7/8/06: Reds @ Braves (No Edwin Again)

[reds44]

Freel-3B
Dunn
Griffey
Kearns
Hatteberg
Lopez
Phillips
LaRue
Harang

Giles
Renteria
C. Jones
A. Jones
McCann
Francoeur
LaRoche
Langerhans
Smoltz

:bang: :bang:
I am starting to strongly dislike Narron.

[Heath]

No Aurilia either.

:dunno:

Then there's Bobby Cox who basically Xeroxes his lineup 5 times a week.

[Matt700wlw]

Strange.

[PuffyPig]

There's nothing wrong with putting Freel at the top of the lineup.

Sitting EE for Aurilia (against a RH pitcher) or Castro is one thing, sitting him so the hot hitting Freel can hit first is another thing entirely.

Freel got on base his first 3 times up yesterday, and scored a run in everyone of the Reds 3 scoring innings.

[Tony Cloninger]

Well....at least RA is not in there for him.

What conspiracy theory do people draw from this?

He has also woken up to the fact that Lopez needs to be moved down.....hopefully, but doubtful, he will start moving KGJ down.

[Joseph]

Strange not to have EE, but thats a STRONG lineup overall.

[WMR]

I think a big part of EE sitting is Narron's strong dislike for throwing errors.

Add in a hot Freel who made a couple real nice diving catches at the hot corner last night and there you go.

[Big Klu]

Well....at least RA is not in there for him.

What conspiracy theory do people draw from this?

He has also woken up to the fact that Lopez needs to be moved down.....hopefully, but doubtful, he will start moving KGJ down.

The conspiracy is still there--Freel is on the wrong side of 30. ;)

It's a veteran plot! :D

[Caveat Emperor]

That's the lowest I can remember seeing Felipe bat in quite some time.

[Reds1]

Freel-3B
Dunn
Griffey
Kearns
Hatteberg
Lopez
Phillips
LaRue
Harang

Giles
Renteria
C. Jones
A. Jones
McCann
Francoeur
LaRoche
Langerhans
Smoltz

:bang: :bang:
I am starting to strongly dislike Narron.


Either Freel or Aurilia at 3B makes me happy instead of EE. I want to win the last 2 games of the 1st half. :eek:

[reds44]

Either Freel or Aurilia at 3B makes me happy instead of EE. I want to win the last 2 games of the 1st half. :eek:
:rolleyes:

8-16 with EE on the DL. 8-16. Yeah he sucks.

[Caveat Emperor]

:rolleyes:

8-16 with EE on the DL. 8-16. Yeah he sucks.

Almost as much as the bullpen. I don't think EE in the lineup those 24 games means more than 1 or 2 additional wins when you factor in just how awful the 'pen has been.

Last I checked, you can't stick EE out on the mound in the 11th to shut the door following a Dunn solo shot.

[captainmorgan07]

That's the lowest I can remember seeing Felipe bat in quite some time.
maybe it allow him to see more pitches to hit with men on base could be a good move by narron

[reds44]

Almost as much as the bullpen. I don't think EE in the lineup those 24 games means more than 1 or 2 additional wins when you factor in just how awful the 'pen has been.

Last I checked, you can't stick EE out on the mound in the 11th to shut the door following a Dunn solo shot.
We scored 4.2 RPG in those 24 games.

So far the Reds have scored 444 runs in 78 games.
In the 24 games with Edwin on the DL we scored 103 runs in 24 games.

Bare with me here while I do the math.
We have played 54 games with Edwin on the roster (ovbiously not all he has played in) and scored 341 runs.

So with Edwin on the roster we have scored 6.3 RPG.
Without him we scored 4.2 RPG

Even though those numbers aren't exact because they include games he didn't play in while on the active roster, don't tell me we are a better offensive ballclub when he isn't in the lineup.

[Ltlabner]

So with Edwin on the roster we have scored 6.3 RPG.
Without him we scored 4.2 RPG

You say that is if there are no other variables other than EE being in/out of the line up. Does he have an impact on run production certinally, but you can't just say the reduction in run production is only because of EE's time away.

[reds44]

You say that is if there are no other variables other than EE being in/out of the line up. Does he have an impact on run production certinally, but you can't just say the reduction in run production is only because of EE's time away.
Of course there are, but the difference over 2 RPG. The offense is better with him then without him.

[Reds1]

:rolleyes:

8-16 with EE on the DL. 8-16. Yeah he sucks.

Ya, ok that was all EE. Plays one game and basically allows the a run on an error and we lost in extra innings. YOu are basically saying Freel suck and Aurlia - at least not a big fall off. Come on. Better defense and probably better offense by both.

[Reds1]

We scored 4.2 RPG in those 24 games.

So far the Reds have scored 444 runs in 78 games.
In the 24 games with Edwin on the DL we scored 103 runs in 24 games.

Bare with me here while I do the math.
We have played 54 games with Edwin on the roster (ovbiously not all he has played in) and scored 341 runs.

So with Edwin on the roster we have scored 6.3 RPG.
Without him we scored 4.2 RPG

Even though those numbers aren't exact because they include games he didn't play in while on the active roster, don't tell me we are a better offensive ballclub when he isn't in the lineup.

RPG aren't just 1 guy. BP had something to do with those gaudy numbers. This team needs the defense and I just dont' think you get a big falloff between freel or aurilia at 3B over EE. Play EE 2-3 times a week, but these two games with our top 2 pitchers we SHOULDN"T need the offense and we do need the defense behind all our pitchers. I agree with management on this one.

