9-12-21 Reds @ Cardinals 2:15pm

[Ron Madden]

Reds
1. Jonathan India (R) 2B
2. Tyler Stephenson (R) C
3. Nick Castellanos (R) RF
4. Joey Votto (L) 1B
5. Eugenio Suarez (R) SS
6. Aristides Aquino (R) LF
7. Asdrubal Cabrera (S) 3B
8. Delino DeShields (R) CF
9. Sonny Gray (R) P

Cardinals
1. Tommy Edman (S) 2B
2. Paul Goldschmidt (R) 1B
3. Tyler O'Neill (R) LF
4. Nolan Arenado (R) 3B
5. Dylan Carlson (S) RF
6. Paul DeJong (R) SS
7. Harrison Bader (R) CF
8. Andrew Knizner (R) C
9. J.A. Happ (L) P

[Ron Madden]

Go Crazy Folks! Go Crazy!

[NatiRedGals]

Lol Cabrera??? #WhiteTowel

[Mitri]

Beer League lineup of the year

[Tom Servo]

Beer League lineup of the year
Indeed but hopefully it does the job of delivering a knockout punch early to Happ

[Big Klu]

Lol Cabrera??? #WhiteTowel

I figured when Barrero was lifted for the PH last night that he was banged up due to his collision with Naquin, and that he would probably be unavailable today. With Suarez having to move to SS in his absence, Cabrera becomes the RH half of the 3B platoon.

[Ironman92]

Hopefully Assrubal proves me wrong…I’m not seeing it. Suarez back at SS, might as well lead him off too

[KeefeCato]

Really need to take a series and stop the losing of a series bleeding.

[KeefeCato]

Hopefully Assrubal proves me wrong…I’m not seeing it. Suarez back at SS, might as well lead him off too

I loved the signing of Cabrera. He hasn't looked good to say the least. He has always been a starter though. Maybe he is a guy who just can't hit unless he plays regular. No I am not saying he needs to play regular. Saying it looks like a bad signing. Looks like when this season ends so does Cabrera's MLB career.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

Go Crazy Folks! Go Crazy!

Our Redlegs better go crazy scoring some runs today. We desperately need this series. We have the man on the mound that I want in a big game like this. I feel like Sonny's gonna shine today.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

You get past Votto at #4 and #5 through #8 looks pretty brutal. A case could be made than no one hitting 5 through 8 should be on a Major League field. But this is baseball, which means they'll probably score 9 runs today.

[DocRed]

This may be Asdrubal's last stand...

[Ky Fried Redleg]

This may be Asdrubal's last stand...

So far, he looks like he can barely stand...

[Kc61]

Plenty of power in Reds’ lineup today, need a few long balls and a good game by Sonny Gray.

[Ironman92]

I loved the signing of Cabrera. He hasn't looked good to say the least. He has always been a starter though. Maybe he is a guy who just can't hit unless he plays regular. No I am not saying he needs to play regular. Saying it looks like a bad signing. Looks like when this season ends so does Cabrera's MLB career.

I wasn’t mad or upset by it….but at his stage of his career seemed like a bit of a reach

Hope he goes 2/4 today with 3 steaks

[Kc61]

Put a player on the bench with limited PAs and he’s hit or miss.

Bring him in late in the season, give him 15 scattered PAs, he’s totally hit or miss.

No basis for an assessment except so far he isn’t doing the difficult job of a lightly used bench hitter.

Cabrera is in that boat.

[mhs95_06]

I hope the defense on the left side of the infield doesn't hurt Sonny and the Reds too much today. Both teams have off days tomorrow so they can throw the bullpen "kitchen sink" at each other today!

[Kc61]

I hope the defense on the left side of the infield doesn't hurt Sonny and the Reds too much today. Both teams have off days tomorrow so they can throw the bullpen "kitchen sink" at each other today!

Agree that Bell needs to manage this like a playoff game. I believe this is the Reds’ last game head-to-head against a competing Wild Card contender. And an off-day tomorrow.

[CaiGuy]

Need to start winning series again, starting today.

[KeefeCato]

I hope the defense on the left side of the infield doesn't hurt Sonny and the Reds too much today. Both teams have off days tomorrow so they can throw the bullpen "kitchen sink" at each other today!

Guessing Barrero is hurting. Suarez is only guy left on the roster who has played SS. Bell's hands tied today.

[Kc61]

Phils up 1-0, have to watch them, easy schedule similar to Reds.

Reds down in the first with nothing across.

[GADawg]

Cabrera hasn't looked good to say the least but i still feel like IF the Reds can get to the playoffs that i'm comfortable that a tough pinch hitting spot won't scare the life out of him....i'm a glass half full guy!

[BCubb2003]

Edman is the worst superhero ever.

[NebraskaRed]

Damn

[Ky Fried Redleg]

Reds have to be the lowest IQ team in baseball. You CAN'T let Arenado beat you. You just can't!!!

[Red Buckeye]

No worries!! Reds WILL win today. I had a dream about it last night and the last 4 sports dreams I had all came true. 5-4 will be the final.

[Kc61]

Reds have to be the lowest IQ team in baseball. You CAN'T let Arenado beat you. You just can't!!!

It’s not IQ. Nobody is walking Arenado on purpose there.

It’s bad pitching execution. Players just have to play better.

[Mitri]

Reds have to be the lowest IQ team in baseball. You CAN'T let Arenado beat you. You just can't!!!

This doesn't make any sense.

[OldFashionedRed]

It’s not IQ. Nobody is walking Arenado on purpose there.

