World Series Game 4 Thread

[Reds Fanatic]

Game is going to be delayed by rain but they do expect to play tonight.

[Matt700wlw]

I guess the only plus is that one of these chicks on whatever show they're showing is rather hot.

:)

[Col_ IN Reds fan]

Did anyone else see pregame when they were talking about W.S. rainouts?
They mentioned 1976. No mention of 1975 when a game (maybe 2) was delayed 2 or 3 days. I am not even sure any game in 1976 WS was rained out.

[RedsBaron]

Did anyone else see pregame when they were talking about W.S. rainouts?
They mentioned 1976. No mention of 1975 when a game (maybe 2) was delayed 2 or 3 days. I am not even sure any game in 1976 WS was rained out.

Game five of the 1975 World Series was played on 10/16/75 and rain delayed game six until 10/21/75. In 1976 there was a one day delay between game three and game four.
By the way, I heard some expert analysis by Dusty Baker on ESPN this morning. He opined that the Tigers needed to win one of the next two games. Wow-amazing insight!

[Reds Fanatic]

Latest update is they may try to start the game around 10:15 ET. Baseball wonders why they are losing viewers. It is crazy to start a World Series game that late.

[Crosley68]

I love baseball very much, but I will only get to watch about 2 innings tonight if they go at 10:15. Sad.

[WMR]

Game five of the 1975 World Series was played on 10/16/75 and rain delayed game six until 10/21/75. In 1976 there was a one day delay between game three and game four.
By the way, I heard some expert analysis by Dusty Baker on ESPN this morning. He opined that the Tigers needed to win one of the next two games. Wow-amazing insight!

Did he discuss the wisdom of routinely pushing pitchers past the 120 pitch mark?

[Matt700wlw]

This is getting a bit silly...

[blumj]

This tv show is really, really bad. I can't believe they air this and people actually choose to watch it when they're not being forced to by a rain delay.

[westofyou]

Latest update is they may try to start the game around 10:15 ET. Baseball wonders why they are losing viewers. It is crazy to start a World Series game that late.

Bring it on.... it's only 7:04 here.

[Reds Fanatic]

It continues to rain in St. Louis but for some reason they won't just make the decision to postpone the game. So they are still waiting at 10:05 ET.

[KronoRed]

They should play a DBL header tomorrow

;)

[Super_Barry11]

Bring it on.... it's only 7:04 here.

No kidding... :laugh: I hate all these 5 pm starts!! :p:

[Reds Fanatic]

They just announced the game is officially postponed. Game 4 will be tomorrow night and game 5 will be on Friday night.

[Matt700wlw]

Rained out.

Duh. :)

[Reds Fanatic]

They are expecting more rain tomorrow night and possibly a couple of inches of rain on Friday. This series may be stuck in St. Louis for several days.

[Blimpie]

They are expecting more rain tomorrow night and possibly a couple of inches of rain on Friday. This series may be stuck in St. Louis for several days.Lucky me. I am traveling to work a week-long conference in St. Louis starting at the first of the week. I had hoped that the entire series would have ended by no later than Sunday (as originally scheduled).

That way, I could have avoided witnessing anything resembling a winner's parade. Now, I am not so sure....:bang:

[remdog]

No kidding... :laugh: I hate all these 5 pm starts!! :p:

Ah yes, the truly correct time zone. ;) Not to mention 75 degree temps, sunny skies and Surf's Up! :laugh:

Rem

[919191]

I'm kind of bummed out. I work 7:00 PM tp 7:00 AM shifts and I am not off again until Sunday, so I might not see any more baseball for quite a while. Guess it is time to play MVP2005 on the machine with the kids.:thumbdown

[GAC]

They just announced the game is officially postponed. Game 4 will be tomorrow night and game 5 will be on Friday night.

I think they shouldn't screw with the schedule and play game 5 tonight and just rescehdule game 4. ;)

[RedsBaron]

I think they shouldn't screw with the schedule and play game 5 tonight and just rescehdule game 4. ;)

World Series TV ratings are at a record low. Usually game seven is the highest rated game; maybe MLB should play game seven next to build interest in the Series and then play games four, five and six.;)

[GAC]

World Series TV ratings are at a record low. Usually game seven is the highest rated game; maybe MLB should play game seven next to build interest in the Series and then play games four, five and six.;)

I think you're on to something there Randy. Call Bud! :lol:

[Blimpie]

World Series TV ratings are at a record low. Usually game seven is the highest rated game; maybe MLB should play game seven next to build interest in the Series and then play games four, five and six.;)They think the ratings have stunk thusfar? Wait until the World Series goes up against the NFL on both Sunday and Monday nights...

I predict pain for Bud. Much, much pain.

[cumberlandreds]

They think the ratings have stunk thusfar? Wait until the World Series goes up against the NFL on both Sunday and Monday nights...

I predict pain for Bud. Much, much pain.

NFL kills MLB when they go head to head. A few years back a World Series game,I think, went against MNF that featured a winless Washington Redskins going against a winless Dallas Cowboy team. MNF won the ratings game by a wide margin. MLB might as well play these games in the day because the ratings couldn't be a whole lot worse.

[RedsBaron]

NFL kills MLB when they go head to head. A few years back a World Series game,I think, went against MNF that featured a winless Washington Redskins going against a winless Dallas Cowboy team. MNF won the ratings game by a wide margin. MLB might as well play these games in the day because the ratings couldn't be a whole lot worse.

I wish they would, at least on weekends anyway.

[Matt700wlw]

Speaking of rain delays....let's hit rewind to 1975 (per Lance)


Reds won game five thanks to two homers by Tony Perez.....and took a 3-2 lead in the series.

They traveled to Boston on the scheduled off day.
It then rained out the game six for three consecutive days.