[reds44]

Ya, ok that was all EE. Plays one game and basically allows the a run on an error and we lost in extra innings. YOu are basically saying Freel suck and Aurlia. Come on. Better defense and better offense by both.
Stop putting words in my mouth. I have never said either of them suck. Freel and Rich are 2 of the better utility players in baseball today. Neither should play over Edwin though.

If you truly believe Freel and Rich are better offense players then Edwin, then I am not going to argue with you. Not only is Edwin better offensively, but he is most likely going to keep improving. He is nowhere near his peak.

Don't base your opinon's on players off of 1 play.

[reds44]

RPG aren't just 1 guy. BP had something to do with those gaudy numbers. This team needs the defense and I just dont' think you get a big falloff between freel or aurilia at 3B over EE. Play EE 2-3 times a week, but these two games with our top 2 pitchers we SHOULDN"T need the offense and we do need the defense behind all our pitchers. I agree with management on this one.
Please tell me you don't truely believe Rich is better then Edwin.

http://cincinnati.reds.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/stats/sortable_player_stats.jsp?c_id=cin&section1=1&statSet1=1&statType=1&sortByStat=OPS&timeFrame=1&timeSubFrame=2006&baseballScope=null&isCompare=true&subScope=teamCode&teamPosCode=cin&box1=XXXX429665cin5&box3=XXXX110383cin5&checkBoxTotal=0&playerLocator=Enter+Last+Name&compare.x=27&compare.y=3

Not to mention Rich has the range of an egg.

Freel is a utility player, and a very good one at that.

[Reds1]

Stop putting words in my mouth. I have never said either of them suck. Freel and Rich are 2 of the better utility players in baseball today. Neither should play over Edwin though.

If you truly believe Freel and Rich are better offense players then Edwin, then I am not going to argue with you. Not only is Edwin better offensively, but he is most likely going to keep improving. He is nowhere near his peak.

Don't base your opinon's on players off of 1 play.


Dude. Read your 1st post reply. YOu put words in my mouth saying EE sucks. Did I say that. NO. Check it out. That's not the point here. I want to win. Not do what's best for EE and his career. He'll be ok, but we need to win now. I"m not playing for next year.

Also, 1 play. EE would probably have the most errors in the league if he started every game. He's defense does Suck and I did say that. I don't think his offense if measurably better then either freel or aurilia.

[Johnny Vander m]

:thumbup:
Either Freel or Aurilia at 3B makes me happy instead of EE. I want to win the last 2 games of the 1st half. :eek:

:thumbup: I agree!:thumbup:

[reds44]

Dude. Read your 1st post reply. YOu put words in my mouth saying EE sucks. Did I say that. NO. Check it out. That's not the point here. I want to win. Not do what's best for EE and his career. He'll be ok, but we need to win now. I"m not playing for next year.

Also, 1 play. EE would probably have the most errors in the league if he started every game. He's defense does Suck and I did say that. I don't think his offense if measurably better then either freel or aurilia.
You want to win?

Hmmmm

Before Edwin went on the DL:
Record during the 24 games:
8-16

Record with Edwin:
37-26

Again he didn't play in all of thise wins, nor all of those losses, but we play 11 over with him on the roster (and he played in most game) and 8 under without him.

You win with Edwin.

[Patrick Bateman]

You want to win?

Hmmmm

Before Edwin went on the DL:
Record during the 24 games:
8-16

Record with Edwin:
37-26

Again he didn't play in all of thise wins, nor all of those losses, but we play 11 over with him on the roster (and he played in most game) and 8 under without him.

You win with Edwin.

You win with EE when the pitching is good.

You win with Bozo the Clown when the pitching is good.

[Reds1]

Please tell me you don't truely believe Rich is better then Edwin.

http://cincinnati.reds.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/stats/sortable_player_stats.jsp?c_id=cin&section1=1&statSet1=1&statType=1&sortByStat=OPS&timeFrame=1&timeSubFrame=2006&baseballScope=null&isCompare=true&subScope=teamCode&teamPosCode=cin&box1=XXXX429665cin5&box3=XXXX110383cin5&checkBoxTotal=0&playerLocator=Enter+Last+Name&compare.x=27&compare.y=3

Not to mention Rich has the range of an egg.

Freel is a utility player, and a very good one at that.

I'll give you that, but after the injury he's clearly not back 100 percent. HIs AAA stats not great. Aurila is doing very well. We win more when they find a way to get him in there. He also makes all the throws. EE's offense right now IMO won't be enough to make up for his defense. Again, my opinion, but I feel that way. With the ace on the mound we don't need free outs. I have to run. thanks for banter.

[membengal]

EE hit .350 in his extended stay at AAA. Yeah, that's awful.

[Reds1]

I think he had 1 good game that picked him up. Seems like all the box scores I looked at he didn't do well. Fine, we disagree. But this thing about record when he's playing is bogus. 1 guy normally doesn't matter. I remember times when we lost when griffey played and then we won for a brief time with him out and the media ran with it. Fact is pitching is much worse then it was earlier in the year. Aka White, Hammonds DFA and we had to get go a new closer because Coffey wasn't doing well. Pen is worst in the league. When EE played they were doing much better. Hammonds had 14 straight app. with no runs I believe.

OFf to go see superman. Go REds

[reds44]

Screw it, I am going to go through all the games and find out what are record in games Edwin starts are.