It’s bad pitching execution. Players just have to play better.

It's just good pitchers having a bad game.

[NebraskaRed]

Reds are panicking. That's probably not going to work for them.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

Toronto with 16 runs in 4 innings so far today. Reds making Happ look like Denton True Young.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

This doesn't make any sense.

Yeah it does. I've watched 140 games. They don't play smart baseball. I don't mean they are dumb guys. I still say make anyone but Nolan beat you.

[NebraskaRed]

Yeah it does. I've watched 140 games. They don't play smart baseball. I don't mean they are dumb guys. I still say make anyone but Nolan beat you.

I'm not following you. Why is it unbelievable that Nolan Arenado would do well?

[Kc61]

Yeah it does. I've watched 140 games. They don't play smart baseball. I don't mean they are dumb guys. I still say make anyone but Nolan beat you.

You would have walked Arenado and faced Carlson with two men on? Wouldn’t be the usual call, Carlson has hurt the Reds too.

At some point Reds have to execute pitching, hitting, defense. I blame the lack of execution more than the thinking.

[NebraskaRed]

Maybe Arenado felt sorry for Cabrera

[Kc61]

Reds top five in OPS for the season in MLB, over last 14 days are 23rd.

Time to start hitting the ball again fellas.

Single for India, two on, let’s do something guys.

Well, one pitch, nope.

[NebraskaRed]

Stephenson continuing to slump

[Ky Fried Redleg]

You would have walked Arenado and faced Carlson with two men on? Wouldn’t be the usual call, Carlson has hurt the Reds too.

At some point Reds have to execute pitching, hitting, defense. I blame the lack of execution more than the thinking.

You may be right. I've just watched this Arenado guy kill our pitching over the years, including last night, that I want to make someone else beat us. Maybe not an intentional walk in that case but I don't come anywhere near the plate. Intentional but not intentional.

[Kc61]

You may be right. I've just watched this Arenado guy kill our pitching over the years, including last night, that I want to make someone else beat us. Maybe not an intentional walk in that case but I don't come anywhere near the plate. Intentional but not intentional.

Arenado likely isn’t going fishing. If you pitch around him, he’ll walk. Maybe it’s an ok strategy but if the Reds don’t start hitting it won’t matter. Can’t think or strategize your way into victories if you don’t hit and score runs.

My take is the Reds just may not be good enough. When that’s true, eventually the weaknesses show up. Hope that’s wrong, they get hot again and make the Wild Card.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

Since the Luzardo fail in Miami two weeks ago( when Jesus, Jesus, and Jesus beat the Reds), the Reds have scored 2 runs in 22 innings in Sunday games. Maybe the Almighty is saying 'NO" to Reds' postseason.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

Arenado likely isn’t going fishing. If you pitch around him, he’ll walk. Maybe it’s an ok strategy but if the Reds don’t start hitting it won’t matter. Can’t think or strategize your way into victories if you don’t hit and score runs.

My take is the Reds just may not be good enough. When that’s true, eventually the weaknesses show up. Hope they get hot again and make the Wild Card.

True.

[JFLegal]

how in the world is washed-up, chunky soup azzdrubal cabrera on an MLB roster? especially one competing for a playoff spot.

[JFLegal]

deshields being on the roster also makes no sense. he's bad.

nepotism.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

how in the world is washed-up, chunky soup azzdrubal cabrera on an MLB roster? especially one competing for a playoff spot.

Apparently we aren't very good.

[JFLegal]

Apparently we aren't very good.

barrero is far better than him.

[Kc61]

I guess Mike Trout is injured and Aaron Judge is not available.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

Is it possible that , aside from all of the Pirate bashing the Reds have done, they are not any better than a .500 team plus/minus a couple games?

[Bruce Berenyi]

guys we need to score more than the opponent go reds, I know they will win

[Ky Fried Redleg]

barrero is far better than him.

It certainly appears that way.

- - - Updated - - -


guys we need to score more than the opponent go reds, I know they will win

We need a Hal King moment.

[Bruce Berenyi]

it would take more thanthat possibly a richie scheinblum bob bailey moment

[NebraskaRed]

Unless something changes, Reds will lose their 6th series in a row.

And like always, there will be no answers about what they've been doing that needs work, what they're trying to do differently, just comments about how "hey, we thought we had a chance there and it didn't work out"

[BCubb2003]

Maybe Sonny Gray should pitch batting practice before his games.

[Alabama Red]

This WC spot is a race to the bottom.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

Von Bell hits HARD!!! I wonder if he could hit a baseball hard?

[OldFashionedRed]

Is it possible that , aside from all of the Pirate bashing the Reds have done, they are nothing better than a .500 team plus/minus a couple games?

That's exactly what it is, and I think it's being realistic. I put a lot of the blame on a manager who was more worried about being everyone's friend, until it was too late. Anyone else remember the hot month the Reds had? What was the most consistent thing during that time? I'll let others take a guess.

[Wonderful Monds]

Unless something changes, Reds will lose their 6th series in a row.

And like always, there will be no answers about what they've been doing that needs work, what they're trying to do differently, just comments about how "hey, we thought we had a chance there and it didn't work out"

Assuming that is the case, and they end up missing the wild card - does Bell have to go in that scenario? I know there’s a lot out of his control with injuries and whatnot, but with a collapse this bad, seems like someone has to be accountable for it.

[OldFashionedRed]

Votto is batting .240+ in the past two months.