The Reds decided to hold workouts indoors at Tufts College, in suburban Medford.
The bus driver got lost taking the team to the facility. Spark Anderson had to get off the bus, in uniform, and ask a gas station attendant for directions.

Five days after game 5, they finally played. And after all of that.......the game goes 12 innings and Carlton Fisk hits the hr to tie the series.

[Blimpie]

NFL kills MLB when they go head to head. A few years back a World Series game,I think, went against MNF that featured a winless Washington Redskins going against a winless Dallas Cowboy team. MNF won the ratings game by a wide margin. MLB might as well play these games in the day because the ratings couldn't be a whole lot worse.I could not agree more...

[Matt700wlw]

Let's try again tonight....

Looks like they will play game 4......for now...let's hope :D

[vaticanplum]

OMG Scooter!!!!

[vaticanplum]

Ok, my pregame thoughts, beyond the thrilling return of Scooter:

1. David Eckstein is truly a teeny, weeny, petite little man. He is as tall as I am. Think about that for a second. Most baseball players are above average height for men, and I'm not even particularly tall for a girl.

2. Jeremy Bonderman looks like Powder.

3. If I see that Chevy commercial one more time I'm going to put a spike through my heart.

[vaticanplum]

My cousin and I have had spectacular plans thwarted two nights in a row, so we are drinking and watching the game at home. Beer and Scooter and the Tigers. this night is going to be a freaking kick. Especially since I appear to have this thread entirely to myself.

[Falls City Beer]

2. Jeremy Bonderman looks like Powder.


:laugh:

[Reds Fanatic]

Suppan cruises through the 1st on only 7 pitches.

[vaticanplum]

Suppan disposes of the top 3 in .07 seconds.

[Falls City Beer]

Roidsy McGee is on deck. :p:

[Falls City Beer]

Bonderman's the kind of pitcher the Cards destroy.

[vaticanplum]

I'm going to ask something that I think I know the answer to, but what the hey...

I like him a whole, whole lot, and he's been great for this team and others, but does anybody think that Jim Leyland is just slightly overrated? Even beyond just average levels of commentator fawning?

[Falls City Beer]

I'm going to ask something that I think I know the answer to, but what the hey...

I like him a whole, whole lot, and he's been great for this team and others, but does anybody think that Jim Leyland is just slightly overrated? Even beyond just average levels of commentator fawning?

No more or less so than Larussa, say.

[Falls City Beer]

How did Jay-Z escape the set of Fat Albert and Friends?

[vaticanplum]

No more or less so than Larussa, say.

I think LaRussa is overrated too. But I hear a lot of people talking about that -- never with Leyland.

That's the second Jay-Z reference of this series that I remember -- is he actually there? I keep missing him.

[Falls City Beer]

Suppan's exploiting the high strike calls so far.

[vaticanplum]

Casey!! :laugh:

[MrCinatit]

Welcome to the Big Show, Mr. Casey!

[Reds Fanatic]

Casey homers! 1-0 Tigers

[Matt700wlw]

:jump:

[Falls City Beer]

I think LaRussa is overrated too. But I hear a lot of people talking about that -- never with Leyland.

That's the second Jay-Z reference of this series that I remember -- is he actually there? I keep missing him.

It's these damn Bud commercials.

[OnBaseMachine]

Bonderman's the kind of pitcher the Cards destroy.

Bonderman - June 25 vs Cardinals:

7 IP, 7 H, 1 R, 1 BB, 8 K

[Matt700wlw]

Wow..Edmonds makes a routine catch...and keeps it routine...

[Falls City Beer]

Bonderman - June 25 vs Cardinals:

7 IP, 7 H, 1 R, 1 BB, 8 K

June Cardinals were a shell of this current incarnation. But anything can happen.

[Patrick Bateman]

Bonderman - June 25 vs Cardinals:

7 IP, 7 H, 1 R, 1 BB, 8 K


Yes, but remember that the Cards are an offensive juggernaut now.:laugh:

[Falls City Beer]

Yes, but remember that the Cards are an offensive juggernaut now.:laugh:

Yes, that's exactly what they are.

[Patrick Bateman]

June Cardinals were a shell of this current incarnation.

In June the Cards averaged 4.8 runs per game with an OPS of .751 (compared to 4.85 for the season).

In the playoffs, the Cardinals have averaged 3.9 runs per game, with an OPS of .722.

That "shell" Cards team in June scored at the same pace as the Cards all season, and more than 25% more than the juggernaut you see now.

[Falls City Beer]

In June the Cards averaged 4.8 runs per game with an OPS of .751 (compared to 4.85 for the season).

In the playoffs, the Cardinals have averaged 3.9 runs per game, with an OPS of .722.

That "shell" Cards team in June scored at the same pace as the Cards all season, and more than 25% more than the juggernaut you see now.

Small sample for the postseason. You can't make that kind of comparison.

The bottom line: their offense is totally healthy.

[blumj]

Bonderman's the kind of pitcher the Cards destroy.
What kind of pitcher is that? Who's like him that they destroy?

[Falls City Beer]

What kind of pitcher is that? Who's like him that they destroy?

Two-pitch fastball pitcher.

By comparison, they struggle against junkball lefties.

They're dialing him in--case in point, Rolen sends it to the wall in left.

[Matt700wlw]

Rolen almost ties it up.....as almost as can be.

[vaticanplum]

Cardinals fans are so...Midwestern.

And I'm a native Ohioan, so I can say that.

[Falls City Beer]

Cardinals fans are so...Midwestern.

And I'm a native Ohioan, so I can say that.

Totally cornfed. And very non-ethnic-looking, as opposed to, say, Shea.

[vaticanplum]

Totally cornfed. And very non-ethnic-looking, as opposed to, say, Shea.

Yes, the most colorful they get is when they paint their faces red.

[Falls City Beer]

Yes, the most colorful they get is when they paint their faces red.