4/3: L
4/5: W
4/7: W
4/8: W
4/9: L
4/11: W
4/12: L
4/14: W
4/15: L
4/16: L
4/17: W
4/18: L
4/19: W
4/20: W
4/22: L
4/23: W
4/24: W
4/25: W
4/26: W
4/29: W
4/30: L
5/1: W
5/2: W
5/3: L
5/4: W
5/5: L
5/6: L
5/7: W
5/9: L
5/10: W
5/11: W
5/12: L
5/13: L
5/14: L
5/16: L
5/17: L
5/18: W
5/20: L
5/21: L
5/22: W
5/23: W
5/24: L
5/26: L
5/28: W
5/30: L
5/31: W
6/2: W
6/3: W
6/4: W
6/5: W
6/6: W
7/6: L

W- 30
L-23

30-23 when Edwin starts

Which means:
15-19 when he doesn't start

So we average of 2 more runs per game with Edwin then without, we play 7 over when he starts, and 4 under when he doesn't.

You tell me what to make of this

[dsmith421]

It doesn't bother me that Reds fans fail to see Encarnacion's incredible potential and value to this ballclub now and down the line. Quite frankly, fans in this town often can't distinguish their ass from their elbow (Exhibit A: Dunn).

What bothers me is that our "braintrust" apparently buys into this line of crap. Edwin is a potential All-Star, maybe an outside shot at an MVP somewhere along the line, and the guys that run the ballclub seem bent on ruining him.

[RollyInRaleigh]

Frankly, I don't think Encarnacion's presence or absence makes the Reds win or lose.

[Mario-Rijo]

Let's take a deep breath here guys perhaps EE is still a bit ginger on that ankle, something that we cannot see. Or perhaps they want a guy in there with a bit more value at the top of the lineup, because the real surprise is FeLo not in the top 2. That one actually puzzles me!

[RollyInRaleigh]

Frankly, I don't think Encarnacion's presence or absence makes the Reds win or lose.


P-I-T-C-H-I-N-G

[reds44]

Lights on Lidge just blew a save to the Cards.

[RFS62]

P-I-T-C-H-I-N-G


E-X-A-C-T-L-Y


:beerme:

[Eric_Davis]

I think he had 1 good game that picked him up. Seems like all the box scores I looked at he didn't do well. Fine, we disagree. But this thing about record when he's playing is bogus. 1 guy normally doesn't matter. I remember times when we lost when griffey played and then we won for a brief time with him out and the media ran with it. Fact is pitching is much worse then it was earlier in the year. Aka White, Hammonds DFA and we had to get go a new closer because Coffey wasn't doing well. Pen is worst in the league. When EE played they were doing much better. Hammonds had 14 straight app. with no runs I believe.

OFf to go see superman. Go REds

We also didn't have to play the American League when EE was healthy.

[Gallen5862]

Terrible swing on strike 2 by Freel but stays alive on next pitch.

[Gallen5862]

Freel out looking at strike 3.

[Eric_Davis]

Screw it, I am going to go through all the games and find out what are record in games Edwin starts are.

4/3: L
4/5: W
4/7: W
4/8: W
4/9: L
4/11: W
4/12: L
4/14: W
4/15: L
4/16: L
4/17: W
4/18: L
4/19: W
4/20: W
4/22: L
4/23: W
4/24: W
4/25: W
4/26: W
4/29: W
4/30: L
5/1: W
5/2: W
5/3: L
5/4: W
5/5: L
5/6: L
5/7: W
5/9: L
5/10: W
5/11: W
5/12: L
5/13: L
5/14: L
5/16: L
5/17: L
5/18: W
5/20: L
5/21: L
5/22: W
5/23: W
5/24: L
5/26: L
5/28: W
5/30: L
5/31: W
6/2: W
6/3: W
6/4: W
6/5: W
6/6: W
7/6: L

W- 30
L-23

30-23 when Edwin starts

Which means:
15-19 when he doesn't start

So we average of 2 more runs per game with Edwin then without, we play 7 over when he starts, and 4 under when he doesn't.

You tell me what to make of this

It's more due to the other guys, not EE. Phillips was Player of the Week during one of those stretches and had a torrid month during that stretch....LaRue missed most of EE's playing time and that was a good thing...Lopez played much better...you can go on and on, but as was stated before, the bullpen was the biggest factor and 15 or so games vs the American League was also a huge factor.

[Caveat Emperor]

Is it just me, or did it get a lot more mid-1990s in here?

Smoltz strikes the side out.

[reds44]

It's more due to the other guys, not EE. Phillips was Player of the Week during one of those stretches and had a torrid month during that stretch....LaRue missed most of EE's playing time and that was a good thing...Lopez played much better...you can go on and on, but as was stated before, the bullpen was the biggest factor and 15 or so games vs the American League was also a huge factor.
We were 5-7 vs. the AL without Edwin.

Take out the AL and we are 10-12 without Edwin and 29-21 with him.


Of course it isn't all Edwin, but we just seem to play better with him in the lineup.

[Eric_Davis]

Is that Smoltz or Koufax pitching?

Wow!

[flyer85]

Smoltz had all 4 pitches working in that inning. Not a good sign.

[RedsMan3203]

Pujols just went yard against Oswalt........


St. Louis up 1 in the 10th.

[Eric_Davis]

It's nice to see how passionate you are about Ed E. There's an Ed M that I felt as passionate about 14 years ago that the Mariner's were holding back. I felt that they cost him a batting title or two by keeping him in the minors too long.