[NebraskaRed]

Stop...swinging...at...the...first...pitch

[TheBigLebowski]

They’re done. No one chasing them is playing well but they’re at least capable of .500. Watching them is excruciating.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

Assuming that is the case, and they end up missing the wild card - does Bell have to go in that scenario? I know there’s a lot out of his control with injuries and whatnot, but with a collapse this bad, seems like someone has to be accountable for it.

Bell's not going anywhere. I don't think anyone will be held accountable. There should be accountability but there won't be.

[NebraskaRed]

Happ had only pitched 5+ innings while giving up no runs twice this year: once to the Pirates, once to the Royals

Now add Reds to that list of fine baseball clubs.

[Alabama Red]

This team is done. Last night Castillo bowing a 4 run lead was the end IMO. Still think we should have sold at the deadline.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

They’re done. No one chasing them is playing well but they’re at least capable of .500. Watching them is excruciating.

And the post game comments will be equally excruciating.

[RedTeamGo!]

JA Happ lol

[NebraskaRed]

Yes, having Winker back will theoretically help, but that's not going to fix the problem of many, many people going up to the plate and performing pathetically.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

This team is done. Last night Castillo bowing a 4 run lead was the end IMO. Still think we should have sold at the deadline.

But he was pleased with last night's outing. I heard it from his own mouth(well, his interpreter).

[Red Raindog]

Votto is batting .240+ in the past two months.

And looking at the Sombrero today


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[Kc61]

Ok, Reds got into Cards pen early. Still three innings to go. Just need two to tie.

Let’s find some reliever we can hit and knock the door down.

Or else a couple of walks, an error, a wild pitch. Anything!

[Ky Fried Redleg]

Reds doing Reds' stuff... will the Bengals do Bengals' stuff in the last two minutes?



UPDATE: Bengals did Bengals stuff. Of course they did.

[NebraskaRed]

https://memegenerator.net/img/instances/85719141.jpg

[Kc61]

Suarez against good righty reliever. Take a guess.

Correct.

[NebraskaRed]

Who could have seen that double play coming?

[Fil3232]

Really glad Cabrera is here

[gagliano]

it would take more thanthat possibly a richie scheinblum bob bailey moment

I thought the reds couldnt miss the world series in 73 with scheinblum's bat. If they had only gotten steve hovley in the deal. They'd already lost oe hague.

[NebraskaRed]

If Barrero is injured, he still would have had a better chance there than Caberera

[CaiGuy]

I mean, I get some of you guys aren't overreacting...the team looks terrible and really blew a gift chance to completely lock down a playoff spot with so many teams fading this month. At this very moment, it doesn't look hopefull.

But anything could happen with baseball left, and they aren't even behind in the race...they are tied. So to act like they are done is a little silly to me...teams go hot and cold and this team has shown it can get hot. Baseball fans should know better than to declare an outcome until it's mathematically clinched...good or bad.

And to prefer a fire sale to competing, even after this cold streak? Meh.

[Big Klu]

Isn't Lars Nootbaar the all-black ninja from Mortal Kombat II?

[CaiGuy]

Isn't Lars Nootbaar the all-black ninja from Mortal Kombat II?

I thought it was a Danish candy bar?

[BCubb2003]

Maybe the Reds thought they were getting Miguel.

[dakota42]

The Reds look like a team ready for the season to end.

[Tom Servo]

Nice start by Sonny, anyway.

[Mitri]

Yeah it does. I've watched 140 games. They don't play smart baseball. I don't mean they are dumb guys. I still say make anyone but Nolan beat you.

Is Sonny "not smart" still?

[Big Klu]

Sonny Gray pitched well today. Definitely deserves better than a potential loss.

[Redsfan5]

I thought it was a Danish candy bar?

I thought he was the drummer for Metallica


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[NebraskaRed]

Nice hit by Deshields

[BCubb2003]

Nice hit by Deshields

DeLightful.

[BCubb2003]

Blake Snell throws 11 pitches and limps to the dugout.

[Big Klu]

DeLightful.

https://static.onecms.io/wp-content/uploads/sites/20/2015/08/deee-lite-800.jpg

[dakota42]

Even Winker can't save this offense.

[NebraskaRed]

I think we can all agree that whichever team gets the 2nd WC, they are going to lose that WC game.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

Is Sonny "not smart" still?

Sonny's very smart. Not so much on the pitch that cost him the game. If Arenado had walked it might be 0 to 0.

[Tom Servo]

Assuming that is the case, and they end up missing the wild card - does Bell have to go in that scenario? I know there’s a lot out of his control with injuries and whatnot, but with a collapse this bad, seems like someone has to be accountable for it.
I think it's Zinter who goes if the offense stays like this the rest of the September.

[NebraskaRed]

Phillies lose, so there's that

[Ky Fried Redleg]

I think we can all agree that whichever team gets the 2nd WC, they are going to lose that WC game.



Probably 70% chance that wil be the case.

[Fil3232]

Why does this offense completely shut down? I don’t get it, but it’s terribly frustrating

[Redsfan5]

Bengals win


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[Ky Fried Redleg]

Bengals get a very un Bengals like win!!!

[Wonderful Monds]

I think it's Zinter who goes if the offense stays like this the rest of the September.

I could definitely see that.


The one thing that I would say does concern me and might actually be something Bell has influence over, is the club’s culture namely their attitude towards losing. Granted, it seems like Bell has had them ready to compete for most of the season until recently.

But there was that fairly bad quote by Barnhart during that losing streak in May, something along the lines of “losing streaks happen sometimes” and then Castellanos last month going “do you want us to get mad about it” after a fairly critical loss,

Not saying this collapse is Bell’s fault because of that, but if that’s how they approach losing, idk if the right kind of fire is under their ass to pull out of a tailspin like this and perform when it matters most.

