But if she had ever suggested I try that look, it would have been for Halloween.

[Chip R]

The city of Oakland has filed a lawsuit against the Raiders and the NFL. The Raiders are scheduled to play there one more year but they said they won't play there if the city sues.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/25511689/city-oakland-files-federal-lawsuit-raiders-nfl

[Boston Red]

The NFL at Sam Boyd Stadium would be interesting. I mean, the Chargers play in a tiny soccer stadium, so why not?

[WrongVerb]

The NFL at Sam Boyd Stadium would be interesting. I mean, the Chargers play in a tiny soccer stadium, so why not?

Cal and Stanford are both in that area. And Levi stadium accommodating both teams for a season wouldn't be out of the question either.

[Boston Red]

Cal and Stanford are both in that area. And Levi stadium accommodating both teams for a season wouldn't be out of the question either.

Sure, but if you're forced to move to a college stadium, why on earth would you stay in the area you're abandoning the next year as opposed to going ahead to the place that is actually excited to have you? The Levi Stadium alternative might work, though. Have they torn down the Stick?

[Boston Red]

Glad to see Lamar Jackson getting the nod over a healthy Joe Flacco in Baltimore. Would love to see LJ starting a playoff game in his rookie season!

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/25517134/lamar-jackson-named-starting-qb-baltimore-ravens

[WrongVerb]

Sure, but if you're forced to move to a college stadium, why on earth would you stay in the area you're abandoning the next year as opposed to going ahead to the place that is actually excited to have you? The Levi Stadium alternative might work, though. Have they torn down the Stick?

Yes, I believe Candlestick is either gone or slated for demolition soon. Doubtful it's in any condition to host NFL games for a season.

[Assembly Hall]

Yes, I believe Candlestick is either gone or slated for demolition soon. Doubtful it's in any condition to host NFL games for a season.

I am thinking it is gone. But I could be wrong.

[KronoRed]

Candlestick has been an empty lot for over 3 years.

[Kingspoint]

If the Cowboys win their last three, Jason Garrett should be in the mix, too.

Absolutely.

[Kingspoint]

So, Wentz has a fracture in a vertebrae that will heal on its own with time. Carson Palmer was never the same after the Kimo hit. Some injuries, though they may heal physically, leave mental scars that last a long time.

[Hillsdale87]

Referees have way too much control over the outcome of a game. The Chargers have stopped the Chiefs twice on this drive and the refs have bailed the Chiefs out with horrible calls. Happens way too often in the NFL


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[Sea Ray]

Referees have way too much control over the outcome of a game. The Chargers have stopped the Chiefs twice on this drive and the refs have bailed the Chiefs out with horrible calls. Happens way too often in the NFL


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I agree. All these flags are ruining the NFL game. Having said that, it was an awfully exciting finish. It's almost like the game is so great, even the refs can't ruin it but I don't know.

[Kingspoint]

Referees have way too much control over the outcome of a game. The Chargers have stopped the Chiefs twice on this drive and the refs have bailed the Chiefs out with horrible calls. Happens way too often in the NFL


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Apparently the refs made up for it in the 4th by being equally bad against the Chiefs.

[Chip R]

K.C.'s defense has to be better than this if they expect to advance in the playoffs.

[Hillsdale87]

Apparently the refs made up for it in the 4th by being equally bad against the Chiefs.

Somewhat. The pass interference in the end zone was weak, but the refs missed an obvious personal foul helmet to helmet hit on the play before that should have given the Chiefs a first down. The refs were awful last night, and they've been a big problem all year with inconsistency

[Boston Red]

K.C.'s defense has to be better than this if they expect to advance in the playoffs.

That defense is atrocious. It's not going to get better.

[Assembly Hall]

The Chiefs have the tiebreaker over the Chargers, right?

[Sea Ray]

The Chiefs have the tiebreaker over the Chargers, right?

Correct. They have a better in division record. Their only remaining div game is at home vs the Raiders

[Kingspoint]

That defense is atrocious. It's not going to get better.

When you get rid of all of your Starting Secondary in the off-season and expect in-house, inexperienced players to step up, this is the results you're going to get. Basically, a Secondary full of 2nd and 3rd Stringers in a league that heavily favors Quarterbacks and Receivers is going to suck the whole season (except when they play the Bengals).

[WVRed]

Drew Brees is a class act.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/25535823/drew-brees-new-orleans-saints-gifts-174-players-coaches-milestone-balls

[Assembly Hall]

Drew Brees is a class act.

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/25535823/drew-brees-new-orleans-saints-gifts-174-players-coaches-milestone-balls

Yes he is.

[Kingspoint]

Btw, how did Eric Berry look in his return?

[Sea Ray]

Btw, how did Eric Berry look in his return?

Rusty. A step late

- - - Updated - - -


Yes he is.

Very cool

[Sea Ray]

Cam Newton did not look right tonight. I think his shoulder is plenty screwed up. He couldn't throw the ball over ten yds there at the end of that game

[Kingspoint]

From Rotoworld with Rotoworld comments:

Phillip Lindsay became the first undrafted offensive player to be selected to the Pro Bowl as a rookie.

Lindsay earned his selection by scoring nine rushing touchdowns while averaging 5.4 yards on his 182 carries. The undrafted rookie has also snagged 33-of-45 targets for 230 yards and an additional touchdown. The other running backs to be selected to the Pro Bowl are James Conner, Melvin Gordon, Todd Gurley, Saquon Barkley, Ezekiel Elliott, and Tarik Cohen (return specialist). The full list can be found in the link below, but remember that many others are added as players drop out from participating. Just ask Andy Dalton.

Source: NFL.com

[Rojo Rijo]

From Rotoworld with Rotoworld comments:

Phillip Lindsay became the first undrafted offensive player to be selected to the Pro Bowl as a rookie.

Lindsay earned his selection by scoring nine rushing touchdowns while averaging 5.4 yards on his 182 carries. The undrafted rookie has also snagged 33-of-45 targets for 230 yards and an additional touchdown. The other running backs to be selected to the Pro Bowl are James Conner, Melvin Gordon, Todd Gurley, Saquon Barkley, Ezekiel Elliott, and Tarik Cohen (return specialist). The full list can be found in the link below, but remember that many others are added as players drop out from participating. Just ask Andy Dalton.

Source: NFL.com

I'm all for the NFL scrapping the AFC/NFC pro bowl votes and just vote for the league as a whole. Having Lindsay and Conner make the team while Alvin Kamara and Christian McCaffrey don't because they are blocked is ridiculous. Scarp the conferences and go back to the draft format. Nobody really cares about the actual game anyways. It's all about being able to put the accolade beside the name.

[texasdave]

Josh Gordon will be on hiatus for awhile. https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/josh-gordon-reportedly-facing-another-indefinite-suspension-from-nfl/ar-BBRdFXF?ocid=spartanntp

[WrongVerb]

Josh Gordon will be on hiatus for awhile. https://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/nfl/josh-gordon-reportedly-facing-another-indefinite-suspension-from-nfl/ar-BBRdFXF?ocid=spartanntp

Such a tragic path his career has taken to this point. I really hope he is able to struggle past this and find some peace in himself and with his life.

[bucksfan2]

Such a tragic path his career has taken to this point. I really hope he is able to struggle past this and find some peace in himself and with his life.

I have heard that Josh Gordon never really liked football all that much. He just was insanely gifted the sport and excelled at it.

Correct me if I am wrong, but haven't most of Gordon's issues been with alcohol and marijuana? You wonder if its addiction or just not caring?

As with everyone who falls on tough times, I hope he finds peace in his life. Looking on from the outside, its a shame his career has taken this path. And on the other hand, maybe he just doesn't care.

[Sea Ray]

I have heard that Josh Gordon never really liked football all that much. He just was insanely gifted the sport and excelled at it.

Correct me if I am wrong, but haven't most of Gordon's issues been with alcohol and marijuana? You wonder if its addiction or just not caring?

As with everyone who falls on tough times, I hope he finds peace in his life. Looking on from the outside, its a shame his career has taken this path. And on the other hand, maybe he just doesn't care.

This is why the NFL is so much smarter than other leagues for not giving out guaranteed contracts. In MLB or the NBA this guy would still be pulling down huge paychecks

[Chip R]

I feel bad for Gordon but I'm not crying for the Patriots.

[Slyder]

I feel bad for Gordon but I'm not crying for the Patriots.

They knew what they were getting into.

[Assembly Hall]

I feel bad for Gordon but I'm not crying for the Patriots.

I don't and the hell with the Patriots.

[Chip R]

They knew what they were getting into.

Exactly. These moves usually work out for them. I wish the circumstances were different but it's great that it didn't work out.

[WrongVerb]

The hated Steelers are on the outside of the playoffs looking in after being beaten by the Saints.

[dubc47834]

I wonder what happened to the leagues/refs love for the Steelers!!!

[Hillsdale87]

I wonder what happened to the leagues/refs love for the Steelers!!!

Once again the refs had way too much impact on the outcome of a game. I'm not upset about the Steelers losing, but that first PI call in the end zone was one of the worst I've seen and probably cost the Steelers the game. They would have had the ball with great field position, and instead the Saints were gifted a TD. I'm ok with the PI call in the 4th that everybody was complaining about though. If you don't call PI, It was defensive holding. He grabbed Thomas's jersey and tried to yank him to the ground.

Too often in big spots the refs have become a story. I don't know if it's the loss of Dean Blandino or something else, but the NFL needs to get this fixed


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[Boston Red]

So that Lamar Jackson guy is working out pretty well.

[Assembly Hall]

So that Lamar Jackson guy is working out pretty well.

And Michael Vick says hello. That Jackson guy better be worried about the Browns.

[Kingspoint]

So that Lamar Jackson guy is working out pretty well.

Many like him have gotten a few wins for a season or two. It never lasts.

[CTA513]

So that Lamar Jackson guy is working out pretty well.

In his 6 starts:
134 pass attempts (sacked 13 times)
99 rushes (average of 16.5 rushes per game) (about 264 rushes in a season if he did it over 16 games)


Heres how many rushing attempts the top NFL running backs have this season:
Elliott: 304 rushes in 15 games
Gurley: 256 rushes in 14 games
Barkley: 244 rushes in 15 games
McCaffrey: 215 rushes in 15 games
Mixon: 224 rushes in 13 games


Do I think he can be a good QB? yes, but I don't know how long he'll last taking all the extra hits hes going to take running this much.

[CTA513]

And Michael Vick says hello. That Jackson guy better be worried about the Browns.

Even Vick didn't run as much as Lamar Jackson has been doing in his starts.

http://www.nfl.com/player/mikevick/2504531/profile

123 rushing attempts was the Vick had in a 16 game season.

Lamar Jackson has 127 rushes this season and 99 of them are from his 6 starts.

[Assembly Hall]

Even Vick didn't run as much as Lamar Jackson has been doing in his starts.

http://www.nfl.com/player/mikevick/2504531/profile

123 rushing attempts was the Vick had in a 16 game season.

Lamar Jackson has 127 rushes this season and 99 of them are from his 6 starts.

Exactly.

[Boston Red]

And Michael Vick says hello. That Jackson guy better be worried about the Browns.

As long as Jackson doesn't decide to fight dogs, I think that comparison says great things for Lamar.

[Assembly Hall]

As long as Jackson doesn't decide to fight dogs, I think that comparison says great things for Lamar.

As it should....just no dog fights, or cock fights.

[Todd Gack]

As long as Jackson doesn't decide to fight dogs, I think that comparison says great things for Lamar.

Meh. There's a reason Bal. is running the type of offense that they're running. Vick was on another level in terms of athleticism. Jackson is a tier below him and his arm isn't even as good as Vick's either. The league will catch up sooner rather than later.