And having lived there for a couple of years, I can say that plenty of non-honkies live in St. Louis, but damned if you can find one in the stands.

[vaticanplum]

Curtis Granderson is grrrrrreat.

[mth123]

Yes, the most colorful they get is when they paint their faces red.

Just catching up. Does this mean they look like powder?

[Falls City Beer]

Ordonez swings on the first pitch. :rolleyes:

[TheBurn]

Casey !!!

[Reds Fanatic]

Casey drives in another run. 2-0 Tigers.

[Patrick Bateman]

Small sample for the postseason. You can't make that kind of comparison.

The bottom line: their offense is totally healthy.

And yet they can't put runs accross the plate.

A totally healthy offensive juggernaut scores more than 3.9 runs a game.

Even with their health, the Cards still have the likes of Eckstein, Wilson, Molina, Miles, Edmonds (a sheel of his former self), and Duncan (I'm not convinced he's anything great) in their starting line-up. They only have 2 bats in their line-up that strike fear into anyone's heart. Granted those 2 guys are Rolen and Pujols, but that's simply not enough to be considered an offensive juggernaut.

[Falls City Beer]

And yet they can't put runs accross the plate.

A totally healthy offensive juggernaut scores more than 3.9 runs a game.

Even with their health, the Cards still have the likes of Eckstein, Wilson, Molina, Miles, Edmonds (a sheel of his former self), and Duncan (I'm not convinced he's anything great) in their starting line-up. They only have 2 bats in their line-up that strike fear into anyone's heart. Granted those 2 guys are Rolen and Pujols, but that's simply not enough to be considered an offensive juggernaut.

You face the best pitchings staffs in MLB in the postseason. That's the nature of the beast. It's not all that surprising that their runs scored numbers are a bit down from the regular season.

[TheBurn]

Pudge !!!

[Reds Fanatic]

Rodriguez drives in a run. 3-0 Tigers.

[Matt700wlw]

3-0 now

[vaticanplum]

Just catching up. Does this mean they look like powder?

In a sense, minus the extreme creepy and sinister factor.

[mth123]

You face the best pitchings staffs in MLB in the postseason. That's the nature of the beast.

Valid point. I think the Cards middle three, of Pujols, Edmonds and Rolen, when healthy, is better than anyone on Detroit and Duncan is almost as good as any IMO.

[vaticanplum]

Good lord I love Sean Casey. Even now.

[vaticanplum]

It's funny how perceptions shape things. Because Jeremy Bonderman was the one who ultimately disposed of the Yankees, I now look on him as a terrifying face of evil against whom no one will ever again hit a baseball.

I'm on my fourth beer already I think, perhaps I should slow down.

[Matt700wlw]

I'm on my fourth beer already I think, perhaps I should slow down.

Nah.

:)

[Falls City Beer]

I'm on my fourth beer already I think, perhaps I should slow down.

http://www.80stees.com/images/products/ROTN_Ogre-Tee-shirt.jpg

[vaticanplum]

But seriously, Powder or not, Jeremy Bonderman does look like he's about 50.

[Falls City Beer]

But seriously, Powder or not, Jeremy Bonderman does look like he's about 50.

Progeriac?

[vaticanplum]

David Eckstein is SO TINY that his uniform number is almost tucked into his pants.

I always knew he was little, but all of a sudden he's just a little leprachaun.

[blumj]

I love Bonderman, but he's still so young. Imagine the contract he'll get if he reaches free agency at, what, 26?

[Matt700wlw]

David Eckstein is SO TINY that his uniform number is almost tucked into his pants.

I always knew he was little, but all of a sudden he's just a little leprachaun.

According to MLB...he's 5'7" and weighs 165lbs...

[Reds Fanatic]

Eckstein drives in a run. 3-1 Tigers

[Falls City Beer]

Here they come.

[vaticanplum]

Progeriac?

I have just looked this up in two online dictionaries to no avail. I see "geriac" but the definition in my head is still incomplete. Please explain.

[Cyclone792]

Does everybody remember this chart that I posted in the Game 3 thread?


After Game Three ...

Pitches Seen PA P/PA BB PA/BB Balls Balls/PA Runs
Cardinals 426 113 3.77 13 8.69 172 1.52 13
Tigers 333 99 3.36 3 33.00 104 1.05 5

If you do, good. If not, look at it. ;)

Let's have some fun here, and we'll take a look at that Tigers third inning pitch-by-pitch ...

Curtis Granderson - Ball, Ball, C Granderson doubled to right
Craig Monroe - Ball, Ball, Ball, Strike (looking), C Monroe grounded out to third
Carlos Guillen - Ball, Ball, Ball, Strike (foul), Ball, C Guillen walked
Magglio Ordonez - M Ordonez flied out to left
Sean Casey - S Casey singled to right, C Granderson scored, C Guillen to third
Ivan Rodriguez Strike (looking), Ball, Ball, I Rodriguez singled to right, C Guillen scored, S Casey to second
Placido Polanco Strike (foul), Ball, Ball, P Polanco grounded into fielder's choice to shortstop, I Rodriguez out at second

The plate appearances bolded are plate appearances in which the hitter got ahead in the count. Granderson, Monroe, Guillen, Rodriguez and Polanco all got ahead of the count. Granderson, Guillen and Rodriguez all contributed to the Tigers third inning run production. Sean Casey also contributed, and his single came off an even 0-0 count.

That's five out of seven hitters that inning who got ahead in the count. The other two hitters were in even counts, which means that zero hitters for Detroit in that inning ended their plate appearance in a pitcher's count.

It's amazing what plate discipline, getting ahead in the count, and avoiding a pitcher's count can do for an offense.

[vaticanplum]

According to MLB...he's 5'7" and weighs 165lbs...

That is slightly small for a man, but ubertiny for a ballplayer.