[NebraskaRed]

Time for Schrock to rock

[Tom Servo]

I could definitely see that.


The one thing that I would say does concern me and might actually be something Bell has influence over, is the club’s culture namely their attitude towards losing. Granted, it seems like Bell has had them ready to compete for most of the season until recently.

But there was that fairly bad quote by Barnhart during that losing streak in May, something along the lines of “losing streaks happen sometimes” and then Castellanos last month going “do you want us to get mad about it” after a fairly critical loss,

Not saying this collapse is Bell’s fault because of that, but if that’s how they approach losing, idk if the right kind of fire is under their ass to pull out of a tailspin like this and perform when it matters most.
I kind of get this impulse, and I certainly get annoyed when I see some of the positive quotes, but I mean that's pretty much just what baseball is. You don't dwell on losses and publicly talk about how mad and depressed you are about losing, you just get ready to play tomorrow. We don't really know what is being said behind closed doors and what the tone is.

I do think Bell deserves a degree of blame for the tailspin just because it's happening under his watch, but there's still a little more than two more weeks of baseball left. They aren't going to start in with recriminations now even if Redszone wants to.

[KeefeCato]

Reds look to be about done.

[Tom Servo]

I thought the Reds finally had a chance to win a series by actually winning the first game of a series for once.

I thought wrong. And like I'd said I'd take a loss like what we saw yesterday any day over this lifeless, flailing effort.

Anything short of sweeping Pittsburgh won't fly.

[Mutaman]

I think it's Zinter who goes if the offense stays like this the rest of the September.

Making the batting coach the scapegoat would be such a Reds' like move.

[Kinsm]

This team desperately needs Winker back.

[Kc61]

I could definitely see that.


The one thing that I would say does concern me and might actually be something Bell has influence over, is the club’s culture namely their attitude towards losing. Granted, it seems like Bell has had them ready to compete for most of the season until recently.

But there was that fairly bad quote by Barnhart during that losing streak in May, something along the lines of “losing streaks happen sometimes” and then Castellanos last month going “do you want us to get mad about it” after a fairly critical loss,

Not saying this collapse is Bell’s fault because of that, but if that’s how they approach losing, idk if the right kind of fire is under their ass to pull out of a tailspin like this and perform when it matters most.

Often seems like attitude problems when teams lose. Usually, if anything, the team is trying too hard and is pressing. Maybe they care too much rather than not enough. No way to know.

Reds probably just are not ready for prime time. Pretty good regular season team not ready for the bigger stage. Keep plugging away in the off-season to improve personnel, team balance, bullpen, etc.

[Wonderful Monds]

I kind of get this impulse, and I certainly get annoyed when I see some of the positive quotes, but I mean that's pretty much just what baseball is. You don't dwell on losses and publicly talk about how mad and depressed you are about losing, you just get ready to play tomorrow. We don't really know what is being said behind closed doors and what the tone is.

I do think Bell deserves a degree of blame for the tailspin just because it's happening under his watch, but there's still a little more than two more weeks of baseball left. They aren't going to start in with recriminations now even if Redszone wants to.

Yeah I wouldn’t call for him to go now, I’m speaking mostly in a scenario where they end up missing the WC by a fairly good margin that’s where I start considering it.

I will say, I’m not into the micromanaging anger that’s cropped up a lot here lately and Bell’s post game quotes have never really bothered me, I’m not expecting anyone to go ballistic on the Gatorade cooler by any means. But I do recall that one Barnhart quote being particularly bad in the context when it came out, it seemed like went beyond typical baseball cliche speak like a “we’re gonna go out there and get them tomorrow” kinda thing. He seemed fairly dismissive of a losing streak that was getting pretty rough at that point, at least it seemed like.

Again not blaming this losing streak on that by any means, but that is something that I would be considering after the end of the season if things continue going south.

[Ron Madden]

The season ain't over, let's see if they can pull out of this skid.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

I could definitely see that.


The one thing that I would say does concern me and might actually be something Bell has influence over, is the club’s culture namely their attitude towards losing. Granted, it seems like Bell has had them ready to compete for most of the season until recently.

But there was that fairly bad quote by Barnhart during that losing streak in May, something along the lines of “losing streaks happen sometimes” and then Castellanos last month going “do you want us to get mad about it” after a fairly critical loss,

Not saying this collapse is Bell’s fault because of that, but if that’s how they approach losing, idk if the right kind of fire is under their ass to pull out of a tailspin like this and perform when it matters most.

And last night, Castillo being satisfied with his outcome and Castellanos talking about what a well played game it was. I think they accept losing a lot better than most of us would like. I think that falls back on Bell. Where's the accountability for these kind of performances? Where's the fire? Where's the pissed off attitude?

[Wonderful Monds]

Often seems like attitude problems when teams lose. Usually, if anything, the team is trying too hard and is pressing. Maybe they care too much rather than not enough. No way to know.

Reds probably just are not ready for prime time. Pretty good regular season team not ready for the bigger stage. Keep plugging away in the off-season to improve personnel, team balance, bullpen, etc.

That is fair, I agree they’ve been fairly decimated by injuries and it does appear they’ve been pressing for the last couple weeks by now.

[gagliano]

Isn't Lars Nootbaar the all-black ninja from Mortal Kombat II?

I think you're confusing him with Zook Baduda

[OldFashionedRed]

This team desperately needs Winker back.

That won't happen soon to enough to save the season, IMO.