[dubc47834]

Once again the refs had way too much impact on the outcome of a game. I'm not upset about the Steelers losing, but that first PI call in the end zone was one of the worst I've seen and probably cost the Steelers the game. They would have had the ball with great field position, and instead the Saints were gifted a TD. I'm ok with the PI call in the 4th that everybody was complaining about though. If you don't call PI, It was defensive holding. He grabbed Thomas's jersey and tried to yank him to the ground.

Too often in big spots the refs have become a story. I don't know if it's the loss of Dean Blandino or something else, but the NFL needs to get this fixed


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That was pretty much my point. All to often people complain on here that the league gives calls to these favorite teams. Games like this just proves to me anyway, that its just refs making bad calls!

[Boston Red]

Meh. There's a reason Bal. is running the type of offense that they're running. Vick was on another level in terms of athleticism. Jackson is a tier below him and his arm isn't even as good as Vick's either. The league will catch up sooner rather than later.

Vick was faster. Jackson is much quicker. I can't really give Vick being on another level from Jackson. Lamar is a freak. Baltimore is running that offense because it plays to Jackson's unique strengths.

[bucksfan2]

Vick was faster. Jackson is much quicker. I can't really give Vick being on another level from Jackson. Lamar is a freak. Baltimore is running that offense because it plays to Jackson's unique strengths.

I think Vick had abilities that Jackson could only dream of. Honestly, I am somewhat shocked at the limits of Jackson's passing game.

[Ohayou]

Daniel Jones making a case to be the #1 QB picked in next year's draft. Or maybe Kyler Murray declares, the Bengals trade up for him, and Dick Williams makes a deal with the A's to bring him to the Reds as well. :party:

[Assembly Hall]

Daniel Jones making a case to be the #1 QB picked in next year's draft. Or maybe Kyler Murray declares, the Bengals trade up for him, and Dick Williams makes a deal with the A's to bring him to the Reds as well. :party:

Whether Murray declares or not, he will be drafted by someone.

[kaldaniels]

Whether Murray declares or not, he will be drafted by someone.

If he’s wishy washy on committing and slips low in the draft won’t that lock him into a low NFL salary for his first several years?

[Assembly Hall]

If he’s wishy washy on committing and slips low in the draft won’t that lock him into a low NFL salary for his first several years?

But he can still play baseball.

[kaldaniels]

But he can still play baseball.

Never once said he couldn’t but his draft position will be interesting to follow. If he doesn’t commit to football how high would a team draft him?

[Boston Red]

Just hope he doesn't pull a Josh Booty and screw both of them up and end up making basically no money in the process.

[Assembly Hall]

Never once said he couldn’t but his draft position will be interesting to follow. If he doesn’t commit to football how high would a team draft him?

That is up to a team to decide.

[kaldaniels]

That is up to a team to decide.

Alrighty no draft speculation guys, it’s up for the teams to decide.

[Assembly Hall]

Alrighty no draft speculation guys, it’s up for the teams to decide.

Whatever, a team wants to take chance so be it. But he does have a baseball contract as it stands right now.

[kaldaniels]

Whatever, a team wants to take chance so be it. But he does have a baseball contract as it stands right now.

I personally have no idea but it’s very interesting to me. If his baseball career starts with a whimper he could come running back to football.

[Assembly Hall]

I personally have no idea but it’s very interesting to me. If his baseball career starts with a whimper he could come running back to football.

Exactly. The thing is what NFL team will "waste" a high pick on him? TBD

[Sea Ray]

I personally have no idea but it’s very interesting to me. If his baseball career starts with a whimper he could come running back to football.

How long does a drafting team hold rights to a player? If it's only a yr then it doesn't allow for a player's baseball career to falter.

I think his skills translate better to MLB than NFL.

[Assembly Hall]

How long does a drafting team hold rights to a player? If it's only a yr then it doesn't allow for a player's baseball career to falter.

I think his skills translate better to MLB than NFL.

The team that drafted him hold the rights for 1 year or to the following draft. Where said player can be drafted again but not by the team that originally drafted him.

Now don't quote me on this....but it happened to Bo Jackson in some shape or form. I do believe the Buccaneers selected him with the #1 pick. But he chose to play baseball. The following year Oakland drafted him(no idea as to what round). The Raiders worked out a contract with him so that he could continue to play baseball.

[Sea Ray]

The team that drafted him hold the rights for 1 year or to the following draft. Where said player can be drafted again but not by the team that originally drafted him.

Now don't quote me on this....but it happened to Bo Jackson in some shape or form. I do believe the Buccaneers selected him with the #1 pick. But he chose to play baseball. The following year Oakland drafted him(no idea as to what round). The Raiders worked out a contract with him so that he could continue to play baseball.

That would seem reasonable. I doubt Murray will give up on baseball that quickly

[dubc47834]

Its Baker time!!!!

[dubc47834]

The league to the refs in B-More....screw the Ravens...NOW!!!

[dubc47834]

The league to the refs in B-More....screw the Ravens...NOW!!!

B-More...screw you NFL...LOLOLOLOL

[dubc47834]

Congrats to the Eagles as well...only the Colts are left...hopefully!!!

[Kingspoint]

Congrats to the Eagles as well...only the Colts are left...hopefully!!!

It has to be seriously questioned whether or not any Offensive Coordinator can work under Zimmer. DeFelippo cannot be the problem. I know they had Offensive Line issues again, but not to this effect.

[dubc47834]

It has to be seriously questioned whether or not any Offensive Coordinator can work under Zimmer. DeFelippo cannot be the problem. I know they had Offensive Line issues again, but not to this effect.

I agree, although they did play better since making the move.

[Chip R]

Black Monday has begun a day early. Dirk Koetter has been fired in Tampa.

[dubc47834]

Black Monday has begun a day early. Dirk Koetter has been fired in Tampa.

Joseph reportedly out also in Denver.

- - - Updated - - -

Colts by 14+ tonite!

[UKFlounder]

Todd Bowles fired by the Jets

[Chip R]

Mke Mayock to interview for Raiders GM job.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/nfl-draft-analyst-mike-mayock-interviewing-to-be-raiders-gm-reportedly-a-strong-candidate/

[Kingspoint]

Mke Mayock to interview for Raiders GM job.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/nfl-draft-analyst-mike-mayock-interviewing-to-be-raiders-gm-reportedly-a-strong-candidate/

:laugh:

[Stray]

I hate the Steelers enough that I fully expect this Titans/Colts game to tie. Because of course it'd happen.

[Assembly Hall]

I hate the Steelers enough that I fully expect this Titans/Colts game to tie. Because of course it'd happen.

I don't think you have to worry about the Steelers.

[Ohayou]

Really curious to see how Josh Allen progresses next year. He could be just as a good as Mayfield.

[Sea Ray]

Mke Mayock to interview for Raiders GM job.

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/nfl-draft-analyst-mike-mayock-interviewing-to-be-raiders-gm-reportedly-a-strong-candidate/

I'll miss him om NFL Network come draft time

[Kingspoint]

Gruden had to find someone less qualified than himself.

[Revering4Blue]

Gruden had to find someone less qualified than himself.

Which certainly required a herculean effort.

Throwing out the GMing duties, I still don't understand why Gruden is hailed by some as some sort of coaching genius. His winning percentage prior to accepting the Oakland gig was lower than Brian Billick's.

Place that in perspective.

[Chip R]

Trouble in the PIT?

[Sea Ray]

Makes you wonder why Mike Tomlin isn't mentioned as having been fired. It sounds like he's lost this team

[WrongVerb]

Screeeechhh! Wait, what?

[Sea Ray]

Screeeechhh! Wait, what?

What are you referring to? You'll have to be more specific.

[Todd Gack]

Makes you wonder why Mike Tomlin isn't mentioned as having been fired.


Tomlin has let his team act like a bunch of fools for a long time. He's let his own coaches run onto the field to intimidate and taunt opponents along with actually tripping players in the field himself. He's let players like Mike Mitchell be Mike Mitchell, etc. It's the same feelings Bengals fans have had with Marvin and his history of players. It gets tiring allowing these fools to continue to act the way they do. The only reason he's as successful as he's been is because of Cheeseburger and the organization itself. Those both go hand-in-hand with his success. If I'm Pittsburgh, I'd fire him and find a better coach to transition away from Cheeseburger. You're going to get a very good pool of candidates to choose from.

[WrongVerb]

14388

- - - Updated - - -

AB pushes off more than anyone and never gets called for it because he's protected by being one the Steelers. Any other team and watch his numbers plummet and penalties skyrocket.

[Todd Gack]

14388

- - - Updated - - -

AB pushes off more than anyone and never gets called for it because he's protected by being one the Steelers. Any other team and watch his numbers plummet and penalties skyrocket.

That's just jealousy. AB, like most receivers, get away with a lot in this league. It's not just him. He's a hell of a receiver. And this is coming from someone who loathes that team.

[CTA513]

14388

- - - Updated - - -

AB pushes off more than anyone and never gets called for it because he's protected by being one the Steelers. Any other team and watch his numbers plummet and penalties skyrocket.

I can definitely see the Steelers trading him.
Plenty of teams would love to have him, so they should get a really nice return if they do trade him.

[redsfanmia]

Tomlin has let his team act like a bunch of fools for a long time. He's let his own coaches run onto the field to intimidate and taunt opponents along with actually tripping players in the field himself. He's let players like Mike Mitchell be Mike Mitchell, etc. It's the same feelings Bengals fans have had with Marvin and his history of players. It gets tiring allowing these fools to continue to act the way they do. The only reason he's as successful as he's been is because of Cheeseburger and the organization itself. Those both go hand-in-hand with his success. If I'm Pittsburgh, I'd fire him and find a better coach to transition away from Cheeseburger. You're going to get a very good pool of candidates to choose from.
It’s funny...the Colts signed Mitchell and he’s been great. No cheap shots and has been a positive influence for the younger guys. I was upset when the colts signed because of his dirty history, now I think it could just be the Steeler culture.

[Sea Ray]

I can definitely see the Steelers trading him.
Plenty of teams would love to have him, so they should get a really nice return if they do trade him.

It'd be really tough given the cap hit:


​No matter how bad the relationship gets between ​Antonio Brown and the Pittsburgh Steelers, both parties are stuck with each other, for all intents and purposes. That's bad news for Pittsburgh, Brown, and Steelers fans. It's a lose-lose...lose.



​Trading or cutting Brown would be wildly detrimental to the Steelers' franchise, both on and off the field. The reason lies in the cap space. If Brown were to be traded or cut this offseason, Pittsburgh would be carrying around $21.12 million in dead money over the next two seasons.

https://www.12up.com/posts/6260829-insane-cap-hit-means-steelers-couldn-t-trade-antonio-brown-even-if-they-wanted-to

[dubc47834]

It’s funny...the Colts signed Mitchell and he’s been great. No cheap shots and has been a positive influence for the younger guys. I was upset when the colts signed because of his dirty history, now I think it could just be the Steeler culture.

Or...it could be he wasnt much of a dirty player to begin with. He just happened to play for the hated Steelers.

[Assembly Hall]

Or...it could be he wasnt much of a dirty player to begin with. He just happened to play for the hated Steelers.

People hate the Steelers around here? Never noticed!!!!!!!!! LOL

[dubc47834]

People hate the Steelers around here? Never noticed!!!!!!!!! LOL

Maybe it was a misjudgment on my part...possible I guess!!!

[GAC]

I hope the Steelers keep Brown ... and find a way to also bring RB Bell back into the fold. And both of their massive "me" egos wrecks havoc in the Steeler locker-room for years to come! :lol:

[WVRed]

Idea for a trade:

Pittsburgh gets: Von Miller
Denver gets: Antonio Brown

Makes sense for both sides and I think Elway is going to ship out Von Miller. Pittsburgh could trade Brown to San Francisco, get their pick and take Josh Allen, but Von Miller is a sure thing and Pittsburgh won’t drop off much at wideout to necessitate spending a draft pick.