[Falls City Beer]

I swear to God, I'll eat three of my fingers if Duncan isn't juicing. He's MADE of roids.

[Falls City Beer]

I have just looked this up in two online dictionaries to no avail. I see "geriac" but the definition in my head is still incomplete. Please explain.

Progeriac. As in, one stricken by progeria.

[Matt700wlw]

Pujols....

[vaticanplum]

Progeriac. As in, one stricken by progeria.

YES. That is it.

My GREs thank you, as this is about as much preparation as I've done for them.

[Matt700wlw]

Gets out of it...

Nice.

[vaticanplum]

Anybody got Pujols's stats this postseason? Off of the top of my head he seems to have been pretty quiet.

[Falls City Beer]

Anybody got Pujols's stats this postseason? Off of the top of my head he seems to have been pretty quiet.

He's buffing his rap career.

And the Tigers continue to swing at the first bloody pitch. They have no business winning this series.

[blumj]

Anybody got Pujols's stats this postseason? Off of the top of my head he seems to have been pretty quiet.
.298/.431/.553, 2 2b, 3 HR, 6 RBI, and 8 R in 14 G before tonight.

[vaticanplum]

One of the great joys of life on this earth is watching AL pitchers bat. My favorite back in the day was Pedro.

[vaticanplum]

.298/.431/.553, 2 2b, 3 HR, 6 RBI, and 8 R in 14 G before tonight.

that's just this year? Wow, once again my head has tricked me.

[vaticanplum]

And in an effort to shake midwestern stereotypes, a Cardinals fan creates for himself a hate made out of budweiser cans. And attaches a blond wig to boot.

[blumj]

that's just this year? Wow, once again my head has tricked me.
I guess by his standards, that's nothing special. And I always liked watching Pedro bat, too. He seemed to find it so amusing.

[Falls City Beer]

The Cards DO have a sure out in their lineup, and his name is Preston Wilson.

[Reds Fanatic]

Molina doubles in a run. 3-2 Tigers.

[Heath]

Bonderman's getting his pitches up. Not good.

[Falls City Beer]

Bonderman's getting his pitches up. Not good.

Especially when you only have two pitches. I've never been, and I'm still not, sold on Bonderman.

[OnBaseMachine]

Awful, awful performance from Bonderman. Allowing three of the worst players in baseball (Eckstein, Miles, Molina) to reach base a combinded five times is just a pitiful pitching effort. Leyland needs to pull him pronto.

[OnBaseMachine]

In June the Cards averaged 4.8 runs per game with an OPS of .751 (compared to 4.85 for the season).

In the playoffs, the Cardinals have averaged 3.9 runs per game, with an OPS of .722.

That "shell" Cards team in June scored at the same pace as the Cards all season, and more than 25% more than the juggernaut you see now.

:clap:

[Falls City Beer]

Awful, awful performance from Bonderman. Allowing three of the worst players in baseball (Eckstein, Miles, Molina) to reach base a combinded five times is just a pitiful pitching effort. Leyland needs to pull him pronto.

I'm not sure. The Tigers' bullpen has been blech. They need to get some more mileage out of him tonight.

[OnBaseMachine]

And the Tigers continue to swing at the first bloody pitch. They have no business winning this series.

And neither do the Deadbirds.

[vaticanplum]

Ordonez is a guy on the Tigers who really needs to step it up. Maybe he should cut his hair.

[Falls City Beer]

Ordonez is a guy on the Tigers who really needs to step it up. Maybe he should cut his hair.

He's been inexcusably bad.

[Reds Fanatic]

Another hit for Casey. Casey is now 6 for 12 in this series.

[Heath]

And the Tigers continue to swing at the first bloody pitch. They have no business winning this series.

You think Leyland would know this and get some serious screaming going on.

At this rate, they're heading to Detroit on Saturday...to pack for the winter and ponder what might have been.

[Falls City Beer]

Another first pitch swing. Atrocious.

Casey looks like Adam Dunn up there compared to the rest of this Juan Castro Brigade.

[vaticanplum]

My cousin and I are now reminiscing about the 90 reds and looking for a place where we can download mc hammer's "You Can't Touch This" for free online. I beleive we are now officially tipsy.

OH MY GOD THIS CHEVY COMMERCIAL.

[Falls City Beer]

My cousin and I are now reminiscing about the 90 reds and looking for a place where we can download mc hammer's "You Can't Touch This" for free online. I beleive we are now officially tipsy.

OH MY GOD THIS CHEVY COMMERCIAL.

Isn't Hammer from Oaktown?

Yet his favorite team is....the Reds?

*proper*

[vaticanplum]

Isn't Hammer from Oaktown?

Yet his favorite team is....the Reds?

*proper*

They played it after winning games at Riverfront that year. I swear to God.

[vaticanplum]

Here is a superfun factoid from your resident Yankees fan, you can impress all your friends.

After winning games at Yankee stadium, they play "New York, New York" by Frank Sinatra.

After losing games at Yankee Stadium, they play "New York, New York" by Liza Minelli.

How can you all hate on the Yankees, really? apart from their representation of all that is wrong and evil in capitalism?

[Falls City Beer]

They played it after winning games at Riverfront that year. I swear to God.

Dude, you don't have to convince me of that fact.

[OnBaseMachine]

How can you all hate on the Yankees, really? apart from their representation of all that is wrong and evil in capitalism?

I don't hate the Yankees at all; in fact, I actually like them. I can't hate them...all the history they have - Yankee Stadium, the awesome pinstripe uniforms, all the great players they've had, Joe Torre, etc, ...it's impossible for me to dislike that organization.

[Patrick Bateman]

You face the best pitchings staffs in MLB in the postseason. That's the nature of the beast. It's not all that surprising that their runs scored numbers are a bit down from the regular season.