[Tony Cloninger]

Time for Schrock to rock

He should be starting as much as possible. Bring Friedl up and see if he can play CF and hot better than Shogo.

[Ron Madden]

Yeah I wouldn’t call for him to go now, I’m speaking mostly in a scenario where they end up missing the WC by a fairly good margin that’s where I start considering it.

I will say, I’m not into the micromanaging anger that’s cropped up a lot here lately and Bell’s post game quotes have never really bothered me, I’m not expecting anyone to go ballistic on the Gatorade cooler by any means. But I do recall that one Barnhart quote being particularly bad in the context when it came out, it seemed like went beyond typical baseball cliche speak like a “we’re gonna go out there and get them tomorrow” kinda thing. He seemed fairly dismissive of a losing streak that was getting pretty rough at that point, at least it seemed like.

Again not blaming this losing streak on that by any means, but that is something that I would be considering after the end of the season if things continue going south.

Apparently they came out of that early season losing streak alright. I mean they're still alive for a playoff spot.

[Tom Servo]

And last night, Castillo being satisfied with his outcome
So we're just never going to hear the end of this one, huh? This isn't true, he didn't even say he was happy with the "outcome", he wasn't frustrated "with the performance".

Also Castellanos called their play "subpar" yesterday.

[OldFashionedRed]

And last night, Castillo being satisfied with his outcome and Castellanos talking about what a well played game it was. I think they accept losing a lot better than most of us would like. I think that falls back on Bell. Where's the accountability for these kind of performances? Where's the fire? Where's the pissed off attitude?

Someone said it somewhere that lots of money makes losing a lot easier. I think that's the problem. The reality is that this is a paycheck to every single one of these guys. And we all know that how we feel about our job tends to not really matter so much on payday, or when there's money in the bank. They're on different timelines of expectations than the rest of us. We fans, if we screw up at work, we're worried about our job in the near term, maybe even tomorrow. Pro players, they're on contracts so they have years to prove themselves. If they don't do well today, lose one for the team, it's ah well get'em tomorrow.

[Kc61]

And last night, Castillo being satisfied with his outcome and Castellanos talking about what a well played game it was. I think they accept losing a lot better than most of us would like. I think that falls back on Bell. Where's the accountability for these kind of performances? Where's the fire? Where's the pissed off attitude?

I don’t want a pissed off attitude. I want a focused, dedicated but calm team that wins games. Professional, doing the right things to win.

Old saying - don’t get too high or too low. Just do the job.

[gagliano]

And last night, Castillo being satisfied with his outcome and Castellanos talking about what a well played game it was. I think they accept losing a lot better than most of us would like. I think that falls back on Bell. Where's the accountability for these kind of performances? Where's the fire? Where's the pissed off attitude?

Yeh...if it were 1975, pete rose and johnny bench would have taken him aside and had a little chat with him, and i wouldnt want to be on the receiving end. Baseball has really changed.

[NebraskaRed]

They mentioned during the game that the Reds are swinging at the first pitch 40% (I think that was the number) of the time since Sept. 1.

I'd like to see some acknowledgement from them that this approach is not working. I'd like to see some more patient at bats.

It couldn't hurt.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

That won't happen soon to enough to save the season, IMO.

What is your take on the last couple of weeks of uninspiring and , quite frankly, really bad baseball? When the Reds went through that hot stretch they were beating up on the Pirates a lot, plus Joey Votto was pretty much carrying the team on his back with superhuman like play. He's not doing that now. I think maybe they are just around a .500 team and they are just falling back to that level.

[Wonderful Monds]

Apparently they came out of that early season losing streak alright. I mean they're still alive for a playoff spot.

That’s true. That’s why it’s hard for me to lay this at Bell’s feet at all, because it seems like for most of the summer he had them at 110% almost every night. It likely just is a combination of injuries and a weak depth chart striking at the worst time.


They do look pretty bad out there though, they just kind of have this dead man walking vibe where it almost seems like losing is inevitable. I haven’t seen a talented team look as shellshocked as they do right now since the 2013 Reds in September.

[Wonderful Monds]

They mentioned during the game that the Reds are swinging at the first pitch 40% (I think that was the number) of the time since Sept. 1.

I'd like to see some acknowledgement from them that this approach is not working. I'd like to see some more patient at bats.

It couldn't hurt.

They should go hard opposite and stop swinging at 100% of any pitches at all imo

[Kinsm]

That won't happen soon to enough to save the season, IMO.

Playing the Pirates from here out will.

[NebraskaRed]

They should go hard opposite and stop swinging at 100% of any pitches at all imo

Panic and desperation

That's also describes me trying to ask a girl out in high school

[OldFashionedRed]

Yeh...if it were 1975, pete rose and johnny bench would have taken him aside and had a little chat with him, and i wouldnt want to be on the receiving end. Baseball has really changed.

Yeah, now it's social justice and wildcards for everyone. I want a Lou Piniella type manager who doesn't put up with guys going through the motions. If they don't perform they sit, and everytime they screw up they're given a bit more time to think about it, eventually riding the pine to the end. I mean, guys (our guys one of the worst in the league at it) go up there taking called third strike after called third strike. Aw shucks. That's an organizational thing.

[Tom Servo]

Yeah, now it's social justice and wildcards for everyone. I want a Lou Piniella type manager who doesn't put up with guys going through the motions. If they don't perform they sit, and everytime they screw up they're given a bit more time to think about it, eventually riding the pine to the end. I mean, guys (our guys one of the worst in the league at it) go up there taking called third strike after called third strike. Aw shucks. That's an organizational thing.
Neat.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

They mentioned during the game that the Reds are swinging at the first pitch 40% (I think that was the number) of the time since Sept. 1.