Denver gets a veteran receiver to pair with Courtland Sutton and could then draft Haskins if he’s there. Let Haskins sit behind Keenum until he’s ready.

[dubc47834]

Idea for a trade:

Pittsburgh gets: Von Miller
Denver gets: Antonio Brown

Makes sense for both sides and I think Elway is going to ship out Von Miller. Pittsburgh could trade Brown to San Francisco, get their pick and take Josh Allen, but Von Miller is a sure thing and Pittsburgh won’t drop off much at wideout to necessitate spending a draft pick.

Denver gets a veteran receiver to pair with Courtland Sutton and could then draft Haskins if he’s there. Let Haskins sit behind Keenum until he’s ready.

Not a bad idea!!!

[WrongVerb]

Michael Giardi
@MikeGiardi

McDaniels says the "book is closed" on any more interviews for a head coaching position. Said he was appreciative of the opportunity to interview with the #Packers. Is "here moving forward." #Patriots @nflnetwork
4:28pm · 8 Jan 2019

[Slyder]

After how he did the Colts I'm surprised any team would even give him the time of day. I personally would fire anyone who try to convince me to hire him.

[WVRed]

After how he did the Lions I'm surprised any team would even give him the time of day. I personally would fire anyone who try to convince me to hire him.

*Colts


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Slyder]

*Colts


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Fixed, trying to do this at lunch SUCKS.

[Tom Servo]

Kliff Kingsbury is the choice in Arizona.

It's gonna be scrutinized but I think it's a pretty smart hire given how the league is trending offensively, despite how on the surface it looks like a fired guy failing upwards. But if Arizona had chosen Kingsbury a year ago instead of Steve Wilks, when Kingsbury was still the Texas Tech head coach, would anybody have batted an eye in regards to Kingsbury? Did Texas Tech's poor finish this season and the firing mean Kingsbury went from legitimate candidate to non-starter?

That said, I don't think Wilks was treated very fairly. They shouldn't have hired him last year if they weren't prepared to give him more slack.

[WVRed]

Translation: “The only team worth my time was the Packers and they went a different direction.”

I honestly don’t see what the big deal is with McDaniels. He’s already failed once as a head coach.

[WVRed]

Kliff Kingsbury is the choice in Arizona.

It's gonna be scrutinized but I think it's a pretty smart hire given how the league is trending offensively, despite how on the surface it looks like a fired guy failing upwards. But if Arizona had chosen Kingsbury a year ago instead of Steve Wilks, when Kingsbury was still the Texas Tech head coach, would anybody have batted an eye in regards to Kingsbury? Did Texas Tech's poor finish this season and the firing mean Kingsbury went from legitimate candidate to non-starter?

That said, I don't think Wilks was treated very fairly. They shouldn't have hired him last year if they weren't prepared to give him more slack.

It’s questionable in that Kingsbury has zero NFL coaching experience and a losing record as a college coach.

Being hired as an offensive coordinator in the NFL? Sure. Head coach is a bit of a reach.

[Tom Servo]

It’s questionable in that Kingsbury has zero NFL coaching experience and a losing record as a college coach.

Being hired as an offensive coordinator in the NFL? Sure. Head coach is a bit of a reach.
I do think any other team hiring him as a head coach would be reaching, but given the shape the Cardinals are in I think going with a guy who was always highly thought of, right up until he got fired and wasn't, is a pretty good and bold choice. Because of their lack of talent and the fact that they'd just dumped a new coach after a year, the League's top candidates weren't going to be beating down the door to coach for them. At least Kingsbury offers more upside and fresher ideas than retreads like McCarthy and Gase, I'd compare him to a respected offensive coordinator coming off a bad season.

[WrongVerb]

Arians to the Bucs:



Ian Rapoport
@RapSheet

The #Bucs are signing Bruce Arians to a 4-year deal with a fifth-yaer option, source said. Among the coaches Arians hopes to finalize deals with: Harold Goodwin as Run Game Coordinator/OLine, Byron Leftwich as Pass Game Coordinator and Clyde Christianson as QB coach.
10:21pm · 8 Jan 2019

[Assembly Hall]

Arians to the Bucs:

Notre Dame fans will breathe a sigh of relief.

[Chip R]

Translation: “The only team worth my time was the Packers and they went a different direction.”

I honestly don’t see what the big deal is with McDaniels. He’s already failed once as a head coach.

True. But so did Belichick. Pete Carroll did too. I'm not saying McDaniels is going to be the next Belichick or Carroll but to call him a failure because he failed his first time out is premature. I think McDaniels is going to stay right where he's at until Belichick retires. That stunt he pulled with Indy last year did not help him. Teams are going to wonder if they will get jilted at the altar too.

[WVRed]

True. But so did Belichick. Pete Carroll did too. I'm not saying McDaniels is going to be the next Belichick or Carroll but to call him a failure because he failed his first time out is premature. I think McDaniels is going to stay right where he's at until Belichick retires. That stunt he pulled with Indy last year did not help him. Teams are going to wonder if they will get jilted at the altar too.

Agree, just sick of the media attention with him every time there’s a major opening.

[Todd Gack]

I do think any other team hiring him as a head coach would be reaching, but given the shape the Cardinals are in I think going with a guy who was always highly thought of, right up until he got fired and wasn't, is a pretty good and bold choice. Because of their lack of talent and the fact that they'd just dumped a new coach after a year, the League's top candidates weren't going to be beating down the door to coach for them. At least Kingsbury offers more upside and fresher ideas than retreads like McCarthy and Gase, I'd compare him to a respected offensive coordinator coming off a bad season.

I agree with this take. I just don't think he'll end up being a good HC.

[WrongVerb]

Kitchens to the Browns
Fangio to the Broncos

[WrongVerb]

NFL on ESPN
@ESPNNFL

The Browns have relieved DC Gregg Williams of his duties and he is no longer with the team, sources tell @DanGrazianoESPN & @PatMcManamon.
5:21pm · 9 Jan 2019

[Chip R]

Agree, just sick of the media attention with him every time there’s a major opening.

Agreed.

[Slyder]

Kliff Kingsbury is the choice in Arizona.

It's gonna be scrutinized but I think it's a pretty smart hire given how the league is trending offensively, despite how on the surface it looks like a fired guy failing upwards. But if Arizona had chosen Kingsbury a year ago instead of Steve Wilks, when Kingsbury was still the Texas Tech head coach, would anybody have batted an eye in regards to Kingsbury? Did Texas Tech's poor finish this season and the firing mean Kingsbury went from legitimate candidate to non-starter?

That said, I don't think Wilks was treated very fairly. They shouldn't have hired him last year if they weren't prepared to give him more slack.

Former WVU OC and current Texas State HC Jake Spavital is in the running to be OC for Arizona. I personally would bet on myself and stay at college. Kingsbury is to Arizona what Dennis Allen was to Oakland... a fall guy to get them through the worst of the rebuilding and hope someone better is interested in 2 years. Meanwhile at Texas State you probably have 3 years before the seat even begins to get warm and if you succeed, you've already moved on to a bigger program.

[WVRed]

Hot rumor that Arizona is looking to draft Kyler Murray first overall and trade Josh Rosen.

[Sea Ray]

Hot rumor that Arizona is looking to draft Kyler Murray first overall and trade Josh Rosen.

Yeah, ESPN was having fun with that one this morning. I'm not a fan of Rosen so I don't know what to make of this except to say that I see this whole Kingsbury pick as a disaster. It would mean enough $$ for Kyler to live off of for life

[WVRed]

Yeah, ESPN was having fun with that one this morning. I'm not a fan of Rosen so I don't know what to make of this except to say that I see this whole Kingsbury pick as a disaster. It would mean enough $$ for Kyler to live off of for life

Or at least have a decision to make for his immediate future. Football or baseball?

Still, he’s a 5’10 QB who at best is Russell Wilson (who the Seahawks got in the third round). It could work, but he’s not a first overall pick even without baseball being in the picture.

[Kingspoint]

You'd have a fool for a G.M. who wastes a 1st, or even a 2nd Round pick on a player who signed a $4.7M Bonus with another sport.

[Assembly Hall]

Hot rumor that Arizona is looking to draft Kyler Murray first overall and trade Josh Rosen.

Media "click bait".

[Sea Ray]

You'd have a fool for a G.M. who wastes a 1st, or even a 2nd Round pick on a player who signed a $4.7M Bonus with another sport.

If he's the #1 overall pick he'll get Baker Mayfield money which is over $30mill in guaranteed money. With that option, you can forget the baseball route. He's going football. Baseball's no longer a factor.

[Kingspoint]

If he's the #1 overall pick he'll get Baker Mayfield money which is over $30mill in guaranteed money. With that option, you can forget the baseball route. He's going football. Baseball's no longer a factor.

5'10" QB's will never be a #1 pick.

[WVRed]

5'10" QB's will never be a #1 pick.

And former college head coaches with losing records won’t be their head coach.

I would normally agree as it is common sense, but Arizona doesn’t seem to be operating that way.

[Sea Ray]

5'10" QB's will never be a #1 pick.

They shouldn't be...but then there's Arizona...

[Kingspoint]

And former college head coaches with losing records won’t be their head coach.

I would normally agree as it is common sense, but Arizona doesn’t seem to be operating that way.

Arians didn't quit for nothing. Arians is not a quitter.

[WVRed]

Arians didn't quit for nothing. Arians is not a quitter.

I know. I was talking about Arizona hiring Kingsbury.

[Assembly Hall]

I know. I was talking about Arizona hiring Kingsbury.

I think Kingspoint was inferring that Arians left for a reason. And my take is the Arizona organization.

[WrongVerb]

Matt Rhule’s side of Jets saga: I wouldn’t accept ‘arranged marriage’ (https://nypost.com/2019/01/11/matt-rhules-side-of-jets-saga-i-wouldnt-accept-arranged-marriage/):


After a confusing conclusion to Matt Rhule’s Jets’ coaching candidacy, he is now providing answers.

Speaking to KRZI-AM 1660 Waco on Thursday, the Baylor head coach confirmed he and the Jets could not agree on his prospective staff in New York.

“At the end of the day, I’m never going to be in an arranged marriage,” Rhule told the radio station. “I’m never going to subcontract jobs to the offense and defense. I always want to hire people that believe in what I believe, that are going to do things our way, that are going to believe in process, that are going to be part of a program. I truly believe that programs win.”

[WrongVerb]

ig: josinaanderson
@JosinaAnderson

I'm told the #Cardinals are planning to hire Vance Joseph as defensive coordinator, per sources. They are still in discussions on a deal.
6:06pm · 11 Jan 2019

[Sea Ray]

ig: josinaanderson
@JosinaAnderson

I'm told the #Cardinals are planning to hire Vance Joseph as defensive coordinator, per sources. They are still in discussions on a deal.
6:06pm · 11 Jan 2019

They've also supposedly hired Steve Sarkisian as OC. Those are two excellent hires for a young inexperienced head coach

[Assembly Hall]

They've also supposedly hired Steve Sarkisian as OC. Those are two excellent hires for a young inexperienced head coach

I will drink to that!!!!!!

[Slyder]

They've also supposedly hired Steve Sarkisian as OC. Those are two excellent hires for a young inexperienced head coach

Or sabotage him at every step in hope of getting the gig after he gets canned in 2 years.

[Chip R]

They've also supposedly hired Steve Sarkisian as OC. Those are two excellent hires for a young inexperienced head coach

Sark is going to Bama.

https://es.pn/2TJCNm0

[Assembly Hall]

Sark is going to Bama.

https://es.pn/2TJCNm0

I will drink to that!!!!!!

