Hatteberg Signed through 07

[acredsfan]

per Marc's blog.

HOUSTON -- Scott Hatteberg and the Reds have agreed to terms on a $1.5 million contract for 2007 that also includes a club option for 2008.

Hatteberg is making a base salary of $750,000 this year, plus up to $250,000 in bonuses based on plate appearances.wow, that is interesting. Wonder if that's to make him more tradeable or if it kills the supposed rumor.

[remdog]

That's a 'play it safe' contract for the Reds.

Having said that, I'm not enamored with the idea of Scott Hatteberg at first for the next year or two.

Rem

[markymark69]

I like it and I think it does kill the trade rumor. He's hot right now, let's ride him, whether he is next year or not, let's worry about that next year. He's solid and a bargain contract-wise. Good move by Krivsky and Co.

[redssouth]

Good move. He has been productive this year, and allows a cheap option even if produciton falls off next year. Not too much to pay for a backup and Pinch hitter if Votto can make the jump, and a safe club option for 2008. Wayne always with the big picture in mind. Good job!!

[redssouth]

That's a 'play it safe' contract for the Reds.

Having said that, I'm not enamored with the idea of Scott Hatteberg at first for the next year or two.

Rem


But are you okay with Hatte being our veteran pinch hitter for the next year or two at 1.5??

[marcshoe]

For one thing, it means they can trade him in the off-season.

[HBP]

I like it. This allows Votto to gain some more experience and work on defense at AAA next year. If Votto lights it up in Louisville, he can come up and Hatteberg can provide some good PH at bats and a fall back option. At least that's my wish. More likely, we won't see Votto get regular ABs until the 2008 season.

[CrackerJack]

$1.5 is nothing these days.

Votto won't get a chance to play here any ways until he's 30+ as long as Narron and Krivsky are running the show. :P

[REDREAD]

I think this means Hatteberg is here for the long term.

And it makes a lot of sense, since it only costs 1.5 million.

It's obvious Dunn isn't going to move to 1b, so that doesn't give us a whole lot of options.

I hope Votto pans out, but I like having an insurance policy.

I doubt there was really a trade market for Hatteberg anyhow. Let's remember that this guy was unsigned in Jan or Feb. Seems like he jumped on the first offer he got from the Reds. He's played great this year, and even though I don't expect him to maintain it over the life of his contract, I have no problem signing him to a 1.5 million extension. Nice to reward people that have produced.

[princeton]

For one thing, it means they can trade him in the off-season.

Unlike Arroyo's agent, I'd have insisted on language that addressed that.

Reds LIKE good contracts. My guess is that Hatteberg's ours until next year's trade deadline, at least.

Votto's more tradeable now...

[remdog]

But are you okay with Hatte being our veteran pinch hitter for the next year or two at 1.5??

Yeah. That's not too much to pay for what he was supposed to being doing this year. (shrug) I'm more hopeful though that it actually makes Scott easier to trade since he is locked up for next year at a reasonable price.

Just my opinion.

Rem

[cincy09]

Votto's more tradeable now...

What do you think we could get for Votto? He's had an incredible year and his value is at an all-time high.

[M2]

Maybe Hatteberg will finally be able to string together two good seasons in a row at age 37.

My advice would be the Reds not convince themselves to make or not make any deals based on the notion that "Hey, we've got Scott Hatteberg locked up."

[edabbs44]

Ugh...Votto must be a little upset. Maybe he and EE one day can have a few beers and talk about what could've been.

[princeton]

My advice would be the Reds not convince themselves to make or not make any deals based on the notion that "Hey, we've got Scott Hatteberg locked up."

my guess is that the Reds will bring in a chorus line of candidates to join Hat, once Votto's traded...

[Benihana]

Nice move. Although I wouldn't have minded seeing the Reds sell high on Hat (maybe to Anaheim), I don't have a problem insuring against Votto for $1.5 mil. Even at 2/3 of the production he has provided this year that is a bargain. Now maybe shop Votto (who's value is also at an alltime high) for a pitcher or long term middle infield help.

And please don't resign Aurillia now.