That's not the case with the REDS though as they brought up Ed E as soon as he proved himself ready. Ed E didn't tear up AAA...he did fairly well. He hasn't torn up Major League pitching...he's doing fairly well....for a newbie.

He'll get over 300 AB's this year, then if he can stay healthy, over 500 AB's next year. And who knows? Maybe by August first he's playing every day again because Freel and/or Aurilia goes down to injuries or they just start slumping themselves.

Ed E is clearly the future and third base is his for the taking.

[SteelSD]

Strike-em-Out/Throw-em-Out DP. Renteria tried to call time out during his slide. LOL!

[Falls City Beer]

Thankful for Jason Larue. Who's with me? :)

[Gallen5862]

Renteria thought worth a chance calling timeout with so many blown calls this year lol.

[reds44]

Thankful for Jason Larue. Who's with me? :)
He has been throwing guys out like crazy this year.

[Falls City Beer]

Shades of Reggie Sanders in the 95 NLCS with Phillips vs. Smoltz.

[Eric_Davis]

Thankful for Jason Larue. Who's with me? :)

Yeah, loving that .184 w/ RISP right before the pitcher hits vs. David Ross' .311 AVG and .681 SLG.

[Falls City Beer]

Yeah, loving that .184 w/ RISP right before the pitcher hits vs. David Ross' .311 AVG and .681 SLG.

But Ross is hurt. Having Larue as second fiddle beats carting around the carcass of, say, Todd Pratt.

[Kc61]

Yeah, loving that .184 w/ RISP right before the pitcher hits vs. David Ross' .311 AVG and .681 SLG.

Against Smoltz, I would have liked Javier V catching with his lefty bat. I hope Larue has a decent night at the plate.

[RFS62]

Hell of a play by Ryan

[SirFelixCat]

While I would prefer EdE at 3B nice play Freelin!!!

[Caveat Emperor]

But Ross is hurt. Having Larue as second fiddle beats carting around the carcass of, say, Todd Pratt.

It's amazing how spoiled Reds fans have gotten what with their backup catchers having career years in two consecutive seasons ('05 Valentin, '06 Ross).

I'm not saying that accuse anyone -- I'm just saying there needs to be a serious reality check on what passes for good catching around here.

[Falls City Beer]

It's deader than a Warrant concert in here.

I guess I'll go drinkin' here shortly.

[Matt700wlw]

It's deader than a Warrant concert in here.

I guess I'll go drinkin' here shortly.

mmm....beer...

[Caveat Emperor]

It's deader than a Warrant concert in here.

I guess I'll go drinkin' here shortly.

It's deader than the concept of the Fee Tail in here.

Nothing?

I hate the Bar Exam.

[SirFelixCat]

Jr = STUD!

[Caveat Emperor]

Kearns owns Smoltz.

Possibly by quitclaim deed, I'm not certain.

[SirFelixCat]

Ya know, I'm not a big fan of The Hat swinging 3-0, but if you're gonna...get ALL OF IT...and he did...to the track in RCF, but caught on the run by A. Jones...Sac. Fly 1-0 Good guys!

[Matt700wlw]

Thank goodness for the sac fly....don't want to kill the rally ;)

[SirFelixCat]

And FeLo smokes the first pitch into LF for a single. 1st and 2nd, 2 out for BP.


The boys are hitting Smoltz pretty doggone hard this inning...

[SirFelixCat]

And a swinging bunt back to Smoltz ends the threat. bot 4, 1-0 Boys in Red

[RFS62]

Kearns owns Smoltz.

Possibly by quitclaim deed, I'm not certain.



I think it's more of a lease with an option

[Falls City Beer]

It's something I've always admired about Smoltz. He seldom lets the young upstarts get a piece of him. He's made Phillips look pathetic tonight.

[reds44]

5 years ago that is an out.

[RFS62]

Wow

Another thing I've never seen before

[Heath]

Wow - in between innings I've been flipping back and forth between the Reds and the Yanks/Rays on ExInn. Joe Magrane actually had an intelligent discussion of OPS with ACTUAL stats!

[Caveat Emperor]

I think it's more of a lease with an option

Perhaps by a Defeasible Fee:

O grants JohnSmoltzOwnageAcre to Austin Kearns so long as Austin maintains his current playing weight. Should Austin fail to maintain his playing weight, to Chris Denorfia.

[Tony Cloninger]

Does it really matter when EE sits or not?

I mean....if he plays the next 15 straight games...and no matter what he does....sits for the 16th game...there will be people in an uproar over him getting a day off.

The posters favorite player should never sit......no mater what..... the player most disliked though, should never see the light of day.

People have been calling for Lopez to be dropped down....he finally is.....but it does not sound as good of an idea as it was some days ago, it seems, to some people. I do not know how it would be puzzling to anyone why he was dropped. And if Freel is not starting.....BP is probably leading off.

I have never read anyone being really happy when RA starts.....no matter what the situation.......yet they will call him a good utility player to have.
Well a utility player....like him....will play more than once a week..... he is not just a RH off the bench. This would not have been an issue at all...if EE had never been hurt as he was starting almost every game....and RA was platooning with SH. Freel was the 1 that people should have been pining for in long......drawn out threads about conspiracy and old guys sucking.


To top it off......Smoltz is very tough.....against all hitters. Maybe Narron felt Freel was on 1 of his hot streaks and decided to ride it for another day.

Hell.....Sparky would even have Merv rettemund play or even PH for Griffey in 1975, more than you might realize....even when Griffey was clearly the better player.