[texasdave]

NFL work stoppage, anyone? http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/25749860/language-new-coaches-contracts-hints-possible-nfl-work-stoppage-2021

[Boston Red]

NFL work stoppage, anyone? http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/25749860/language-new-coaches-contracts-hints-possible-nfl-work-stoppage-2021

I'll worry about that in about...30 months.

[Hillsdale87]

Tom Brady appears to still be good. Amazing the way the Patriots continue to out-scheme more talented teams


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Sea Ray]

NFL work stoppage, anyone? http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/25749860/language-new-coaches-contracts-hints-possible-nfl-work-stoppage-2021

The owners are just covering themselves "in case of..." They're outstanding businessmen. The best of all sports. They have everything to gain and nothing to lose by doing this.

My guess is that the players want guaranteed contracts. I don't see that happening and the owners hold the cards here seeing as the avg NFL career is so short. The players can't afford to sit out a work stoppage. These billionaire owners sure can.

[Sea Ray]

Tom Brady appears to still be good. Amazing the way the Patriots continue to out-scheme more talented teams




What's amazing this weekend is the enormous advantage there is to the "bye" teams. They first of all get the week off and the home field but in many cases they get the weather advantage too. Big weather difference of NE and SD,Ca...and wintry KC last night as opposed to the Lucas Oil Dome in Indy. As a fan it kinda sucks but I'm not suggesting anything be done about it.

[Boston Red]

Do you think there's really a weather advantage? Do you think the Patriots and Chiefs players like playing in cold weather any more than Colts and Chargers players?

[Assembly Hall]

Do you think there's really a weather advantage? Do you think the Patriots and Chiefs players like playing in cold weather any more than Colts and Chargers players?

I don't think anybody likes playing in cold weather to be honest. But the Colts did practice outside in Indy. Now the Chargers, that is a different story.

[Sea Ray]

Do you think there's really a weather advantage? Do you think the Patriots and Chiefs players like playing in cold weather any more than Colts and Chargers players?

I think they're more used to it. I would tell you that dome teams don't do well on the road in the playoffs but then someone would say prove it and I don't wanna go there...:) but...yeah, I think there is a weather advantage for certain teams. I definitely think the weather helped the Bengals get to their first Super Bowl when they beat Dan Fouts and the SD Chargers. If someone had opined "do you really think the Bengals enjoy playing in the cold anymore than the Chargers" I'd have replied "did you watch the game?"

[Boston Red]

I was 4 or 5, so...no! :)

[Sea Ray]

I don't think anybody likes playing in cold weather to be honest. But the Colts did practice outside in Indy. Now the Chargers, that is a different story.

Hey Assembly, how much snow did you get in your part of Indiana? We got 9" in my area of NE Cincinnati. I just finished my workout of shoveling it. The worst part is my back but I think it'll be OK. It was heavy snow...

[Assembly Hall]

Hey Assembly, how much snow did you get in your part of Indiana? We got 9" in my area of NE Cincinnati. I just finished my workout of shoveling it. The worst part is my back but I think it'll be OK. It was heavy snow...

Didn't get much here SR. 3". The storm went south. My cousin around Indy said she got 7". Get you an adult beverage to sooth that back.

[Sea Ray]

In beginning of the game introductions where players announce the school where they came from, yesterday UC's own Travis Kelce, star TE of the Chiefs, eschewed mentioning the University of Cincinnati and instead chose to announce his high school. Anyone know if there's something up with that? Is there some ill will between him and UC? Just wonderin'...

[Assembly Hall]

I think they're more used to it. I would tell you that dome teams don't do well on the road in the playoffs but then someone would say prove it and I don't wanna go there...:) but...yeah, I think there is a weather advantage for certain teams. I definitely think the weather helped the Bengals get to their first Super Bowl when they beat Dan Fouts and the SD Chargers. If someone had opined "do you really think the Bengals enjoy playing in the cold anymore than the Chargers" I'd have replied "did you watch the game?"

There are some things that I could point out but I won't because I am chuckling.

We had an unseasonable November here in Northern Indiana. Hell, it was just cold. Florida St. played at Notre Dame, I am thinking it was maybe the second Saturday of the month. It was cold. I mean real cold. To top it off, it was a night game. Florida St. did not want to be there. LOL They looked like they were freezing to death. I know they weren't very good, but they looked miserable due to the weather.

Do I think weather gives an advantage to some teams? Sometimes. I don't think it was the issue with the Colts. With the Chargers? Yes.

[WrongVerb]

Kyler Murray
@TheKylerMurray

I have declared for the NFL Draft.
8:23pm · 14 Jan 2019

[Kingspoint]

Rivers, more than any QB over the last 20 years, has never had a problem traveling and playing in any weather. He's proven it more times than other QB's hhave career starts.

[GAC]

I can now understand why I quit watching the stupid Pro Bowl game 30+ years ago. I could only stomach the first half (LOL). It's billed as an All-Star game. No denying there were all-stars on the field; but it was like watching a neighborhood backyard game of two-hand touch with the players laughing, hugging, just having a good ol' time, and the refs blowing a play dead as soon as there was any sign of contact. There was 101 total yards rushing between both teams. And it wasn't because of stout defensive play either (LOL). RBs like Elliot, Hill, Barkley, only had 2-3 carries.

I know it's a meaningless game, means nothing; but that was simply a poor (laughable) exhibition of football, and the NFL should be embarrassed at televising what I was witnessing yesterday.

[RedsBaron]

I've long thought the Pro Bowl should be abolished. Picking a Pro Bowl team is fine, but actually playing a game is too risky for injuries. Obviously there is some injury risk in any team sport-there have been injuries in MLB's All Star game (Ted Williams in 1950 and Ray Fosse in 1970 come to mind)-but the risk is much higher in football, a full contact sport.

[cumberlandreds]

I can now understand why I quit watching the stupid Pro Bowl game 30+ years ago. I could only stomach the first half (LOL). It's billed as an All-Star game. No denying there were all-stars on the field; but it was like watching a neighborhood backyard game of two-hand touch with the players laughing, hugging, just having a good ol' time, and the refs blowing a play dead as soon as there was any sign of contact. There was 101 total yards rushing between both teams. And it wasn't because of stout defensive play either (LOL). RBs like Elliot, Hill, Barkley, only had 2-3 carries.

I know it's a meaningless game, means nothing; but that was simply a poor (laughable) exhibition of football, and the NFL should be embarrassed at televising what I was witnessing yesterday.

I actually didn't even know the Pro Bowl was being played until yesterday afternoon. We were visiting this older couple from our church at an assisted living facility and the man mentioned he was going to watch the football game. I asked him what game since the Super Bowl isn't until next week? He said the Pro Bowl and I said oh.. OK they still play that game? I always thought it was the most useless of games played. No one cared about it. It was after the season was over and it was obvious the players really didn't care.

[GAC]

I've long thought the Pro Bowl should be abolished. Picking a Pro Bowl team is fine, but actually playing a game is too risky for injuries. Obviously there is some injury risk in any team sport-there have been injuries in MLB's All Star game (Ted Williams in 1950 and Ray Fosse in 1970 come to mind)-but the risk is much higher in football, a full contact sport.

I agree. This is a sport where there is far too much at risk because it is so physical. Who wants to risk sitting out a good part of, or maybe all of, the next season because of an injury sustained in the Pro Bowl? Common sense there.

I wonder if the NFL can abolish it without consulting with the Player's Union? After all, isn't that like taking away paid vacation for your employees? (LOL) And the Pro Bowl winners get a paycheck bigger then the Super Bowl losers.

If the NFL wants to give players, and their families, a paid vacation that includes playing a friendly game of two-handed touch that's fine. Maybe they can line up some grills and picnic tables on the sidelines cooking Johnsonville brats and serving one's favorite refreshment. Also some lawn chairs and blankets. Heck, get your kids involved. Make it a "Take Your Kid To Work" thing, and let them be the place holders for kicks (LOL).

Just don't televise it! Because you're not watching a football game.. you're watching home movies! LOL

[GAC]

I actually didn't even know the Pro Bowl was being played until yesterday afternoon. We were visiting this older couple from our church at an assisted living facility and the man mentioned he was going to watch the football game. I asked him what game since the Super Bowl isn't until next week? He said the Pro Bowl and I said oh.. OK they still play that game? I always thought it was the most useless of games played. No one cared about it. It was after the season was over and it was obvious the players really didn't care.

Dude. I was simply bored. Saw it was on ... "Hey! There's still some football left! What the heck!" ... so we watched it. Well, only the first half. All we could stomach (LOL). We actually turned on his Wii and started playing golf games (LOL).

[CTA513]

Jon Kitna is back in the NFL and Kellen Moore has been named the Cowboys OC.




It’s Official: Kellen Moore Named New OC

The team also formally announced Jon Kitna as new quarterbacks coach, the role Moore held last season.

https://www.dallascowboys.com/news/it-s-official-kellen-moore-named-new-oc?sf206981620=1

[WrongVerb]

Roger Goodell breaks silence on controversial no-call in NFC championship game (https://sports.yahoo.com/roger-goodell-breaks-silence-controversial-no-call-nfc-championship-game-182248316.html)


ATLANTA – After failing to publicly address one of the biggest officiating failures in the history of his tenure as NFL commissioner, Roger Goodell finally spoke Wednesday about the controversial no-call in the NFC championship game that arguably denied the New Orleans Saints a trip to Super Bowl LIII.

His response: These things happen and the NFL simply has to do better.

“We understand the frustration of the fans,” Goodell told media after making remarks about the upcoming Atlanta Super Bowl. “I’ve talked to coach [Sean] Payton, the team the players. We understand the frustration that they feel right now. We certainly want to address that.

“Whenever officiating is part of any kind of discussion postgame, it’s never a good outcome for us. We know that. Our clubs know that. Our officials know that. But we also know our officials are human. We also know that they’re officiating a game that moves very quickly and have to make snap decisions under difficult circumstances. And they’re not going to get it right all the time.””

blah blah blah

[Sea Ray]

Roger Goodell breaks silence on controversial no-call in NFC championship game (https://sports.yahoo.com/roger-goodell-breaks-silence-controversial-no-call-nfc-championship-game-182248316.html)



blah blah blah

He didn't say much but I did take two things away from it:

1) He admitted that the call should have been made, thus the bad call did determine who went to the Super Bowl

2) He said that he does NOT have the power to over rule judgment calls in the NFL. Some media reported otherwise after the game

[kaldaniels]

RIP Wade Wilson.

Died on his 60th birthday.

[15fan]

A friend of my wife was at some sort of Super Bowl function yesterday. She walked up to a guy and said “you look important. Where do you work?”

“I’m with the Eagles.”

“What do you do? Marketing?”

“I play safety.”

It was Malcolm Jenkins.

So she took the obligatory picture with him and started sharing with friends.

Best part of the story: her husband is a big Michigan fan. :laugh:

[GAC]

He didn't say much but I did take two things away from it:

1) He admitted that the call should have been made, thus the bad call did determine who went to the Super Bowl

2) He said that he does NOT have the power to over rule judgment calls in the NFL. Some media reported otherwise after the game

And that is all he can do. Make a public acknowledgement. Do fans really think the NFL should go back, after-the-fact, and reverse a win/lose? The NFL did the same thing after refs ripped a W from the Browns when they played the Raiders. Could that one more win have helped the Browns make the post-season? Not sure, and really don't care.

I hate missed calls as much as anyone. But have always considered them an "unfortunate" part of the game. But when you witness one like in the N.O. game ... that are so damn blatant, right in front of everyone's eyes (including the refs), that make you throw your hands in the air and yell "WTF ref??" ... those are very hard to accept and explain.

