Reds Trade Rumors Discussion II - Deadline Week 2022

[Benihana]

New thread necessary

We all know the Castillo talk. I only like a Yankees deal if Dominguez or Waldichuk come along with one of the two SS, and I prefer Dominguez to Waldichuk. And I strongly prefer Volpe to Peraza. We have enough SS in the system that I'd rather get the better bat with questionable ability to stick at SS then the true SS with the lesser bat. Only way I'd send Castillo to St. Louis is if Jordan Walker is coming back.

If Mahle goes to Minnesota, I'd like to see Emmanuel Rodriguez and Alex Kirilloff (or Royce Lewis) coming back. Otherwise I'd be interested in seeing a straight up swap for Adell, Pages or Kelenic (or Dominguez if he goes to the Yankees instead of Castillo).

[UKFlounder]

It was an enjoyable thread to read, so hopefully there are more thoughts out there.

Castillo to Yankees? Dodgers? Someone else?

Will Mahle go? Or Drury?

Any surprised?

Edit: Benihana got it first. Please delete this one

[cumberlandreds]

It was an enjoyable thread to read, so hopefully there are more thoughts out there.

Castillo to Yankees? Dodgers? Someone else?

Will Mahle go? Or Drury?

Any surprised?

Edit: Benihana got it first. Please delete this one

I merged the two.

[RedsManRick]

I don't know prospects well, but given our current organizational depth chart, I'd be prioritizing near-ready or ready 3B/OF bat in the Winker mold (high OBP, moderate-or-better power). Sure, you can never have too many arms, and I'm totally of the mind that runs prevent and runs scored are equally important. But you are also more likely to find arms through volume and great gloves with questionable bats are not hard to find (just ask Almora, Fraley, Fairchild, Friedl, etc.). Target a high pedigree bat with a good enough glove as the centerpiece.

[Bourgeois Zee]

Really intrigued if Royce Lewis is indeed the centerpiece of a Mahle deal.

He should be a legitimate middle of the order bat and well above average CF defender, and there are few holes in his game.

If he's healthy, there's no way the Twins deal him. But he's not (and struggles to fend off that injury bug). Love the upside and the aggressiveness of a deal involving him.

[SidneySlicker]

What are people's thoughts about trading Drury for Franmil Reyes and maybe a minor league arm? Reyes just turned 27 and is under contract on the cheap. Get him in a small ballpark, get him to focus on contact, and see what you can turn him into.

[Benihana]

Really intrigued if Royce Lewis is indeed the centerpiece of a Mahle deal.

He should be a legitimate middle of the order bat and well above average CF defender, and there are few holes in his game.

If he's healthy, there's no way the Twins deal him. But he's not (and struggles to fend off that injury bug). Love the upside and the aggressiveness of a deal involving him.

Yep, hopefully he's more Byron Buxton and less Nick Senzel (if we get him).

[LeatherPants]

Buster:

18573

[Coopdaddy67]

If they don't trade him, just go ahead and kill me. Bob first though.

[SidneySlicker]

Buster:

18573

I think this is just them leveraging a trade. That's what I'm choosing to tell myself anyway.

[mth123]

What are people's thoughts about trading Drury for Franmil Reyes and maybe a minor league arm? Reyes just turned 27 and is under contract on the cheap. Get him in a small ballpark, get him to focus on contact, and see what you can turn him into.

Reyes is making $4.5 Million this year and is arb eligible. He has no defensive value at all and a .628 OPS. If you are going to spend that much, just sign Drury.

[Wayne Krivsky]

Really intrigued if Royce Lewis is indeed the centerpiece of a Mahle deal.

He should be a legitimate middle of the order bat and well above average CF defender, and there are few holes in his game.

If he's healthy, there's no way the Twins deal him. But he's not (and struggles to fend off that injury bug). Love the upside and the aggressiveness of a deal involving him.

No argument here. I'd probably target Kirilloff over Lewis, but he has had his own issues. My only fear with Royce finding him a position to play, but right now the Reds have plenty of options. I believe both of his major knee injuries have come from playing the OF. The bat should certainly play almost anywhere though, especially in GABP.

[Bourgeois Zee]

If the Yankees deal starts with Peraza, who would you guys want as the secondary pieces?

If I'm Krall, I'm demanding one of the following three hauls:

- Peraza, Waldichuk, Medina, and Florial

- Peraza, Wesneski, Pereira, and Gil

- Peraza, Dominguez, and Gil or Medina

Not sure if I'd do only Dominguez and Peraza, but I might be persuaded to take them and a lottery ticket pitcher beyond the Yankees' top 30 prospects or at its very bottom (think Will Warren).

Also not sure I'd settle for less than one of these deals.

[Rowsdower]

I’d be okay with keeping Luis and signing him to 3-4 year extension. Then trade Mahle for prospects. Fine with me

[SidneySlicker]

Reyes is making $4.5 Million this year and is arb eligible. He has no defensive value at all and a .628 OPS. If you are going to spend that much, just sign Drury.

I'm sure you're right it was just something that crossed my mind. Thought it could maybe be another buy low sell high move.

[Wayne Krivsky]

I’d be okay with keeping Luis and signing him to 3-4 year extension. Then trade Mahle for prospects. Fine with me

You probably have a decent chance of dealing Castillo and keeping Mahle. I just don't see it working the other way around though. Castillo will be more expensive and the one that brings back the bigger prospect haul.

[Coopdaddy67]

I’d be okay with keeping Luis and signing him to 3-4 year extension. Then trade Mahle for prospects. Fine with me

He isn't going to sign a short-term extension, that would be stupid.

There's a real possibility of him getting more than $200 million in a long-term deal after next season.

[Benihana]

If the Yankees deal starts with Peraza, who would you guys want as the secondary pieces?

If I'm Krall, I'm demanding one of the following three hauls:

- Peraza, Waldichuk, Medina, and Florial

- Peraza, Wesneski, Pereira, and Gil

- Peraza, Dominguez, and Gil or Medina

Not sure if I'd do only Dominguez and Peraza, but I might be persuaded to take them and a lottery ticket pitcher beyond the Yankees' top 30 prospects or at its very bottom (think Will Warren).

Also not sure I'd settle for less than one of these deals.

The third offer is the only one I'd consider.

[mth123]

If the Yankees deal starts with Peraza, who would you guys want as the secondary pieces?

If I'm Krall, I'm demanding one of the following three hauls:

- Peraza, Waldichuk, Medina, and Florial

- Peraza, Wesneski, Pereira, and Gil

- Peraza, Dominguez, and Gil or Medina

Not sure if I'd do only Dominguez and Peraza, but I might be persuaded to take them and a lottery ticket pitcher beyond the Yankees' top 30 prospects or at its very bottom (think Will Warren).

Also not sure I'd settle for less than one of these deals.

I've convinced myself that I like Wesneski as much as Waldichuk. I like Pereira better than Florial and Gil better than Medina. So the first option would be my last choice.

I really like Dominguez, but I think the reds really need one of Waldichuk or Wesneski, so I take door number 2 Monty!

[MikeS21]

Not a huge fan of Florial. Strikes out too much for my liking, and I think the Reds have a farm system of OF bats with power, but a lot of swing and miss (Cerda, Hopkins, Cotton ...)

[Reds Freak]

Buster:

18573

So Buster's tweet speculates the Reds will either keep Castillo or trade him. Glad we were able to get that out of the way.

[Kc61]

I’m guessing that Dismantle the Reds Part II begins after today’s game.

It’ll be mini-series with several episodes. Streaming to continue through the weekend.

Including some unforeseen departures from the cast of characters.

[Wayne Krivsky]

So Buster's tweet speculates the Reds will either keep Castillo or trade him. Glad we were able to get that out of the way.

Well at least we can rule out the Wade Miley treatment

[Mitri]

I've convinced myself that I like Wesneski as much as Waldichuk. I like Pereira better than Florial and Gil better than Medina. So the first option would be my last choice.

I really like Dominguez, but I think the reds really need one of Waldichuk or Wesneski, so I take door number 2 Monty!

I like all of these guys, really. Not sure why some folks here are so down on the NYY system, especially since a lot of their guys are having great seasons. It's on par with the Dodgers' talent, only LA seems to be in a place where they can be stingier with who they give away.

[Benihana]

I like all of these guys, really. Not sure why some folks here are so down on the NYY system, especially since a lot of their guys are having great seasons. It's on par with the Dodgers' talent, only LA seems to be in a place where they can be stingier with who they give away.

I think it’s because Yankees prospects and farm system have a long history of being overhyped.

If you look at their top five prospects over the last 15-20 years, they have pretty starkly underperformed their expectations. And the Reds have a history of getting fooled by them (see Chapman, Boone and Neagle trades)

[Mitri]

I think it’s because Yankees prospects and farm system have a long history of being overhyped.

If you look at their top five prospects over the last 15-20 years, they have pretty starkly underperformed their expectations. And the Reds have a history of getting fooled by them (see Chapman, Boone and Neagle trades)

I get that with guys like Volpe and Dominguez, but I think we all are a bit more informed these days than in times past. I don't really see people who follow prospects falling for the Yankees hype anymore. I mean, all across MLB these guys are overhyped; at least all "Top 100" types are.

I guess it ebbs and flows, but the proof is in the pudding and most of their top 20 prospects have done quite well in recent years. It's a good system from my viewpoint. It all comes down to our scouts getting looks and picking the right players, but it's not a bad organization to be in talks with.

[Benihana]

I get that with guys like Volpe and Dominguez, but I think we all are a bit more informed these days than in times past. I don't really see people who follow prospects falling for the Yankees hype anymore. I mean, all across MLB these guys are overhyped; at least all "Top 100" types are.

I guess it ebbs and flows, but the proof is in the pudding and most of their top 20 prospects have done quite well in recent years. It's a good system from my viewpoint. It all comes down to our scouts getting looks and picking the right players, but it's not a bad organization to be in talks with.

https://twitter.com/PlayoffTanaka_/status/1549816149067501568?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5 Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1549816149067501568%7Ctwgr% 5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_c10&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fd-36576010573079720897.ampproject.net%2F220718172700 0%2Fframe.html

Also, at least as of 2018, in the 20 years of Brian Cashman’s tenure, only seven of the many dozen Yankee prospects dealt by Cashman over the years eventually made an All-Star appearance. Those men are Cristian Guzman, Eric Milton, Mike Lowell, Jake Westbrook, Ted Lilly, Dioner Navarro and Mark Melancon.

Think about that for a moment.

Here’s more recent history:
https://reflectionsonbaseball.com/yankees-prospects-traded-away-2015-2018-where-are-they-now/

[Marc D]

Yankees aside for a moment. Houston might be a great trade partner.

Recent MLBTR article (https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2022/07/astros-willing-to-listen-to-offers-on-controllable-starting-pitching.html) on their willingness to trade "controllable pitching". Here is the pre season top prospect list from FG (https://blogs.fangraphs.com/houston-astros-top-33-prospects-2022/)

They have young, near MLB ready arms, catchers and OF. They need starting pitching depth and a bat. What could we get for Castillo and Drury (with the bonus vale of keeping Castillo away from NY)?

I'd take Brown, best near MLB catcher we could get and a lower minors OF with contact skills as a starter.

Thoughts?

[Rowsdower]

He isn't going to sign a short-term extension, that would be stupid.

There's a real possibility of him getting more than $200 million in a long-term deal after next season.

And who’s to say the Reds won’t do that? Votto and Moose are off the books, there’s really no one else that will demand any real money. Ownership has been towards middle of the pack in payroll before this year. Who better to open up the wallet and get fans back on board than Castillo?

[CySeymour]

And who’s to say the Reds won’t do that? Votto and Moose are off the books, there’s really no one else that will demand any real money. Ownership has been towards middle of the pack in payroll before this year. Who better to open up the wallet and get fans back on board than Castillo?

The Reds don't want to be in the business of giving $200m contracts to 30-something pitchers.