ERA of Padres: 3.87
ERA of Mets: 4.14
ERA of Tigers: 3.84

Average ERA: 3.95
RPG of Cards in post season: 3.90


Obviously the Cards don't get to face mop-up men and 5th starters which makes these stats skewed for play-off purposes, but remember, the Mets also didn't have Pedro Martinez and Duaner Sanchez on the play-off roster which made the Mets' staff not very good for the play-offs, allowing guys like Maine and Perez to get big starts.

To me, it looks like the Cards are doing a fairly average job off these teams. They have surely been short of juggernaut standards.

[vaticanplum]

I don't know how to quantify this, but for all of his genius, Bonderman's
greatest weakness still looks to me to be his youth. He could be fine here; he jsut needs to chill.

[Joseph]

I don't hate the Yankees at all; in fact, I actually like them. I can't hate them...all the history they have - Yankee Stadium, the awesome pinstripe uniforms, all the great players they've had, Joe Torre, etc, ...it's impossible for me to dislike that organization.

You're just not trying hard enough now.

[vaticanplum]

Good god, cardinals fans are irritating as a hangnail. What is it about them?

[OnBaseMachine]

Good god, cardinals fans are irritating as a hangnail. What is it about them?

Arrogance. And they're a bunch of arses.

Question for myself...

Would you rather see a Cardinals win, or get a bowling ball dropped on your family jewels?

My answer - Hmmm...easy choice. I'll take the bowling ball to the jewels.

[blumj]

I don't know how to quantify this, but for all of his genius, Bonderman's
greatest weakness still looks to me to be his youth. He could be fine here; he jsut needs to chill.
He isn't even 6 months older than Verlander. Those two haven't even begun to start being what they could be if they can stay healthy.

[Joseph]

Big strikeout there.

[Cedric]

I'd kill for half of the Tigers bullpen.

[vaticanplum]

Rodney is awesome.

[blumj]

I'd kill for half of the Tigers bullpen.
Even the lesser half. Ledezma, Walker, and Grilli? Good enough for me.

[TeamBoone]

And having lived there for a couple of years, I can say that plenty of non-honkies live in St. Louis, but damned if you can find one in the stands.

Not many on the team either.

[Falls City Beer]

Rodney is awesome.

Agree completely.

http://thursdays.com/pic200/rod13656m.jpg

[Falls City Beer]

Not many on the team either.

Good point.

[Reds Fanatic]

Ordonez has been pitiful this series. Now 2 for 14 with no RBIs.

[Falls City Beer]

Ordonez has been pitiful this series. Now 2 for 14 with no RBIs.

The dude out and out refuses to take a walk, even when it's being handed to him.

[George Foster]

Big inning here...top of the line up. Might be the biggest inning of the Series.
Could mean the difference between tied or down 3-1....

[Falls City Beer]

Awful.

[Reds Fanatic]

Again a Detroit pitcher throws away a bunt and the game is tied.

[George Foster]

Tigers youth coming to light.....tie ball game.

[vaticanplum]

David Eckstein is, as we have established, a little bitty man. His parents are schoolteachers who have spoken out about steroids. He has some terrible illness in his family that both of his siblings have suffered. He is the scrappiest of scrappy, a man who dives into his bowl of Wheaties every single morning, and being a Reds fan I am genetically predisposed to favor the scrappy. He is the poster child for things that make me cry on a daily basis.

And yet, I liken him to those obnoxious pieces of mildew that I cannot get out of my shower no matter how hard I scrub with a toothbrush. I must have a heart made of steel.

Game tied. yep...Eckstein.

[Falls City Beer]

Tigers youth coming to light.....tie ball game.

I'm not saying you have to be a scrappy vet, but postseason experience matters hella lots.

And having a good patient offense.

[George Foster]

That run was gift-wrapped....don't remember seeing that in a World Series in a long time.

[vaticanplum]

I'm not saying you have to be a scrappy vet, but postseason experience matters hella lots.

If this Series isn't a bang-on example of the mental aspect of baseball completely turning around results, then I'm well stumped.

[George Foster]

Now for the hottest guy in the world....

[vaticanplum]

That last pitch on Edmonds was beautiful.

[George Foster]

how bad does that pumpkin stink...crazy fans...:laugh:

[George Foster]

Rodney should be out of the inning with a one run lead...

[Reds Fanatic]

Wilson singles in a run. 4-3 Cardinals.

[George Foster]

3 of the 4 runs were batted in with 2 outs....thats how you win a ring.

[Joseph]

The luckiest team in the world.

[George Foster]

Big inning here...top of the line up. Might be the biggest inning of the Series.
Could mean the difference between tied or down 3-1....

any rep points???? I'm beggin':laugh: :laugh:

[Falls City Beer]

The luckiest team in the world.

I'm thinking the same thing about Detroit.

How the hell did this team make it to the Series? They are awful.

[KronoRed]

The Cardinals winning is super duper gross.

[Falls City Beer]

If you're a Cards pitcher, why on earth would you throw a strike on the first pitch?

[George Foster]

If the Cards win here...it won't make it back to Mo-town. Too devestating for a young team.

[Caseyfan21]

Did McCarver really just credit Pujols for a base running blunder?

Taguchi was safe if the ball gets cut or not. Pujols just assumed the throw was going through and he got caught only to have McCarver defend him for "trading an out for a run."

[KronoRed]

Did McCarver really just credit Pujols for a base running blunder?

Taguchi was safe if the ball gets cut or not. Pujols just assumed the throw was going through and he got caught only to have McCarver defend him for "trading an out for a run."

Pujols is the chosen one, he never does anything wrong.

[George Foster]

If you're a Cards pitcher, why on earth would you throw a strike on the first pitch?

The Tigers were batting as a team .185 coming into this game. The 7 days off killed the offense. Leyland should of had 2 simulated games during the off week. Tuesday and Thursday, first game last Sat.