I think the technology is fine. In fact, IMO, it's helped catch a lot of missed calls that otherwise wouldn't have gotten corrected. I think the problem is that they've put too many "limitations" on the who, when, and how? They've put too many rules on when it can be used so there are "gaps". That no-call in the New Orleans game, IMO, is a perfect example. There was no flag, no call made. Therefore, replay could not be utilized in that situation (that's what I read anyway). IMO, there has to be someone "above" those on-field refs, maybe in the control booth with the technology, who, when they see a play like this that they feel the refs have missed, where they can intervene and say "Lets take a look at this. We want to get it right." Now you'd probably have to place a limitation on that - number of times it can be utilized in a game - because then your broadcast networks go nutsy because of the time variable and what it cost them.

How does a defender get fined $26,739 for the hit he made on a no-call play? LOL When refs miss such blatant and obvious calls like that, I can understand some of the conspiracy theories that pop up. IMO, it was inexcusable, and I have a hard time with this "OK. We missed it" responses.

And the other thing going around is that four of those refs involved in that no-call have strong ties, even live in, southern California. It's more of a perception thing then anything else. But some have suggested that the NFL should have seen this, and to avoid that perception, used other refs. I personally don't think there's anything to it; but many fans, and some media, immediately pointed it out to stoke those conspiracy theories.

[Sea Ray]

And that is all he can do. Make a public acknowledgement. Do fans really think the NFL should go back, after-the-fact, and reverse a win/lose? The NFL did the same thing after refs ripped a W from the Browns when they played the Raiders. Could that one more win have helped the Browns make the post-season? Not sure, and really don't care.

I hate missed calls as much as anyone. But have always considered them an "unfortunate" part of the game. But when you witness one like in the N.O. game ... that are so damn blatant, right in front of everyone's eyes (including the refs), that make you throw your hands in the air and yell "WTF ref??" ... those are very hard to accept and explain.

I think the technology is fine. In fact, IMO, it's helped catch a lot of missed calls that otherwise wouldn't have gotten corrected. I think the problem is that they've put too many "limitations" on the who, when, and how? They've put too many rules on when it can be used so there are "gaps". That no-call in the New Orleans game, IMO, is a perfect example. There was no flag, no call made. Therefore, replay could not be utilized in that situation (that's what I read anyway). IMO, there has to be someone "above" those on-field refs, maybe in the control booth with the technology, who, when they see a play like this that they feel the refs have missed, where they can intervene and say "Lets take a look at this. We want to get it right." Now you'd probably have to place a limitation on that - number of times it can be utilized in a game - because then your broadcast networks go nutsy because of the time variable and what it cost them.

How does a defender get fined $26,739 for the hit he made on a no-call play? LOL When refs miss such blatant and obvious calls like that, I can understand some of the conspiracy theories that pop up. IMO, it was inexcusable, and I have a hard time with this "OK. We missed it" responses.

And the other thing going around is that four of those refs involved in that no-call have strong ties, even live in, southern California. It's more of a perception thing then anything else. But some have suggested that the NFL should have seen this, and to avoid that perception, used other refs. I personally don't think there's anything to it; but many fans, and some media, immediately pointed it out to stoke those conspiracy theories.

I found it interesting that Drew Brees said recently that he didn't think Godell said enough about the call until his annual press conference. That's not what Godell told us. The Commissioner said that he reached out to both coach Payton and the owner of the Saints after the game and told them that it was a call that should have been made. So the Commissioner DID address it right away. What's Drew complaining about?

[WVRed]

Worst.

Super Bowl.

Ever.

[Boston Red]

Worst.

Super Bowl.

Ever.

Worst postseason game ever.

- - - Updated - - -


Worst.

Super Bowl.

Ever.

Worst postseason game ever.

[Boston Red]

I have no idea who to even make MVP. Belichick?

[WVRed]

I’ve never seen a team shoot themselves in the foot in a super bowl as many times as the Rams have in this game.

[SteelSD]

I have no idea who to even make MVP. Belichick?

For the Pats? Jared Goff

[Boston Red]

This postgame scrum is more exciting than the game.

[kaldaniels]

The Rams were not ready for Prime Time.

[WrongVerb]

Supunt Bowl

Yawn.

[Sea Ray]

After a season full of RPOs, trick plays, wide open spreads, sub 4.4 athletes and wildcats this game had none of that. Straight forward drop back passing with a fair amount of QBs under center. Saints/Chiefs would have been a much better game.

A good case can be made that the Rams shouldn't have been there. Goff looked like a deer in the headlights. Similar to Peyton's last Super Bowl win, Brady's is due to his defense. He looked his age on several throws tonight.

Not to take anything away from what the Patriots have accomplished but the fact remains, a great deal of their success is due to the ineptitude of the teams in their division. This means byes during the playoffs and lots of home games. They can only play who they play but that is one factor in their success

[texasdave]

The Rams would have been better served to let Shane Falco play the second half.

[757690]

The fact that the Pats have been in the last three Super Bowls and won twice, means that NFL is a joke.

The Pats were caught cheating time and time again for years, and should have been given the death penelty. Instead, the NFL did little to stop them from cheating again.

It’s really hard to take any of the games seriously.

[The Villian]

The fact that the Pats have been in the last three Super Bowls and won twice, means that NFL is a joke.

The Pats were caught cheating time and time again for years, and should have been given the death penelty. Instead, the NFL did little to stop them from cheating again
It’s really hard to take any of the games seriously. NFL=National Fixed League

[Kingspoint]

The fact that the Pats have been in the last three Super Bowls and won twice, means that NFL is a joke.

The Pats were caught cheating time and time again for years, and should have been given the death penelty. Instead, the NFL did little to stop them from cheating again.

It’s really hard to take any of the games seriously.

Football is often compared to War. So many Wars were won because one side had better espionage than the other, from the American Revolution to WWII. Same is true in the NFL.

If you aren't cheating, you aren't trying.

[757690]

Football is often compared to War. So many Wars were won because one side had better espionage than the other, from the American Revolution to WWII. Same is true in the NFL.

If you aren't cheating, you aren't trying.

When we watch sports, we want some basic level of integrity, of knowing that the game was fairly played and honestly won. I don’t have that when I watch the NFL. It’s so hard to suspend disbelief now, that I can’t invest myself in the game like I used to.

If the fix is in, then why watch?

[kaldaniels]

When we watch sports, we want some basic level of integrity, of knowing that the game was fairly played and honestly won. I don’t have that when I watch the NFL. It’s so hard to suspend disbelief now, that I can’t invest myself in the game like I used to.

If the fix is in, then why watch?

How would you compare Spygate and Deflategate to the Cardinals hacking incident, and your willingness to watch MLB but your difficulty stomaching the NFL?

The only difference I see is that Correa took the fall for the Cardinals, but I suspect he wasn’t the only one involved. (And he says the Astros were found using Cardinals proprietary info). Regardless I just assume there is always stuff behind the scenes that stinks, in any sport.

- here’s one of my favorite books I read as a kid...taught me that someone is always up to something

https://www.amazon.com/Aint-Cheating-You-Dont-Caught/dp/0140116524

[757690]

How would you compare Spygate and Deflategate to the Cardinals hacking incident, and your willingness to watch MLB but your difficulty stomaching the NFL?

The only difference I see is that Correa took the fall for the Cardinals, but I suspect he wasn’t the only one involved. (And he says the Astros were found using Cardinals proprietary info). Regardless I just assume there is always stuff behind the scenes that stinks, in any sport.

- here’s one of my favorite books I read as a kid...taught me that someone is always up to something

https://www.amazon.com/Aint-Cheating-You-Dont-Caught/dp/0140116524

Have you not been reading my posts about the Cardinals and PED’s?

I feel the same way about MLB as I do about the NFL.

[kaldaniels]

Have you not been reading my posts about the Cardinals and PED’s?

I feel the same way about MLB as I do about the NFL.

“It’s hard to take any of the games seriously.”

I had no idea you get that way about MLB but now I know.

[757690]

“It’s hard to take any of the games seriously.”

I had no idea you get that way about MLB but now I know.

I watch, or listen to games, but passively, for entertainment and really haven’t cared too much about the outcome in years. As I said, I’m not invested like I used to be.

[Kingspoint]

When we watch sports, we want some basic level of integrity, of knowing that the game was fairly played and honestly won. I don’t have that when I watch the NFL. It’s so hard to suspend disbelief now, that I can’t invest myself in the game like I used to.

If the fix is in, then why watch?
The Yankees have ten times more money than the REDS and the game is designed to reward them for that. Why watch the REDS?

[Kingspoint]

When we watch sports, we want some basic level of integrity, of knowing that the game was fairly played and honestly won. I don’t have that when I watch the NFL. It’s so hard to suspend disbelief now, that I can’t invest myself in the game like I used to.

If the fix is in, then why watch?

My Spouse asks me the same question about the NBA.

I guess I'm looking for the stars to align and I'm invested. I also love Sports and people pushing themselves to their limits and personal triumph. I also call out the cheating whenever I can to try to keep it in check.

I know for a fact that effort and desire can overcome great odds. I also support an underdog. I also know that intelligence can overcome great odds by finding and exploiting a weakness in any system, and every system has them.

[Assembly Hall]

When my Dad says it is the worst SB he has ever seen, I take him at his word.

[757690]

The Yankees have ten times more money than the REDS and the game is designed to reward them for that. Why watch the REDS?

That’s a good point, and something MLB needs to address more, though they are trying. It might be one reason why MLB is losing fans.

- - - Updated - - -

Final score:

Patriots 13
Maroon 5
Rams 3

[Kingspoint]

After a season full of RPOs, trick plays, wide open spreads, sub 4.4 athletes and wildcats this game had none of that. Straight forward drop back passing with a fair amount of QBs under center. Saints/Chiefs would have been a much better game.

A good case can be made that the Rams shouldn't have been there. Goff looked like a deer in the headlights. Similar to Peyton's last Super Bowl win, Brady's is due to his defense. He looked his age on several throws tonight.

Not to take anything away from what the Patriots have accomplished but the fact remains, a great deal of their success is due to the ineptitude of the teams in their division. This means byes during the playoffs and lots of home games. They can only play who they play but that is one factor in their success

The RAMS belonged. Goff didn't.

On a day their Offense punted the first nine times they had the ball, their Defense kept the Patriots out of the endzone, while giving up a lone FG through 3-1/2 Quarters. McVay's play-calling was atrocious. Glad he's not going to be the Bengals' new HC.

Goff reverted back to his Rookie season. He should have been pulled at Halftime and Mannion be given a try. At least they could have worked the Oregon State connection of Mannion-to-Brooks better. Instead they had the Oregon State Punter represent their Offense the whole game.

[Kingspoint]

Not that NCAA Basketball or NCAA Football or the Olympics or Top-level Soccer has ever had cheating or anything... What gets me is that there are people gullible enough to believe that there is any sport that doesn't have cheating and attempts at manipulating the outcomes for the benefit of making more money for the Owners or some "Good 'Ol Boys" backroom promises. There hasn't been a political election at the National, State or Local level since Jefferson beat Adams that hasn't had cheating involved. It's a fact of life when adults and lots of money and power are involved that greed overcomes morality in so many. Everyone in power wants to keep that power and many who don't have the power are trying to get it, and adults don't play fair. What they do and what they say have absolutely nothing to do with each other.

[Kingspoint]

..it's everywhere in everything, from "organics" to anything you can think of.


Adidas, the second-largest athletic apparel and footwear brand in the world, funded a "black opps" crew that funneled payments to high school basketball players' families so their sons would attend an Adidas-affiliated school. Dramatic testimony from an Adidas bagman-turned government witness at a criminal fraud trial in October ripped the lid off the corruption long suspected in the sport and the footwear companies' role.

[RedTeamGo!]

Football is often compared to War. So many Wars were won because one side had better espionage than the other, from the American Revolution to WWII. Same is true in the NFL.

If you aren't cheating, you aren't trying.