[Wonderful Monds]

And who’s to say the Reds won’t do that? Votto and Moose are off the books, there’s really no one else that will demand any real money. Ownership has been towards middle of the pack in payroll before this year. Who better to open up the wallet and get fans back on board than Castillo?

do you remember what our glorified used car salesman owner jr. said back in April, my man

[757690]

It could make sense for the Reds to keep Castillo but not extend him. He’s not a free agent in the offseason. They could trade him next offseason.

They would get a lesser package next trade deadline, but they would get his production next season, which has value, even if they aren’t competitive. The lesser package wouldn’t be that much less, it should include a similar headliner, just one or two fewer C prospects. The extra production from him next year could easily be worth more than those additional prospects.

[CySeymour]

It could make sense for the Reds to keep Castillo but not extend him. He’s not a free agent in the offseason. They could trade him next offseason.

They would get a lesser package next offseason, but they would get his production next season, which has value, even if they aren’t competitive. The lesser package wouldn’t be that much less, it should include a similar headliner, just one or two fewer C prospects. The extra production from him next year could easily be worth more than those additional prospects.

How could they trade him next offseason? He's a free agent after 2023.

[757690]

How could they trade him next offseason? He's a free agent after 2023.

Haha, good catch. I obviously meant next trade deadline. Editing it now.

[klw]

It could make sense for the Reds to keep Castillo but not extend him. He’s not a free agent in the offseason. They could trade him next offseason.

They would get a lesser package next offseason, but they would get his production next season, which has value, even if they aren’t competitive. The lesser package wouldn’t be that much less, it should include a similar headliner, just one or two fewer C prospects. The extra production from him next year could easily be worth more than those additional prospects.

Castillo is only under control through next season. The latest they could trade him would be the midseason trade deadline in 2023. He would be a FA after 2023 but the Reds could issue a QO and get draft compensation (if the current rules continue in place). They would not be able to trade him in the 23-24 off-season as he would be a free agent at that point.


Edit: someone else types faster than I do

[TRF]

Lots of Castillo talk and rumors. Mahle needs the same love, and it seems the Twins are the strongest suitor. I wonder how much of that is Gray's influence?

It's odd to me that the Dodgers talk has quieted and that both Miami AND Houston are said to be willing to deal Controllable pitching assets. Houston is dangling Urquidy, which considering they are leading their division seems odd at best. Miami, well Not sure why they want to toss Pablo Lopez other than you get him for 3+ years. If Castillo and Mahle require top prospects, Lopez because of control certainly does too.

Since 2019, Castillo, Montas, Mahle splits:

Away



Name
IP
ERA
TBF
H
R
ER
HR
BB
IBB
HBP
SO
AVG
OBP
SLG
wOBA


Tyler Mahle
237.0
3.57
978
205
104
94
23
63
0
11
253
.230
.287
.368
.284


Luis Castillo
236.0
3.97
1007
207
116
104
26
105
0
8
261
.235
.321
.393
.312


Frankie Montas
193.2
4.04
816
183
98
87
30
60
1
3
202
.244
.301
.429
.312



Home



Name
IP
ERA
TBF
H
R
ER
HR
BB
IBB
HBP
SO
AVG
OBP
SLG
wOBA


Frankie Montas
247.0
2.95
1016
212
95
81
20
71
4
10
277
.229
.290
.343
.277


Luis Castillo
297.1
3.12
1218
238
115
103
27
101
4
11
336
.217
.289
.340
.275


Tyler Mahle
218.2
5.06
956
209
128
123
44
95
0
11
253
.250
.332
.460
.340



Sure seems like Mahle needs more love. Montas gets quite the home boost. I can see why the Yankees want Castillo though. That RF bandbox of theirs can intimidate pitchers. Mahle in LA? That would work nicely.

[Gandalf the Red]

How could they trade him next offseason? He's a free agent after 2023.

I'm sure the Cards front office would find a way to pull that off.

[RedTeamGo!]

I think Mahle is first red to get moved. I think it happens tonight or tomorrow morning. I think Castillo gets traded Sunday. Drury, Naquin, Pham get traded deadline day.

[WrongVerb]

I’d be okay with keeping Luis and signing him to 3-4 year extension. Then trade Mahle for prospects. Fine with me

This is what I would consider the optimal outcome. However, I don't think it's going to come to pass.

[kaldaniels]

As an aside I think I have to switch sides yet again.

When it comes to controllable assets I think the Reds should play service time games.

I don’t like that, but if they are going to be shipping guys out a couple years before free agency (Winker, Castillo, etc) they need to maximize time spent with the Reds. I’m just shaking my head at the prospect of Greene potentially only having 3 more years in Cincy if they follow the Winker playbook.

Get competent and willing ownership and I’ll change my tune back.

[Bourgeois Zee]

I think Mahle is first red to get moved. I think it happens tonight or tomorrow morning. I think Castillo gets traded Sunday. Drury, Naquin, Pham get traded deadline day.

Solano gets moved on that last day too, perhaps for a better prospect than any of us think. (Seems to be a near-complete dismissal of Solano on the board, yet his offensive numbers are on-par with or better than anyone on the Red team.) He profiles as a real help to a team that leans too far to the left. As an added bonus, he's absolutely killing RH this season.

I think he can generate another club's top 10 prospect-- maybe top 15.

[WrongVerb]

Twins approaching trade deadline very differently from 2018 and 2021 (https://theathletic.com/3451645/2022/07/26/twins-trade-deadline/)


The Twins asked about Luis Castillo and Tyler Mahle this winter only to be denied by Cincinnati. There was an attempt to trade for Frankie Montas, too, but Oakland wouldn’t engage.


The Twins continue to love Mahle more than Castillo and have also engaged the Miami Marlins, who are loaded with pitching and believed to be a good trade partner in terms of possible fits.

[Guacarock]

USA Today's Bob Nightengale says the Yankees' top target now is Luis Castillo. He Tweets, "The #Yankees grab outfielder Andrew Benintendi after being swept by the #Mets. The No. 1 target now on their shopping list: Cincinnati #Reds ace Luis Castillo."

That said, any deal with the Reds might still take a couple of days to consummate. The reason: The Mariners are now said to be upping the ante on a counter proposal. So don't be surprised if Mahle is traded first.

[kaldaniels]

USA Today's Bob Nightengale says the Yankees' top target now is Luis Castillo. He Tweets, "The #Yankees grab outfielder Andrew Benintendi after being swept by the #Mets. The No. 1 target now on their shopping list: Cincinnati #Reds ace Luis Castillo."

That said, any deal with the Reds might still take a couple of days to consummate. The reason: The Mariners are now said to be upping the ante on a counter proposal. So don't be surprised if Mahle is traded first.

The flurry of reports that Luis is the Yankee’s #1 target is quite encouraging.

The M’s upping their offer? Yes please.

[Benihana]

USA Today's Bob Nightengale says the Yankees' top target now is Luis Castillo. He Tweets, "The #Yankees grab outfielder Andrew Benintendi after being swept by the #Mets. The No. 1 target now on their shopping list: Cincinnati #Reds ace Luis Castillo."

That said, any deal with the Reds might still take a couple of days to consummate. The reason: The Mariners are now said to be upping the ante on a counter proposal. So don't be surprised if Mahle is traded first.

Can you please source this- is the second paragraph also directly from Nightengale?

[Guacarock]

Can you please source this- is the second paragraph also directly from Nightengale?

Second paragraph is not from Nightengale, but from a couple of Twitter sources. Less credible -- all Mariners fans -- but coming from enough fans to possibly represent a little bit of smoke.

[Benihana]

I’d take Marte, Ford and Hancock. Would take Trammell as a bonus throw in, even if it meant including someone like Pham or Naquin.

[Bourgeois Zee]

USA Today's Bob Nightengale says the Yankees' top target now is Luis Castillo. He Tweets, "The #Yankees grab outfielder Andrew Benintendi after being swept by the #Mets. The No. 1 target now on their shopping list: Cincinnati #Reds ace Luis Castillo."

That said, any deal with the Reds might still take a couple of days to consummate. The reason: The Mariners are now said to be upping the ante on a counter proposal. So don't be surprised if Mahle is traded first.

You love to see it.

I'm guessing, reading the tea leaves, that Seattle was reluctant to deal SS prospect Noelvi Marte, but may be reconsidering.

I'm also of the opinion that he's far less likely to stick at SS than Peraza, but is likely a more potent power bat.

As an added bonus, he'd probably match up better with the timeline of Elly De La Cruz than Peraza (though the difference is negligible).

[Bourgeois Zee]

I’d take Marte, Ford and Hancock. Would take Trammell as a bonus throw in, even if it meant including someone like Pham or Naquin.

That's a ridiculous haul-- the Mariners would be crazy to offer that much prospect capital for one player.

That's the type of deal that would grab Soto, IMO. (If they also were willing to take on Corbin's salary.)

[WrongVerb]

Source: Yankees push hard for Luis Castillo, but Reds are the holdup (https://www.nj.com/yankees/2022/07/source-yankees-push-hard-for-luis-castillo-but-reds-are-the-holdup.html)


The Yankees believe they have expressed strong interest in Reds starting pitcher Luis Castillo, but Cincinnati hasn’t seemed like it’ll be ready to act until not long before Tuesday’s trade deadline, a person with knowledge of the situation told NJ Advance Media on Thursday.

“They’re telling people, basically, we’ll get back to you on that,” said the person, who spoke under the condition of anonymity because he wasn’t authorized to speak publicly.

I wonder if this is the same info about why the Reds are holding up on Castillo: they've got something cooking with Seattle for Mahle.

[Benihana]

That's a ridiculous haul-- the Mariners would be crazy to offer that much prospect capital for one player.

That's the type of deal that would grab Soto, IMO. (If they also were willing to take on Corbin's salary.)

Not sure I agree. A #20ish and #70ish prospect (who’s a 19 year old catcher) plus an arm that’s not top 100 isn’t an insane deal for Castillo, and the Nats would certainly want more for Soto.

Frankly, it’s similar to getting Peraza and Dominguez plus an arm like Gil or Medina or Wesnewsky, except that Marte’s profile is more similar to Volpe than Peraza.

[RedTeamGo!]

It’s HERBIE Hancock

[kaldaniels]

Not for the headliner in a return but the Reds need to look for guys with the Drury profile. Underrated but there’s underlying skills that when dropped into GABP they could become a star.

They aren’t trading with Arizona right now but perhaps a guy in the Seth Beer mold.

[Bourgeois Zee]

Source: Yankees push hard for Luis Castillo, but Reds are the holdup (https://www.nj.com/yankees/2022/07/source-yankees-push-hard-for-luis-castillo-but-reds-are-the-holdup.html)

Reds playing coy with the Yankees to get them to up their offer seems like a good move for Cincinnati.

That someone in the New York front office is angry enough about it to leak their complaint to Yankee fans is even better.

I'm really hoping this means the Yankees will add Dominguez to Peraza and a third lesser pitching prospect (Medina? Gil?) in a limited time offer.

[Benihana]

Source: Yankees push hard for Luis Castillo, but Reds are the holdup (https://www.nj.com/yankees/2022/07/source-yankees-push-hard-for-luis-castillo-but-reds-are-the-holdup.html)



I wonder if this is the same info about why the Reds are holding up on Castillo: they've got something cooking with Seattle for Mahle.

Good. Bid em up Bruce but don’t wait too long. The best hauls frequently happen within 24 hours of the deadline.

If Montas goes first a team like the Yanks are even more likely to overpay

[Bourgeois Zee]

Not sure I agree. A #20ish and #70ish prospect (who’s a 19 year old catcher) plus an arm that’s not top 100 isn’t an insane deal for Castillo, and the Nats would certainly want more for Soto.

Frankly, it’s similar to getting Peraza and Dominguez plus an arm like Gil or Medina or Wesnewsky, except that Marte’s profile is more similar to Volpe than Peraza.

Hancock is ranked #82 in MLB and #87 in BP.
Harry Ford was #93 on MLB's pre-season list and has put up an 800+ OPS as a catcher.
Noelvi Marte is a borderline top 10 prospect, #11 in MLB's list, #15 in BP's pre-season list.

