Timetable on Votto, Bruce?

[RedEye]

I apologize if this topic should be in the minor league forum, but since it pertains hypothetically to the Reds big club, I thought I'd post it here.

Although conventional wisdom has Bailey at GABP sometime in '07, I've been wondering lately what Wayne's long-ish term plans for the Reds offense might be. I'm assuming that both these guys have to be there as centerpieces in the next two years:

Votto: The Pickin' Machine is just a stopgap, albeit one whom I have grown to love in a Reds uniform. He is signed through next season, though. My best guess is that Joey starts the season in AAA unless he absolutely tears the cover off in ST. Hatte opens with the big club and hangs around until the team is out of contention. Barring some unexpected pennant run, Votto then makes his appearance somewhere around midseason. My guess is they'd want to give him more than a September cup of joe so that they can see what they've got.

Bruce: Seems to me that Bruce will start in AA and be one of our first options in the event of a major injury or a trade. If there is a deal during the offseason (Griffey or, more likely, Dunn), then I think the gears start to get put into faster motion for Jay's appearance in Cincy. By all accounts I've read, he is far closer to ML ready than anyone expected, and he doesn't have much to prove in the minors anymore. Already a far better fielder than either Dunn or Griffey and surprising power for his age--kind of like the hitting version of Homer.

Anyway, what do you all think? It's good to be back here posting again.

[HBP]

Bruce: Seems to me that Bruce will start in AA and be one of our first options in the event of a major injury or a trade. If there is a deal during the offseason (Griffey or, more likely, Dunn), then I think the gears start to get put into faster motion for Jay's appearance in Cincy. By all accounts I've read, he is far closer to ML ready than anyone expected, and he doesn't have much to prove in the minors anymore. Already a far better fielder than either Dunn or Griffey and surprising power for his age--kind of like the hitting version of Homer.


I disagree for the reason that Bruce has never played above low A ball. Yep, he put up great numbers, but I think he'd have to repeat that again in a combination of Sarasota and Chattanooga to be considered ready (mostly in AA). I doubt the FO starts him off in Chattanooga; I guess there's a chance, but they've said repeatedly they don't like players skipping levels. Most likely, I think he may get his first shot in 2008. It's great to have an OF of his caliber in the system though.

[mth123]

I disagree for the reason that Bruce has never played above low A ball. Yep, he put up great numbers, but I think he'd have to repeat that again in a combination of Sarasota and Chattanooga to be considered ready (mostly in AA). I doubt the FO starts him off in Chattanooga; I guess there's a chance, but they've said repeatedly they don't like players skipping levels. Most likely, I think he may get his first shot in 2008. It's great to have an OF of his caliber in the system though.

My thoughts exactly. He's on schedule to take over for Griffey either in mid to late 2008 or 2009.

[paintmered]

I disagree for the reason that Bruce has never played above low A ball. Yep, he put up great numbers, but I think he'd have to repeat that again in a combination of Sarasota and Chattanooga to be considered ready (mostly in AA). I doubt the FO starts him off in Chattanooga; I guess there's a chance, but they've said repeatedly they don't like players skipping levels. Most likely, I think he may get his first shot in 2008. It's great to have an OF of his caliber in the system though.

Agreed. He should start the season in Sarasota. Depending on how he does there he could be in Chattanooga as early as June/July. I don't see him moving beyond AA this year though.

[dougdirt]

Jay has said in this offseason that his goal is to start next season in AA.

[dfs]

Jay has said in this offseason that his goal is to start next season in AA.
Not gonna happen. They've been very delibrate about not skipping levels and the difference between low A ball and AA is pretty substantial. He'll go to Sarasota and if he cleans up there he'll end up with the Lookouts in July. That would be a great season for Bruce.

I wonder if Bruce is going to end up in center. I suspect he's bound for a corner.

[dougdirt]

They have said that, but every case is different. If he goes into ST and absolutely kills the ball, it wouldnt surprise me. As for position, he projects as a corner guy because of the growth he is expected to see over the next few years.

