If the Reds had a Delmon Young, national press would love this trade

[Redsnake]

Say the Reds had a minor league player that was rotting away on AAA team (ex Delmon Young) and a trade could be made giving this player a promotion to the big leagues. This team could add something lacking (for example pitching) while making room for such a minor league player. Then the national press would love this trade. They would say how this team got better.

Wait a minute..didn't the Reds do this? They added a minor league player by that was leading the IL in hitting. And wan't this player the Reds 2006 minor league player of the year. Denorfia might never be a Delmon Young, but he could be a Austin Kearns!!

Of yeah, saving close to $10 million in salary next year by getting rid of Kearns/Lopez was noted as well. If the Reds kept them they still couldn't start every 5th day on the mound. Money that can be used on a quality free agent arm.

[thatcoolguy_22]

i like this free agent thinking... No one is saying anything about Denorfia, the national media is sleeping on him. Also I just read that the pirates are talking trades involving Jack Wilson... SS anyone?

[markymark69]

ESPN probably doesn't even know about Chris Denorfia, or if they do, they don't know that he was Reds minor league player of the year last year or any of his other accolades.

Please disregard anything that ESPN says about the Reds.

[Gizmo]

Please disregard anything that ESPN says about the Reds.


easy enough. They rarely say anything about the Reds anyway.

[Mario-Rijo]

Interesting line of thinking and I would not necc. say your wrong, however how exactly is it that everyone expects Denorfia to replace Kearns? I do see him adding something to this club, he will in all likelihood be a better baserunner, contact hitter and will give you better range than Kearnsy. And for the long term I am happy with that.

But in the short term he gives us nothing of which we need out of a Kearns replacement. The 2 things that Kearns brought to the table that we need that Deno cannot replace is his power RH bat and his cannon of an arm in RF. The cannon is something we may not need as much of with improved pitching and defense however that RH power bat is gonna hurt us if not replaced. People have been itching to throw Freel and Deno out there in his stead. However in order for that to work they MUST do what they do best in order for that work to our advantage.

Like I said I am not saying Denorfia has no value and indeed I think he is a solid all around ballplayer whom will be an asset now and in the future but we need that RH slugger if we intend on competing for anything more than a .500 record.

[NewEraReds]

i dont mean to bash this as i havent been on the board lately, but i just cant be on the side of it being a good trade. as much as i love kearns, im ok with trading him and especially lopez for pitching, even bullpen help. just not what they got. majewski(sp - im sure) just doesnt have enough to get lefties out and you cant use him against just righties. and hes proven that just in his two outings. its not that the idea was bad, just what the got and for how much.

[NewEraReds]

Interesting line of thinking and I would not necc. say your wrong, however how exactly is it that everyone expects Denorfia to replace Kearns? I do see him adding something to this club, he will in all likelihood be a better baserunner, contact hitter and will give you better range than Kearnsy. And for the long term I am happy with that.

But in the short term he gives us nothing of which we need out of a Kearns replacement. The 2 things that Kearns brought to the table that we need that Deno cannot replace is his power RH bat and his cannon of an arm in RF. The cannon is something we may not need as much of with improved pitching and defense however that RH power bat is gonna hurt us if not replaced. People have been itching to throw Freel and Deno out there in his stead. However in order for that to work they MUST do what they do best in order for that work to our advantage.

Like I said I am not saying Denorfia has no value and indeed I think he is a solid all around ballplayer whom will be an asset now and in the future but we need that RH slugger if we intend on competing for anything more than a .500 record.
which is why i was amazed we sat encarnacion to straight games after his first game

[dougdirt]

Mario-rijo, Denorfia likewise has a cannon connected to his shoulder.

[crazybob60]

ESPN probably doesn't even know about Chris Denorfia, or if they do, they don't know that he was Reds minor league player of the year last year or any of his other accolades.

Please disregard anything that ESPN says about the Reds.

I doubt they even know he is a player on the Reds roster at any level, more or less on their major league roster. I would like to sit down and talk with any of those guys over at ESPN and see if they can name, oh say 15 current Reds on their roster.

[Heath]

i like this free agent thinking... No one is saying anything about Denorfia, the national media is sleeping on him. Also I just read that the pirates are talking trades involving Jack Wilson... SS anyone?

um, no. I'd rather have Royce Clayton at SS than Jack Wilson. He's much cheaper.

[REDREAD]

I think the main beef people have with the Kearns trade is that we paid more for 2 relief pitchers than I've ever seen in my entire lifetime.