[Benihana]

Hancock is ranked #82 in MLB and #87 in BP.
Harry Ford was #93 on MLB's pre-season list and has put up an 800+ OPS as a catcher.
Noelvi Marte is a borderline top 10 prospect, #11 in MLB's list, #15 in BP's pre-season list.

Not sure what MLB rankings you are looking at.

I’m seeing Marte as 21 (moved down materially from May) and Hancock unranked in their midseason rankings.

[Bourgeois Zee]

Not for the headliner in a return but the Reds need to look for guys with the Drury profile. Underrated but there’s underlying skills that when dropped into GABP they could become a star.

They aren’t trading with Arizona right now but perhaps a guy in the Seth Beer mold.

I like the idea of targeting former top 100 guys who've lost some prospect hype either due to prospect fatigue or inconsistent PAs.

Florial is one of those types of guys. Trammell and Jo Adell are too. Kelenic, Kyle Lewis, and Royce Lewis are better prospects that also might be available.

- - - Updated - - -


Not sure what MLB rankings you are looking at.

I’m seeing Marte as 21 (moved down materially from May) and Hancock unranked.

Look on baseball-reference.com

[Benihana]

Hancock is ranked #82 in MLB and #87 in BP.
Harry Ford was #93 on MLB's pre-season list and has put up an 800+ OPS as a catcher.
Noelvi Marte is a borderline top 10 prospect, #11 in MLB's list, #15 in BP's pre-season list.

Not sure what MLB rankings you are looking at.

I’m seeing Marte as 21 (moved down materially from May) and Hancock unranked as of their July 7 update.

Marte seems to have moved up 3 spots since then with graduations of Riley Greene and two others.

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- - - Updated - - -



Look on baseball-reference.com

Look at MLB’s actual rankings though.

https://www.mlb.com/prospects/top100/

[Bourgeois Zee]

Look at MLB’s actual rankings though.

https://www.mlb.com/prospects/top100/

It's also on baseball-reference, as are other industry leaders.

Regardless, asking for a team's best, second-best, and fourth-best prospects is ridiculous. Unless it's for a guy like Soto.

[Kc61]

I think Mahle is first red to get moved. I think it happens tonight or tomorrow morning. I think Castillo gets traded Sunday. Drury, Naquin, Pham get traded deadline day.

In light of Mahle’s recent injury, I expect he’ll make his final start as a Red this coming weekend.

Teams may want to make sure he’s 100%.

[Bourgeois Zee]

In light of Mahle’s recent injury, I expect he’ll make his final start as a Red this coming weekend.

Teams may want to make sure he’s 100%.

I'm guessing teams will want him to start for their team.

[kaldaniels]

It's also on baseball-reference, as are other industry leaders.

Regardless, asking for a team's best, second-best, and fourth-best prospects is ridiculous. Unless it's for a guy like Soto.

Are we arguing/deflecting what MLB’s rankings are when they post them on their own site?

Remember, I and many others subscribe to the “don’t worry about where a guy ranks prospect wise on his club” theory. Too much variance amongst teams? Look at the individual players.

I wouldn’t want the Angels or Cubs 1,2 and 4 prospects for Castillo and I don’t even know who they are. (Those are just crude examples from the top of my head)

[Old school 1983]

In light of Mahle’s recent injury, I expect he’ll make his final start as a Red this coming weekend.

Teams may want to make sure he’s 100%.

He will get checked head to toe by the other teams medical staff…or so I’d think. If they say go ahead, I think another start isn’t necessary.

[Kc61]

I'm guessing teams will want him to start for their team.

So you’d give up some good prospects for a recently injured pitcher? Without watching him make two starts after injury?

I’m more of a due diligence buyer myself. Difference of one start.

[Bourgeois Zee]

Are we arguing/deflecting what MLB’s rankings are when they post them on their own site?

Remember, I and many others subscribe to the “don’t worry about where a guy ranks prospect wise on his club” theory. Too much variance amongst teams? Look at the individual players.

I wouldn’t want the Angels or Cubs 1,2 and 4 prospects for Castillo and I don’t even know who they are. (Those are just crude examples from the top of my head)

And we all know the Mariners have one of the best prospect top 10s in all of baseball.

[RedTeamGo!]

Feisand:

The Twins, Guardians & White Sox - separated by just 3 games in the AL Central - are among the most aggressive teams in the pitching market right now, per sources. According to one executive from a potential seller, “They all think they have a shot and are trying to get better.”

I said this a couple days ago. I think Guardians are a perfect trading partner for the Reds

Cleveland gets:

Castillo
Whatever expiring offensive contract they want

Reds get:

Plesac
Valera
Nikhazy
If they want Drury as their offensive player a pitching prospect not named Espino


Either way - Krall could not ask for a better market at the deadline. The next 5 days will either make or break the next decade of Reds baseball. Not being hyperbolic.

[TRF]

I wouldn’t want the Angels or Cubs 1,2 and 4 prospects for Castillo and I don’t even know who they are. (Those are just crude examples from the top of my head)

If Jo Adell is still considered a prospect, hell yes for me.

[Old school 1983]

So you’d give up some good prospects for a recently injured pitcher? Without watching him make two starts after injury?

I’m more of a due diligence buyer myself.

One mans due diligence is another man’s cold feet. One team may be willing to just go off the word of their medical staff to get one more start out of him then waiting for him to go for the Reds. Guess it depends on how much you want to roll the dice.

[Bourgeois Zee]

So you’d give up some good prospects for a recently injured pitcher? Without watching him make two starts after injury?

I’m more of a due diligence buyer myself.

I'd have my doctors all over him. That plus his recent outing (where he proved he could still dial it up) would be enough for me to pull the trigger.

[kaldaniels]

And we all know the Mariners have one of the best prospect top 10s in all of baseball.

I mean for reference MLB currently has Peraza and Jasson each as a high 30 prospect. That has been mentioned as reasonable.

And we are talking about getting the M’s guys who are what 21, 93 and unranked and that’s an abomination of a return?

- - - Updated - - -


If Jo Adell is still considered a prospect, hell yes for me.

He is not.

[Bourgeois Zee]

I mean for reference MLB currently has Peraza and Jasson each as a high 30 prospect. That has been mentioned as reasonable.

And we are talking about getting the M’s guys who are what 21, 93 and unranked and that’s an abomination of a return?

Marte in in the upper echelon of elite prospects (https://theathletic.com/3074113/2022/01/31/top-100-mlb-prospects-2022-keith-laws-rankings-with-adley-rutschman-at-no-1/). (Keith Law ranks him one spot below Volpe, fwiw.)

Dominguez, Peraza, Ford, and Hancock are in the next tier. (Again, according to Law, Ford is a top 50 guy, Dominguez ranks in the mid-80s, Peraza in the mid-90s.)

It'd be similar to ask for Volpe, Dominguez, and one of Peraza or Waldichuk.

That's a massive haul that is wholly unlikely for Luis Castillo.

[Coopdaddy67]

It's also on baseball-reference, as are other industry leaders.

Regardless, asking for a team's best, second-best, and fourth-best prospects is ridiculous. Unless it's for a guy like Soto.

These rankings are constantly changing and not all systems are equal.

Marte was a Top 10-15 overall coming into the season, but he's fallen given that he's underperformed up until the last 2 weeks or so when he's gotten hot.

The Nationals would laugh at that offer from the Mariners.

[Kc61]

I'd have my doctors all over him. That plus his recent outing (where he proved he could still dial it up) would be enough for me to pull the trigger.

Mahle is supposed to pitch Saturday. Seems like a prudent health check to wait for that. It’s the day after tomorrow.

But we’ll see what they do.

[Mitri]

If it's the Mariners I'd rather have Kelenic as the centerpiece (over Marte). Ford and Hancock are nice second pieces.

[kaldaniels]

Mahle is supposed to pitch Saturday. Seems like a prudent health check to wait for that. It’s the day after tomorrow.

But we’ll see what they do.

I wasn’t too worried about Castillo pitching yesterday.

I do worry about Mahle getting lit up at GABP this weekend.

[fearofpopvol1]

I can't think of any time ever that there was this much hype around a pitcher/haul for the Reds at the deadline. And obviously, that doesn't even account for Mahle either.

Just hope the Reds get it right. This is a bit of a unicorn situation for them.

[RedTeamGo!]

I can't think of any time ever that there was this much hype around a pitcher/haul for the Reds at the deadline. And obviously, that doesn't even account for Mahle either.

Just hope the Reds get it right. This is a bit of a unicorn situation for them.

Make or break situation

[LeatherPants]

I wasn’t too worried about Castillo pitching yesterday.

I do worry about Mahle getting lit up at GABP this weekend.

Yeah, a home start is not ideal.

[Kc61]

I wasn’t too worried about Castillo pitching yesterday.

I do worry about Mahle getting lit up at GABP this weekend.

Reds can’t make the trade alone. If the other team wants to watch another outing, that’s it. Reds can say three innings, that’s your market check. I doubt Reds can refuse altogether.

[Coopdaddy67]

Are we arguing/deflecting what MLB’s rankings are when they post them on their own site?

Remember, I and many others subscribe to the “don’t worry about where a guy ranks prospect wise on his club” theory. Too much variance amongst teams? Look at the individual players.

I wouldn’t want the Angels or Cubs 1,2 and 4 prospects for Castillo and I don’t even know who they are. (Those are just crude examples from the top of my head)

The Reds traded Mike Leake for Keury Mella, the Giants' #1 prospect in 2015.

[WrongVerb]

Héctor Gómez
@hgomez27

The Padres would send to the #Nationals shortstop CJ Abrams, left-handed pitchers Mackenzie Gore and Adrian Morejon, as well as outfielders Robert Hassell III (No. 23 MLB prospect), Joshua Mears (No. 8 Padres prospect) ).

Buster Olney @Buster_ESPN

As of Thursday morning, some rival executives perceive the Padres to be the frontrunner to land Juan Soto.
2:23pm · 28 Jul 2022

[Benihana]

It's also on baseball-reference, as are other industry leaders.

Regardless, asking for a team's best, second-best, and fourth-best prospects is ridiculous. Unless it's for a guy like Soto.

I believe those are preseason rankings. Things change obviously.

And I simply disagree, that’s not ridiculous, especially when a farm system isn’t stacked. Remember what the Reds traded for Latos? (Reds’ immediately previous three first round picks, two of whom were top 10 picks AND their #2 starter). Castillo is better than Latos was, and teams are more desperate for rotation upgrades for the stretch run than the Reds were at that time.

[757690]

Someone reported that the Nationals were likely to trade Soto at this deadline because of an offer they can’t refuse. The above one from the Padres, if accurate, seems to be that offer.

[Kc61]

Pads GM is not faint of heart. He goes big. Dodgers already are paying Betts nearly the GNP for the outfield. Cards, not so bold as Pads IMO.

[Bourgeois Zee]

Abrams, Gore, Morejon, and Hassell is a massive amount of prospect and MLB-ready guys to throw at one player.

I could see why the Nationals make that deal.

Luis Garcia, Keibert Ruiz, Abrams, and Hassell up the middle is a really solid starting spot.

Gore and Morejon should be interesting enough to give at least a couple of seasons of innings at-- and might end up a solid 1-2 punch atop the rotation.

- - - Updated - - -


I believe those are preseason rankings. Things change obviously.

And I simply disagree, that’s not ridiculous, especially when a farm system isn’t stacked. Remember what the Reds traded for Latos? Castillo is better.

We definitely disagree.

[TRF]

I can't think of any time ever that there was this much hype around a pitcher/haul for the Reds at the deadline. And obviously, that doesn't even account for Mahle either.

Just hope the Reds get it right. This is a bit of a unicorn situation for them.

Is it though? The Reds have burnt it down before, and despite the actual outcome of the trade, Cueto to KC, in concept alone, was an excellent trade.

Is 2022 Castillo better than 2015 Cueto? Does he have more value due to player control?

Mahle > Leake obviously. Did you know Keury Mella now plays baseball in China?