[Heath]

Wow - good crowd for Atlanta tonight. Must be Phil Niekro Knuckle-Bobbing Head Doll Night tonight.

[SirFelixCat]

The ump seems pretty consistent tonight for both sides and Harang is simply dealing tonight. wow.


My fault guys...blame that BB on me. 1st and 2nd 0 out :(

[Heath]

OK, FCB - I give - who's the girl in the avatar.

[Matt700wlw]

Come on, Harang.

[Falls City Beer]

The ump seems pretty consistent tonight for both sides and Harang is simply dealing tonight. wow.

Not really. He's throwing a TON of pitches. I can't see him lasting beyond the 6th in that humidity.

[Heath]

Harang's definately tossing the seed - he's 93-94 no problem.

[reds44]

BP is AMAZING!!!!!

[RFS62]

Phillips is off the charts crazy

[MrCinatit]

Wow. Phillips and FeLo can turn in some remarkably pretty defensive plays - that double play was magnificent.

[SirFelixCat]

Nice to see Larry roll into a 6-4-3 DP which we got the best of the call.


Ole Larry was safe by 1/2 a step.

[SteelSD]

Chipper may have been safe, but that Phillips kid can play around that 2B bag.

And yeah, Chipper was safe. I like getting breaks.

[RFS62]

Sit down and shut up Larry

[Matt700wlw]

That was huge.

HUGE.

[SirFelixCat]

OK, FCB - I give - who's the girl in the avatar.


Sara Silverman.

[George Foster]

safe...I'll take it

[Falls City Beer]

Aaron's going to need all the help he can get tonight. I'm out yall; beer calls.

[Heath]

Harang's at 57 pitches.

Humidity's at 44 % with a South wind at 6 mph at 81 degrees in the ATL.

Keep himself hydrated - he can go a while.

[dsmith421]

I love baseball. Old, lumpy men wearing baseball spikes for no other purpose than the off chance they may have to run on the field and have a pantomime argument with an umpire for no good reason. Sublimely ridiculous.

[RFS62]

Sara Silverman.


Who is not only hot, but extremly funny

[SirFelixCat]

And Harang makes A. Jones look really bad in that AB. Thru 4, Reds 1-0.

[George Foster]

Davy C was the last All-Star the Reds had that was the MVP....what was the other thing Davy did that game that was different and got some good TV exposure??

[Mario-Rijo]

Bronson has been dealing and is the heart of the staff, but Harang is definitely the backbone and the ACE!

[MrCinatit]

Who is not only hot, but extremly funny

She's committed her love to me, guys, stay away.



Of course, I have yet to make her aware of this factoid yet. The restraining order has been a bit rough to work around.

[SirFelixCat]

Laure....a HIT!!!


Double off the top of the RCF wall!

[Matt700wlw]

Larue doubles.

Trade him now. :D

[Tony Cloninger]

He wore Red shoes...instead of the traditional black.

[George Foster]

I love baseball. Old, lumpy men wearing baseball spikes for no other purpose than the off chance they may have to run on the field and have a pantomime argument with an umpire for no good reason. Sublimely ridiculous.

The only sport that the coach were's a uniform too. I would like to see Larry Brown in those baggy pants they have now in basketball!:laugh:

[letsgojunior]

Hey RFS - have you watched those episodes yet?

[SirFelixCat]

Harang with a decent bunt, but the throw beats Larue at 3rd. 1 out and Harang on 1st :(

[SteelSD]

Larue doubles off the top of the LCF wall over Jones. Nearly gone. Man on 2nd, no one out. Lot of the hits tonight coming early-count on "get-ahead" fastballs.

Then Harang kills Larue at 3rd with an awful bunt. Sigh.

[Matt700wlw]

What the hell was that?

[George Foster]

He wore Red shoes...instead of the traditional black.

no, he wore white shoes...close..:rolleyes:

[RFS62]

uuhhhh, no. tomorrow

[letsgojunior]

uuhhhh, no. tomorrow

:bang: :angry: :cry: :thumbdown :(

[MrCinatit]

The only sport that the coach were's a uniform too. I would like to see Larry Brown in those baggy pants they have now in basketball!:laugh:

Bill Parcells...shoulder pads. Oh, that would be classic.

[George Foster]

If Dunn gets a hit here, LaRue should get fined

[SirFelixCat]

And Dunn pops out about Mars high, F-8. Inning over. :sigh:

[SteelSD]

If Dunn gets a hit here, LaRue should get fined

That wasn't Larue's fault. The bunt was too close to home plate. I know you dislike Larue with the passion of a billion burning suns, but a decent bunt advances him.

[Matt700wlw]

That ball's a goner at GABP.

Oh well :D

[SteelSD]

McCann flies out to Kearns. One down.

[Matt700wlw]

Another looooooooooong out.

Oh well :D

[SirFelixCat]

Harang has given up some pretty solid shots this inning, but just has two long outs to show for it...keep the ball down, Aaron :)


Make that 3 long outs this inning. 1-2-3 though ...

[reds44]

Harang used the ENTIRE field that inning.

[Tony Cloninger]

Either way....i hated those shoes Davey wore.

Give me the blac look any day.......even the TBS announcers were talking about how the Reds unis......show really no Red and you would not know it was the Reds beacuse of it.

They also talked about Griffey's attitude towards a Sparky intentional walk during his first year or so in the majors. Sparky told him to eat dirt if that happened again! Or something along that line.