I'd like to see some acknowledgement from them that this approach is not working. I'd like to see some more patient at bats.

It couldn't hurt.

I've wanted to see more patient AB's, working the count, going opposite field, taking a better approach , etc... for over two decades now. It just hasn't been this organization's approach.


BTW, post game comments from India and Bell : SOS (same old sh!t) .... "We're gonna be fine."

[OldFashionedRed]

Playing the Pirates from here out will.

I hope you're right. But the results of late don't bear that out. We'll see.

[Kinsm]

The one thing that has stayed constant all year is they haven’t quit…they still haven’t.

[Larry Schuler]

Neat.

Swell, even.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

Yeah, now it's social justice and wildcards for everyone. I want a Lou Piniella type manager who doesn't put up with guys going through the motions. If they don't perform they sit, and everytime they screw up they're given a bit more time to think about it, eventually riding the pine to the end. I mean, guys (our guys one of the worst in the league at it) go up there taking called third strike after called third strike. Aw shucks. That's an organizational thing.

You and I think a lot of like on this. GREAT post!!!!!

[Ron Madden]

I don’t want a pissed off attitude. I want a focused, dedicated but calm team that wins games. Professional, doing the right things to win.

Old saying - don’t get too high or too low. Just do the job.

I agree with this.

How silly would they look if they acted like a spoiled child that didn't get their way and threw a hissey fit after every loss?

Remember Nellie Olsen from Little House On the Prairie?
Haha!

[OldFashionedRed]

The one thing that has stayed constant all year is they haven’t quit…they still haven’t.

That is true, but I think there is a talent deficit and some tweaks needed in the minor leagues.

[NebraskaRed]

Yeah, now it's social justice and wildcards for everyone. I want a Lou Piniella type manager who doesn't put up with guys going through the motions. If they don't perform they sit, and everytime they screw up they're given a bit more time to think about it, eventually riding the pine to the end. I mean, guys (our guys one of the worst in the league at it) go up there taking called third strike after called third strike. Aw shucks. That's an organizational thing.

"Social Justice and wildcards" might be the funniest thing I've read on here in quite a while.

Edited to add: because it's ridiculous

[Tom Servo]

The Reds being a bunch of coddled millennials is exactly the sort of insight we were missing here.

[Wonderful Monds]

Panic and desperation

That's also describes me trying to ask a girl out in high school


https://youtu.be/WW0dkMw8ywM

[Kinsm]

That is true, but I think there is a talent deficit and some tweaks needed in the minor leagues.

If that were true they’d be dropping in the wildcard hunt and they aren’t. They’re not a .600 W% team, so no reason to expect that out of them. In their favor, neither are the Padres, Cards, Mets, etc.

[NebraskaRed]

https://i.imgflip.com/5mqsjy.jpg

[Wonderful Monds]

The Reds being a bunch of coddled millennials is exactly the sort of insight we were missing here.

Winning earlier in the summer was a double edged sword for RZ lol

[Ky Fried Redleg]

Another example... Cards had just snatched the lead last night. Top of the ninth inning, two outs. Flash to the Reds' dugout. I caught a couple of big smiles on faces. One of them was Shogo. Pinella wouldn't stand for it. No accountability. The uninspired play of late reflects the culture of acceptance of losing. "Aw shucks, we lost. We'll get 'em tomorrow." This should be unacceptable to everyone. Unfortunately, it seems to be an organizational thing.

[NebraskaRed]

Another example... Cards had just snatched the lead last night. Top of the ninth inning, two outs. Flash to the Reds' dugout. I caught a couple of big smiles on faces. One of them was Shogo. Pinella wouldn't stand for it. No accountability. The uninspired play of late reflects the culture of acceptance of losing. "Aw shucks, we lost. We'll get 'em tomorrow." This should be unacceptable to everyone. Unfortunately, it seems to be an organizational thing.

To be fair, Shogo might just be happy that they let him be there.

[Tom Servo]

Another example... Cards had just snatched the lead last night. Top of the ninth inning, two outs. Flash to the Reds' dugout. I caught a couple of big smiles on faces. One of them was Shogo. Pinella wouldn't stand for it. No accountability. The uninspired play of late reflects the culture of acceptance of losing. "Aw shucks, we lost. We'll get 'em tomorrow." This should be unacceptable to everyone. Unfortunately, it seems to be an organizational thing.
god this is so stupid lol

[Bruce Berenyi]

yes lets root root root for the home team if they dont win its a shame get em tomorrow

[Ky Fried Redleg]

I agree with this.

How silly would they look if they acted like a spoiled child that didn't get their way and threw a hissey fit after every loss?

Remember Nellie Olsen from Little House On the Prairie?
Haha!

The Big Red Machine didn't lose a lot but when it did there were players who would make it known that uninspired play and losing wasn't gonna fly. I've listened to the post game comments through this entire two to three week stretch. It's always, "Aw shucks. Too bad we lost but we'll be fine." I want to see one or two guys at least say this is totally unacceptable. The manager's not gonna say it. I wouldn't mind one hissy fit. Time's running out. Maybe that tantrum would light a fire!!!

[Wonderful Monds]

yes lets root root root for the home team if they dont win its a shame get em tomorrow

This but unironically

[Ky Fried Redleg]

god this is so stupid lol

Grab you a deep dish and be okay with players smiling in the 9th inning after giving up a lead. Piniella would totally agree with what I said. Guarantee he wouldn't find it stupid.

