Wheelhouse
05-13-2006, 02:12 PM
Some initial reaction to the WMP/Arroyo trade:
OnBaseMachine, 3/20/06:
"Reds got ripped off.
Krivsky's first trade=F+"
registerthis, 3/20/06:
"Just what we need--another flyball pitcher with low K totals. Everything about him sreams "average" to me--no complete games, average BB totals, low K totals, etc. He was able to keep the ball in the park significantly more than, say, Milton--and he pitched in a hitter's park, too, so that much is encouraging.
On the flipside, while I don't think Arroyo is this team's answer for its pitching needs, I think people have a serious tendency to overvalue WMP. He's got all the raw talent in the world, but unrefined talent is worthless. While i would have rather seen the reds get more of a groundball pitcher--or one with a higher K rate--a pitcher in the neighborhood of Arroyo is about where WMP's value currently sits.
At least the Reds answered one of their question marks in the rotation--and this perhaps also opens the possibility of Milton moving to the bullpen if he continues to remain ineffective as a starter."
deltachi8, 3/20/06:
And the Reds still lose 90 games.
Bad deal.
Johnny Footstool, 3/20/06:
"If Clement was on the table and the Reds walked away with Arroyo, Krivsky should be lynched.
As it is, Arroyo is a junkballer with flyball tendencies who forgot how to strike batters out last season. He only struck out 100 batters in 205 innings last season. That's not a recipe for "cautious optimism"; it's a recipe for disaster.
Quote:
How are the Reds worse for this move?
They traded away a decent commodity for absolute junk, that's how.
This trade makes me sick."
Cedric, 3/20/06:
"I find it VERY hard to believe that Bronson frickin Arroyo is the best you could get for Pena. Maybe the Reds just helped torpedo his worth by bashing him any chance they could get in the papers."
BuckeyeRedleg, 3/20/06:
"I must be one of the few that likes this trade."
Red Leader, 3/20/06:
"I'm back in "I don't care anymore" mode with the Reds. It's funny, we needed pitching, everybody knows that. I was hoping out of WMP or Kearns that WMP was the player we'd give up, but now that it has been done, I don't like it so much. I was hoping we'd get a pitcher like Arroyo along with a stud pitching prospect to stick in the rotation with Bailey and allow them to work through the minors together, dominating people. I realize now that we'll suck this year, and we're still "bridging the gap" before we'll be good. That's what this trade says to me.
I was hoping Krivsky would address both short term and long term concerns when he traded WMP or Kearns. Seems the long term has been ignored, again."
pedro, 3/20/06:
"I think it's a pretty good deal."
flyer85, 3/20/06:
"Dunn going to LF and Hatteberg is 1b is an AWFUL, AWFUL decision. Krivsky and Narron have truly transformed this into a solid 6th place team and possibly even worse than the Marlins."
OnBaseMachine, 3/20/06:
"Reds got ripped off.
Krivsky's first trade=F+"
registerthis, 3/20/06:
"Just what we need--another flyball pitcher with low K totals. Everything about him sreams "average" to me--no complete games, average BB totals, low K totals, etc. He was able to keep the ball in the park significantly more than, say, Milton--and he pitched in a hitter's park, too, so that much is encouraging.
On the flipside, while I don't think Arroyo is this team's answer for its pitching needs, I think people have a serious tendency to overvalue WMP. He's got all the raw talent in the world, but unrefined talent is worthless. While i would have rather seen the reds get more of a groundball pitcher--or one with a higher K rate--a pitcher in the neighborhood of Arroyo is about where WMP's value currently sits.
At least the Reds answered one of their question marks in the rotation--and this perhaps also opens the possibility of Milton moving to the bullpen if he continues to remain ineffective as a starter."
deltachi8, 3/20/06:
And the Reds still lose 90 games.
Bad deal.
Johnny Footstool, 3/20/06:
"If Clement was on the table and the Reds walked away with Arroyo, Krivsky should be lynched.
As it is, Arroyo is a junkballer with flyball tendencies who forgot how to strike batters out last season. He only struck out 100 batters in 205 innings last season. That's not a recipe for "cautious optimism"; it's a recipe for disaster.
Quote:
How are the Reds worse for this move?
They traded away a decent commodity for absolute junk, that's how.
This trade makes me sick."
Cedric, 3/20/06:
"I find it VERY hard to believe that Bronson frickin Arroyo is the best you could get for Pena. Maybe the Reds just helped torpedo his worth by bashing him any chance they could get in the papers."
BuckeyeRedleg, 3/20/06:
"I must be one of the few that likes this trade."
Red Leader, 3/20/06:
"I'm back in "I don't care anymore" mode with the Reds. It's funny, we needed pitching, everybody knows that. I was hoping out of WMP or Kearns that WMP was the player we'd give up, but now that it has been done, I don't like it so much. I was hoping we'd get a pitcher like Arroyo along with a stud pitching prospect to stick in the rotation with Bailey and allow them to work through the minors together, dominating people. I realize now that we'll suck this year, and we're still "bridging the gap" before we'll be good. That's what this trade says to me.
I was hoping Krivsky would address both short term and long term concerns when he traded WMP or Kearns. Seems the long term has been ignored, again."
pedro, 3/20/06:
"I think it's a pretty good deal."
flyer85, 3/20/06:
"Dunn going to LF and Hatteberg is 1b is an AWFUL, AWFUL decision. Krivsky and Narron have truly transformed this into a solid 6th place team and possibly even worse than the Marlins."