Good point, war sucks...and so does NFL football.

[cumberlandreds]

I think this Super Bowl is example 1A on why I hardly watch the NFL any longer. It's just a bad product they put on the field. I would rather spend my time now doing something else.

[Rojo Rijo]

Woke up this morning, over it, who cares cause its not like I'm a Rams fan (Jags). Then I make the mistake of turning on the radio and its on ESPN and I hear Trey Wingo telling everybody that if you didn't like the SuperBowl to shut the hell up and you should've just turned it off.

Ok, I get it. The mans livelihood is directly impacted by the NFL but 1) If you take a step back and realize a grown adult professional is telling millions of people to shut the hell up and 2) If you don't like it turn it off. How am I supposed to know I don't like it unless I watch it? Childish reaction by Wingo but not surprising.

I actually did turn it off after the 4Q INT by Goff on the play right after Cooks dropped the TD. It was the worst SB I've ever watched and I bet you 85-90% of the viewers felt the same way. The game was bad, the commercials weren't anything special (and haven't been in forever, though I attribute that to most companies likely choosing to focus more on online/media advertising. It felt like every other commercial was bud/bud light), and the halftime show was a massive disappointment, though I saw that coming.

[WVRed]

Woke up this morning, over it, who cares cause its not like I'm a Rams fan (Jags). Then I make the mistake of turning on the radio and its on ESPN and I hear Trey Wingo telling everybody that if you didn't like the SuperBowl to shut the hell up and you should've just turned it off.

Ok, I get it. The mans livelihood is directly impacted by the NFL but 1) If you take a step back and realize a grown adult professional is telling millions of people to shut the hell up and 2) If you don't like it turn it off. How am I supposed to know I don't like it unless I watch it?

I actually did turn it off after the 4Q INT by Goff on the play right after Cooks dropped the TD. It was the worst SB I've ever watched and I bet you 85-90% of the viewers felt the same way. The game was bad, the commercials weren't anything special (and haven't been in forever, though I attribute that to most companies likely choosing to focus more on online/media advertising. It felt like every other commercial was bud/bud light), and the halftime show was a massive disappointment, though I saw that coming.

The only thing about the Super Bowl I even cared about was this:

https://youtu.be/-iFq6IcAxBc

And that was online shortly after it aired.

On a related note, I kinda wish the snap was real so I didn’t have to watch that game last night.[emoji846]

[puca]

I find lifetime channel movies more compelling than this year's version of the Super Bowl, but I suppose that belongs in a different thread.

I do think that if the NFL were really 'fixed' though, the Chiefs would have made it past the Patriots in the conference game. That's the team I think the majority of the country wanted to see on the big stage. Unfortunately for most of the country, the Patriots are just better at preparing for and executing in big games than the rest of the league.

[GAC]

The fact that the Pats have been in the last three Super Bowls and won twice, means that NFL is a joke.

So when other teams have done the same thing (Pitt, Dallas, 49ers, Denver), that means there's something wrong with the NFL, the fix is in?


The Pats were caught cheating time and time again for years, and should have been given the death penelty. Instead, the NFL did little to stop them from cheating again.

I don't know what you're inferring by "death penalty"? LOL

In recent history there have been what some call "major" scandals involving the Patriots .... Spygate and Deflategate.

A far as I'm concerned.. and if you ask most NFL coaches they'll tell you the same ... it was Much Ado About Nothing. Videotaping your opponents offensive and defensive signals during a game is not prohibited by the league. Former Cowboys coach Jimmy Johnson, after Spygate, confessed that he did the same thing. It's standard practice. They all do it.

This whole "spygate" thing started with the NY Jets. In 2006 Goodell came out with a memo laying out approved and unapproved locations for filming. Who are the first to violate it? Two months later the Jets are caught engaging in the exact same filming activity vs the Patriots in Foxboro. The Patriots had the cameraman removed from the stadium. A year later, as a form of payback, the Jets flagged the Patriots for the same activity. These two teams, who aren't fond of each other at all, we're doing this tit-for-tat all season. So now newly installed Commish Goodell (and his massive ego) decides he can't allow a team to "disrespect" his authority. How dare they! I had no problem with the Pats getting disciplined. Just don't think the punishment fit the crime. It was more about Goodell's ego. But again, this Jets infraction was identical to the videotaping infraction that the Patriots would be harshly punished for a year later. Yet the NFL let this one slide because NFL commissioner (and former Jets public relations intern) Roger Goodell came out with some BS reasoning that the Jet's "infraction" didn't upset the competitive balance in the league.

And Deflategate was another overblown situation thanks to Goodell's ego....

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/redskins/in-trying-to-restore-his-authority-goodell-undermined-his-credibility/2015/05/21/142c8d2c-ffd4-11e4-805c-c3f407e5a9e9_story.html?postshare=2711432250632181&utm_term=.54e45bd59e79


NFL Commissioner Roger Goodell predetermined guilt in DeflateGate; that’s clear now. He has smeared Tom Brady and the New England Patriots without proper evidence or a competent investigation and turned an unimportant misdemeanor into a damaging scandal as part of a personal power play to shore up his flagging authority. In other cases, he just looked inept. In this one, he looks devious.

And the Well's Report that the NFL relied on was deeply flawed and unreliable ....https://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/14/opinion/deflating-deflategate.html?_r=0

The bottom-line is ... you had many NFL QBs who came out in defense of Brady saying this was silliness because it's a practice that most NFL QBs do and have done for ages. They're all adjusting the ball for the best feel/fit for them, and everyone has always looked the other way.

And the officials insured the balls were properly inflated for the second half of the Pats-Indy game. And that's when Brady tore them a new A-hole (LOL).

All the NFL teams are cheating (LOL) .... https://yourteamcheats.com/

[GAC]

I didn't watch the whole game. I wanted to, but kept falling asleep from boredom. I did DVR the game though, and put it in my Favorites labelled as "Sleep Aid" (LOL)

[RedsBaron]

If the officials hadn't blown the pass interference in the NFC title game, the Saints would have played the Patriots. I would have still favored New England to win, but I expect that New Orleans would have given the Patriots a more competitive and entertaining game.

[Sea Ray]

If the officials hadn't blown the pass interference in the NFC title game, the Saints would have played the Patriots. I would have still favored New England to win, but I expect that New Orleans would have given the Patriots a more competitive and entertaining game.

Agreed. The greatest game would have been NO vs KC. But it's fair to wonder if the Saints were robbed of a championship

[klw]

Rams were caught cheating 9 times during the game and were penalized 65 yards accordingly. Patriots were found cheating only 3 times and penalized 20 yards.

[757690]

So when other teams have done the same thing (Pitt, Dallas, 49ers, Denver), that means there's something wrong with the NFL, the fix is in?



I don't know what you're inferring by "death penalty"? LOL

In recent history there have been what some call "major" scandals involving the Patriots .... Spygate and Deflategate.

A far as I'm concerned.. and if you ask most NFL coaches they'll tell you the same ... it was Much Ado About Nothing. Videotaping your opponents offensive and defensive signals during a game is not prohibited by the league. Former Cowboys coach Jimmy Johnson, after Spygate, confessed that he did the same thing. It's standard practice. They all do it.

This whole "spygate" thing started with the NY Jets. In 2006 Goodell came out with a memo laying out approved and unapproved locations for filming. Who are the first to violate it? Two months later the Jets are caught engaging in the exact same filming activity vs the Patriots in Foxboro. The Patriots had the cameraman removed from the stadium. A year later, as a form of payback, the Jets flagged the Patriots for the same activity. These two teams, who aren't fond of each other at all, we're doing this tit-for-tat all season. So now newly installed Commish Goodell (and his massive ego) decides he can't allow a team to "disrespect" his authority. How dare they! I had no problem with the Pats getting disciplined. Just don't think the punishment fit the crime. It was more about Goodell's ego. But again, this Jets infraction was identical to the videotaping infraction that the Patriots would be harshly punished for a year later. Yet the NFL let this one slide because NFL commissioner (and former Jets public relations intern) Roger Goodell came out with some BS reasoning that the Jet's "infraction" didn't upset the competitive balance in the league.

And Deflategate was another overblown situation thanks to Goodell's ego....

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/redskins/in-trying-to-restore-his-authority-goodell-undermined-his-credibility/2015/05/21/142c8d2c-ffd4-11e4-805c-c3f407e5a9e9_story.html?postshare=2711432250632181&utm_term=.54e45bd59e79



And the Well's Report that the NFL relied on was deeply flawed and unreliable ....https://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/14/opinion/deflating-deflategate.html?_r=0

The bottom-line is ... you had many NFL QBs who came out in defense of Brady saying this was silliness because it's a practice that most NFL QBs do and have done for ages. They're all adjusting the ball for the best feel/fit for them, and everyone has always looked the other way.

And the officials insured the balls were properly inflated for the second half of the Pats-Indy game. And that's when Brady tore them a new A-hole (LOL).

All the NFL teams are cheating (LOL) .... https://yourteamcheats.com/

You are correct that videotaping other teams are not prohibited, and every team does it, but there are rules you have to follow which the Pats did not, and this is the important part, for years. The same for inflating or deflating balls. Other teams do it, but they do it within the rules most of the time.

Here is a good article about it:

http://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/spygate-revisited-how-patriots-scandal-false-rams-connections-impact-legacies/ypd04i8h1uov1xbp9u38mxhh0


When the NFL looked into New England's practice of filming signals, it discovered the Jets game was not an isolated incident. Rather, the Patriots had been stealing signals for years. According to ESPN, officials found handwritten diagrams of the defensive signals of the Steelers at New England headquarters, including the notes used in the 2002 AFC championship game, won by the Patriots, 24-17.

Instead of simply confiscating all the tapes, the NFL destroyed the evidence on the spot.

Confused? So were many team owners and officials around the league. Not only had the punishment been handed out less than a week after the Jets game — hardly enough time for a thorough investigation — but the evidence teams around the league were interested in had been swiftly destroyed.

Goodell reportedly told team owners he ordered the tapes obliterated so they couldn't be used again, but people around the league struggled to accept that explanation, according to ESPN... ESPN also reported that, in addition to stealing signals, Patriots staff members would sneak into visiting locker rooms to take play sheets. The Patriots denied those reports.[/B]

This wasn't the ordinary attempt to get an advantage that most teams practice. This was a decade long, organizational cheating that went far beyond what most teams do. I think it's hard to argue that the Pat's dominance would have been the same without this cheating. They should have gotten the NFL equivalent of the NCAA death penalty for this. But the league looked the other way because, well, the Pats are their cash cow. And I would bet good money that the Pats are still cheating, though with different, more advanced methods, because they see no repercussions if they get caught again.

[Sea Ray]

The Patriots cheated, got caught, paid the price. Time to move on. Nobody's getting a death penalty here. It's not happening

[757690]

The Patriots cheated, got caught, paid the price. Time to move on. Nobody's getting a death penalty here. It's not happening

Only they didn’t pay the price.

The price for cheating for years the way they did is to make sure they aren’t competitive for years. Anything short of that is not them paying the price.

[Sea Ray]

Only they didn’t pay the price.

The price for cheating for years the way they did is to make sure they aren’t competitive for years. Anything short of that is not them paying the price.

That's your opinion. The NFL dealt with it the way they saw fit. It's their league. It's up to them to adjudicate it. Not us. I'm fine with that. I enjoy the entertainment of the sport. I'm not going to let this take that enjoyment away from me

[Slyder]

This wasn't the ordinary attempt to get an advantage that most teams practice. This was a decade long, organizational cheating that went far beyond what most teams do. I think it's hard to argue that the Pat's dominance would have been the same without this cheating. They should have gotten the NFL equivalent of the NCAA death penalty for this. But the league looked the other way because, well, the Pats are their cash cow. And I would bet good money that the Pats are still cheating, though with different, more advanced methods, because they see no repercussions if they get caught again.