[Wonderful Monds]

To be fair, Shogo might just be happy that they let him be there.

If I were Shogo I’d hide in the Mr. Red costume and let everybody forget that I’m still on the roster as long as possible

[Ky Fried Redleg]

To be fair, Shogo might just be happy that they let him be there.

Maybe. But in Piniella's dugout he and anyone else with a smile on their face would have been out the door.

[NebraskaRed]

I may have had more playing time than Shogo in the past couple weeks.

[Ron Madden]

Another example... Cards had just snatched the lead last night. Top of the ninth inning, two outs. Flash to the Reds' dugout. I caught a couple of big smiles on faces. One of them was Shogo. Pinella wouldn't stand for it. No accountability. The uninspired play of late reflects the culture of acceptance of losing. "Aw shucks, we lost. We'll get 'em tomorrow." This should be unacceptable to everyone. Unfortunately, it seems to be an organizational thing.

didn't you use to post this stuff on the old reds.com message board

[OldFashionedRed]

If that were true they’d be dropping in the wildcard hunt and they aren’t. They’re not a .600 W% team, so no reason to expect that out of them. In their favor, neither are the Padres, Cards, Mets, etc.

They've now lost their 6 series. That is real cause for concern. I'm concerned about my favorite team, not the other teams. I'd expect the manager to say the same to his players. The Reds may or may not come out of this with a wildcard, but at this point it doesn't look likely. The team needs Winker in the worst way.

[Tom Servo]

Grab you a deep dish and be okay with players smiling in the 9th inning after giving up a lead. Pinella would totally agree with what I said. Guarantee he wouldn't find it stupid.
Lou Piniella is on a golf course in South Florida somewhere, it doesn't really matter what he thinks about the 2021 Reds not all sitting with a dour expression on their face for 3 hours in the dugout.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

Neat.

And very accurate.

[Tony Cloninger]

Maybe. But in Pinella's dugout he and anyone else with a smile on their face would have been out the door.

It would have been a wrestling match to the death after every game for anyone smiling after a loss.

[DocRed]

Another sh** performance by this offense. 6 straight series losses by this team...this team do not deserve to be in the playoff race. Disgraceful and pathetic....

[Ky Fried Redleg]

didn't you use to post this stuff on the old reds.com message board

This is the only Reds message board I've seen. But , it's relevant for any board. Piniella or Bench or Rose would have taken some of these players aside and fixed some attitudes in a hurry. Losing with ease and grace was not a part of their makeup. Losing should burn, not bring about smiles in the dugout. I agree with Old Fashioned Red and gagliano and Tony Cloninger.

[Larry Schuler]

I can’t stand it. They just got shut out and the players are in the dugout smiling, laughing, and having a Civil Rights.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

Another sh** performance by this offense. 6 straight series losses by this team...this team do not deserve to be in the playoff race. Disgraceful and pathetic....

India didn't seem concerned or terribly disappointed in the post gamer. Neither did Bell. Castillo was happy after last night's performance and Castellaneous talked about what a well played game it was. At least two players were smiling in the dugout. There's a culture problem in this dugout and this organization . Is anyone other than OFR or gagliano disillusioned by this? I bet Bench and Rose are more pissed off right now than some of these players are. It seems as though , for a lot of these uninspired players, visions of golf courses in early October are dancing in their heads.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

It would have been a wrestling match to the death after every game for anyone smiling after a loss.

I can't even imagine what Piniella would have said or done if he saw his players smiling after having given up a four run lead to a division rival and playoff contender in one of the biggest series of the year. Apparently, though, it's not that big of a deal to a lot of fans either. I think a lot of Reds' fans have just become numb to losing. It's what they expect.

[Ron Madden]

I don't like losing anymore than you do.

But I'm not gonna lose my mind and throw a fit like a spoiled child that didn't get their way. I'm not going to act like Nellie Olsen.

[Wonderful Monds]

India didn't seem concerned or terribly disappointed in the post gamer. Neither did Bell. Castillo was happy after last night's performance and Castellaneous talked about what a well played game it was. At least two players were smiling in the dugout. There's a culture problem in this dugout and this organization . Is anyone other than OFR or gagliano disillusioned by this? I bet Bench and Rose are more pissed off right now than some of these players are. It seems as though , for a lot of these uninspired players, visions of golf courses in early October are dancing in their heads.


I can't even imagine what Piniella would have said or done if he saw his players smiling after having given up a four run lead to a division rival and playoff contender in one of the biggest series of the year. Apparently, though, it's not that big of a deal to a lot of fans either. I think a lot of Reds' fans have just become numb to losing. It's what they expect.

This is one of those things that you only get angry about if the Reds are the only team you watch. That’s just baseball, dude. Every single player answers with those cliches after a loss in post game interviews, you won’t see a team losing their s*** on the water cooler in the dugout after losing 99.9% of the time. That’s just what the game is. The days of Piniella esque hardasses constantly losing their cool are long gone, all across the entire sport.

[KeefeCato]

The one thing that has stayed constant all year is they haven’t quit…they still haven’t.

Agree team doesn't quit. But at some point you would think law of averages would kick in vs. the Pirates. Hopefully they keep pounding them though.

[KeefeCato]

I don't like losing anymore than you do.

But I'm not gonna lose my mind and throw a fit like a spoiled child that didn't get their way. I'm not going to act like Nellie Olsen.

Agree. Blowing up in front of a TV camera would do no good at all. Only make them look like idiots. I don't wanna see a Peed off team in the batters box. That doesn't do one bit of good.