I remember watching the 1982 AS Game in vegas......with my family and they all went out and thought i was crazy for staying in the room to watch a baseball game.

[Heath]

Harang used the ENTIRE field that inning.

As long as they are staying in the park, who cares.

Wow - quick game. 1 hour and 20 minutes and almost 2/3 the way home.

[SirFelixCat]

Jr with a rocket down the LF line....juuuuuuuuuuuuust foul. But on the bright side, did draw the first BB vs Smoltz tonight. Love them lead off BB's :)

[SirFelixCat]

Kearns rolls into the 6-4-3 Rally Killer. 2 down.

[Heath]

well, they are hitting the ball hard on Smoltz ... lots of 2-out hits, though..

[George Foster]

Either way....i hated those shoes Davey wore.

Give me the blac look any day.......even the TBS announcers were talking about how the Reds unis......show really no Red and you would not know it was the Reds beacuse of it.

They also talked about Griffey's attitude towards a Sparky intentional walk during his first year or so in the majors. Sparky told him to eat dirt if that happened again! Or something along that line.


I remember watching the 1982 AS Game in vegas......with my family and they all went out and thought i was crazy for staying in the room to watch a baseball game.

I watched it at home, I was 12. I think he was making a statement to the Reds management. They all wanted to ware Red shoes. It was the 80's!

[Heath]

Boy, Pat Corrales looks old.

[George Foster]

Harang has given up some pretty solid shots this inning, but just has two long outs to show for it...keep the ball down, Aaron :)


Make that 3 long outs this inning. 1-2-3 though ...

He starts to struggle the 3rd time through the order. However an out is an out!

[SirFelixCat]

Lopez makes like a Brave and flies out near the track in LF. This is a helluva pitchers duel. Go Reds...out to dinner now. Holler later all and GL Reds!

[Tony Cloninger]

Lopez seems to be taking a lot more pitches today.

Drove the ball pretty good the other way for that out.

I thought it would carry better.

[Matt700wlw]

Harang at 74 pitches

[George Foster]

I forgot how big a ballpark Atlanta has...how many homeruns would both Jones' have if they still played in the launching pad? How would the numbers of the big three (Smoltz, Glavine, Maddadx sp?) be if they did not pitch most of their career in a bigger ball park? It was extreamly smart of the braves organization.

[Heath]

Lopez seems to be getting back to the patience part - lower in the lineup is going to help him here.

[Matt700wlw]

Brandon Phillips is a great athlete.

[George Foster]

Brandon Phillips is a great athlete.

Not many pitchers in their late 30's would have done that either... real professional.

[Matt700wlw]

Edgar Renteria: The only ballplayer to make the final out for the losing team in a WS (cardinals), and then start the next season with the team that won that series (red sox).

[George Foster]

If I see another Ford commercial again with that guy ...I will never even consider a Ford again. I started singing that song today, for no reason. I felt like such an idiot

[Matt700wlw]

Reds could use another run or 2 if at all possible.

[Red in Chicago]

If I see another Ford commercial again with that guy ...I will never even consider a Ford again. I started singing that song today, for no reason. I felt like such an idiot


the single most annoying commercial on television:bang:

[George Foster]

Reds could use another run or 2 if at all possible.

or 5

[Caveat Emperor]

Reds could use another run or 2 if at all possible.

I'm not saying the bullpen is bad or anything, but I'm putting Harang at a 150 pitch count tonight.

[George Foster]

the single most annoying commercial on television:bang:

He can sing, but he has the white man's disease when it comes to dancing. This is his 15 minutes of fame...

[Red in Chicago]

He can sing, but he has the white man's disease when it comes to dancing. This is his 15 minutes of fame...


are you tone deaf:devil:

[Matt700wlw]

He can sing, but he has the white man's disease when it comes to dancing.

You should see me dance.

I won't do it at a bar or something....I'm afraid I may scare the women. I'll gladly watch them though. :D

[Matt700wlw]

Harang gets the heart of the order.

1 down.

[George Foster]

are you tone deaf:devil:

He IS America's choice...:laugh:

[Matt700wlw]

2 down.

[George Foster]

You should see me dance.

I won't do it at a bar or something....I'm afraid I may scare the women. I'll gladly watch them though. :D

you got to dance...to get the ladies:thumbup:

[Matt700wlw]

you got to dance...to get the ladies:thumbup:

I know.....kind of a no-win situation. :)

Next time I'm at a dancing establishment (which is almost never), I'll be sure I'm completely wasted :D

[George Foster]

This guy could tie this game...or worse

[CrackerJack]

good call 1-1 - not a bad pitch either

[CTA513]

2-1 Braves

:bang:

[reds44]

5 years ago that's an out.

[Matt700wlw]

That hurts...

If Smoltz goes the distance, that may be enough....he's in a groove.

[Gallen5862]

Braves take the lead 2-1 on a Francouers homerun.

[George Foster]

did he give up on that ball?

[SteelSD]

Why do you ever throw Franceour anything to hit? He'll get himself out constantly if you just bust breaking pitches away.

[Matt700wlw]

Oh for the love of god...

:bang:

[George Foster]

That's going to happen at twilight...:bang:

[GAC]

did he give up on that ball?

Didn't see it. They say there is a "haze" ove the stadium.... or maybe the haze was over just Dunn. :lol:

[GAC]

Chat is open :beerme:

[Matt700wlw]

Hopefully the guys can get the lead back in the 8th...Harang deserves win #10.

[reds44]

Maybe Narron will bench Dunn for the next 2 days.