[EddieMilner]

I think this leaves the oppurtunity to trade RA and larue for some type of arm.

That would also give EE the reins at 3B for the rest of the season.

[registerthis]

Ugh...Votto must be a little upset. Maybe he and EE one day can have a few beers and talk about what could've been.

let's get Votto a major league at-bat first before he starts crying in his beer.

[registerthis]

I think this means Hatteberg is here for the long term.

And it makes a lot of sense, since it only costs 1.5 million.

It's obvious Dunn isn't going to move to 1b, so that doesn't give us a whole lot of options.

I hope Votto pans out, but I like having an insurance policy.

I doubt there was really a trade market for Hatteberg anyhow. Let's remember that this guy was unsigned in Jan or Feb. Seems like he jumped on the first offer he got from the Reds. He's played great this year, and even though I don't expect him to maintain it over the life of his contract, I have no problem signing him to a 1.5 million extension. Nice to reward people that have produced.

I agree, I htink this was a good signing. And the option is a club option, so that makes him particularly attractive for a trade.

[kaldaniels]

For the naysayers, please project a better player we could have had for 1.5 M.

[registerthis]

For the naysayers, please project a better player we could have had for 1.5 M.

You couldn't, really. And even if Hatte drops down to career norms next year, he's still not signed for a huge amount of money, it's only one year with a club option, and he'd be a solid player on your bench regardless. i think this was a very shrewd move.

Not to mention, as others have, the potential trading opportunities that such a move opens up for the Reds.

[edabbs44]

For the naysayers, please project a better player we could have had for 1.5 M.
So I guess Wayne should just burn money if he's not spending it? Here's a few ways it could be better spent...

1) 2007 trade deadline
2) Adding it to the FA budget (i.e., getting a better player than Rick White and Chris Hammond)
3) Adding it to the draft budget

Is everyone here that comfortable with Hatteberg as the starting 1st baseman next year? As comfortable as Felipe at SS this season? One season doesn't make the player, and unless Hatte joined Bonds at the "Fountain of Youth", he will be hard pressed to have a repeat season.

[edabbs44]

You couldn't, really. And even if Hatte drops down to career norms next year, he's still not signed for a huge amount of money, it's only one year with a club option, and he'd be a solid player on your bench regardless. i think this was a very shrewd move.

Not to mention, as others have, the potential trading opportunities that such a move opens up for the Reds.
He won't be on the bench, that is one of the problems. If RA has the ability to push EdE to the bench this year, Hatteberg will not sit unless he is hitting .100.

[MartyFan]

So I guess Wayne should just burn money if he's not spending it? Here's a few ways it could be better spent...

1) 2007 trade deadline
2) Adding it to the FA budget (i.e., getting a better player than Rick White and Chris Hammond)
3) Adding it to the draft budget

Is everyone here that comfortable with Hatteberg as the starting 1st baseman next year? As comfortable as Felipe at SS this season? One season doesn't make the player, and unless Hatte joined Bonds at the "Fountain of Youth", he will be hard pressed to have a repeat season.

Considering this Fo and ownership have not yet been involved in one single offseason in power of the team I think maybe your assuming that there is no money to go out and improve our team beyond what has already been done since spring training and the rest of this season.

What is the Draft Busget for this team? What sort of money will they have to invest in FA's this off season? I don't know but you seem to so please share.

[TOBTTReds]

The Reds are very good at blocking their best talent in the minors. I'm glad the last 2 years we've had 3 good prospects that are close to the majors(Homer, EdE, Votto). Two of them are being blocked. Nice.

[registerthis]

He won't be on the bench, that is one of the problems. If RA has the ability to push EdE to the bench this year, Hatteberg will not sit unless he is hitting .100.

And who's to say he won't be productive? Good grief, the guy has outperformed his contract by leaps and bounds this year. The odds of him having another .900 OPS season aren't high, but if he's comfortable in GAB who's to say he couldn't OPS around .800, while offering good defense? That's $1.5 mil well spent if you ask me.

You're treating the guy like he's chopped liver, all the while he's only been one of the most consistent hitters on this team this year.