[Kinsm]

Facts matter:

Reds were tied with the Pads for the 2nd wildcard back on August 21st.

3 weeks later and the Reds are still in the same spot even with only winning 8 of 20 in that span

18 games left, 9 against PIT

…the sky is not falling.

[KeefeCato]

Facts matter:

Reds were tied with the Pads for the 2nd wildcard back on August 21st.

3 weeks later and the Reds are still in the same spot even with only winning 8 of 20 in that span

18 games left, 9 against PIT

…the sky is not falling.

My guess is they need to go 11-8 at worse. I think 13-5 clinches it.

[Kinsm]

Why do they need to go 11-8, have you seen the Pads schedule?

[OldFashionedRed]

I don't like losing anymore than you do.

But I'm not gonna lose my mind and throw a fit like a spoiled child that didn't get their way. I'm not going to act like Nellie Olsen.

I'm embarrassed to say this, but I thought she was cute when I was little.

[Rantly]

Why do they need to go 11-8, have you seen the Pads schedule?
nm

[gagliano]

Another example... Cards had just snatched the lead last night. Top of the ninth inning, two outs. Flash to the Reds' dugout. I caught a couple of big smiles on faces. One of them was Shogo. Pinella wouldn't stand for it. No accountability. The uninspired play of late reflects the culture of acceptance of losing. "Aw shucks, we lost. We'll get 'em tomorrow." This should be unacceptable to everyone. Unfortunately, it seems to be an organizational thing.

Yep. Enough of those games and you end up like...the reds. You dont see the giants and dodgers yukking it up while they get their heads caved in

[gagliano]

god this is so stupid lol

Oh yes...servo has spoken. Everyone else is wrong. My bad.

[Kinsm]

Yep. Enough of those games and you end up like...the reds. You dont see the giants and dodgers yukking it up while they get their heads caved in

The Reds gave up 3 hits today, they didn’t get “their heads caved in.”

[gagliano]

India didn't seem concerned or terribly disappointed in the post gamer. Neither did Bell. Castillo was happy after last night's performance and Castellaneous talked about what a well played game it was. At least two players were smiling in the dugout. There's a culture problem in this dugout and this organization . Is anyone other than OFR or gagliano disillusioned by this? I bet Bench and Rose are more pissed off right now than some of these players are. It seems as though , for a lot of these uninspired players, visions of golf courses in early October are dancing in their heads.

The millennials on the board are saying "ok boomer." Yeh...boomer this. They're wrong

[gagliano]

This is one of those things that you only get angry about if the Reds are the only team you watch. That’s just baseball, dude. Every single player answers with those cliches after a loss in post game interviews, you won’t see a team losing their s*** on the water cooler in the dugout after losing 99.9% of the time. That’s just what the game is. The days of Piniella esque hardasses constantly losing their cool are long gone, all across the entire sport.

Well that may be the problem then

[gagliano]

Agree. Blowing up in front of a TV camera would do no good at all. Only make them look like idiots. I don't wanna see a Peed off team in the batters box. That doesn't do one bit of good.

At least they could say "i dont like it at all...i gotta do better...we're gonna fix this and come back strong."

[Sassy Sal]

At least they could say "i dont like it at all...i gotta do better...we're gonna fix this and come back strong."

Yeah, I can understand wanting to keep an even keel during a long season, but when you get to September and you are still in it, intensity needs to increase and from the top down IMO. That's the responsibility of the manager - and maybe he is trying, as well as the veterans. There's not much a manager can do about guys not hitting or pitchers giving up leads at this point, but he can make near damn sure it's not due to a lack of focus and intensity. I'd like to see at least some players conveying that to the media.

[Bruce Berenyi]

yes back in the olden days when the reds lost, scotty madison, rafael santo domingo, sonny ruberto and gerry arrigo would get irate, and after the game they would read the Odyssey to imagine all the difficulties they would face and how they would overcome them

[Ky Fried Redleg]

yes back in the olden days when the reds lost, scotty madison, rafael santo domingo, sonny ruberto and gerry arrigo would get irate, and after the game they would read the Odyssey to imagine all the difficulties they would face and how they would overcome them

Bruce, who was the better catcher... Sal Butera or Brad Gulden ???

[mhs95_06]

Why do they need to go 11-8, have you seen the Pads schedule?

To stay ahead of the Phillies and Cardinals.

[Big Klu]

Bruce, who was the better catcher... Sal Butera or Brad Gulden ???

Sal Butera in a landslide. I absolutely loathed Brad Gulden.

[Ky Fried Redleg]

Sal Butera in a landslide. I absolutely loathed Brad Gulden.

Gulden was pretty bad, Klu. Actually both were pretty dreadful. Probably not much more than .215 to .220 hitters, if that. Butera was better behind the plate , I think.

[757690]

Sal Butera in a landslide. I absolutely loathed Brad Gulden.

Butera was your standard all defense, no hit, back up catcher, except for his time with the Reds. He hit pretty well for a back up catcher. .700 OPS, .350 OBP.

The problem with Gulden was that Vern Rapp liked him and started him way too often. He was a fine backup, but never should have been a starter.

[Larry Schuler]

Sorry but I’m taking Karim Garcia over DT Cromer.

[Ron Madden]

Facts matter:

Reds were tied with the Pads for the 2nd wildcard back on August 21st.

3 weeks later and the Reds are still in the same spot even with only winning 8 of 20 in that span

18 games left, 9 against PIT

…the sky is not falling.

Good common sense post

Some of these folks have declared the season over after every loss but here we are on 9-14-21 In the lead for the 2nd wildcard.