:lol:

[Matt700wlw]

Harang's at 107 pitches.

I'm guessing this inning is it.

[OldXOhio]

Smoltz still swings awfully well for a pitcher.

[CTA513]

Reds got burned by another teams 2 out ralley.

:help:

[Reds Fanatic]

Smoltz singles in a run. 3-1 Braves.

[reds44]

Leave him in longer Jerry.

[Matt700wlw]

The boys are falling apart.

[SteelSD]

God dang it, Harang. Stupid pitches this Inning. You've got Smoltz at 2 strikes. Bust him up at 94 MPH rather than dinking around with off-speed crap over the plate. Lord.

[GAC]

Smoltz gets an RBI

3-1 now

That "I can't see the ball" cost us there. ;)

[George Foster]

Didn't see it. They say there is a "haze" ove the stadium.... or maybe the haze was over just Dunn. :lol:
I was talking about Griffey...it hit the top of the wall. He was there...did not jump.

[reds44]

I was talking about Griffey...it hit the top of the wall. He was there...did not jump.
He wasn't quite back there yet.

[George Foster]

[QUOTE=George Foster]He starts to struggle the 3rd time through the order.

Stats don't lie

[CTA513]

Better hope the Braves go to there bullpen in the 9th.

[reds44]

It took Narron until Harang's 111th pitch to just get somebody up in the pen.

No matter hwo bad it is, you can't expect your starters to throw 120 pitches every night.

[CrackerJack]

I was talking about Griffey...it hit the top of the wall. He was there...did not jump.

He didn't make much of an effort, he slowed down a foot or two away and watched it.

Oh well.

[GAC]

I was talking about Griffey...it hit the top of the wall. He was there...did not jump.

I know. I was referring to the dbl that "fell" in front of Dunn

[captainmorgan07]

3 whiffs for freel tonite

[Reds Fanatic]

Freel strikes out looking. 9 Ks for Smoltz.

[reds44]

0-4 with 3 Ks for Freel.

Glad Edwin isn't playing.

[Matt700wlw]

Honestly, the All-Star break is coming at a good time. (win or lose)

These guys need a break.

Hell...I need a break. :)

[George Foster]

3 whiffs for freel tonite

Feast or famine

[captainmorgan07]

dunn having nice battle

[captainmorgan07]

dunn down looking for the 3rd time

[reds44]

That was a cookie.

What are you looking at?

[Reds Fanatic]

Dunn strikes out looking. 10 Ks for Smoltz.

[Matt700wlw]

Smoltz is cruising...

And he has that closer mentality thing too....if he stays in the whole game, that could be trouble for the Redlegs.

[GAC]

Nice AB by Dunn, but ya stil gotta protect the plate. Go down swinging big guy on stuff that close. ;)

[captainmorgan07]

jams griffey for the third out

[Reds Fanatic]

Junior grounds out to Smoltz. 3-1 Braves mid 8th.

[captainmorgan07]

chip caray is starting to get on my nerves

[reds44]

So Dunn looks at a hanger and Griffey swings at a dirtball and a pitch that would have beaned him.

[Matt700wlw]

Harang didn't do too bad tonight...

Smoltz has just done better.

Pitchers duels....love 'em! (seriously...I do)

[captainmorgan07]

Harang didn't do too bad tonight...

Smoltz has just done better.

Pitchers duels....love 'em! (seriously...I do)
not bad but it's better when u win um

[Reds Fanatic]

Smoltz now at 117 pitches through 8.

[SteelSD]

Nice AB by Dunn, but ya stil gotta protect the plate. Go down swinging big guy on stuff that close. ;)

Pitch sequence locked him up. Every time Smoltz had tried to go outside, he'd missed high and away then come back in with that 77 MPH curve. The last pitch most likely looked like more of the former. Great job by Smoltz there.

[Matt700wlw]

not bad but it's better when u win um

No doubt.




Harang's still out there...

[captainmorgan07]

intersting harang still out there no confidence in coffey and i dont' blame jerry for not having any

[oneupper]

Smoltz now at 117 pitches through 8.

Why is Harang out there?

[flyer85]

Nice AB by Dunn, but ya stil gotta protect the plate. Go down swinging big guy on stuff that close. ;)Smoltz got lucky he wanted the ball down and in, instead it was high and away. Ball comes out his hand that high, it looks like a fastball and ends up a perfect pitch on the outside corner at the top of the zone.

[reds44]

Jerry is going to blow out Harang's arm. I would rather see the pen give up 8 runs, then Harang be in here.

[Reds Fanatic]

Renteria grounds out to Harang. 1 out.

[flyer85]

Why is Harang out there?Narron is stupid. I guess he wants him to throw 130+ pitches

[captainmorgan07]

1 out bounced out to harang

[captainmorgan07]

Narron is stupid.
my guess is he wants to keep it closer than what the bullpen can give him

[oneupper]

Narron is stupid.

Very set in his ways. A game which is probably lost anyway is not worth this risk...

[reds44]

my guess is he wants to keep it closer than what the bullpen can give him
I'd rather have the bullpen give up 8 runs then Aaron be in. You are going to ruin his arm.

[GAC]

Pitch sequence locked him up. Every time Smoltz had tried to go outside, he'd missed high and away then come back in with that 77 MPH curve. The last pitch most likely looked like more of the former. Great job by Smoltz there.

Thorughly agree. Smoltz has it.