My point is the Reds very recent history has them doing a similar rotation sell off. The assets might be a bit better or more controllable, but the results of those 2015 deals shows that what seems like a great return was far from a certain thing.

[Benihana]

I can't think of any time ever that there was this much hype around a pitcher/haul for the Reds at the deadline. And obviously, that doesn't even account for Mahle either.

Just hope the Reds get it right. This is a bit of a unicorn situation for them.

To me this is the exact same as it was with Cueto in 2015. Let’s hope the Reds do much better than they did then.

[Old school 1983]

I believe those are preseason rankings. Things change obviously.

And I simply disagree, that’s not ridiculous, especially when a farm system isn’t stacked. Remember what the Reds traded for Latos? (Reds’ immediately previous three first round picks, two of whom were top 10 picks AND their #2 starter). Castillo is better than Latos was, and teams are more desperate for rotation upgrades for the stretch run than the Reds were at that time.

Latos was very good and came with way more control.

[klw]

Shi Davidi
@ShiDavidi
·
13h

Worth keeping in mind as it relates to the Blue Jays and potential acquisitions of unvaccinated players ahead of the trade deadline: Even if a player agrees to get vaccinated, he is ineligible for entry until 14 days clear of an accepted vaccine's second dose or one dose J&J.


So, best case, if someone takes J&J he becomes eligible for entry on 15th day after shot. If it's a two-dose vaccine, factoring in a 21-day period between shots, you're looking at 36 days.

The Blue Jays open August with a nine game road trip and first home game is on 12th.


That means Friday is the last day for an unvaccinated player to get a J&J shot and not miss any Blue Jays home games. If a player opts for a two-dose vaccine (i.e. Pfizer/Moderna), and assuming 21-day period is followed, no home games until September.

[Benihana]

How could the Padres ever afford to pay Soto with Tatis and Machado on the books? I don’t get it.

[RedTeamGo!]

Is it though? The Reds have burnt it down before, and despite the actual outcome of the trade, Cueto to KC, in concept alone, was an excellent trade.

Is 2022 Castillo better than 2015 Cueto? Does he have more value due to player control?

Mahle > Leake obviously. Did you know Keury Mella now plays baseball in China?

My point is the Reds very recent history has them doing a similar rotation sell off. The assets might be a bit better or more controllable, but the results of those 2015 deals shows that what seems like a great return was far from a certain thing.

And those returns are a big part of the reason the Reds are a dumpster fire right now. Not going to get all sidetracked but Cueto should have been traded a calendar year before he was.

Castillo had significantly more value than Cueto had in 15.

[Benihana]

Latos was very good and came with way more control.

Castillo is better than Latos ever was.

Agree Latos had one more season of control.

- - - Updated - - -

[Kc61]

To me this is the exact same as it was with Cueto in 2015. Let’s hope the Reds do much better than they did then.

Reds are in a better position with Castillo than Cueto.

Cueto had an elbow injury in late May of that season. He was not having as good a year as in 2014. He was still a highly respected pitcher, but not at peak.

Castillo is at peak. Healthy, pitching great, top form.

Reds should do better than in the Cueto trade.

[Alpha Zero]

Castillo is better than Latos ever was.

Agree Latos had one more season of control.

- - - Updated - - -

Agree Castillo is far better than Latos, but I believe Latos had 4 full seasons of team control when the Reds acquired him, assuming I remember correctly.

[Old school 1983]

Castillo is better than Latos ever was.

Agree Latos had one more season of control.

- - - Updated - - -

Sure. But I don’t think the gap is as big as you’re making it out to be. Latos was a Red for 3 years and then was traded under that contract to Miami. I think he had 4 years of control to Castillo’s 1.5. Castillo is a true number one IMO. Latos was more of a 1-2, but the years of control make those deals non-comparable IMO.

[fearofpopvol1]

To me this is the exact same as it was with Cueto in 2015. Let’s hope the Reds do much better than they did then.

I'm talking about where the Reds held THEE prized pitcher. 2015 had David Price, who was as good as Cueto. Kazmir and Hamels were available too and pretty darn good then as well.

[fearofpopvol1]

Is it though? The Reds have burnt it down before, and despite the actual outcome of the trade, Cueto to KC, in concept alone, was an excellent trade.

Is 2022 Castillo better than 2015 Cueto? Does he have more value due to player control?

Mahle > Leake obviously. Did you know Keury Mella now plays baseball in China?

My point is the Reds very recent history has them doing a similar rotation sell off. The assets might be a bit better or more controllable, but the results of those 2015 deals shows that what seems like a great return was far from a certain thing.

Absolutely it's a bigger deal having the extra year of control. Castillo is THEE prized possession. 2015 had David Price, Kazmir, and Cole Hammels all traded at the deadline too. The Cueto of 2015 was fairly comparable to those guys.

[LeatherPants]

How could the Padres ever afford to pay Soto with Tatis and Machado on the books? I don’t get it.

Because major league teams are swimming in money, even “small market” teams like San Diego.

[Big Klu]

I think a lot of people's opinions of Mat Latos are clouded by his prickly personality and one unfortunate pitch to the Giants. In reality, Latos was quite good for the Reds.

[Wonderful Monds]

Yeah the Reds got Latos for the 2012-2015 seasons

All things considered, trading 2 prospects and Boxberger for 4 years of a #2 pitcher was basically a steal for the Reds.

[RiverRat13]

Latos was coming into his 24 yo season with 4 years of control and had back to back 4+ WAR seasons as a 22/23 yo. He absolutely had more value than Castillo does now.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

[Bourgeois Zee]

Latos was never the same after getting hurt.

Pitching is a delicate and violent process.

That said, he held far more value when the Reds dealt for him than does Castillo now.

[Guacarock]

Andy Martino, author of the sports book CHEATED, says the Yankees sent a scout to watch Castillo pitch Wednesday in Cincinnati. Without elaborating on every aspect of a possible trade, Martino says, "Prospect Ken Waldichuk has drawn interest."

[Wonderful Monds]

Reds are in a better position with Castillo than Cueto.

Cueto had an elbow injury in late May of that season. He was not having as good a year as in 2014. He was still a highly respected pitcher, but not at peak.

Castillo is at peak. Healthy, pitching great, top form.

Reds should do better than in the Cueto trade.

Castillo should have more value, but honestly the return for Cueto was not bad for 2 months. A top 50 prospect in Reed, a first round draft pick the previous year in Finnegan, and then yeah I guess Lamb.


You don’t see those kind of returns for 2 month rentals anymore.

[TRF]

And those returns are a big part of the reason the Reds are a dumpster fire right now. Not going to get all sidetracked but Cueto should have been traded a calendar year before he was.

Castillo had significantly more value than Cueto had in 15.

I'm not disagreeing here. What I am saying is the Reds got a haul by every metric for Cueto, except for what happened after. In reality those guys flamed out. But in terms of getting something for someone, the Reds did a fantastic job.

Castillo SHOULD bring more, but that's the standard for what you could get with just the remaining year of control. So, yeah, Castillo needs to bring a lot more. But Finnegan /Reed/Lamb was the absolute right target for Cueto in terms of talent THAT year. had he been dealt mid 2014... who knows.

When the Reds Think through a trade, getting Castillo for Straily for example, they do well. When they react, Chapman for a pile of wet leaves, they don't. The Reds did well in trading Sonny Gray. I think they gave up on Suarez, when they should have given up on Moose. But they addressed some pitching needs there and Fraley might not be Schebler...

He's totally Schebler.

We'll see. It's an exciting trade deadline for sure.

I still want the Reds to trade Pham to SF for the sheer comedic gold of it.

[Kc61]

Castillo should have more value, but honestly the return for Cueto was not bad for 2 months. A top 50 prospect in Reed, a first round draft pick the previous year in Finnegan, and then yeah I guess Lamb.


You don’t see those kind of returns for 2 month rentals anymore.

I don’t disagree. Of course, if Reds had traded Johnny in the off-season, right off his near Cy Young season, they should have done better.

But this Castillo thing is the perfect storm. He got hot just at the right time. This off-season should really boost the Reds’ organization.

[RedTeamGo!]

Castillo should have more value, but honestly the return for Cueto was not bad for 2 months. A top 50 prospect in Reed, a first round draft pick the previous year in Finnegan, and then yeah I guess Lamb.


You don’t see those kind of returns for 2 month rentals anymore.

Yep, the return for Benintendi was horrendous, for example.

[RiverRat13]

Castillo should have more value, but honestly the return for Cueto was not bad for 2 months. A top 50 prospect in Reed, a first round draft pick the previous year in Finnegan, and then yeah I guess Lamb.


You don’t see those kind of returns for 2 month rentals anymore.Cody Reed was not a top 50 prospect when the Reds traded for him. Finnegan was clearly the headliner.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

[corkedbat]

I'm not disagreeing here. What I am saying is the Reds got a haul by every metric for Cueto, except for what happened after. In reality those guys flamed out. But in terms of getting something for someone, the Reds did a fantastic job.

Castillo SHOULD bring more, but that's the standard for what you could get with just the remaining year of control. So, yeah, Castillo needs to bring a lot more. But Finnegan /Reed/Lamb was the absolute right target for Cueto in terms of talent THAT year. had he been dealt mid 2014... who knows.

When the Reds Think through a trade, getting Castillo for Straily for example, they do well. When they react, Chapman for a pile of wet leavings, they don't. The Reds did well in trading Sonny Gray. I think they gave up on Suarez, when they should have given up on Moose. But they addressed some pitching needs there and Fraley might not be Schebler...

He's totally Schebler.

We'll see. It's an exciting trade deadline for sure.

I still want the Reds to trade Pham to SF for the sheer comedic gold of it.

FIFY

[Wonderful Monds]

Cody Reed was not a top 50 prospect when the Reds traded for him. Finnegan was clearly the headliner.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

He was ranked #34 pre-season 2016 by BA. I think he had already moved up to top 50 in midsession 2015 lists when he had been acquired. At the very least I remember talk here at the time of the trade that Reed either was already or was about to be a highly ranked prospect.

[Alpha Zero]

He was ranked #34 pre-season 2016 by BA. I think he had already moved up to top 50 in midsession 2015 lists when he had been acquired. At the very least I remember talk here at the time of the trade that Reed either was already or was about to be a highly ranked prospect.

Yeah, Reed was a guy with a lot of helium and momentum at the time of the trade.

[RedTeamGo!]

Watching Yankees fans go from “Castillo is awesome, we need him now!” To “Castillo sucks anyways, 30 year old pitcher that is inconsistent” back to “We need Castillo NOW!” Back to “Castillo stinks, 36 year old pitcher with a negative career WAR” back to “Get him now!” Back to ….

Is absolutely hilarious

Oh yeah, they have no idea what the Yankees are offering but they cannot believe the Reds haven’t accepted it yet. And the Yankees should ABSOLUTELY not trade even one of Volpe, Peraza, Dominguez, Waldichuk, etc for him. Reds are so stoooopid.

I honestly don’t want him to go to the Yankees. Garbage entitled fanbase that doesn’t deserve nice things.

[Old school 1983]

Watching Yankees fans go from “Castillo is awesome, we need him now!” To “Castillo sucks anyways, 30 year old pitcher that is inconsistent” back to “We need Castillo NOW!” Back to “Castillo stinks, 36 year old pitcher with a negative career WAR” back to “Get him now!” Back to ….

Is absolutely hilarious

Oh yeah, they have no idea what the Yankees are offering but they cannot believe the Reds haven’t accepted it yet. And the Yankees should ABSOLUTELY not trade even one of Volpe, Peraza, Dominguez, Waldichuk, etc for him. Reds are so stoooopid.

I honestly don’t want him to go to the Yankees. Garbage entitled fanbase that doesn’t deserve nice things.

Make the Yankees cut off body parts to pay for his services.

[missionhockey21]

Watching Yankees fans go from “Castillo is awesome, we need him now!” To “Castillo sucks anyways, 30 year old pitcher that is inconsistent” back to “We need Castillo NOW!” Back to “Castillo stinks, 36 year old pitcher with a negative career WAR” back to “Get him now!” Back to ….