[WrongVerb]

The Reds are very good at blocking their best talent in the minors. I'm glad the last 2 years we've had 3 good prospects that are close to the majors(Homer, EdE, Votto). Two of them are being blocked. Nice.

Yes we have prospects. Let's let them develop first. I like the signing as it allows the Reds to give Votto a call-up at the end of the year, then start next season at AAA. If he's ready at mid-season next year, deal Hatt at the deadline. If not then pick up the option on Hatt in '08 and let Votto work his way into the lineup then.

And Bailey's not being blocked, he's being kept on a prescribed path that will lead him to be a successful ML pitcher for a long time. It's just that ML part doesn't start this year.

[registerthis]

The Reds are very good at blocking their best talent in the minors. I'm glad the last 2 years we've had 3 good prospects that are close to the majors(Homer, EdE, Votto). Two of them are being blocked. Nice.

And Votto only became a top prospect this season, his first year above A ball. I'd hardly say he's being blocked. In fact, having a guy signed whom you know will offer at least some consistent level of production should Votto fail is a smart move. Four years ago, people would have complained about Larson being blocked, and we saw how that played out.

[fielder's choice]

Yes we have prospects. Let's let them develop first. I like the signing as it allows the Reds to give Votto a call-up at the end of the year, then start next season at AAA. If he's ready at mid-season next year, deal Hatt at the deadline. If not then pick up the option on Hatt in '08 and let Votto work his way into the lineup then.

And Bailey's not being blocked, he's being kept on a prescribed path that will lead him to be a successful ML pitcher for a long time. It's just that ML part doesn't start this year.

He was referring to Edwin being blocked, not Homer. Hopefully this means that we'll trade Hatteburg high in the offseason. I like the guy a lot and he's having a great year, but I wouldn't expect him to keep it up next year.

[registerthis]

And Bailey's not being blocked, he's being kept on a prescribed path that will lead him to be a successful ML pitcher for a long time. It's just that ML part doesn't start this year.

Yes, to insenuate that Bailey is being "blocked" is laughable. Who's blocking him--Joe Mays?

[Johnny Footstool]

Everything about Hatteberg screams "career year."

At least they signed him cheaply for a short time.

Next April and May, odds are we'll be treated to 150 ABs of .650 OPS from the 37 year-old Hat, while Narron keeps trotting him out there because "he's a veteran and he just needs a chance to get going."

[GOREDSGO32]

I don't see how people can whine about this move. Hatteburgh is batting like .330 for God's sake. He's actually an IMPROVEMENT over Casey, and we dropepd Casey's salary along the way. You wanna whine about paying someone, look at the big two up there: Griffey and Milton. If we had those two off the books, the Reds salary would be 2nd to last in the major leagues. Crying about 1.5 mil is ridiculous.

And saying the Reds are 'blocking' anyone is ridiculous. I'm sure the prospects will be brought up in time. Remember the rush job with Ryan Wagner? First year up he did pretty good, then this year the tailspin ended with like a 9 ERA in Triple A. There's no need to rush things. I'm sick of peopel saying players are 'held back'. EE maybe should have the starting 3rd baseman job, but to say he is a complete lock and what else could he do to start is a joke. Maybe if he spent some time on his defense and didn't lead 3rd baseman in the NL in errors, he WOULD be playing.

[bounty37h]

He won't be on the bench, that is one of the problems. If RA has the ability to push EdE to the bench this year, Hatteberg will not sit unless he is hitting .100.

I don't understand all the negatives about EE's playing time. He is going to be great, no doubt, and will be the 3'rd baseman of the future, but we are in a playoff race now, and he has 15 errors!!!!!!!! If we fall out of the race, then let him learn to play D when it doesnt hurt the team.

[registerthis]

Everything about Hatteberg screams "career year."

At least they signed him cheaply for a short time.

Next April and May, odds are we'll be treated to 150 ABs of .650 OPS from the 37 year-old Hat, while Narron keeps trotting him out there because "he's a veteran and he just needs a chance to get going."

That may be, but I'm not inclined to kick guys out the door because we may have an incompetent manager who may continue to play them after their stats may have dropped.