More great D by Dunn there on the LF wall off of Chipper's hit. :rolleyes:

[reds44]

Oh a triple.

Leave him in longer Jerry!!!!! Come on.

[Matt700wlw]

triple.


Yank him....

[captainmorgan07]

dunn tries to go junior and rob a homer keeps the ball in play but jones with a triple

[Reds Fanatic]

Jones triples off the top of the wall. It is unbelievable Harang is still out there at 121 pitches.

[captainmorgan07]

grounder to freel 2 outs runner still at third

[oneupper]

Harang should have been gone....long ago...

[flyer85]

my guess is he wants to keep it closer than what the bullpen can give himat the expense of what? They aren't going to score off of Smoltz anyway.

[Reds Fanatic]

A. Jones grounds out to short. C. Jones holds at 3rd. 2 outs.

[Matt700wlw]

Dunn could have caught that.

Marty: "A good left fielder catches that ball."

:laugh:

[oneupper]

Andruw Jones is dogging it?

[SteelSD]

One out triple by Chipper. Nice attempt by by Dunn on a slicing ball that he just couldn't get to at the top of the LF wall.

There's no way Narron should have run Harang out there with that pitch count. First pitch swinging helps minimize the damage, but dang.

[captainmorgan07]

at the expense of what? They aren't going to score off of Smoltz anyway.
he has whole week off one more inning aint gonna kill him

[Matt700wlw]

he has whole week off one more inning aint gonna kill him

He pitches thursday.

[captainmorgan07]

mccann doubles chipper scores

[reds44]

Narron is an idiot.

Leave him in longer Jerry.

[Reds Fanatic]

McCann doubles to right. 4-1 Braves.

When Harang develops an arm injury before the end of the year remember night's like tonight when he throws 126 pitches for no reason.

[flyer85]

gone beyond the point of absurd

[Matt700wlw]

Narron leaves him in.

I'm baffled at this point.




Perhaps Harang is in charge of things tonight.

[Reds Fanatic]

And he is still staying in the game.

[SteelSD]

he has whole week off one more inning aint gonna kill him

Anything near a 120-pitch workload is danger zone. No reason to go above that when down by 2 the way Smoltz is dealing tonight. Now down by 3. Great idea, Jerry.

[oneupper]

Harang is pitching every fifth day...they're changing the rotation so he never gets an extra day...

Does Narron really expect to win this game now?

[captainmorgan07]

that braves pen aint to great this one is far from over

[flyer85]

he has whole week off one more inning aint gonna kill himwhen guys get hurt it is often because of the stress of high pitch counts. One more inning may very well hurt and if it did would it be worth it?

[Matt700wlw]

that braves pen aint to great this one is far from over

Gotta rock Smoltz in the 9th first.

Not an easy task.

[oneupper]

Harang at 132 pitches...looking to set a new season high (if not already). :rolleyes:

[CTA513]

People wont be liking it when Harang tops out around 88 mph sometime between his next 1-3 starts.

[captainmorgan07]

franceour k's to the 9th we go

[Heath]

Can you say **** on a message board.

Guess not.

So much for adding an expletive when discussing Narron's managerial moves. Or our bullpen in general. The answer of "all the above" applies here.

C'mon offense.

[flyer85]

Harang has thrown 50+ pitches in the last 2 innings to go with 130+

[reds44]

135 pitches......


You gotta be kidding.

[captainmorgan07]

heck of a try for harang tonite just made couple bad pitches but it was a duel all nite

[oneupper]

Win the game...lose the season...great thinking...

[Reds Fanatic]

Francouer strikes out swinging. 133 pitches for Harang. A ridiculous pitch count. Apparently Narron took the Dusty Baker course on how to handle starting pitchers.

[Matt700wlw]

Smoltz NOT pitching the 9th...

[Matt700wlw]

135 pitches......


You gotta be kidding.

Back in the day they didn't worry about pitch count.

Ask Joe Nuxhall :D

[GAC]

that braves pen aint to great this one is far from over

But we'll prbably never se it though.

[reds44]

Francouer strikes out swinging. 133 pitches for Harang. A ridiculous pitch count. Apparently Narron took the Dusty Baker course on how to handle starting pitchers.
Actually it was 135

[captainmorgan07]

Smoltz NOT pitching the 9th...
get out ur rally caps fella's this one is gonna get very intersting

[CTA513]

135 pitches......


You gotta be kidding.


He must have been taking tips from Dusty Baker.

:help:

[M2]

Defense is killing the Reds tonight.

By my count, Francouer's homer should have been caught, Chipper's triple should have been caught and McCann should have been gunned out at second (if Felipe had managed to catch Kearns' throw and tag him out).

[flyer85]

Smoltz NOT pitching the 9th...and he has thrown a lot less pitches than Harang. Myabe Bobby knows something Jerry doesn't. Now that would be a shock.

[Reds Fanatic]

Kenny Ray in to pitch the 9th.

[Heath]

The next outing will not be Harang's best. Crap.

[captainmorgan07]

ken ray on for the braves

[reds44]

Win the game...lose the season...great thinking...
You probably aren't even going to win the game.

I would have rather seen the bullpen give up 8 runs that inning even if it was still 1-0 us, then leave Aaron out there for 135 pitches.

[oneupper]

REDS aren't going to score here, guys...they're all stupified watching Narron try to blow out Harang's arm.

[Matt700wlw]

and he has thrown a lot less pitches than Harang. Myabe Bobby knows something Jerry doesn't. Now that would be a shock.

15 less...he threw 120