Is absolutely hilarious

Oh yeah, they have no idea what the Yankees are offering but they cannot believe the Reds haven’t accepted it yet. And the Yankees should ABSOLUTELY not trade even one of Volpe, Peraza, Dominguez, Waldichuk, etc for him. Reds are so stoooopid.

I honestly don’t want him to go to the Yankees. Garbage entitled fanbase that doesn’t deserve nice things.

Reading their comments often reminds me that I live on the poor, rough side of the tracks when it comes to MLB fandom. As they discard toys and complain about their lavish meals while my vagrant little friends and I crush berries to make a purple like paste that we can crudely draw #selltheteambob on the overpass.

[Bourgeois Zee]

Question for the board:

- What would it take to deal Alexis Diaz in terms of a prospect package?

[Bourgeois Zee]

Question II for the board:

- Reiver Sanmartin has, since the calendar flipped to June, put up tremendous numbers-- 17 IP, 15 G, 13 H, 3 ER, 7 BB, 12 K.

As a RP, he's worked to a 1.23 ERA in 22 innings of 1.000 WHiP ball.

What would you want for him?

[TRF]

Question for the board:

- What would it take to deal Alexis Diaz in terms of a prospect package?

Now that is an interesting thought experiment.

I need a team's top 10 pitching prospect + a lottery ticket arm. I think he's going to be as good as his brother.

[Guacarock]

Ken Rosenthal reporting the Padres have entered the Castillo trade talks.

MLB Trade Rumors gives the skivvy, saying, "Frankie Montas and Luis Castillo have also been linked to the Padres in trade rumors, and as Rosenthal notes, it is noteworthy in itself that San Diego is looking at pitchers despite having plenty of rotation depth on paper. However, MacKenzie Gore was recently placed on the injured list, Sean Manaea has struggled as of late, and the Padres could be trying to land a pitcher controlled through at least 2023 considering that Manaea, Joe Musgrove, Mike Clevinger, and Nick Martinez could all potentially enter the free agent market this winter. "

MLB Trade Rumors adds, "Furthermore, someone like Blake Snell could be dealt to try and stay under the luxury tax threshold, as avoiding another tax payment is another consideration for Preller to manage as the deadline approaches."

[Patrick Bateman]

Question II for the board:

- Reiver Sanmartin has, since the calendar flipped to June, put up tremendous numbers-- 17 IP, 15 G, 13 H, 3 ER, 7 BB, 12 K.

As a RP, he's worked to a 1.23 ERA in 22 innings of 1.000 WHiP ball.

What would you want for him?

He feels like a house of cards waiting to fall.

Anything interesting (decent upside), even if far away would probably be ok with me.

[Tom Servo]

I'd love to consummate a deal with San Diego. Good collection of talent there and none of the PTSD scars from dealing with the Yankees or Dodgers.

[Larry Schuler]

Surprised no one has posited this yet:

What if the Reds are just scared?

The other teams are offering too many good players and it’s overwhelming and the Reds are just scared cause that’s too many good players and what will they do if the good players are like “Ugh, I don’t like Cincinnati” and then people are like “Cincinnati doesn’t know what to do with all those good players” and then Cincinnati is like “Ugh, I’m scared! I don’t want any of this! What if we have to play in the playoffs against scary teams in front of all those people? Too scary!” so then they don’t trade Castillo because it’s too scary. It’s better to keep him and then let him walk for a draft pick and then it won’t be scary and the Reds can have fun and not be scared.

What do you think?

[Kc61]

Don’t want to walk down the aisle with Pads and be left at the altar for Soto.

[corkedbat]

Reds have had a tough enough time stocking even adequate bullpen arms. I don't think other teams are gonna offer up more value for either than they currently have for the Reds.

[fearofpopvol1]

Watching Yankees fans go from “Castillo is awesome, we need him now!” To “Castillo sucks anyways, 30 year old pitcher that is inconsistent” back to “We need Castillo NOW!” Back to “Castillo stinks, 36 year old pitcher with a negative career WAR” back to “Get him now!” Back to ….

Is absolutely hilarious

Oh yeah, they have no idea what the Yankees are offering but they cannot believe the Reds haven’t accepted it yet. And the Yankees should ABSOLUTELY not trade even one of Volpe, Peraza, Dominguez, Waldichuk, etc for him. Reds are so stoooopid.

I honestly don’t want him to go to the Yankees. Garbage entitled fanbase that doesn’t deserve nice things.

Imagine living here and having to hear and deal with this on a daily basis. It's brutal.

- - - Updated - - -


I'd love to consummate a deal with San Diego. Good collection of talent there and none of the PTSD scars from dealing with the Yankees or Dodgers.

I'm intrigued but not off if they're landing Soto. I know their system is deep but the Pickens may be slimmer.

[Guacarock]

Looks like the World-Champion Braves might also be circling Castillo now. Jim Bowden says they would ""jump at the opportunity" to add Castillo to their rotation. The Braves were also in on the trade talks with Kansas City for outfielder Andrew Benintendi but lost out to the Yankees. So they could now be plotting a little revenge.

Here's a Doric Sam Bleacher Report that provides more background discussion: https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10043408-braves-trade-rumors-andrew-benintendi-luis-castillo-top-target-list-before-deadline

[MikeS21]

Lol! Braves have fleeced the Reds in trades as often as the Yankees and Dodgers have.

Honestly, I don’t think the Braves have the prospect capital to land Castillo. I don’t see much there after Muller, and his control is iffy.

[Assembly Hall]

Looks like the World-Champion Braves might also be circling Castillo now. Jim Bowden says they would ""jump at the opportunity" to add Castillo to their rotation. The Braves were also in on the trade talks with Kansas City for outfielder Andrew Benintendi but lost out to the Yankees. So they could now be plotting a little revenge.

Here's a Doric Sam Bleacher Report that provides more background discussion: https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10043408-braves-trade-rumors-andrew-benintendi-luis-castillo-top-target-list-before-deadline

I can get behind rooting for the Braves.

[corkedbat]

Surprised no one has posited this yet:

What if the Reds are just scared?

The other teams are offering too many good players and it’s overwhelming and the Reds are just scared cause that’s too many good players and what will they do if the good players are like “Ugh, I don’t like Cincinnati” and then people are like “Cincinnati doesn’t know what to do with all those good players” and then Cincinnati is like “Ugh, I’m scared! I don’t want any of this! What if we have to play in the playoffs against scary teams in front of all those people? Too scary!” so then they don’t trade Castillo because it’s too scary. It’s better to keep him and then let him walk for a draft pick and then it won’t be scary and the Reds can have fun and not be scared.

What do you think?

IIRC, if they adopt an International Draft, chances are compensation goes away - there will be no draft pick.

[Larry Schuler]

IIRC, if they adopt an International Draft, chances are compensation goes away - there will be no draft pick.

Honestly, that is good. Getting one more draft pick to worry about is too scary!

[corkedbat]

Looks like the World-Champion Braves might also be circling Castillo now. Jim Bowden says they would ""jump at the opportunity" to add Castillo to their rotation. The Braves were also in on the trade talks with Kansas City for outfielder Andrew Benintendi but lost out to the Yankees. So they could now be plotting a little revenge.

Here's a Doric Sam Bleacher Report that provides more background discussion: https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10043408-braves-trade-rumors-andrew-benintendi-luis-castillo-top-target-list-before-deadline

If they also want a bat, we could sweeten the pot with Drury, Pham, Naquin or Solano.

[Guacarock]

This falls in the "I'll believe it when I see it category" but one reason the Padres might now be circling Castillo is because the Cardinals might have outbid the Padres to get Juan Soto. Here's a Cardinal fan, citing an unnamed source, saying the deal is done. The report: Soto deal details according to source…

#Cardinals get:
-OF Juan Soto
-P Patrick Corbin
-$$cash$$

#Nationals get:
-IF Nolan Gorman (MLB)
-3B Jordan Walker (AA)
-SS/P Masyn Winn (AA)
-P Michael McGreevy (AA)
-OF Won-Bin Cho (FCL ROK)

#MLBTradeDeadline #SotoWatch #MLB

I'm not claiming this is final or accurate, but it's out there -- and there are similar reports starting to appear.

[NebraskaRed]

This falls in the "I'll believe it when I see it category" but one reason the Padres might now be circling Castillo is because the Cardinals might have outbid the Padres to get Juan Soto. Here's a Cardinal fan, citing an unnamed source, saying the deal is done. The report: Soto deal details according to source…

#Cardinals get:
-OF Juan Soto
-P Patrick Corbin
-$$cash$$

#Nationals get:
-IF Nolan Gorman (MLB)
-3B Jordan Walker (AA)
-SS/P Masyn Winn (AA)
-P Michael McGreevy (AA)
-OF Won-Bin Cho (FCL ROK)

#MLBTradeDeadline #SotoWatch #MLB

I'm not claiming this is final or accurate, but it's out there -- and there are similar reports starting to appear.

The person who tweeted that also tweeted this on July 11


Legend
@LegendOwnMind1
·
Jul 11

SOURCES: Reds are close to agreeing to a deal that will send P Luis Castillo to the Dodgers for prospects IF Michael Busch & OF Jake Vogel. People w/knowledge of the deal, expect the deal to be completed at the end of next wk after the ASG #MLBTradeDeadline

[MikeS21]

If the Padres get involved, it may motivate the Dodgers to wake up.

[Guacarock]

Good catch. Looks like a disreputable source. But even disreputable sources occasionally are correct. Time will tell!

[Guacarock]

If the Padres get involved, it may motivate the Dodgers to wake up.

There's no doubt all of the energy surrounding a Soto trade has sucked some of the wind out of the Castillo talks. But if Soto is drawing to a close, you'll see gale-like forces suddenly calling on Castillo. Might not be 3-4 teams, could be 6 or 7, with others adding fuel to the fire. If you like Battle Royales, keep your eyes open!

[LeatherPants]

IIRC, if they adopt an International Draft, chances are compensation goes away - there will be no draft pick.

The international draft is dead for now as the owners and the union couldn’t reach an agreement by the deadline a few days ago.

[MikeS21]

Unnamed MLB Source = Conversation between two MLB junior interns at the water cooler, discussing what their other intern friend heard from his brother-in-law’s sister’s next-door-neighbor’s uncle’s cousin.

[CaiGuy]

Watching Yankees fans go from “Castillo is awesome, we need him now!” To “Castillo sucks anyways, 30 year old pitcher that is inconsistent” back to “We need Castillo NOW!” Back to “Castillo stinks, 36 year old pitcher with a negative career WAR” back to “Get him now!” Back to ….

Is absolutely hilarious

Oh yeah, they have no idea what the Yankees are offering but they cannot believe the Reds haven’t accepted it yet. And the Yankees should ABSOLUTELY not trade even one of Volpe, Peraza, Dominguez, Waldichuk, etc for him. Reds are so stoooopid.

I honestly don’t want him to go to the Yankees. Garbage entitled fanbase that doesn’t deserve nice things.

The Reds are being mean for not giving us Castillo for our spare parts, but he sucks and we don't want him anyways, and Cashman is incompetent for not making it happen at any cost, but again he sucks and we don't even want him.

So neurotic that group.

[Benihana]

I’ll never understand the practice of reporting fake MLB trades on Twitter

[Larry Schuler]

I’ll never understand the practice of reporting fake MLB trades on Twitter

I once spent a summer with fake MLB trade reporters in north east Nepal, sleeping under the canopies of the tall trees, trading tales with my co-traveler, Julius Freed, the founder of Orange Julius. We saw them tweet in the early morn, spend the rest of the sunlight hours washing robes in whirlpools caused by tectonic magnets in the Earth’s soft core, and then on to the eve when they’d read the replies to all of us hunkered around and shivering from the Nepalese snow cones being lifted from our hands to our maws like rabbits lifting tiny Nepalese snow cones from their rabbit hands to their rabbit maws. It was for attention but also for the sustenance of our shared thirst for the simple yet scarce resource known as human interaction. That night, Kurt Cobain wrote Lithium.