Too many "mays" up there for my tastes.

[fielder's choice]

I don't understand all the negatives about EE's playing time. He is going to be great, no doubt, and will be the 3'rd baseman of the future, but we are in a playoff race now, and he has 15 errors!!!!!!!! If we fall out of the race, then let him learn to play D when it doesnt hurt the team.

Arod has 18. Would you want Aurilia over him too?

[registerthis]

Arod has 18. Would you want Aurilia over him too?

i think New York wouldn't mind seeing him play someplace other than third...

[GOREDSGO32]

Except Arod has won gold gloves, and this year is the anomaly. Everyone knows he can hit and play defense, whatever his problem is this year isn't the norm.

[kaldaniels]

So I guess Wayne should just burn money if he's not spending it? Here's a few ways it could be better spent...

1) 2007 trade deadline
2) Adding it to the FA budget (i.e., getting a better player than Rick White and Chris Hammond)
3) Adding it to the draft budget

Is everyone here that comfortable with Hatteberg as the starting 1st baseman next year? As comfortable as Felipe at SS this season? One season doesn't make the player, and unless Hatte joined Bonds at the "Fountain of Youth", he will be hard pressed to have a repeat season.

I said player. For 1.5 million. Name one. You could also add to the free agent budget by charging a buck more for nachos. You want to discuss payroll, that's a whole other story, I'm talking about 1.5 million well spent.

[He's Dunn It]

1.5 Mill for a guy who's among the league leaders in OBP. I don't mean to be a Moneyball guy, but that's pretty impressive. I'm liking this Wayne guy more and more each month.

Now let's go out there and win this thing!

[Rotater Cuff]

Only Scott Hatteberg could have made us forget sean casey as soon as we did. Who else would you want up at the plate in a critical situation these days. He's been the man. $1.5 is peanuts, and we're lucky he likes it here!

[Johnny Footstool]

That may be, but I'm not inclined to kick guys out the door because we may have an incompetent manager who may continue to play them after their stats may have dropped.

Too many "mays" up there for my tastes.

I disagree on the "mays". I think it's fairly certain that A) Hatteberg's OPS won't touch .800 next season, B) Narron has shown little competence in anything except penmanship, and C) Narron ignores stats and plays veterans over youngsters regardless of performance.\

But again, at least the contract isn't a backbreaker.

[johngalt]

Yes, to insenuate that Bailey is being "blocked" is laughable. Who's blocking him--Joe Mays?

He said *two* of them were blocked. Not Homer.

[fielder's choice]

Narron has shown little competence in anything except penmanship

:laugh:

[M2]

my guess is that the Reds will bring in a chorus line of candidates to join Hat, once Votto's traded...

Quite possibly.

Though let's hope they don't trade Votto for a new model Russ Branyan this time around.

[Handofdeath]

Ah, Joey Votto the Reds offensive Homer Bailey. I remember when fans spoke of such players and their potential when they had actually played in AAA. No matter. If Votto makes it out of Spring Training w/ the Reds next season, I would expect him to spell Hatteburg. There are 15-20 Interleague games to be played for Hatteburg to DH and Votto to play first. Hatteburg will need some time off occasionally. With pinchhitting Votto can be eased into the position next year and get his 200 AB's next season. In 2008 he would be ready.

[registerthis]

I disagree on the "mays". I think it's fairly certain that A) Hatteberg's OPS won't touch .800 next season, B) Narron has shown little competence in anything except penmanship, and C) Narron ignores stats and plays veterans over youngsters regardless of performance.

Other than his much-maligned (yet somewhat understandable) playing of Aurilia over Encarnacion, what superior young players have not been playing due to Narron's affinity for older vets? I think this label has been applied to Narron because the team is so overloaded with vets, but in reality I don't see much in the way of overwhelming proof for that. Lopez was a frequent starter at SS despite being awful defensively, Phillips quickly won the starting 2B job, Kearns and Dunn played pretty much every day, and Freel has gotten a lot of playing time as well. Even E_E, in spite of all of Rich's playing time, has amassed 200+ ABs and some nice offensive numbers.