[Caseyfan21]

Pujols is the chosen one, he never does anything wrong.

Seriously, it boggles my mind someone associated with baseball would make that comment. I mean, any player from knothole on knows you don't get caught in between bases by a cut throw.

Apparently it's ok if you run yourself out of an inning to trade 1 run scoring that would have scored no matter what.

[George Foster]

The Tigers were batting as a team .185 coming into this game. The 7 days off killed the offense. Leyland should of had 2 simulated games during the off week. Tuesday and Thursday, first game last Sat.

They could of opened up the stadium for free (for the fans) and had 2 night games with fan noise. If they did not have enough position players, could of gotten a few minor league players.

[Caseyfan21]

Was that the Scott Spiezio fan club holding up that sign just now?

[Reds Fanatic]

Inge doubles in a run. Tie game 4-4.

[Falls City Beer]

Way to go Inge. But you got to take the lead now or it won't matter. A battle of the pens will be won by the Cards.

[George Foster]

Tigers showing some major male sexual organs......:thumbup:

[Falls City Beer]

As least Wainwright's not getting that neck-high curve called for a strike tonight.

So that's something.

[George Foster]

good pitching move Tony....

[George Foster]

time for the Tigers to return the favor with a 2-out hit.

[vaticanplum]

This is kind of turning out to be a good seires. From two teams who won a collective total of five games in September. Whooda thunk it.

[George Foster]

dude that ball looked high.....:thumbdown

[Falls City Beer]

I spoke too soon. The neck-high curve strikes out Granderson.

[Caseyfan21]

As least Wainwright's not getting that neck-high curve called for a strike tonight.

So that's something.

Spoke too soon. Although that last one was close enough he should have swung.

[Falls City Beer]

Molina's going to go deep here.

[George Foster]

that is pure gas.....would love to see it in person.

[blumj]

I must have missed something. Where the heck has Marcus Thames been in this series?

[Falls City Beer]

that is pure gas.....would love to see it in person.

Has no idea where it's going.

[vaticanplum]

Pull Zumaya.

[OldRightHander]

That heat would work better over the plate.

[Reds Fanatic]

Zumaya throwing 99 or 100 MPH but no where near the strike zone.

[OldRightHander]

that is pure gas.....would love to see it in person.

I'd love to see it in the strike zone.

[George Foster]

Leyland coming out to say, "ah...throw strikes man....you can bring 102mph gas...."

[George Foster]

it's to much for him...take him out...now...

[vaticanplum]

Oh my god it doesn't matter how fast you throw if you're THROWING IT TO NEBRASKA

[Falls City Beer]

Plus it's Aaron bleepin Miles.

[George Foster]

all he is thowing is fastballs...

[OldRightHander]

My three favorite numbers are 6-4-3.

[vaticanplum]

I don't think I've ever seen Encarnacion take a pitch in all my life.

[George Foster]

I did not know that rule...I love baseball. with one out or less and a runner on 1st, you cannot gain 1st base on a pass ball 3rd strike.

[OldRightHander]

@#%$!!!!

[WMR]

#@$%

[vaticanplum]

gaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhh

[George Foster]

Walks kill. Monroe not playing all that deep....

[Reds Fanatic]

Cardinals take the lead as Eckstein's line drive goes off the top of Monroe's glove.

[WMR]

the 2nd best defensive catcher of all-time allows a passed ball in the most unfortunate of circumstances

[Falls City Beer]

I've said it a million times: this Cards' team is a team of destiny. There will be no denying them. They're willing themselves to victory.

[George Foster]

I've said it a million times: this Cards' team is a team of destiny. There will be no denying them. They're willing themselves to victory.

Let's all hope they will themselves to 3rd place next season.:thumbup:

[OldRightHander]

I've said it a million times: this Cards' team is a team of destiny. There will be no denying them. They're willing themselves to victory.

Darned scrappy clutch hitters.

[Falls City Beer]

Let's all hope they will themselves to 3rd place next season.:thumbup:

Nope. Not with Walt "Howsam" Jocketty at the helm. They'll be pickin' off fleas next season too.

[George Foster]

another 2-out RBI....wow

[George Foster]

I guess it's safe to say game 4 was the pivotal game in this series. Did I spell that right?

[vaticanplum]

Nope. Not with Walt "Howsam" Jocketty at the helm. They'll be pickin' off fleas next season too.

NO. Nonononono.

I will allow them one championship. it's been building for a long time. Fine, whatevs, little birds. You scrape by with it and you deserve it. But that is it. then the torch is passed, and we get it, because we are charming, dammit. And by we I mean the Reds, greatest baseball team ever.

[vaticanplum]

I guess it's safe to say game 4 was the pivotal game in this series. Did I spell that right?

You did. But it is not over yet, you know.

[George Foster]

Do you pitch Rogers tomorrow? I do.

[OldRightHander]

:angry: :bang: :bash:

[OldRightHander]

Do you pitch Rogers tomorrow? I do.

It's not up to you or me.

[George Foster]

It's not up to you or me.

Nothing is up to us...what would you do?

[OldRightHander]

Nothing is up to us...what would you do?

I'd throw him. You don't win that one, the others don't matter.

[vaticanplum]

Ok yeah, now it's over.

[Falls City Beer]

Wainwright's the best postseason closer I've seen since Rivera.

They had absolutely zilch chance against him.

[George Foster]

I hope we see another St. Louis calaps...I doubt it however.

[WMR]

Of course Magglio is first pitch swinging...

can we bring back the Yankees?

that's how much I hate the Cards.

[George Foster]

I'd throw him. You don't win that one, the others don't matter.

EVERY STARTER but tonights starter should be ready....it's do or die. Got to get it back to Motown.

[Cedric]

I've said it a million times: this Cards' team is a team of destiny. There will be no denying them. They're willing themselves to victory.