[Bourgeois Zee]

If the Pads land Soto, there's little chance they have the prospect capital left to entice the Reds into a Castillo deal.

Maybe a Luis Campusano, James Wood, Eguy Rosario, and Reiss Knehr/ David Weathers deal might work?

The Braves have even less-- maybe IF Vaughn Grissom, RHP Royber Salinas, OF Justyn-Henry Malloy, RHP Freddy Tarnok, and Kyle Muller might get it done?

[Rojo Rijo]

Looks like the Reds and Yanks are playing the game right now, just a matter of who blinks first. The reports saying the Reds are in wait and see mode (trying to force them to make a deal) vs. oh hey the Padres and Braves etc etc are interested in Castillo (up your offer or lose him).

Hopefully the deal gets done by Monday, not interested in some last minute deal of this magnitude. Only real fear here is Cashman walking away from the table and getting Montas for a fraction of the cost. Thankfully I’m convinced the Yankees want Castillo and don’t want to settle for Montas.

[klw]

FWIW Dustin May is starting for the Dodgers AAA team tonight on a rehab assignment.

https://twitter.com/okc_dodgers/status/1552750772055572481?cxt=HHwWgoCwkbamvYwrAAAA

Oklahoma City Dodgers
@okc_dodgers

We feel like we're back in 2019 because we have TWO Los Angeles Dodgers slated to make rehab appearances tonight! Come cheer on the Boys in Blue as Dustin May takes the mound and Edwin Ríos rounds the bases!

*all lineups are subject to change prior to game time.

[Bourgeois Zee]

Looks like the Reds and Yanks are playing the game right now, just a matter of who blinks first. The reports saying the Reds are in wait and see mode (trying to force them to make a deal) vs. oh hey the Padres and Braves etc etc are interested in Castillo (up your offer or lose him).

Hopefully the deal gets done by Monday, not interested in some last minute deal of this magnitude. Only real fear here is Cashman walking away from the table and getting Montas for a fraction of the cost. Thankfully I’m convinced the Yankees want Castillo and don’t want to settle for Montas.

I'm fine with a last-minute deal if the Reds can't find the prospects they want.

[Mitri]

Everyone wants Castillo, and there's not a lot else out there pitching-wise. Krall can play the long game through the weekend if he wants.

[WrongVerb]

18574

[bamatank]

The Cardinals are playing in Toronto without Goldsmith and Arenado.

[GoReds]

The Cardinals are playing in Toronto without Goldsmith and Arenado.

Unvaccinated?

[bamatank]

Yes, unvaccinated.

[RED VAN HOT]

Looks like the Reds and Yanks are playing the game right now, just a matter of who blinks first. The reports saying the Reds are in wait and see mode (trying to force them to make a deal) vs. oh hey the Padres and Braves etc etc are interested in Castillo (up your offer or lose him).

Hopefully the deal gets done by Monday, not interested in some last minute deal of this magnitude. Only real fear here is Cashman walking away from the table and getting Montas for a fraction of the cost. Thankfully I’m convinced the Yankees want Castillo and don’t want to settle for Montas.

I think you are right about the blinking. Reds asking price includes prospects that the Yankees are unwilling to include. My fear is that the Reds will give in to the Yankee terms.

[The Kid]

Well I guess I'll be pressing F5 all weekend. I was hoping a deal would get done a bit earlier.

[bamatank]

Not trying to change subject because i am really interested in the trade talk. Just turned on the Lookouts game and De La Cruz hit one completely over the stands and out of the park. Estimated 512 ft. Mcgarry followed with another homer. Now back to trade talk.

[Guacarock]

Ken Rosenthal tells Fox Sports that acquiring Luis Castillo before the Trade Deadline is the single greatest target of the Seattle Mariners.

[The Kid]

Ken Rosenthal tells Fox Sports that acquiring Luis Castillo before the Trade Deadline is the single greatest target of the Seattle Mariners.

I do like that... we already did business with them once. I'm not familiar with their prospects but it would be a nice team to follow into the playoffs. Wink Wink ;)

[Ren Deagle]

Maybe Krall should pivot while the Yankees make him wait. Talk with the Twins about Mahle. Find a taker for Drury or Naquin. Or call up the Dodgers

[Kc61]

It seems like many teams are in this. The Reds have a lot on their hands. Number of guys to trade, including the big one, with a few days remaining.

I hope they’re well organized to do this correctly, have a strong process going, and that they time everything to make all their deals.

I’ve never seen the Reds have such strong opportunity to re-shape their system in one deadline/trade period. They need to handle this well.

[Larry Schuler]

Still think this is all a bit too scary for the Reds and they just want to close their eyes and wake up in their bed back before all this started happening and everyone wanted to give them too many good players and it was too much and too scary.

[TheBigLebowski]

Ken Rosenthal tells Fox Sports that acquiring Luis Castillo before the Trade Deadline is the single greatest target of the Seattle Mariners.

They want us to take Winker back.

[Rantly]

They want us to take Winker back.

Wow, just looked at his stats, what a bust so far, he does lead the league in walks however

[klw]

FWIW Dustin May is starting for the Dodgers AAA team tonight on a rehab assignment.

https://twitter.com/okc_dodgers/status/1552750772055572481?cxt=HHwWgoCwkbamvYwrAAAA

Oklahoma City Dodgers
@okc_dodgers

May has thrown 3 scoreless with 6 k's so far
https://www.milb.com/gameday/space-cowboys-vs-dodgers/2022/07/28/665255#game_state=live,game_tab=,game=665255

[klw]

Not trying to change subject because i am really interested in the trade talk. Just turned on the Lookouts game and De La Cruz hit one completely over the stands and out of the park. Estimated 512 ft. Mcgarry followed with another homer. Now back to trade talk.

McGarry is having a very promising season. 24 hrs now, BA over 28o ops well over 900. Nice to see a power bat advancing in the system. Maybe a future 1b for the Reds.

https://www.milb.com/player/alex-mcgarry-685127

Video of De L Cruz's homer here:
https://twitter.com/ChattLookouts/status/1552815641798868993?ref_src=twsrc%5Egoogle%7Ctwcam p%5Eserp%7Ctwgr%5Etweet

[westofyou]

Nothing defines a ball club’s direction more these days than the trade deadline.

I hope the Reds spend some asset distribution on obtaining some young OF’s.

I worry about hoarding pitchers, they are volatile.

Hoard some outfielders too is my advice

[bamatank]

I think he has been hurt.

[westofyou]

I think he has been hurt.

We all have man… hug it out

[Kingspoint]

Wow, just looked at his stats, what a bust so far, he does lead the league in walks however

It was Winker's bat that started the Mariners' turnaround in June. He emotionally sparked the team at the plate and in the clubhouse. Everybody loves him there, as do the fans. He was the instigator of the Angels' brawl after he was hit with a pitch that ignited the Mariners' streak of 22 of 25 in July. He also was hitting with an OPS of 1.000 over a four-week stretch during this period with a couple of walkoffs. He's since slumped again over his last 15 games or so, but his Defense has been good. Saurez' Defense has been excellent all season while he's been an RBI-machine.

Winker isn't going anywhere, and neither is Saurez.

[RiverRat13]

Still think this is all a bit too scary for the Reds and they just want to close their eyes and wake up in their bed back before all this started happening and everyone wanted to give them too many good players and it was too much and too scary.Swing and a miss.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

[klw]

Not trying to change subject because i am really interested in the trade talk. Just turned on the Lookouts game and De La Cruz hit one completely over the stands and out of the park. Estimated 512 ft. Mcgarry followed with another homer. Now back to trade talk.

De L Cruz also has tripled and stole home tonight

[PuffyPig]

It was Winker's bat that started the Mariners' turnaround in June. He emotionally sparked the team at the plate and in the clubhouse. Everybody loves him there, as do the fans. He was the instigator of the Angels' brawl after he was hit with a pitch that ignited the Mariners' streak of 22 of 25 in July. He also was hitting with an OPS of 1.000 over a four-week stretch during this period with a couple of walkoffs. He's since slumped again over his last 15 games or so, but his Defense has been good. Saurez' Defense has been excellent all season while he's been an RBI-machine.

Winker isn't going anywhere, and neither is Saurez.

I wonder if the fans will continue to love Winker if his WAR continues to be negative.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[Larry Schuler]

Swing and a miss.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

Easy for you to say hiding behind your keyboard. The Reds don’t have the same luxury as you to hide behind their computer screen. Every day, they have to hear almost every single GM tell them they want to give the Reds too many good players and it’s scary. You wouldn’t be mocking them if you felt pressured to make trades when all you want to do is just have your normal life away from the spotlight and the scariness.

[Kingspoint]

I wonder if the fans will continue to love Winker if his WAR continues to be negative.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

They are smart enough to not mix April and May results with what's happening after that. The entire team had an OPS below .550. We know enough about Winker as a REDS' fan to know he'll hit very well ofr the next several years.

- - - Updated - - -


De L Cruz also has tripled and stole home tonight

If the REDS get one of the two Yankee SS's, who plays SS for the REDS?

[Marc D]

Meanwhile, Naquin and Diehl were just traded to the Mets

[Kingspoint]

It seems like many teams are in this. The Reds have a lot on their hands. Number of guys to trade, including the big one, with a few days remaining.

I hope they’re well organized to do this correctly, have a strong process going, and that they time everything to make all their deals.

I’ve never seen the Reds have such strong opportunity to re-shape their system in one deadline/trade period. They need to handle this well.

There ya go.

[kaldaniels]

Meanwhile, Naquin and Diehl were just traded to the Mets

Nice. Relatively inconsequential but shows the big dogs we are ready to deal.

[Marc D]

I was holding out hope we'd be getting Alonso and Lindor back in return but it appears to only be a couple of TBD prospects.

[RedTeamGo!]

I wonder if the fans will continue to love Winker if his WAR continues to be negative.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

It’s not even true. I have been checking on the mariners subreddit throughout the season and the first half woes were almost exclusively blamed on him.

[Coopdaddy67]

Meanwhile, Naquin and Diehl were just traded to the Mets

Just going to assume the Reds are getting Alvarez.

[Rowsdower]

Jose Acuna and Hector Rodriguez is the return

[Marc D]

Just going to assume the Reds are getting Alvarez.

Jose Acuna and Hector Rodriguez apparently (https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2022/07/mets-to-acquire-tyler-naquin-from-reds.html)

[RedTeamGo!]

I can’t find a thing on Jose Acuna.

Hector Rodriguez is 30th ranked prospect in Mets org according to fangraphs. Their write-up on him:


The compact Rodriguez has plus-plus bat control, but he’s a little less athletic than is ideal for a young prospect with very little physical projection. Because he has such prodigious feel for the barrel and can play the middle infield, he has a path to a big league role, it’s just a little tougher to get excited about his upside due to the lack of projection.

He’s 18 years old with basically no power, however has a 60 hit tool. Naquin isn’t worth much at all. Meh return for a meh veteran.

[Coopdaddy67]

Having trouble differentiating between all the different Jose Acuna's in the minor leagues, but this is from two years ago:



Jose Acuña, RHP

Signed out of Venezuela during the 2019-2020 international free agent signing period, 17-year-old Jose Acuña shows the makings of being a starting pitcher. At 6’2”, 175-pounds, he has a solid pitching frame and is likely to add additional mass in the future, increasing his durability and fastball velocity. As the summer progressed, he added a few ticks to that fastball, signing on July 2nd with a fastball that topped out at 91 MPH and ending the summer with a fastball that topped out at 94 MPH. Complementing his fastball is a curveball and a changeup, both of which are developing but show potential. His curveball has sharp drop, while his changeup has solid tumble. Acuña has the ability to throw all three of his pitches for strikes and shows a baseball acumen advanced for a player his age.

Stats: http://origin.milb.com/player/index.jsp?player_id=691641#/career/R/pitching/2022/ALL

[Marc D]

I can’t find a thing on Jose Acuna.

Hector Rodriguez is 30th ranked prospect in Mets org according to fangraphs. Their write-up on him:



He’s 18 years old with basically no power, however has a 60 hit tool. Naquin isn’t worth much at all. Meh return for a meh veteran.