So I don't agree that it's a forgone conclusoon that Narron will play hatteberg come hell or high water if Hatte is blowing up next year.

And, about that...I kept hearing how the bottom was going to fall out on Hatteberg this year, and he's only gotten better. If it's "fairly certain" that Hatteberg won't touch an 800 OPS next year, then the odds of him touching a 920 OPS this year must have been less than zero. Hatteberg seems to be flourishing in GAB, and seems to be very comfortable with the Reds. Maybe he'll revert to his bad old .650 self next year...or maybe he'll continue to be productive. Whatever it is, neither option is a near certainty.

Even less of a "near certainty" is that Votto would be a prime producer at first next year. The guy has, to date, had all of a half season in AA. I feel much better with the Reds going into next season with some degree of assurance at first whether or not Votto produces.

[Rob Dicken]

let's get Votto a major league at-bat first before he starts crying in his beer.

Yeah, we all know how doing great in the Minors has done for the Reds. Need I remind you of Brandon Larson? :rolleyes:

[flyer85]

So I don't agree that it's a forgone conclusoon that Narron will play hatteberg come hell or high water if Hatte is blowing up next year.... but by then the damage will be done. Jerry would remove Hatty but only when the numbers were so bad that he was forced to.

BTW, a 770 OPS(hatty's career average) is awful for a 1B.

[RollyInRaleigh]

I am amazed at the number of people who are ready to crown any player in the Reds minor league system with any semblence of success as the next great superstar.

[Cedric]

... but by then the damage will be done. Jerry would remove Hatty but only when the numbers were so bad that he was forced to.

BTW, a 770 OPS(hatty's career average) is awful for a 1B.

Playing in Oakland isn't good for the ol OPS either though.

He wasn't that bad in Boston.

[Ltlabner]

I am amazed at the number of people who are ready to crown any player in the Reds minor league system with any semblence of success as the next great superstar.

All while quickly dimissing any sucess by players they don't like as "flukes" and "never to be repeted years".

[flyer85]

He wasn't that bad in Boston.He was a catcher in Boston.

[Cedric]

He was a catcher in Boston.

I understand that. I'm saying his OPS wasn't that bad in Boston.

[RollyInRaleigh]

Playing in Oakland isn't good for the ol OPS either though.

He wasn't that bad in Boston.

Lot of foul ground in the Coliseum.

[flyer85]

I understand that. I'm saying his OPS wasn't that bad in Boston.... for a catcher. It was bad for a first baseman. If you are going to take a sub 800 OPS at first you have to make up for it at one of the defensive positions (2b, ss, cf, c).

[M2]

If Scott Hatteberg's not having a career year then no one in history has ever had one. He's never produced a year remotely like this one and I wouldn't recommend anyone invest money in it ever happening again.

He's still not a bad guy to have around. He's a league-average hitter at a reasonable price, but this year he's taken a page right of "Bang the Drum Slowly."

[James B.]

There was a lot of people on this board who complained when the reds signed Aurilia back for this year. Some thought last year was a fluke. He has been solid again this year. I don't see the big deal with resigning Hatt. to a contract like this. If he does not produce then cut him or put him on the bench. Then you could play Votto or Aurilia.

[flyer85]

If Scott Hatteberg's not having a career year then no one in history has ever had one. He's never produced a year remotely like this one and I wouldn't recommend anyone invest money in it ever happening again.

He's still not a bad guy to have around. He's a league-average hitter at a reasonable price, but this year he's taken a page right of "Bang the Drum Slowly."I think he would be an excellent reserve/PH player limited to around 150-200 ABs. However, I forsee a role that gets a lot more ABs

[gonelong]

There was a lot of people on this board who complained when the reds signed Aurilia back for this year. Some thought last year was a fluke. He has been solid again this year. I don't see the big deal with resigning Hatt. to a contract like this. If he does not produce then cut him or put him on the bench. Then you could play Votto or Aurilia.

Many complained because they thought Narron would use RA over Lopez (he did) and that once resigned, he would use RA over EE (deja vu).

I like having RA around, its the way he is being used that bothers me.