The Tigers are willing them to victory. This is a pathetic display of baseball.

[westofyou]

Wainwright's the best postseason closer I've seen since Rivera.Krod was not too shabby.

This is the series where the mistakes are the linchpin of the bigger prize, errors and baserunning have been the real tools that have decided the games.

[Aronchis]

The Tigers are willing them to victory. This is a pathetic display of baseball.

Welcome to MLB 2006, ugly baseball for a ugly season.

[vaticanplum]

FCB, I thought you were nuts, but turns out you may be right. However, I beg to argue with you on one thing: the cards may be a team of destiny, and this series is being decided on experience and psychology to a degree, all that is fine. But it is not so much a matter of the Cards stepping up as it is the Tigers laying down. I really think that they bought into the media hype of them beating the Yankees, then sweeping the A's, david and Goliath and all that; they had a week off and thought they were invincible. And they're learning otherwise and choking.

I blace more blame on the tigers than I credit St. Louis.

[Cyclone792]

After Game Four ...

Pitches Seen PA P/PA BB PA/BB Balls Balls/PA Runs
Cardinals 567 151 3.75 19 7.95 228 1.51 18
Tigers 463 139 3.33 6 23.17 156 1.12 9

The sad thing is the Tiger pitching has done an excellent job just trying to keep themselves in games, but the defense just throws it away and offensive support just isn't there.

[vaticanplum]

place, not blace. gah.

[harangatang]

Krod was not too shabby.

This is the series where the mistakes are the linchpin of the bigger prize, errors and baserunning have been the real tools that have decided the games.I'd have to throw Bobby Jenks in there too.

[harangatang]

After Game Four ...

Pitches Seen PA P/PA BB PA/BB Balls Balls/PA Runs
Cardinals 567 151 3.75 19 7.95 228 1.51 18
Tigers 463 139 3.33 6 23.17 156 1.12 9

The sad thing is the Tiger pitching has done an excellent job just trying to keep themselves in games, but the defense just throws it away and offensive support just isn't there.I think you're overlooking the best stat of all. The Cardinals have 19 BB and the Tigers have only 6 BB, and the Cards are up 3-1. Ironic, I doubt it.

[blumj]

No one ever gives Foulke any credit for '04. 11 G, 14 IP, 1 ER, a solo HR when he had a 3 run lead to play with. Not to mention multiple innings in back to back extra inning tie games in the ALCS.

[vaticanplum]

No one ever gives Foulke any credit for '04. 11 G, 14 IP, 1 ER, a solo HR when he had a 3 run lead to play with. Not to mention multiple innings in back to back extra inning tie games in the ALCS.

Oh, I do. Foulke was terrifying.

[blumj]

Oh, I do. Foulke was terrifying.
It was just that he pitched so much and had no margin for error for so much of it. I'm just constantly surprised by how little credit he gets for it, even from Red Sox fans. If they had an MVP for that whole postseason, he would have been it.

[GAC]

http://www.lastnightdiy.org/gallery/images/04%20-%20fat%20lady%20sings.jpg

[OnBaseMachine]

Congrats to the 2006 'roided up Cardinals on becoming the worst team in history (in any sport) to win a championship.

[GAC]

Congrats to the 2006 'roided up Cardinals on becoming the worst team in history (in any sport) to win a championship.

Give it a rest. :rolleyes:

[BuckWoody]

After Game Four ...

Pitches Seen PA P/PA BB PA/BB Balls Balls/PA Runs
Cardinals 567 151 3.75 19 7.95 228 1.51 18
Tigers 463 139 3.33 6 23.17 156 1.12 9

The sad thing is the Tiger pitching has done an excellent job just trying to keep themselves in games, but the defense just throws it away and offensive support just isn't there.
True but it's been the pitchers' defense that has hurt them the most. Four errors in four games and they have been in game-changing situations.

Those BB and PA/BB stats are quite telling as well.

[Unassisted]

A final Game 5 tonight is a nightmare scenario for MLB and Fox Sports.

The championship of a major sport, decided on the night of the week with the lowest viewing levels for sports in the fall, because die-hard sports fans are out watching high school football games. The teams in the game are 1,500 miles from either coast, where the population is highest and the most-desired viewers are. The teams are also hated rivals of the home teams in the largest midwestern TV market, Chicago. This could be the lowest-rated finish to a WS ever.

[Falls City Beer]

I know most spells and charms come in "threes," but a WS team only needs two starters, two killer bullpen arms, and two hot hitters. Get that, and you can win it all.

Detroit pretty obviously lacked the third component.

[westofyou]

Congrats to the 2006 'roided up Cardinals on becoming the worst team in history (in any sport) to win a championship.

Class is a nice thing, try to show some.

[Matt700wlw]

It makes me wonder what could have the Reds done?

It's not officially over yet, but it looks like the Cardinals got hot at the right time...that's really all it takes in all honesty.

I tip my hat, painfully :)

[pedro]

It makes me wonder what could have the Reds done?

It's not officially over yet, but it looks like the Cardinals got hot at the right time...that's really all it takes in all honesty.

I tip my hat, painfully :)


The Reds pitching never would have done as well as the Cards IMO. Plus their defense is much better too. As close as the Reds were to the cards in the standings this year, and as much as I dislike the cards, they are a much better team than the Reds IMO.

[Matt700wlw]

The Reds pitching never would have done as well as the Cards IMO. Plus their defense is much better too. As close as the Reds were to the cards in the standings this year, and as much as I dislike the cards, they are a much better team than the Reds IMO.

This series shows that not always the "best team" (on paper, obviously) doesn't always win.

Remember 1990?

It's a fun "what if" either way...