Acuna is a 19 year old RHP in the Florida Complex League that misses bats. Not a bad haul really. We shall see.

[RedTeamGo!]

Having trouble differentiating between all the different Jose Acuna's in the minor leagues, but this is from two years ago:




Stats: http://origin.milb.com/player/index.jsp?player_id=691641#/career/R/pitching/2022/ALL

This sounds promising actually

[Tony Cloninger]

Reading their comments often reminds me that I live on the poor, rough side of the tracks when it comes to MLB fandom. As they discard toys and complain about their lavish meals while my vagrant little friends and I crush berries to make a purple like paste that we can crudely draw #selltheteambob on the overpass.

These are some Yankee forum nuggets.

Per the most recent reports from insiders. Yanks are pushing hard for Castillo but the reds are currently considered the hold up on seeming hesitant to make any kind of move.

Regarding Soto. It's reported that Washington isn't overly interested in what the Yanks have to offer compared to other teams.


reply

In reply to CangiaMingia
Don't underestimate the incompetence of the Reds' front office. They're apparently not even returning calls about trades right now.

[Coopdaddy67]

This sounds promising actually

Agreed. I'll take a 20 year old with a live arm and see what happens as he grows into his body for Naquin all day long.

[Tony Cloninger]

On Baseball Reference Henry Rodriguez is a deceased former Cuban Negro League player when you click the link. We got fleeced.

[Kc61]

On Baseball Reference Henry Rodriguez is a deceased former Cuban Negro League player when you click the link. We got fleeced.

This guy is Hector, not Henry.

[RedTeamGo!]

Hector Rodriguez is batting .342 at low A as an 18 year old.

Nice, reds need more players like that.

[NebraskaRed]

Guess we'll be seeing a lot of Stuart Fairchild now

[LeatherPants]

Guess we'll be seeing a lot of Stuart Fairchild now

The Punisher has been raking in AAA.

[Kc61]

Guess we'll be seeing a lot of Stuart Fairchild now

Since reds have so little LHH, I’d guess Friedl will be returning if he isn’t traded.

[NebraskaRed]

The Punisher has been raking in AAA.

Yeah, he'll be up soon for sure. It's not really the greatest choice between Aquino and Fairchild, but I'd rather see Aquino for his arm and the occasional bomb.

- - - Updated - - -

https://twitter.com/JonathanIndia/status/1552846644076548096?s=20&t=4Fg8C-WrLFCXWIp8dyOevA

Probably easy to surmise that India wouldn't mind being traded.

[RedTeamGo!]

This is probably the start of the floodgates. Bet tomorrow is busy.

[Tony Cloninger]

This guy is Hector, not Henry.

I know that but BR does not and his link went to the Cuban player. It was funny.

[bamatank]

At least Aquino is hitting over .080.

[Guacarock]

Guess we'll be seeing a lot of Stuart Fairchild now

Depending on whether Castillo goes to the Yankees, Mariners or Braves, we'll be getting 1-2 young outfielders back. We could also see an outfielder coming our way in whatever trade gets worked out for Mahle, with the Twins and Mariners among the known interested parties. The long and short of it: Fairchild is going to get some attention, but he won't be the only one receiving a shot. Will be an interesting time even if we're still mostly losing games. Wonder how David Bell copes?

[Big Klu]

I can’t find a thing on Jose Acuna.

Hector Rodriguez is 30th ranked prospect in Mets org according to fangraphs. Their write-up on him:



He’s 18 years old with basically no power, however has a 60 hit tool. Naquin isn’t worth much at all. Meh return for a meh veteran.

Sounds a little like Alejo Lopez?

[Kingspoint]

It was a lot easier to look up Acuna than Gonzalez.

[HokieRed]

Sounds a little like Alejo Lopez?

Looks to have significantly more power than Alejo, though of course the sample size is miniscule. K rate is very good and XBH rate good. Looks like a pretty interesting kid.

[herbdizzle]

With Naquin gone we'll probably see Fraley up.

[Nemesis_Returns]

With Naquin gone we'll probably see Fraley up.

The Reds do not want for a interesting combination of Outfielders.

The Reds will move Pham for literally anything.

That leaves:

Senzel - if the shoulder holds up
Almora (once healthy)
Fairchild
"Reynolds" -Even though he does not belong out there
Aquino- 1.176 OPS 7 HR - But 27 K in 67 AAA AB
Friedl - .984 OPS in June and .961 in July (Probably up to give a LHH option)
Fraley - Part of the Seattle trade they really want to pan out
Schrock - who is a Bell favorite

Gonna be interesting.

Also don't be surprised if the Reds send Moran in one of these deals...

[kaldaniels]

The Reds do not want for a interesting combination of Outfielders.

The Reds will move Pham for literally anything.

That leaves:

Senzel - if the shoulder holds up
Almora (once healthy)
Fairchild
"Reynolds" -Even though he does not belong out there
Aquino- 1.176 OPS 7 HR - But 27 K in 67 AAA AB
Friedl - .984 OPS in June and .961 in July (Probably up to give a LHH option)
Fraley - Part of the Seattle trade they really want to pan out
Schrock - who is a Bell favorite

Gonna be interesting.

Also don't be surprised if the Reds send Moran in one of these deals...

It’s not feasible but am I the only one that looks at that list of guys and has the devil on my shoulder saying “just get rid of them all…”?

[LeatherPants]

It’s not feasible but am I the only one that looks at that list of guys and has the devil on my shoulder saying “just get rid of them all…”?

It’s a great big list of future insurance sales reps. (If anyone needs some long term care insurance, please contact me at my Fishers, IN office and ask for Pete).

[MikeS21]

It’s not feasible but am I the only one that looks at that list of guys and has the devil on my shoulder saying “just get rid of them all…”?
Not sure why Aquino is still a part of the conversation. How much longer are they going to give him to prove that he is, in fact, Exhibit A for the Peter Principle?

[Big Klu]

I really don't see the infatuation with Fraley. He showed me very little earlier in the season, before the injury.

[Wonderful Monds]

It’s not feasible but am I the only one that looks at that list of guys and has the devil on my shoulder saying “just get rid of them all…”?

I’m still intrigued by Schrock

[LeatherPants]

I really don't see the infatuation with Fraley. He showed me very little earlier in the season, before the injury.

They should put a windmill out in right field and they could sell energy to the electric company. New revenue for the owners.

[badcontent]

Yeah, he'll be up soon for sure. It's not really the greatest choice between Aquino and Fairchild, but I'd rather see Aquino for his arm and the occasional bomb.

- - - Updated - - -

https://twitter.com/JonathanIndia/status/1552846644076548096?s=20&t=4Fg8C-WrLFCXWIp8dyOevA

Probably easy to surmise that India wouldn't mind being traded.
Probably. But in spring training half the team voted to be stuck with Naquin on a deserted island for his hunting and fishing skills.

[kaldaniels]

Yeah, he'll be up soon for sure. It's not really the greatest choice between Aquino and Fairchild, but I'd rather see Aquino for his arm and the occasional bomb.

- - - Updated - - -

https://twitter.com/JonathanIndia/status/1552846644076548096?s=20&t=4Fg8C-WrLFCXWIp8dyOevA

Probably easy to surmise that India wouldn't mind being traded.

I’m telling you his eyes were dead when they were playing in Yankee Stadium. I think he has realized he is dying a slow death in Cincinnati.

[757690]

https://twitter.com/JonathanIndia/status/1552846644076548096?s=20&t=4Fg8C-WrLFCXWIp8dyOevA

Probably easy to surmise that India wouldn't mind being traded.

Most likely he is legitimately sad to see a friend being traded. I wouldn’t read much else into that tweet.

Most players really don’t care where they play, as long it’s in the majors and they are getting paid.

[Tom Servo]

Naquin was pretty clearly a popular guy in the clubhouse, he and Farmer were generally described as being the funniest guys by Votto et al. So not surprising they hate to see him go, but they know the deal.

[corkedbat]

They are smart enough to not mix April and May results with what's happening after that. The entire team had an OPS below .550. We know enough about Winker as a REDS' fan to know he'll hit very well ofr the next several years.

- - - Updated - - -



If the REDS get one of the two Yankee SS's, who plays SS for the REDS?

Whoever is the best defensive SS. EDLC and McLain should each be able to handle 3b or an OF spot, Could easily see de la Cruz, McClain & Volpe/Peraza in the same lineup on a regular basis. I thinking the jury is still out as to whether Barrero's bat projects him as a regular (there's a reason he has not been brought back after his IL stint).

[corkedbat]

Guess we'll be seeing a lot of Stuart Fairchild now

I'd say before the weekend is out, there's a good chance we'll see Aquino &/or Friedl back in Cincy as well.

[corkedbat]

It’s not feasible but am I the only one that looks at that list of guys and has the devil on my shoulder saying “just get rid of them all…”?

If the return in one of these deals is a solid major-league-ready CF, it wouldn't stun me to see Senzel dealt too.

[Marty and Joe]

Kelenic keeps popping up in the back of my mind. Seems to be on the 4-step program. Young, super-hyped, all the tools, rockets through the minors. Brought up early struggles. Sent down. Tears it up. Brought back up...struggles. Sent down. Tears it up. Still young (just turned 23) and still has all the tools. Eventually figures it out - is the question.
Value now is also the key question - the Reds' scouting staff would have to be relied on to determine if he is one that will eventually take that next step and become an above average major leaguer.

[MikeS21]

Kelenic has always had a high K rate and lower walk rate, even in the minors. And he’s been pretty bad in 470+ plate appearances spread over a couple seasons on the walks and strikeouts. Sure, he could improve, but do you really want him as the centerpiece of a trade for Castillo? I think Krall can do better.

[Kc61]

If the return in one of these deals is a solid major-league-ready CF, it wouldn't stun me to see Senzel dealt too.

If I had to guess a surprise move, it would a trade of Senzel. Not advocating it, just have the sense Reds might be ready to move on.

[MikeS21]

If the Mariners are truly making a push for Castillo, I’m thinking a package starting with Noelvi Marte and Levi Stoudt. I really like Hancock, but his durability is still questionable at this point.

[Benihana]

Kelenic has always had a high K rate and lower walk rate, even in the minors. And he’s been pretty bad in 470+ plate appearances spread over a couple seasons on the walks and strikeouts. Sure, he could improve, but do you really want him as the centerpiece of a trade for Castillo? I think Krall can do better.

Nooooooooo

He’s more a guy they could target for Mahle.

I’m not sending Castillo to Seattle without at least Marte, Hancock and another piece. Could debate whether Kelenic could be that other piece, or someone like Ford.

[RedTeamGo!]

I they somehow get Marte for Castillo I don’t really care what the secondary pieces are. Marte is a top 10 prospect in mlb.

[Kc61]

I they somehow get Marte for Castillo I don’t really care what the secondary pieces are. Marte is a top 10 prospect in mlb.

Edwin Arroyo is flying up the charts for Mariners. Top 50 MLB prospect.

[Marty and Joe]

Not sure I said anything about him being the centerpiece for Castillo :) and don't disagree. Wouldn't hate him as part of a package though.

[MikeS21]

Nooooooooo

He’s more a guy they could target for Mahle.

I’m not sending Castillo to Seattle without at least Marte, Hancock and another piece. Could debate whether Kelenic could be that other piece, or someone like Ford.

Thank you! I am not the only one who feels as you do.

[RiverRat13]

The good news is that we've seen no indication that they are trying to attach Moose to any deal.

[LeatherPants]

The good news is that we've seen no indication that they are trying to attach Moose to any deal.

There was an article on ESPN plus a couple days ago that still is a possibility.

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The good news is that we've seen no indication that they are trying to attach Moose to any deal.

There was an article on ESPN plus a couple days ago that still is a possibility.

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The good news is that we've seen no indication that they are trying to attach Moose to any deal.

There was an article on ESPN plus a couple days ago that still is a possibility.

[Tom Servo]

I hear there was an article on ESPN plus a couple days ago that still is a possibility.