GL

[minus5]

http://www.larrysmithpuppets.com/wcet_postcard_1966b.jpg

If he continues to swing the bat well...how long before the Cincinnati area baby boomers start calling him "Batty Hatty from Cincinnati"?

[registerthis]

He's still not a bad guy to have around. He's a league-average hitter at a reasonable price, but this year he's taken a page right of "Bang the Drum Slowly."

Oh, he's most definitely having a career year. I wouldn't expect anything close to this next season.

But, like you said, I see the value in having him around. And at $1.5 million it's a reasonable luxury.

[registerthis]

I think he would be an excellent reserve/PH player limited to around 150-200 ABs. However, I forsee a role that gets a lot more ABs

And as Cyclone posited in another thread, that's a Jerry Narron problem.

And the assumption being made, of course, is that by getting more than the 150-200 ABs mentioned he's blocking a younger, more productive player (presumably Votto.) But this younger, more productive player has had only had a half season of truly impressive minor league ball. Yet we're so concerned about Hatteberg potentially blocking him? This team has other, more tangible concerns than that.

[bounty37h]

Arod has 18. Would you want Aurilia over him too?

ARods proven himself before in the big show, EE has a long way to go. He likely will get there, but has to earn it first. And yes, at this point in time, the way ARod has played as of late, I would rather have him in the game right now till ARod comes back around. Guess thats why neither you or I are coaching...

[M2]

http://www.larrysmithpuppets.com/wcet_postcard_1966b.jpg

If he continues to swing the bat well...how long before the Cincinnati area baby boomers start calling him "Batty Hatty from Cincinnati"?

You've got some rep coming your way tomorrow.

[MartyFan]

I am amazed at the number of people who are ready to crown any player in the Reds minor league system with any semblence of success as the next great superstar.

I agree with you 100%...

[Johnny Footstool]

I am amazed at the number of people who are ready to crown any player in the Reds minor league system with any semblence of success as the next great superstar.

Homer Bailey, for instance.

[Unassisted]

It's not such a big investment. I trust that Narron will use Hatteberg in a fashion which gets the most out of him, and avoid running him out there every day because he "plays the game the right way."

[PTI (pti)]

I just can't for the life of me see how anyone could *complain* about this signing. Here's the good things about Hatteberg:

* Kills right-handed pitching. He's hitting .341 / .431 on-base % / .529 slugging / .960 ops vs righties

* 2-to-1 walk/K ratio (44 / 22) -> don't even have to look it up, that HAS to be the best on the team

* 2nd-hardest hitter in the NL to strikeout (only behind Nomar)

* Just signed a contract for $1.5 million next year - which is (I believe) less than the league mininum -> and that's coming off a career year.



What is the absolute WORST that can happen by signing Scott Hatteberg to this extremely cheap contract? On top of his overall ability (he's no superstar, but is an above-average player, professional hitter, etc) - he'll be a nice backup plan if Votto isn't ready next year. GREAT move by Krivsky.

[Falls City Beer]

I just can't for the life of me see how anyone could *complain* about this signing. Here's the good things about Hatteberg:

* Kills right-handed pitching. He's hitting .341 / .431 on-base % / .529 slugging / .960 ops vs righties

* 2-to-1 walk/K ratio (44 / 22) -> don't even have to look it up, that HAS to be the best on the team

* 2nd-hardest hitter in the NL to strikeout (only behind Nomar)

* Just signed a contract for $1.5 million next year - which is (I believe) less than the league mininum -> and that's coming off a career year.



What is the absolute WORST that can happen by signing Scott Hatteberg to this extremely cheap contract? On top of his overall ability (he's no superstar, but is an above-average player, professional hitter, etc) - he'll be a nice backup plan if Votto isn't ready next year. GREAT move by Krivsky.

I agree. To complain about it is to make too much of its magnitude, which is small indeed.

Now about those big things that need tending to....

[redsupport]

I wish Griffey had half the discipline that Hattebeg has

[Rob Dicken]

I wish Griffey had half the discipline that Hattebeg has

Right now he doesn't, no. 3/4 of the team doesn't have the plate discipline that Hatteberg has, so this kind of moot.