[dabvu2498]

I think the main beef people have with the Kearns trade is that we paid more for 2 relief pitchers than I've ever seen in my entire lifetime.
Jeff Bagwell was tarded for Larry Anderson once.

Brian Giles was traded for Ricardo Rincon once.

Compared to those two stinkers, the Reds made out like bandits.

It happens.

[registerthis]

Jeff Bagwell was tarded

Come on, no personal attacks on this board.

;)

[Mario-Rijo]

Mario-rijo, Denorfia likewise has a cannon connected to his shoulder.

Thanks DD I had no idea, that will be something I will keep an eye out for to try to compare and contrast the 2's arms. If it's close then I don't feel nearly as bad about Deno replacing him. Of course we still need that Power.

[REDREAD]

Jeff Bagwell was tarded for Larry Anderson once.

Brian Giles was traded for Ricardo Rincon once.

Compared to those two stinkers, the Reds made out like bandits.

It happens.

But Bagwell was more of a case of a prospect vastly exceeding expectations. He was analagous to Harang. The consensus with Harang at the trade was that his ceiling was a #5 starter. That's what all the experts and message board people said. Harang busted his rearend and made himself an above average pitcher. It was a surprise. Likewise Bagwell was well under the radar. He was considered marginal at the time.

As someone else said on that thread, Giles comes close. He was a platoon guy for Cleveland that exploded. It's still possible that Kearns or Lopez could explode into an offensive force like Giles, since they are both only 26. I am not guaranteeing it, but another few legitimate allstar appearances for Lopez certainly is not out of the question.

I guess I should say that AT THE TIME OF THE TRADE, there's never been a trade for relievers that looked this lopsided. The odd thing is that Wash is the rebuilding team and they actually got the two established talents in the deal. We got a LH rookie, and a RH with 1.5 years of service time that's had tendonitis. If you didn't know the W-L records of the two teams, you'd almost assume it was Washington that was the contender loading up for the stretch run.

[RedEye]

i dont mean to bash this as i havent been on the board lately, but i just cant be on the side of it being a good trade. as much as i love kearns, im ok with trading him and especially lopez for pitching, even bullpen help. just not what they got. majewski(sp - im sure) just doesnt have enough to get lefties out and you cant use him against just righties. and hes proven that just in his two outings. its not that the idea was bad, just what the got and for how much.

Completely agreed. And to compare Denorfia to Young is a bit of stretch. I like Deno, but he doesn't look like he'll ever really hit for anything more than gap power and average. Kearns is a better power-average guy and ridiculously strong, and I think we would realize that more if it weren't for the fact that we watch his chum Adam routinely break bats just by swinging them. :eek:

[jmcclain19]

And to compare Denorfia to Young is a bit of stretch.

Uh yeah, that's putting it lightly.

I think perhaps everyone needs to take a slight step away from the Denorfia Kool-aid jar.

He's a nice player no doubt. I've always liked him and I wish him nothing but the best. Denorfia has a virtual clone in Toronto in Reed Johnson, another high average singles hitter who can play some D - and really isn't known outside of Toronto. I hope for the Reds sake he carves himself out a nice career.

But back on topic - Young > Denorfia - and it's not even close.

[princeton]

I do like trading Kearns/FeLo for two middle relievers much more than I liked trading Doggie for two middle relievers, even without a Driessen around...

Kearns/FeLo are young and talented, but Perez raked.

[Redsnake]

Denorfia isn't Young and never will be. My point is this. Too evauluate this trade you most add all the pieces envolved. But too say Kearns/Lopez is a bigger lose to this team than the addition of Majewski/Bray I disagree. For this reason.

The Reds lose Lopez, Kearns, Hammonds, Burns and White off the major league team. Hammonds, White and Burns hurt this team more than Kearns and Lopez helped this team. They lost more games than K/L won for us.

They add Majewski, Bray, Clayton and Denorfia. First this trades get those bad pitchers off the Reds mound. That's a win in its self. Denorfia is not Kearns. Denorfia lacks Kearns power, but might make up for it with a higher average and better speed. Clayton is old, but right now is a better defensive SS and is hitting better than Lopez.

Since the trade stats:
Total AB Hits Runs RBI SB Avg.
Lopez/Kearns 44 5 2 1 2 .113

Deno/Clayton 32 10 2 6 2 .313

The national media sees names and nothing else. They don't see all the working parts in a trade. So without knowing the facts how can anyone say this was a bad trade.