Na, the Pats just got smarter about where to hide the cameras.

On a personal note, of course Pats fans are waving the flag and calling everyone protesting/haters crybabies... Is it being a crybaby when you've been driven to a point that you just don't care?

That's the point I've been at the last few years and the Pats are a big reason why (along with Oakland being just bad). They are a walking house of cards that time will never be allowed to judge because I believe Goodell destroyed the tapes so that the extent of the cheating would never be known (at least unless someone writes a book). They were dumb enough to get caught fudging with things a SECOND time and cry about Goodell dropping an excessively large hammer... I'm sitting here thinking you should thank your lucky stars this a-hole didn't drop this hammer THE FIRST TIME you got cheating you morons.

I haven't watched many NE game since the snow job (Tyree's catch is my favorite memory of a SB, I was only watching because Moss). That was the last Super Bowl I've watched featuring NE. I still refuse to watch the first Rams/Pats SB because that could/should have been Oakland.

[Slyder]

The Patriots cheated, got caught, paid the price. Time to move on. Nobody's getting a death penalty here. It's not happening

No they didn't Paul Tagliabue and Roger Goodell have bent over backwards, forwards, sideways and every other way to legitimize them because they wanted a NY or Boston team in the Super Bowl after 9/11. Ever since NFL has done everything they can to prop them up. They only dropped the hammer on Deflategate because the other owners demanded it. They would have made up something to cover for the Pats again if not for that.

14536

[757690]

That's your opinion. The NFL dealt with it the way they saw fit. It's their league. It's up to them to adjudicate it. Not us. I'm fine with that. I enjoy the entertainment of the sport. I'm not going to let this take that enjoyment away from me

I will admit that I am bias. I have a whole wing of in-laws that are Pats fans and I just can’t stand hearing them defend the Pats at every turn, lol.

[Chip R]

With the reaction to the Super Bowl is it any wonder why the NFL changes rules to goose offense?

[Wonderful Monds]

With the reaction to the Super Bowl is it any wonder why the NFL changes rules to goose offense?

They already have that, the refs inability to call the rules correctly is what led in part to the lack of scoring. The Rams most promising drive was cut short on a phantom call for I can’t remember exactly what. There were a handful of plays like that too.

[WrongVerb]

They already have that, the refs inability to call the rules correctly is what led in part to the lack of scoring. The Rams most promising drive was cut short on a phantom call for I can’t remember exactly what. There were a handful of plays like that too.

There was a hold called on the center that short-circuited one drive.

Also, Cooks was pretty blatantly interfered with on a pass that would have gone for a TD (the one along the sideline, not the one along the back of the endzone). The players were tangled up though so it's not entirely unreasonable the refs missed that.

[Revering4Blue]

The Yankees have ten times more money than the REDS and the game is designed to reward them for that. Why watch the REDS?

Because the Reds -- contrary to popular belief -- even with a significantly smaller margin of error, can still compete if they minimize/stop making grievous organizational mistakes.

OTOH, if the purpose of the NFL's salary cap/structure is to promote parity, it's not exactly working. For example, it's been ages since an AFC Championship game featured two teams other than the Patriots and Steelers. Either one has played in such a game in what seems like forever. And no, I'm not buying the league is fixed mantra; they've earned their way there, even though I agree with Sea Ray about the Patriots benefiting from a very weak (through no fault of their own) division.

So much for the NFL's purported parity.

[GAC]

Agreed. The greatest game would have been NO vs KC. But it's fair to wonder if the Saints were robbed of a championship

I can understand the Saints, but no KC. The Chiefs were blanked in the first half and barely a presence in that game vs the Patriots until that entertaining 4Q. But when it came down to it, Brady got the job done. KC made numerous bad decisions in that game that cost them.

[CTA513]

:laugh:




Andrew Whitworth on Rams losing Super Bowl: 'At the end of the day, you're all gonna die


Whitworth didn't give some recycled answer about how the Rams will learn from this experience and use this feeling to fuel them next season and how they can take some valuable lesson from this loss.
Whitworth instead chose to point out a rather depressing fact that puts losing the Super Bowl into perspective.

"At the end of the day," Whitworth said, "you're all gonna die."



https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/andrew-whitworth-on-rams-losing-super-bowl-at-the-end-of-the-day-youre-all-gonna-die/

[GAC]

I will admit that I am bias. I have a whole wing of in-laws that are Pats fans and I just can’t stand hearing them defend the Pats at every turn, lol.

We're all biased. I know I am when it comes to Michigan and the Steelers (LOL). But we can't let our biases, which also involve a level of hatred, to destroy any sense of fairness or objectivity. The fact that I hate those two teams above with the intensity of seven burning suns does not mean I want to see actions taken that utterly destroyed and wiped off the face of the earth! LOL

[GAC]

Here is a good article about it:

http://www.sportingnews.com/us/nfl/news/spygate-revisited-how-patriots-scandal-false-rams-connections-impact-legacies/ypd04i8h1uov1xbp9u38mxhh0

The Patriots cheat. No denying that. So, as the article states, the NFL found out that the Patriots (Belichick) might have been taping opposing sidelines since 2000? Again, where's there's the violation here since it was common practice? The other 31 teams in the NFL were doing the same thing. If I was a gambling man I'd say they all have their "spygate" tapes they don't want the NFL to see (LOL).


This was a decade long, organizational cheating that went far beyond what most teams do.

Not really. Not when it comes to signal stealing ...

https://yourteamcheats.com/CLE


TEAM: All 32 NFL Teams

SUMMARY: Stealing your opponent's signals has always been common and never been illegal.

Said former Pittsburgh Steelers head coach Bill Cowher, "We had people that always tried to steal signals. Stealing someone's signals was a part of the game, and everyone attempted to do that." Admitted former Dallas Cowboys head coach Jimmy Johnson: "When I came into the NFL, back in 1989, I talked to a Kansas City scout and he said, 'Here's what we do, we videotape the opposing team's signals and then we sync it up with the game film.' So I did it." Bragged, former Denver Broncos head coach Mike Shanahan: "Our guy keeps a pair of binoculars on their signal-callers every game, with any luck, we have their defensive signals figured out by halftime. Sometimes, by the end of the first quarter."

You don't think all those other teams are watching those films and taking notes, making diagrams, etc, just like the Pats were doing? That's why you're filming it, to draw information from.

Why does the NFL even allow video taping knowing that one of the primary reason teams are doing it is to cheat, gain an advantage over the opposition?

Even Goodell has admitted that stealing signs is not illegal or the issue... https://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/17/sports/football/17nfl.html?n=Top%2FReference%2FTimes%20Topics%2FSu bjects%2FE%2FEthics&_r=0


The issue is not stealing signals. That is allowed, “and it is done quite widely,” Commissioner Roger Goodell said recently.

The issue, rather, is the method of acquiring the signals.

“I’m not sure that there is a coach in the league that doesn’t expect that their signals are being intercepted by opposing teams,” Goodell said .... Goodell suggested that the responsibility was on teams to conceal their messages, not on the ones trying to steal them ... During a news conference two days before the Super Bowl, Goodell said that any coach who did not expect signals to be stolen was “stupid”

So we need to quit acting like this is some sort of "problem" only peculiar to the Patriots. It's not. The only reason the "microscope" is placed on them.. and it's like that in every major sport ... is because they're a big market franchise, have the money to spend, and always in that spotlight because they WIN. They're like the Yankees of the NFL. You either love them or hate them immensely. So therefore their cheating is viewed as a far more grievous offense. And you have a egotistical, totalitarian commissioner, in his personal "campaign" to bring parity and "competitive balance" to the NFL, who sees it just that way too. He's here to exercise that iron-fist, put the hammer down on the big boys because DAMMIT you have an unfair advantage and are wining too consistently.

[Slyder]

So we need to quit acting like this is some sort of "problem" only peculiar to the Patriots. It's not. The only reason the "microscope" is placed on them.. and it's like that in every major sport ... is because they're a big market franchise, have the money to spend, and always in that spotlight because they WIN. They're like the Yankees of the NFL. You either love them or hate them immensely. So therefore their cheating is viewed as a far more grievous offense. And you have a egotistical, totalitarian commissioner, in his personal "campaign" to bring parity and "competitive balance" to the NFL, who sees it just that way too. He's here to exercise that iron-fist, put the hammer down on the big boys because DAMMIT you have an unfair advantage and are wining too consistently.

They're just the only ones dumb enough to get caught got it!

[757690]

The Patriots cheat. No denying that. So, as the article states, the NFL found out that the Patriots (Belichick) might have been taping opposing sidelines since 2000? Again, where's there's the violation here since it was common practice? The other 31 teams in the NFL were doing the same thing. If I was a gambling man I'd say they all have their "spygate" tapes they don't want the NFL to see (LOL).



Not really. Not when it comes to signal stealing ...

https://yourteamcheats.com/CLE



You don't think all those other teams are watching those films and taking notes, making diagrams, etc, just like the Pats were doing? That's why you're filming it, to draw information from.

Why does the NFL even allow video taping knowing that one of the primary reason teams are doing it is to cheat, gain an advantage over the opposition?

Even Goodell has admitted that stealing signs is not illegal or the issue... https://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/17/sports/football/17nfl.html?n=Top%2FReference%2FTimes%20Topics%2FSu bjects%2FE%2FEthics&_r=0



So we need to quit acting like this is some sort of "problem" only peculiar to the Patriots. It's not. The only reason the "microscope" is placed on them.. and it's like that in every major sport ... is because they're a big market franchise, have the money to spend, and always in that spotlight because they WIN. They're like the Yankees of the NFL. You either love them or hate them immensely. So therefore their cheating is viewed as a far more grievous offense. And you have a egotistical, totalitarian commissioner, in his personal "campaign" to bring parity and "competitive balance" to the NFL, who sees it just that way too. He's here to exercise that iron-fist, put the hammer down on the big boys because DAMMIT you have an unfair advantage and are wining too consistently.

I said stealing signs was done by other teams and is legal, but there are rules on how you can do it and the Pats broke those rules, give it them a distinct advantage. They had tapes that were illegally optioned, and instead of examining them, so we would know the extent of the Pat’s cheating, the NFL destroyed the tapes. That is highly suspicious, like the NFL didn’t want the public to know how egregious the Pat’s cheating was and is.

Again, everyone steals signs, but the Pat’s were caoight doing it in a way that was against the NFL rules. And there was evidence that they were doing it for every game for years, giving them an illegal advantage for every game. They got a wrist slap and the NFL destroyed the evidence.

I don’t know how anyone can defend that.

[Todd Gack]

Only they didn’t pay the price.

The price for cheating for years the way they did is to make sure they aren’t competitive for years. Anything short of that is not them paying the price.

Why can't you just appreciate the greatness that we are living in the midst of one of the most dominating dynasties in sports history?

[757690]

Why can't you just appreciate the greatness that we are living in the midst of one of the most dominating dynasties in sports history?

Because the reason why they are so dominant is because they have been cheating, cheating for over a decade and cheating to an extreme like we have never seen before.

[Rojo Rijo]

Why can't you just appreciate the greatness that we are living in the midst of one of the most dominating dynasties in sports history?

Because some of us like parity in sports. Right now college football, the NBA and the NFL all have issues with this. If you're not a fan of New England, Alabama, Clemson, Golden State, or Lebron it gets annoying after a while. The added salt with the media infatuation with those teams/players makes it even worse.

[Kingspoint]

I don't like parity.

I like quality.

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Because the reason why they are so dominant is because they have been cheating, cheating for over a decade and cheating to an extreme like we have never seen before.

The reason they are so dominant is because Belichick and Brady are smarter and more talented than everyone else.

[757690]

I don't like parity.

I like quality.