[LeatherPants]

I hear there was an article on ESPN plus a couple days ago that still is a possibility.

I’m going to go out and get the papers, get the papers.

[PuffyPig]

If I had to guess a surprise move, it would a trade of Senzel. Not advocating it, just have the sense Reds might be ready to move on.

I doubt they would trade him when his value would be presumably quite low. No reason not to give him a chance to rebound.

[Guacarock]

USA Today's Bob Nightengale confirming the Yankees, Dodgers, Blue Jays and Cards are in the mix for Luis Castillo. We'd already seen the Mariners and Braves making overtures, so that's at least six teams now jockeying for our ace!

Tweets Nightengale:@BNightengale
The #Reds fire sale is underway: OF Tyler Naquin and LHP Phillip Diehl goes to the #Mets. Now, who gets ace Luis Castillo? The #Yankees, #Dodgers, #BlueJays, #Stlcards all in the mix.

No signs of the Astros, though. They could just be super-stealthy!

[mth123]

This is not a rumor but what I'm reading in this thread has me wondering if this return is too much or not enough. I'm not sure how to view Kelenic. He looks a lot like Aquino to me, but I could be wrong. Is he a top name in a Castillo deal? Castillo and Senzel for Kelenic, Trammel, Levi Stoudt and Bryce Miller. For kicks I'd like to get Bryan Woo thrown in for the bullpen since fans in Cincy are already calling out his name in the 7th or 8th inning every night.

If Kelenic has lost too much luster, how about the same deal with Marte instead of Kelenic?

[TheBigLebowski]

This is not a rumor but what I'm reading in this thread has me wondering if this return is too much or not enough. I'm not sure how to view Kelenic. He looks a lot like Aquino to me, but I could be wrong. Is he a top name in a Castillo deal? Castillo and Senzel for Kelenic, Trammel, Levi Stoudt and Bryce Miller. For kicks I'd like to get Bryan Woo thrown in for the bullpen since fans in Cincy are already calling out his name in the 7th or 8th inning every night.

If Kelenic has lost too much luster, how about the same deal with Marte instead of Kelenic?

Bryan Woo in Cincinnati is a worse idea than Mike Minor.

[JCM11]

Let's move on from Trammel already. Stoudt is a near 25 year old with 5+ ERA in AA. Marte or Arroyo plus Hancock as the headliners throw in a Zach Deloach and I might include Drury in the deal.

[Mitri]

This is not a rumor but what I'm reading in this thread has me wondering if this return is too much or not enough. I'm not sure how to view Kelenic. He looks a lot like Aquino to me, but I could be wrong. Is he a top name in a Castillo deal? Castillo and Senzel for Kelenic, Trammel, Levi Stoudt and Bryce Miller. For kicks I'd like to get Bryan Woo thrown in for the bullpen since fans in Cincy are already calling out his name in the 7th or 8th inning every night.

If Kelenic has lost too much luster, how about the same deal with Marte instead of Kelenic?

I'd love to have Kelenic, but they can do better for Castillo. He's veering hard into Nick Senzel territory.

Kelenic for Mahle would be a good trade.

[Old school 1983]

Castillo and Drury for Kelenic, Lewis and Kirby.

Kelenic is still young, but a former uber prospect that lost his luster. Lewis is a productive player, but pretty much is a DH right now and has injury concerns. Drury could step in and likely outperform down the stretch. Each kinda seem like they are the odd men out in the M’s OF. Each has a chance to be extremely good MLB contributors and are instant starters in the Reds OF. Kirby is a very good young pitcher. But he’s likely on an innings limit and Castillo could take his slot for the stretch run.

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[PuffyPig]

This is not a rumor but what I'm reading in this thread has me wondering if this return is too much or not enough. I'm not sure how to view Kelenic. He looks a lot like Aquino to me, but I could be wrong. Is he a top name in a Castillo deal? Castillo and Senzel for Kelenic, Trammel, Levi Stoudt and Bryce Miller. For kicks I'd like to get Bryan Woo thrown in for the bullpen since fans in Cincy are already calling out his name in the 7th or 8th inning every night.

If Kelenic has lost too much luster, how about the same deal with Marte instead of Kelenic?

That would be a terrible deal, and we are throwing in Senzel for free it looks like.

[Assembly Hall]

That would be a terrible deal, and we are throwing in Senzel for free it looks like.

What is a career -1 WAR player worth these days?

[Redsfan6272]

From MLBTRADRUMORS.COM.


Starting Pitching Rumors: Cardinals, Castillo, Mariners, AL CentralJuly 29th, 2022 at 9:13am CST • By Steve Adams

The Cardinals are “intent on upgrading the rotation, not just spackling it,” Derrick Goold of the St. Louis Post-Dispatch reports in a comprehensive look at the team’s potential deadline trajectories. While past deadline trades have often brought stopgaps options to St. Louis (e.g. Jon Lester and J.A. Happ just last year), the Cardinals could aim a bit higher this time around. Athletics right-hander Frankie Montas and Marlins righty Pablo Lopez are among the starters in whom the Cards have expressed interest, per the report. Goold also lists Angels right-hander Noah Syndergaard as a name of interest, and there are surely others the Cardinals are considering as they look to offset injuries to Jack Flaherty, Steven Matz, Alex Reyes and Dakota Hudson (who has struggled even when healthy this season).

St. Louis has upwards of $155MM already on the books for the current season, though that number will dip to around $90MM for the 2023 campaign (not including several notable arbitration raises). The Cardinals are still nearly $10MM shy of their record Opening Day payroll ($164MM), and they’ve gone a bit further than that with some midseason acquisitions in recent years, so there should still be payroll space to accommodate players making substantial salaries. They also have one of the game’s deepest farm systems, allowing them to bid competitively for the market’s top arms.

ADVERTISEMENT

Some more notes on the trade market for starters…

The Mariners are looking for rotation help, and Ken Rosenthal reports in his latest appearance with FOX Sports that Reds ace Luis Castillo “seems to be their main focus and target” at this juncture (Twitter link, with video). Seattle’s top four starters — Logan Gilbert, Robbie Ray, Marco Gonzales and Chris Flexen — have made at least 19 starts, and they’ve received good results from top prospect George Kirby since plugging him into the rotation (3.50 ERA through 13 starts). However, Kirby is at 96 innings between the minors and big leagues combined, which is already a notable jump from last year’s total of 67 2/3 innings. Gilbert’s 123 innings effectively match last year’s total of 124 1/3 frames. Beyond that, the Mariners probably can’t expect to avoid any notable injuries on the starting staff all season — few teams can — so there’s good sense in adding another arm to support the group. In Castillo’s case, he’d of course slot right in alongside Gilbert and Ray into a playoff rotation and give the M’s an excellent trio upon which to lean both this season and next

[mth123]

Let's move on from Trammel already. Stoudt is a near 25 year old with 5+ ERA in AA. Marte or Arroyo plus Hancock as the headliners throw in a Zach Deloach and I might include Drury in the deal.

Yeah. I think you are right. I look at stoudts scouting grade and see 60 fastball, 55 slider and 60 change and that seems a profile of a successful starting pitcher, but if he can't do it in AA, hard pass.

The more I look, I don't like Seattle as a trade option for Castillo. Too many of their guys come with too many questions. Kelenic, Lewis, Hancock, Stoudt all seem to have a lot of uncertainty about them. Marte and Arroyo seem a long way away.

I like the Yankee rumor of Peraza, Waldichuk or Wesneski, Perreira and Medina or Gil a lot better.

The top name I want in a Castillo deal is Bobby Miller from LA. Add Andy Pages and I'd deal Castillo for those two guys and forget all the rest farther down the food chain.

All prospects have questions about them, but the Seattle guys seem to have extra questions. Castillo should go for players without those extra questions.

[Redsfan6272]

Miller and Pages or Miller and Vargas for Castillo.. if they add both Vargas and Pages then send then Drury and Rece or a different pitching prospect

[PuffyPig]

What is a career -1 WAR player worth these days?

Depends on his age and skill set. Just no reason to move on from him and give him away. He's not taking any AB's away from anyone.

he wouldn't be the first high draft pick to take some time to get going, especially due to injuries.

I am more concerned about his injuries than his actual production.

[mth123]

Depends on his age and skill set. Just no reason to move on from him and give him away. He's not taking any AB's away from anyone.

he wouldn't be the first high draft pick to take some time to get going, especially due to injuries.

I am more concerned about his injuries than his actual production.

I only included Senzel in order to get two OF back. Didn't think anyone would give up two without getting one back that they could keep beyond the end of 2022.

After reading responses and looking deeper at some of these, I would hope the reds don't do any kind of deal like that.

From the Reds standpoint, he's still a question mark and will be arb eligible after the season. I could see them wanting to move on.

Personally, I think he still has potential, but he's probably a short timer in either case. If he hits, his cost will rise and the reds will probably look to move him next year anyway. His timeline doesn't match with a 2024 or 2025 contention window. One of De La Cruz, Barrero or McLain is the likely CF of the future (my money is on De la Cruz as the long term CF).

[JCM11]

All prospects have questions about them, but the Seattle guys seem to have extra questions. Castillo should go for players without those extra questions.

Yeah their top 3 are all in A or A+ ball with Marte probably ready for AA. I wouldn't hate a Marte/ Hancock return for Castillo. Bryce Miller is a nice under the radar secondary piece as well. If we could do better elsewhere then we're getting a really nice haul.

[Guacarock]

MLB Trade Rumors says Mahle is a prime target of the Twins. Their blurb: As for the Twins, 1500 SKOR North’s Darren Wolfson suggested in yesterday’s podcast that Reds right-hander Tyler Mahle could be the likeliest name to land in Minnesota by Tuesday’s deadline, though the Twins are casting a wide net as they seek both rotation and bullpen help. Minnesota has also spoken to the Marlins about righty Pablo Lopez, Wolfson added.

MLB Trade Rumors says Twins' AL Central rivals -- the Cleveland Guardians and Chicago White Sox -- are among "the most aggressive at the moment" in seeking pitching help, although no names identified in their cases.

[klw]

Miller and Pages or Miller and Vargas for Castillo.. if they add both Vargas and Pages then send then Drury and Rece or a different pitching prospect

Miller and Pages were both in action last night in Tulsa. I wonder if the Reds had scouts there. Miller went 6 inn, 2 er, 0bb, 11ks

https://www.milb.com/gameday/travelers-vs-drillers/2022/07/28/671120#game_state=final,lock_state=final,game_tab= box,game=671120

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Miller and Pages or Miller and Vargas for Castillo.. if they add both Vargas and Pages then send then Drury and Rece or a different pitching prospect

Miller and Pages were both in action last night in Tulsa. I wonder if the Reds had scouts there. Miller went 6 inn, 2 er, 0bb, 11ks

https://www.milb.com/gameday/travelers-vs-drillers/2022/07/28/671120#game_state=final,lock_state=final,game_tab= box,game=671120

[Mitri]

Miller is probably untouchable for the Dodgers, unless they wanted to trade for Soto. Which makes it hard for them to put together a package I'd want for Castillo. Pages isn't really a "centerpiece" kind of guy to me.

[Ron Madden]

Bobby Nightengale
@nightengalejr

GM Nick Krall on Luis Castillo/Tyler Mahle trade talks:

"We have to make sure we’re continuously stocking that player pipeline. Having conversations about those players doesn’t mean we’re going to trade them, doesn’t mean we’re not going to trade them."

[RedTeamGo!]

Krall says absolutely nothing at all times. It’s like he’s trolling everyone

[westofyou]

Krall says absolutely nothing at all times. It’s like he’s trolling everyone

Classic business-speak, I bet his elevator pitches are magnificent

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Krall says absolutely nothing at all times. It’s like he’s trolling everyone

Classic business-speak, I bet his elevator pitches are magnificent

[RedTeamGo!]

Krall says absolutely nothing at all times. It’s like he’s trolling everyone

[LeatherPants]

"We have to make sure we’re continuously stocking that player pipeline.

Don’t expect the Reds to ever contend again, unless somehow an entire pre-arb group somehow become superstars all at once.