[steig]

I think Bruce is Cincinnati bound for 2008 unless he tears up the minors the same way that Dunn did. If so then I think we could see him as early as Augusts if an outfielder gets hurt.

Votto, could be up by june in my opinion and then platoon at first with Hatteburgh. If the Reds do go ahead and trade Dunn in the off season then the Hatte/Votto platoon seems very realistic.

[dougdirt]

I doubt you see a platoon between Votto and Hatte, they both hit RHP and struggle against LHP. Both are lefties.

[mound_patrol]

I don't see why the Reds can't move Bruce along faster. If he doesn't have any glaring holes in his game then why keep the man down. I'm all for Starting him in AA to challenge him. Can't wait to see him with the big club.

[Jefferson24]

I don't see why the Reds can't move Bruce along faster. If he doesn't have any glaring holes in his game then why keep the man down. I'm all for Starting him in AA to challenge him. Can't wait to see him with the big club.

I would like nothing more that to see him be sucessfull in AA too. However too big a challenge could become a big setback. Let him prove himself at each level first. I'm sure the Reds wont let him sit too long at any one level as long as he's doing well.

[Aronchis]

Votto is real close, Bruce probably 2 years away. I would give him a full year in the FSL and then let him set the pace in 2008 with AA.

[IslandRed]

I'd start him in Sarasota. "Challenge thy hitters?" Sure. But it's my opinion that the jump from Dayton to Sarasota is the single biggest jump a hitter in our system faces. Next to the one that lands him in Cincinnati, I mean. The competition in High-A is significantly better and the FSL is a pitcher's league. If Bruce seriously rakes there, I'd have no problem with a quick bump up to Chattanooga, and from there who knows?

[The_jbh]

Who knows maybe Bruce will pull an Adam Dunn like rise through the system next year...

You can't really put a time table on a guy like him, he'll hit his way to the majors in due time

[flyer85]

Votto is likely to be better in 2007 at the major league level than the Reds other options. However, I have little doubt that he will start the season in the minors.

For Bruce it all depends on how he plays in the minors.

[paulrichjr]

I just hope they are wearing Red in a couple of years and not some other colors. To improve this team (quickly) you must either trade or sign free agents. I don't see a lot of free agents signed so our biggest chips might be sent away. Let's hope not.

[toledodan]

if the reds are out of contention and can move hatteberg i could see votto up in 2007. jay bruce is a interesting prospect. everything points that he could blow up and be a red by 2008 or we could never see him before 2010. things are coming together for him to easy. i just hope he doesn't change his work ethic that he has used. see brandon larson!

[redsmetz]

I don't see why the Reds can't move Bruce along faster. If he doesn't have any glaring holes in his game then why keep the man down. I'm all for Starting him in AA to challenge him. Can't wait to see him with the big club.

WK's philosophy is to push players but on a level to level basis. Look at how Bailey was handled this year. I think that's the Reds future. Get them here, but through a standard development level. I think the team will be the better for it.

[mth123]

WK's philosophy is to push players but on a level to level basis. Look at how Bailey was handled this year. I think that's the Reds future. Get them here, but through a standard development level. I think the team will be the better for it.

Not sure you can project the handling of a 20 year old pitcher who is still building up to his major league inning load to a position player. You may be right about the handling of pitchers and that's good. Protecting their health has to be a priority. Position players should be pushed IMO.

[IslandRed]

Even for position players, I'm in favor of the "touch each level" approach. I'm not saying they have to stay there very long, mind you. Let the performance dictate the timetable. If Jay Bruce is too good for the FSL, he'll demonstrate it quickly enough.

[RedEye]

I just hope that we see Bruce, Votto and Stubbs up at the ML level sometime soon, because WK is thinning out our offense by the day!

[Betterread]

The way Votto's development has gone year by year, I expect him to spend the full 2007 in AAA, and possibly 2008 for an ETA.
Bruce is really too early to call but he might hit High A and AA if he has a good year in 2007. Then in 2008 I would start him in AA. If he forces the issue through above expected performance, bring him up at the end of 2008 or beginning of 2009.