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The reason they are so dominant is because Belichick and Brady are smarter and more talented than everyone else.

When you cheat, you look smarter and more talented than everyone else.

If we're playing poker, and I know your cards every hand, I will seem like a genius, but I'm just a low life cheater, and that is what the Pats are. Low life cheaters that have tricked people into thinking they are geniuses. .

[Kingspoint]

When you cheat, you look smarter and more talented than everyone else.

If we're playing poker, and I know your cards every hand, I will seem like a genius, but I'm just a low life cheater, and that is what the Pats are. Low life cheaters that have tricked people into thinking they are geniuses. .

No...they are smarter than everyone else and do better at both obtaining information and not giving out information based on the same parameters everyone gets to work under.

Anyone who has ever played fantasy football know they are the most difficult team to figure out as far as who is in their weekly gameplans. Belichick feels that if he can fool FFB players, he has a better chance at fooling his opponents. The antithesis of this is Marvin Lewis and the Bengals. Not only was Marvin Lewis less prepared the more time he was given throughout his career, while being the worst in the NFL year to year at halftime adjustments, but most of us could call every play before the Bengals would call it. Marvin Lewis was as predictable as anyone in the league which is why he never came remotely close to winning a playoff game except for the one stolen from them by the refs vs Pittsburgh, but that was as ugly of a game as this year's Superbowl.

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When you cheat, you look smarter and more talented than everyone else.

If we're playing poker, and I know your cards every hand, I will seem like a genius, but I'm just a low life cheater, and that is what the Pats are. Low life cheaters that have tricked people into thinking they are geniuses. .

You haven't played much poker if you haven't played against cheaters (online doesn't count).

[757690]

No...they are smarter than everyone else and do better at both obtaining information and not giving out information based on the same parameters everyone gets to work under.

Anyone who has ever played fantasy football know they are the most difficult team to figure out as far as who is in their weekly gameplans. Belichick feels that if he can fool FFB players, he has a better chance at fooling his opponents. The antithesis of this is Marvin Lewis and the Bengals. Not only was Marvin Lewis less prepared the more time he was given throughout his career, while being the worst in the NFL year to year at halftime adjustments, but most of us could call every play before the Bengals would call it. Marvin Lewis was as predictable as anyone in the league which is why he never came remotely close to winning a playoff game except for the one stolen from them by the refs vs Pittsburgh, but that was as ugly of a game as this year's Superbowl.

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You haven't played much poker if you haven't played against cheaters (online doesn't count).

The Pats were caught cheating in a more extreme matter than any other team. That is how they obtained information, by breaking the rules.

Now, if you don't have a problem that they cheated, that's fine, but lets not pretend that they won simply because they are smarter and more talented. They won because they cheated.

And I have been playing poker for decades, and if anyone was ever caught cheating, they would end up without their money, their teeth and their balls.

[Kingspoint]

I can't take you seriously if you think the Pats won all their Championships because they were better at cheating and not because Belichick and Brady are more intelligent and talented than their competition.

[Kingspoint]

And I have been playing poker for decades, and if anyone was ever caught cheating, they would end up without their money, their teeth and their balls.

The key there is "caught cheating". I guarantee you that you would have never caught me, nor would you scare me one iota. I could deal myself four deuces whenever I wanted to by the time I was 16 because I spent literally 1000's of hours practicing dealing. I used to play poker regularly with the National Golden Gloves Light-Heavyweight Champion (and other Olympic Boxers) and I caught him trying to cheat once. I dealt with it by cheating him as it was easy for me to do. Personally, that is the only time I would use my skills at dealing, to take care of someone I caught cheating, otherwise, I played an honest game.

[757690]

I can't take you seriously if you think the Pats won all their Championships because they were better at cheating and not because Belichick and Brady are more intelligent and talented than their competition.

And I can’t take you seriously if you think the Pars win any of their championships without cheating. So I guess we’re even ;)

[GAC]

I don't like parity.

I like quality.

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The reason they are so dominant is because Belichick and Brady are smarter and more talented than everyone else.

BINGO!

I's OK to win ... just don't make it a habit! And if you do it's because of cheating. LOL

I'm an old fart who has been watching MLB and the NFL lonnnnng before this push for parity and better competitive balance. In the NFL it's becoming a reality. Do the fans like what they're seeing? I kind of have an attitude of indifference towards it, not sure what to think at this stage.

I have no issue at all with a league taking certain measures so that the big markets don't run roughshod over the smaller ones (salary cap, draft positioning, etc). From a financial aspect I can understand that. You don't have the money you can't buy the talent (pretty simple). But other then that, I don't know how far, to what lengths more it should be taken. It's like they're trying to bring some form of "socialism" to sports now because it's all about equality and fairness.

No it's not! (LOL) It's all about competition and winning.... "The thrill of victory, and the agony of defeat!". There has to be winners and losers. I wasn't wringing my hands in anguish over any of the dynasties that I witnessed. Whether it was Pittsburgh, Dallas, or the 49ers. When you have the two main ingredients of talent and great coaching - and we're talking of the elite level here - that's a formula for a winning dynasty. But we have to break this up because it's not fair. Fans are getting pissed because their team doesn't have a chance. And most of the time, IMO, its not about not having the money, but that you simply suck as an owner and building a team. Look no further then Cleveland for years.

I like the "imbalance" that exists because it keeps all the organizations on their toes (so to speak). It's forcing you to be inventive, not allowing anyone to stand still as the game continues to evolve and you want to keep up with the Jones's. Look at all the inventive offensive and defensive schemes we've seen introduced into the league by those dynasties that other teams adopted?

There's always going to be a lack of parity because you've got too many owners that don't know what they're doing, and it's reflected in their front offices. Cleveland sucked, since they've came back in the league, not because of a lack of parity/unfairness, but because of ineptness (LOL).

Now the new reasoning for dynasties, the only reason they've won so consistently, is - they're cheating. When I go back and review all these so-called cheating "scandals" on the Patriots you can see the effort by some (especially in the media) to build them up beyond what they really are. And simply because it's the Patriots. When you're at the top you have that target on your back.

This year, ESPN was playing up that 2008 Report in the Boston Herald that said the Pats filmed the Rams in 2002. The Herald came out and apologized back then that the report was false, and so did ESPN the other day (LOL). But ESPN already knew the report was false. They knew what they were trying to do. Yet people still accept it as truth.

Same thing with SnowplowGate. Another overblown situation.... http://www.thepostgame.com/blog/throwback/201312/john-hannah-new-england-patriots-offensive-conduct-dolphins-snow-plow-nfl

If the NFL is part of a conspiracy to prop up New England then Goodell has a funny way of showing it. No, I don't think Goodell is a New England fan (LOL).

[GAC]

The Pats were caught cheating in a more extreme matter than any other team.

If it's pre-2006 Goodell memo, then they weren't doing anything illegal or more extreme then any other NFL team (filming from playing field). We've already established that fact. And since that memo, the only reason the Pats did what they did in 2007 (filming the Jets from the an unauthorized sideline location) was because the Jets did the same to them in 2006, right after the memo came out. Jets got nothing, while the Pats got nailed.

So we're talking ONE infraction as far as this particular matter goes. And they were penalized pretty severely IMO. And that was 12 years ago. Have you heard anything since concerning the Pats violating NFL rules concerning filming the opposition?



Now, if you don't have a problem that they cheated, that's fine, but lets not pretend that they won simply because they are smarter and more talented. They won because they cheated.

So you're saying that all those SB's they won, they won only because they cheated? Wow! That's some bias! You really hate these guys don't you! LOL

[GAC]

I thought this was funny!

https://scontent-iad3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/51337023_10218467958520449_6015205056435978240_n.j pg?_nc_cat=107&_nc_eui2=AeEAdSqRr2Kq9jBoC9jlkgpNG0dNuMPYAEd8vyPyU E-dy_C1SoDZd2JvmDKVmWlfApeND3Fg8R6rEu8MmtMy7T71VcHyf eBIjvnJXWyjoDAydg&_nc_ht=scontent-iad3-1.xx&oh=9fca948ffab3945fe1b9019a6522855d&oe=5CEC36AD

[757690]

If it's pre-2006 Goodell memo, then they weren't doing anything illegal or more extreme then any other NFL team (filming from playing field). We've already established that fact. And since that memo, the only reason the Pats did what they did in 2007 (filming the Jets from the an unauthorized sideline location) was because the Jets did the same to them in 2006, right after the memo came out. Jets got nothing, while the Pats got nailed.

So we're talking ONE infraction as far as this particular matter goes. And they were penalized pretty severely IMO. And that was 12 years ago. Have you heard anything since concerning the Pats violating NFL rules concerning filming the opposition?




So you're saying that all those SB's they won, they won only because they cheated? Wow! That's some bias! You really hate these guys don't you! LOL

Sorry, but you’re just flat wrong on the facts. Posting this for a second time:


When the NFL looked into New England's practice of filming signals, it discovered the Jets game was not an isolated incident. Rather, the Patriots had been stealing signals for years. According to ESPN, officials found handwritten diagrams of the defensive signals of the Steelers at New England headquarters, including the notes used in the 2002 AFC championship game, won by the Patriots, 24-17.

Instead of simply confiscating all the tapes, the NFL destroyed the evidence on the spot.

Confused? So were many team owners and officials around the league. Not only had the punishment been handed out less than a week after the Jets game — hardly enough time for a thorough investigation — but the evidence teams around the league were interested in had been swiftly destroyed.

Goodell reportedly told team owners he ordered the tapes obliterated so they couldn't be used again, but people around the league struggled to accept that explanation, according to ESPN... ESPN also reported that, in addition to stealing signals, Patriots staff members would sneak into visiting locker rooms to take play sheets. The Patriots denied those reports.


I don’t see how anyone can defend the Pats knowing all the info we have now, unless you are a very biased Pat fan.

And I didn’t mean to imply that they would not have won anything of they didn’t cheat, but they won all that they won because they cheated. We have no idea how much of their success was because of cheating and how much was because of talent.

And that is why all their wins are tainted, and why the NFL letting them get away with cheating has destroyed the integrity of the sport. If we don’t know if the winning teams won honestly, then how can we become invested in the sport, how can we care who wins?

[Chip R]

Due to a dispute between the Kansas City Chiefs and the Missouri Department of Revenue, the Chiefs tax records from 2008-10 have been made public.

One of the main things the returns showed was that there is little correlation between the team’s on-field performance and how much money it makes.

https://www.kansascity.com/sports/nfl/kansas-city-chiefs/article225279155.html

[Sea Ray]

Sorry, but you’re just flat wrong on the facts. Posting this for a second time:



I don’t see how anyone can defend the Pats knowing all the info we have now, unless you are a very biased Pat fan.

And I didn’t mean to imply that they would not have won anything of they didn’t cheat, but they won all that they won because they cheated. We have no idea how much of their success was because of cheating and how much was because of talent.

And that is why all their wins are tainted, and why the NFL letting them get away with cheating has destroyed the integrity of the sport. If we don’t know if the winning teams won honestly, then how can we become invested in the sport, how can we care who wins?

What's the problem with studying other team's signals? If a team didn't try to do this sort of thing, as a fan I'd be saying they weren't trying hard enough to win. It happens in baseball and in all sports, I'd imagine. It happens often in the AFC North as I see bad players players change teams. I'm sure the reason for this is largely because they want to know stuff like this.

[757690]

What's the problem with studying other team's signals? If a team didn't try to do this sort of thing, as a fan I'd be saying they weren't trying hard enough to win. It happens in baseball and in all sports, I'd imagine. It happens often in the AFC North as I see bad players players change teams. I'm sure the reason for this is largely because they want to know stuff like this.

They did it illegally. That's the problem.

Stealing signs is part of the game. But there are rules you need to follow. The Pats did not follow those rules.