If you get in...you never know what can happen

[westofyou]

The Reds pitching never would have done as well as the Cards IMO. Plus their defense is much better too. As close as the Reds were to the cards in the standings this year, and as much as I dislike the cards, they are a much better team than the Reds IMO.

The Cards run the bases better and hit the cutoff man too.

I'm also going out on the limb and say that their pitchers are better fielders.

[M2]

It'll be interesting to see if the Cardinals can put this one away. The World Series history between these two franchises is the first one to three wins loses the Series.

The Tigers surely felt invincible in 1934 heading home with a 3-2 lead and Schoolboy Rowe set to take the mound. The '68 Cardinals had a commanding 3-1 lead, rings from '64 and '68 on their fingers, two homes games yet to play and Bob Gibson -- who'd won two Game Sevens in previous years and who posted a 1.12 ERA that season -- scheduled to take the mound for a Game Seven if it was needed.

[Hoosier Red]

If the Cardinals lose tonight, would you throw Carpenter in Game 6?

[M2]

FCB, I thought you were nuts, but turns out you may be right. However, I beg to argue with you on one thing: the cards may be a team of destiny, and this series is being decided on experience and psychology to a degree, all that is fine. But it is not so much a matter of the Cards stepping up as it is the Tigers laying down. I really think that they bought into the media hype of them beating the Yankees, then sweeping the A's, david and Goliath and all that; they had a week off and thought they were invincible. And they're learning otherwise and choking.

I blace more blame on the tigers than I credit St. Louis.

IMO, the Cardinals are putting steady pressure on the Tigers and that's causing the cracking. It's what most folks expected the Yankees to do the Tigers, but the Yankess got complacent.

FCB's got a knack for postseason zeitgeist. During that Mets series the Cardinals showed some serious mettle. They beat a far superior team. I mentioned after the NLCS that the Birds have a "Wild Bunch" feel to them (much like the 2001 D-Backs). Though I also think history may look back on this Series and deem the seasonal W-L records a mirage. The Cardinals have been on an extended run and there's little doubt in my mind that we'll look back in 10-20 years and see that St. Louis had a lot more star power (career-wise) than Detroit.

That said, if St. Louis gets complacent now Detroit could climb right back into this thing. The Cardinals need to continue to play every moment like they're about to be eliminated.

[Cedric]

IMO, the Cardinals are putting steady pressure on the Tigers and that's causing the cracking. It's what most folks expected the Yankees to do the Tigers, but the Yankess got complacent.

FCB's got a knack for postseason zeitgeist. During that Mets series the Cardinals showed some serious mettle. They beat a far superior team. I mentioned after the NLCS that the Birds have a "Wild Bunch" feel to them (much like the 2001 D-Backs). Though I also think history may look back on this Series and deem the seasonal W-L records a mirage. The Cardinals have been on an extended run and there's little doubt in my mind that we'll look back in 10-20 years and see that St. Louis had a lot more star power (career-wise) than Detroit.

That said, if St. Louis gets complacent now Detroit could climb right back into this thing. The Cardinals need to continue to play every moment like they're about to be eliminated.

I don't see how the Mets were ever considered vastly superior to the Cardinals. They ran out Trachsel, Perez, and and John Maine for 4 starts. That is painful. They also had bullpen problems and the Cliff Floyd injury.

Give the Redbirds credit though, they keep winning. I just would have liked to see one series where both teams played even remotely up to their potential.

[Falls City Beer]

If the Cardinals lose tonight, would you throw Carpenter in Game 6?

Only death is more of a certainty than the Cardinals winning tonight. The Tigers looked absolutely psychologically destroyed after blowing the lead.

[M2]

I don't see how the Mets were ever considered vastly superior to the Cardinals. They ran out Trachsel, Perez, and and John Maine for 4 starts. That is painful. They also had bullpen problems and the Cliff Floyd injury.

Give the Redbirds credit though, they keep winning. I just would have liked to see one series where both teams played even remotely up to their potential.

The Mets had starting pitching issues thanks to the Pedro and El Duque injuries, but Maine had a pretty good season and Oliver Perez doesn't lack talent (and to his credit he stepped up when his team needed him). They still had a very good bullpen and some dynamite players in the field.

I actually think the Mets played pretty well against St. Louis. That was a heck of a series. I also don't think Detroit's playing all that poorly right now. Yes, they are making some mistakes, but that's part of baseball. No one plays error-free, highlight reel baseball all the time. Yet the Cardinals are putting the Tigers into a position where the normal errors and non-plays of the sport are costing them games. Essentially St. Louis has managed to whittle the Tigers' margin for error down to nearly zero. Getting consistently on base against all the Tiger's main pitchers outside of Kenny Rogers (the Cardinals have had baserunners in 18 of the 24 innings -- some only partial innings -- pitched by Velander, Robertson, Bonderman, Rodney, Zumaya and Jones) has really put Detroit back on its heels.

The pitcher errors are kind of freaky, but St. Louis is forcing flamethrowers like Verlander, Zumaya and Rodney to make plays against them (with runners already on base to boot). Nolan Ryan used to buzz the next few hitters if a team bunted on him. Roger Clemens practically injures himself every time he makes a play in the field. Having to throw the ball to first base is way outside the comfort zone of most power pitchers.

[vaticanplum]

Only death is more of a certainty than the Cardinals winning tonight. The Tigers looked absolutely psychologically destroyed after blowing the lead.

I actually think the Tigers will win tonight, the Cardinals tomorrow. But I'm never, ever right on these things.

[pedro]

I actually think the Tigers will win tonight, the Cardinals tomorrow. But I'm never, ever right on these things.

I should have stopped predicting victories in November of 2004. In fact, after predicting a Bengals victory against the Steelers in last years' playoffs I have been forbidden by one of my frinds to predict anything in his precence.

[OnBaseMachine]

I heard the Cardinals will be popping needles into each other tonight (if they win, of course) instead of popping champagne.